I just have a silly question, since I have nothing else to report. Does anyone know what would make a WS stay with an OM if they know there is no future. Hope that it will change, or just addiction and the way it makes them feel? Does being used not ever enter their mind?<P>And also, does this sort of scenario where the WS might know there is not a future, prolong the affair since there is no sudden realization that is is over, or should it shorten it since they might eventually realize it is not going where they wanted?<P>You probably guessed that my wife is involved with OM that has continued to maintain that there is no future available (I think) . Perhaps she thinks that this is so special, that although there is no future, it is something that should go on since they are so right but just came together in the wrong lifetime. Thus can remain special friends with a few perks. Just guessing here.<P>I'm sure this has been asked 1001 times, but how about 1002? Any comments appreciated.<P>I just had to wait for laundry to finish, so this question is the result. Thanks.

Well why does an alcoholic drink if they know it is bad, why does a drug addict use if they know it is bad and can kill them.<BR>We are dealing with complete lunatics here. <P>They only know what feels good.. When H and I had a talk about he and OW. He told me I over anylize everything. Well you would think A normal person would knowing what the consequences of their actions are, However this only shows how wacked he is..<P>Gee lets lok at his actions...<P>Alcoholic(3 week sobriety)<BR>Leaves wife and kids of 13 yrs<BR>Suffers from depression<BR>Still has issues from child hood<BR>1 month after moving out gets new girlfriend<BR>Lies to everyone<BR>Pays no child support<BR>Has no money<BR>Left me with all the bills<BR>Has sex with OW when kids are in the home<BR>No counceling<BR>No AA<P>Isn't he a great candidate for a new boyfriend.... If OW is in such a daze that this is the man of her dreams can you imagine how she looks to him right now..<P>Goods...<BR>No kids<BR>No Husband<BR>26<BR>Fake BOOBS- which are still smaller then mine..<P>Bads...<BR>Recovering alcoholic<BR>Came out of a 8 year R where Ex cheated on her many times(Can you say STD?)<BR> Aren't they a match made in Heaven.. So if these 2 think they are going to have a successful relationship that will last for years to come. More power to them. They are either smokin something or their heads are where the sun don't shine...<P>I wander if they have ever heard of REBOUND!!! Heck If I saw my H coming at me with all those issues I would run as fast as I could.<P>Who does she think she is to maintain this man..And who is he to think this is his sign from God to leave our marriage.<P>It is like a drug addiction.. You feel sad, scared, lonely and insecure, nobody loves you but the drug.. Therefoe you take in as much as you can as quickly as you can. Loosing everything in sight, morals, Love, selfworth, reality, and your family and friends. One day you wake up Alone, scared insecure, tired, unloved, humiliated, hurt, and ashamed for all the harm you caused..<P>All this for a high that cannot go on forever.. It baffles me to even try and understand. I think that no matter how much pain we endure in our situations we have much more then these people have ever known...<P>Class, selfworth, determination, morals, love, security, KNOWLEDGE!!!! And of course a wonderful support group to guide us through and help us not to make insane decisions such as our spouses...<P>Make sense? I hope so if not maybe some one willl get a laugh out of the fake BOOB thing....<P>Diana

Dear rick 37<P>Question is - who knows the answer to your question? I dont. Although I do think Goochy has given a lot of food for thought. I can only add that from my analysis - and yes, h describes me as being overly analytical - says I should accept things more at face value - well I have, thats why I have decided that if he is back with OW then I am out of the picture by choice - but I digress - what I want to say is that I believe that although H really cares for me - and helieve him when he says I am the most important/significant person in his life and that he cannot imagine life without me - I have to accept the reality that OW remains in the picture and that is not acceptable to me. I have to acknowledge and come to terms with the fact that he seems to want to have his cake and eat it too ! I see that as weak ie. he is just too weak (I would never have believed I could think this once) to do the hard work of recovery - good fun times with OW are easier for him to deal with. <P>Our "final" talk comes at the end of the month. I am now trying to leave him with thoughts of me as the caring and understanding person that I know I am while building my own strength and self esteem - and with dignity while at the same time leaving the door slightly ajar for him - I actually feel very sad that he sees no future with OW - she is 20+ years younger - and he is not exactly what i would be looking for if I was 35 and single - of course there is no future for her with a man that suffers chronic depression; is extremely moody; has a bad back; suffers from ulcers etc; not quiet what I would have been looking for at that age but maybe if you are fairly desperate and heis quite well off then it is beter than nothing. <P>Sad thing is that his own prediction of ending up a "sad and lonely old man" is probably true. But it is his choice.<P>R

Rick,<P>I don't know who is but when we find out I the have the wax doll all ready, just need the pins. Yes, I am in a farily evil mood.<P>Do you know who is teaching OP101? I am still trying to figure out why she is still waiting for my WH to divorce me (it has been almost 2 yrs? Oh well, one of lifes many mysteries.

Rick, being used DOESN'T enter a WS's mind - mainly b/c WS in these cases is operating with half a brain. Believe me, I know.<P>Since I snapped out of it, all I can say to myself is "What was I thinking?????". When you're actually in the situation there seems to be no way to face reality.<P>And even if there is no future with the OP, the OP usually hints that there is, that the relationship is so special, etc. Oh, please.<P>I hope your W wakes up before she loses someone who loves her very much.

I'm sure your laundry is done but I'm having my morning coffee and killing time so I'll bite.<P>Loser or not, the OP fills the aliens needs. How many times does the OP have to piss the alien off before they get terminated? My guess is that in an A, they rarely have the type of disagreements that married people have. They are just so happy to have somebody who understands them, blah blah blah... Sooner or later they will deal with issues.

