Does anyone have an opinion on separtion? My H told me Friday that OW is pregnant. He had moved out approx 3 weeks ago, but still spent alot of time at home with kids and me. Anyway, H says he had decided that he wanted to come home and work on marriage. Then he found out about pregnacy. Now he is confused again. He thinks that he ought to get an apartment and separate for awhile. He says he hasn't talked to OW since he moved out of her place on Sat. I know he has strong feelings for OW still, but says that he also loves me. I am afraid OW might use pregnacy to get H to go back to her. I am still in shock over whole thing. One minute I think we will be okay and that we can deal with OW and OC, other times I am a wreck and feel like my life is falling apart. Have been trying to show support and patience with H while he is trying to sort through all of this, but I really feel that he wants to be home. He says time apart will help us reconnect and start again - begin dating and spending time together (He is reading Divorse for Dummies). I really think that his intentions with the separation are good, but I am so afraid that OW will try to reconnect with him also. I want him to move home and begin recovery. I want to save my marriage. We have 2 small children to think about also, and I don't even know how to begin dealing with OC and my children. But right now I want to concentrate on saving marriage and then deal with OC issue. I want him to stay home and start MC - he thinks separation is the way to go. It just drives me nuts anytime he is not home. Every time he leaves I am afraid he will not return. I want him home where he belongs, but I know that he should probably make that decision. I know its a trust issue, and I don't trust him right now - that will take time. PLEASE help. I need advice soon because H is looking for apartments. Thanks, Kris

Sorry you haven't gotten more replies.

Briefly, my 2c is H should NOT move out. Your marriage has a better chance at recovery if you stay in the same home and BOTH work on the marriage. That was the advice in the book DH and I used 5y ago (After the Affair by Janis Abram Spring--excellent, but no OC advice) and I think staying together is typical MB advice (except for those in Plan B, which I don't think you are).

Do every MB thing you can read and get an MB-friendly marriage counselor. Your DH's loyalty should be with his marriage, regardless of OW/OC. Contrary to popular belief, relationships aren't REALLY about "feelings". Feelings come from met needs, so the right thing is to make a conscious decision to work on the marriage he took vows for, and make those happy feelings come alive again, not wallow in who "feels the best" or such horsemanure. I did a 180 degree turn on that topic after reading much in wake of H's A. Every marriage will dip and rise... it's no excuse to f*** around.

Pardon me for being blunt. I'm very short on time, and as an old timer, I don't put the energy into replies that I used to.

You and all newbies, keep posting and hang in there--marriage IS worth trying for.
God be with you,
J

From what I've read around here, moving out is not the way to go to keep the marriage together.

However, from what I've also read around here, YOU need to contact a lawyer to protect yourself and your kids. Talk to your H about this and let him know what is going on and what can happen if you do not do this.

You NEED to start some seperation proceedings and this is why: If OW sues for CS, you and your children will forever get support AFTER OC. Does this sound fair to you? NO it is not but that is how it will be.

I have never done this, regrettably, but there are others around here who have. It is a legal seperation that you do and get your CS all set up for your own children.(I believe H only needs to have a seperate mailing address which can be a PO box, check around for details)

I know that this seems like something else to overwhelm you @ a time like this but it's not emotional---it's protection for you and your children. Try to focus and think clearly.

If you do not look out for your children right now, NO ONE else will.

Take a deep breath, eat right and get plenty of rest.

I think it's so interesting that some WS in the "fog" think they HAVE to go with OW because there will be a child coming....hello...and what about the children you already have???

If H moves out that will give him more of an opprotunity to see both of you and definately won't help you with the trust that needs to be regained. Try to avoid this. Make him WANT to stay with you and BC (betrayed children). Read this site for ways to do this.

This is a fight and you can WIN!

Take care and keep us updated or even if you just need to vent. We're here for you.

H is still insisting that he needs to leave. I am terrified - that this is the end, that this is more than I can handle right now, that I am losing control. Do I support this or keep trying to get him to stay home? I just really have this horrible, scared gut feeling that if he leaves that it won't be good for our marriage and can't get him to see it.

Legal separation sounds so scary. Wouldn't that be a major LB, especially if he is really trying to work on our marriage? Can OW file for CS before the OC is born? (only 6-7 weeks pregnant) I guess I was wondering how much time I have to decide about this. I don't want to do anything that will drive H away at this point.

Kris, I hope you read up on Plan A. Since your H seems ambivalent, Plan A sounds like what you need to pull him back in. Him moving out is not ideal, but it doesn't have to spell "the end"! And since the XOW cannot seek support until after birth and DNA (make sure they do DNA!), you have some time to work on your H without filing formally for support. That's my 2c.

Go get 'im, girl!
J, in recovery 5y and glad

Recovery is easier when the couple lives in the same house, however, MB can work regardless of living arrangements.

I agree with Jenny that Plan A is a good way to start this process. Regardless of your husband's initial reception of the Plan, it does make an impact and shakes him awake as time goes on.

It breaks my heart when this happens to couples who have small children at home that depend on their parents to provide a safe and stable home. It makes me so mad when these men and their OW's are so self serving that they destroy the happiness and peace of so many people. Breaking little children's hearts and homes...all that to cure an itch.

I hate what you are going through and remember well going through the same thing five years ago. It nearly killed me and it took such a long time to recover. But we did recover. And the ridiculous thing is that we recovered to a place that was far superior to where we were before. I am telling you this to give you some hope that things will get better.

Some important things I learned that were not entirely MB is that I told my husband that if he wanted to leave me for good and go to her, then he could without argument as long as he severed contact with OW for the time being and went to Retrouvaille with me. www.retrouvaille.org

During those six months, I Plan A'd, we attended Retrouvaille, he had NC with OW and we began to rediscover each other and the marriage. Throughout the first six months after D-day, he wavered in his foggy confusion between assuming that too much damage had been done to the marriage (he thought "so why try?"), his shame and his ambivalence as to whether or not he wanted me or the OW. He realized his heart was with me.

After about a year, we were past that horrible stage and started recovery in earnest. It took a long time to take effect for us because my husband suffers from a mental illness, but with diagnosis and medication, he's been pretty normal since June 2002. If recovery can happen for us, it can happen for anyone.

I know you're scared and lonely and your grief is unbelievably deep right now. You don't know what is going to happen or how all this is going to play out, but I would like to tell you that at least 95% of the time, the WS returns home. It is very, very seldom that the WS runs off permanently with the OW...OC or not.

WS's ususally wake up and realize what they have done and that none of it was worth it...they see that their wife is and was always the best choice for him and when they realize that all is not lost, they get brave and come home and face the recriminations of family and friends. It is a courageous thing to return home and repair all the damage.

Work the Harley principles and trust that God will bless you and your marriage and will open your H's eyes, clear his foggy thinking and bring him home where he belongs.

People are human and make horrible, horrible errors in judgment. Even something so immense as this can be fixed and recovery can and usually does happen with MB. Your husband is confused and struggling with misplaced guilt... and feeling responsible for OC, which he should, however, your husband's first obligation is to you, your marriage and your BC. Once he realizes that his only obligation to the OC is financial, he can focus his attention to you and your family and begin the recovery process.

Prayers

<small>[ February 11, 2004, 11:00 AM: Message edited by: catnip ]</small>

OOOOOOOOOOO you need to take a big deep breath and calm your nerves. I know that this is a scary time for you. Unfortunately, it is also the time that he can easily manipulate you. If he is so certain that a separation is necessary then you get thee to a laywer and hammer out the details, all legal of the separation. THEN you can work on the marriage.

He is probably thinking that you will sit on hold while he hides from all he has done. This serves NOBODY but him. You are the only person that can take care of you right now. Also, your children deserve to be protected both emotionally from this as well as financially. Once you have things written in stone, your own uncertainty will ease a bit. If he gets upset, well, you will have to explain to him that you are only doing what is best for you and the children. Should your marriage survive, well, then no harm done. However, should it not, then you have all the legalease in place for a divorce, without having oc get more then your own children.

As for him leaving. Well, yes, you can plan A with him gone. I say call the Harleys and read read read read read.

I know that it is far easier to slump in the couch with tissue and a good friend for a tear fest. However, this will allow the tail to wag the dog. Get up, get dressed and be proactive. Not only will it take care of some fears, but it will also make your inner self feel better for standing up for yourself. Get out and walk too. Take care of your body and soul.

You will be fine. Just don't let them mani[ulate you anymore.

krism,,,,,,,,, from a mans point of view i have to agree with lynng on all counts. your h is most likely thinking that if he moves out he will have the best of both worlds. his freedom to explore a relationship with ow and also try and work on your marriage. all without being under your watchful eyes.

get yourself an attorney and follow lynn's advice. if the marriage succeeds then no harm done. if he complains then you should tell him that you are just trying to protect your kids and yourself should he decide a divorce is the road to choose. legal papers and some hard truths about what reality holds for him should he leave sometimes is the knock up side the head a ws needs to get their head back on straight.

i think for me that was one of the biggest factors in getting fh out of her fog. i pretty much stopped all the wallowing in self pity about her leaving and started making plans to date and move on with my life. i went to the court house and picked up all the legal papers and made no bones about filing them.

keep your head up because although i know how much this hurts it is really your h's nightmare. he is the one that will have to live with his actions for the rest of his life.

H signed lease papers for an apartment. How can he honestly think that this is going to help? The only person he is helping is himself - another selfish decision. All week long I have told him about how I feel about this. He asks the opinions I have been getting here. I talked to our Pastor this week. I guess no one is telling him what he wants to hear. No one thinks this is a good idea. It makes me question if he is at all serious about trying to work on us. I am so angry right now that I feel a hugh angry outburst toward my H coming on and I know that would only make matters worse. If its freedom he wants I'm getting real close to giving it to him permanently. Could anyone please remind me why I would want to stay in this marriage? I have some serious doubts right now.

H is planning to move out Fri or Sat. Says maybe I can bring the kids up Sun. so we can see his place. Is he kidding? This is only going to hurt them worse. I'll be d***** if I will let him to that to the kids. He says after a week or so maybe we can go out on a date or go back to his place and spend some time alone. I wish he would wake up from this fantasy life he is living because I don't think I want to participate. This is very real and it hurts like h***. If he can show this much lack of concern for my feelings after all that he has dumped on me this week, I say why bother!!!

Thanks for listening - I needed to vent.

Kris

k, sorry you are hurting so bad. I agree with the others that separating is not good for the marriage.

Perhaps, plan B is in order. Do you have family or friends to help support you emotionally? Are you seeing a counselor?

Would your H go on a retrouvaille week-end before leaving?

It really hurts to be betrayed by someone you love so much, and someone you trusted.

Hope your H comes to his senses.

ember

ember

ember - Thanks for being here for me last night! I needed someone.

I'm a little more calm and sane tonight. H is still planning on leaving, but he says he is doing it for us. Says that he needs time to get his head on straight and that he wants to make sure he is coming home for the right reasons. I calmly told him of my fears of him living in an apartment, so he knows how I feel. I told him I would support this as long as he stays away from xOW. Says he is confused about OC, but I told him we can do this together. Told him he should stay away from OW until OC is born, and check on her through mutual friend if needed. He wants to go back to counseling with Pastor. Last time I met with Pastor he suggested MC, so I will continue to try to talk H into that.

I appreciate all of the support I am getting here. I know this will be a long road, but I really hope that H is sincere and this is the beginning of our recovery. Any advice or suggestions always appreciated (and still needed).

God Bless,
Kris

whether you reconcile or not-----get CS set up for your children. Do it now, especially since it sounds like you really are separated.

If you do reconcile great but your children will be protected FIRST, BEFORE OC. Otherwise, they will not.

Believe me, I know, as I'm sure many others here too. The courts will not care about YOUR children, only the child that is getting CS sought for them through the courts or on welfare.

Do this now. You can do it.

Take care of yourself.

Hi everyone. Things seem to be looking up here. H seems sincere about wanting to work on us, but yet I keep having so many doubts. One minute I am so hopeful that everything will be alright, then these doubts keep creeping in and I think that I am just nuts. I want to trust him, I want to trust what I feel, but yet - the doubts are there. I know it will be hard to trust again. I am just so scared that I am going to set myself up to be hurt again. I know H has talked to OW - "about the baby". I want to believe that is all it is, but it has only been about a week and a half since he moved out of her place. What do I do?


The idea of a legal separation still scares me. I know I need to protect my kids, but it seems like a step closer to giving up. I am having a hard time with that. Could someone explain a legal separation to me in more detail? If I file and my H moves back home before OC is born, are me and the kids still protected? From what I read on separations in Indiana, they are good for up to a year unless another date is set by court. If we are not really separated when this OC is born, what happens? Or do we need to live apart until after the birth? I hate to even be thinking about this. All I want to concentrate on is fixing my marriage - that's what I should be focusing on - but instead I have to think about all this legal stuff on top of it. It is all just a constant reminder of the A, and I don't know how to sort through all these feelings I am having. I know I need a counselor, but that is another worry. I can't afford counselor or a lawyer, but yet if I don't get them, it will cost me more in the long run. Any advise??

God Bless,
Kris

krism,,,,,, i can't sa for sure what indiana laws are exactly but from what io understand a legal separation is in order now that your h has moved out. if he decides to move back in later the courts wil never know.

you should file and do this right now in any case since if you wait because you are afraid it will cause your h to make the separation perminent you may lose not only your h butany chnce at reasonble support from him also.

if ow files for cs and is awarded cs by courts and you do not have anything from the courts for your own c's you may find that there is nothing left of your h's income to support you and your c's.

i believe that the lions share of cs goes to the first in line.

a legal seperation has nothing to do with giving up on your marriage. It has everything to do with protecting your BC.

Aren't you seperated right now? It is just a legal piece of paper stating the FACTS, which include CS your H is obligated to give you on behalf of the care and welfare of your children.

If you do NOT do this, then when OW comes after H for CS for OC, then your H will be FOREVER legally obligated to provide for OC FIRST!!!!!!

Do you understand that? CS for OC will be his #1 financial priority, not shoes BC might need, not cable, NOT food for you or BC, his first financial responsibility will be to OC!The state will garnish your H wages and take the CS $$ for OC out of his paycheck automatically to make sure that CS is paid first, before any and everything.

If you file a legal seperation with a stipulation of CS for your BC, then any CS obligated to OC will be a % of what is left of H income AFTER CS for BC is deducted. Otherwise CS for OC will be determined as a % of his total income and you and BC will only get the leftovers. This is serious.

I know it is overwhelming and scary but get this done now and then you can be scared and overwhelmed later AND protected. Explain it to your H, I'm sure he would understand.

kt - I absolutely understand what you are telling me. What I am wondering is that if I file a legal separation now and say in May H moves home, will this still protect me? OC is not even due until Sept. I think if I am reading correctly info I found on internet, here in Indiana, a judge could set any time period for the separation he/she sees fit up to a year. So if I file now and a judge sets a time period of say 6 months, the OC will not even be born yet. What happens then? I do want to protect my BC, but I don't want to do anything to jeopardize the protection by filing too soon before OC is born. And I guess I need to know to that if H moves home before OC is born, what happens then? Is legal separation null and void?

H and I have actually discussed the need for separtion to protect our kids. He seems to be supportive and understanding of that. I just want to make sure I do things right. Believe me, my number one priority are my kids!!

Thanks for advice,
Kris

ok I get your ??? now, which I'm sorry I don't know the answer to. How can a judge determine how long you are seperated for? That's dumb. What if you are seperated forever.

Around here, I have read that it does not matter if H moves back home, only what is on that paper. How would they even know he moved back?

I think now is when you'll have to ask a real lawyer to answer your questions. Sorry.

That still sounds wierd about the judge deciding your length of seperation, but in any case, I'm sure you could just renew it.

Good luck. I am really sorry that you have to deal with all this. I know how painful and unimaginabley overwhelming it all is. Really. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

Kris,
In Indiana child support will never pre-empt other chldren as in some states. So, I don't think this needs to be your concern.
But if you'd like to doublecheck call your local (county) Bar association and get a referral for a domestic relations lawyer. Referrals often cost around $25 for an hour of an attorney's time. Well spent money for peace of mind!

Take care, I'm sorry you're hurting right now.

e.
(your buckeye state neighbor)

Thanks kt and e for advice.

e - I am only a transplant Hoosier, I am truly a Buckeye at heart. We have only lived here about 4 years and I really wish we never moved here, maybe this whole nightmare would not have happened. We moved here for H's new job and thats how he met OW. Anyway, so are you telling me that my children will be considered first for CS or will all three be treated equally? I don't suppose an Ohio lawyer can practice in IN? We live near border and I still work in OH. I know lawyers from old home town and would feel more comfortable with someone I am familiar with. I have no idea how to choose a good lawyer - there are so many listed in the phone book.

Thanks so much to all of you for all your help and advice. It helps so much to talk to people who have or are going through the same thing. I don't think all my friends and family understand completely why I would want to save my marriage after all H has put me through, and many don't even know about OC yet. God help me when I break the news to my parents. Thanks again and I will keep you all in my prayers.

Kris

Hi Kris,
Indiana and Ohio law are pretty similar.
If you want you can email me @
mblawmail@yahoo.com

Hopefully I can help clear up some of the confusion and the misinformation about child support.

e.

<small>[ February 18, 2004, 08:29 PM: Message edited by: e29 ]</small>