Yo Rick - I think this WS 101 course is taught during the period when the aliens have extracted the WS's brains and replaced them with whatever they were experimenting with that week - maybe laundry lint.<P>I'm guessing, but I'll bet that the narcotic effect of the affair significantly shortens the WS time horizon. Future? What's that? They've become adolescents - how many teenagers do you know that are putting their babysitting money into mutual funds?<P>Your wife is still on the high. I can tell a difference between yours and mine now. My wife may be coming down because she's being a bit more rational. I remember the time when she was like yours - like 10 year olds on a sleepover with a candy high.<P>Now, let me stir the pot at the risk of hurting someone's sensitivites. Blast away if you want: An old adage I frequently think of goes like this. <P>Men marry their wives expecting they won't change, but they do. Women marry their husbands expecting them to change, but they don't. <P>Perhaps female WSs can overlook obvious "non-future" potential in their OMs, because they expect they can mold them into what they want. Male WSs see these perfect sex units and expect them to stay that way forever.<P>OK, hit me.<P>Dave (WAT)

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Goochy:<BR><B>It is like a drug addiction.. You feel sad, scared, lonely and insecure, nobody loves you but the drug.. Therefoe you take in as much as you can as quickly as you can. Loosing everything in sight, morals, Love, selfworth, reality, and your family and friends. One day you wake up Alone, scared insecure, tired, unloved, humiliated, hurt, and ashamed for all the harm you caused..<BR></B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Right on the money, Diane. I read that and realized that is exactly what my wife went through. It took me 4 months to get her to move back home, another 6 months to quit contacting OM. Now on 15 months (I pray) of no contact. I think it's working!<P>Bama<P>

<p>[This message has been edited by AloneAlot (edited January 12, 2001).]

Thanks Rick for starting this interesting discussion with your laundry question! <P>In my case, my H is really the last guy you would expect to do this (I know everyone says that, but it is really true). He has more integrity and is more dutybound than almost anyone I know. For him to be able to have the A, EA at least, he has had to work very, very hard to try to rationalize it and for the most part cannot do it so I think he just doesn't deal with it. He has admitted in the last couple of months that he thinks and makes plans about 1 hour ahead of where he is. From what he has said about his talks with his new counselor, he really hasn't before this been thinking about what the future really looks like. <P>So I agree with whoever said that their concept of time is very short and the future is tomorrow, maybe next week, but not much longer.

My H has said to me also I just take each day as it comes. That is great and probably the only way he can deal with his situation right now. In our marriage we always were planning for the future. Everything we did was to get us to where we wanted to be. We set goals and achieved them One by One.<P>Now in his life he is hanging on a thread. everything we worked for is gone (By his choice). I guess when you are in such a scary place as they are it is hard to commit to the future. In marriage you see your future in an A everything is up in the air, how could you set goals and strive to achieve them. The only security he has right now is knowing that OW will be there to lie around on the couch with him and makeout. <BR>When you have kids, house, job,yardwork, housework, and a life you are trying to build for everyone involved, It becomes a little difficult to hangout and be a teenager all day. Reality SUCKS!!!<P>H reality right now is that Kids do not want to see him. Do you think this is enough for him to make better choices. I seriously doubt it.. The Fairytale continues...<P>Diana

Hi, can I pitch in my two cents here? I'm going on what I've observed from my own history and from the experience of my female friends over the years. I cannot speak for men, but I could assume this hypothesis might be applicable for them as well.<P>I think that a lot of us, particularly women, equate sex, time shared with a man, gifts, etc., with a possible "forever." As long as there is *some* attention, even a phone call, there is "hope." Many people (a lot of women) equate sex with love, and the two are inseperable. I cannot count the times I've witnessed my friends crying in their martinis over a man they picked up at a party and slept with who didn't call the very next day and want to be their steady boyfriends. I confess, I've made the same mistake - expecting too much out of a too-little situation.<P>I hope that I don't catch any flak for mentioning specific gender; however, I do believe that women are simply cut out differently from men, and they expect forever when forever is not possible, or even offered. The lie that because a man sleeps with us will make him love us forever is dangerous ... but we keep doing it to ourselves, and lying to ourselves, thinking that with more exposure to the person and with more sex, that will bring us closer to that forever kind of love.<P>Just some thoughts from my single days ...<P>belld

Thanks everyone for the interesting replies. I better not try and reply back to each one, cause I'd be here all night.<P>This particular topic is one I find hard to understand, although I'm living it with my WS, and have read enough here to sort of get it. Crazy though.<P>In my wife's case, about 3 years ago one of the couples in our wedding party split suddenly, the female had started talking to a male "friend", and boom, gone. Insisting that they were friends. H couldn't stand it, and knew better. Had no MB to help him. Last I heard she was with this guy, he moved in right away...sad for their 2 children. But my wife blasted that woman till the cows came home. Little did I know my wife would do just like her.<P>Also, in my snooping during the fall, I learned that my wife and OM had attempted to be just friends several times, but soon were "right back at it" (as my wife wrote). She would sometimes say she understood "the situation" and knew what would happen to "this relationship", but that he was going to have to be the one to call it off. His parents forbid him from being involved with her. Now it almost makes sense, because sometimes over the past several months, she'd get more friendly, talk as though she might come back someday, bla bla bla. Probably lined up with when it was over temporarily (which probably lasted 2 hours).<P>I suppose he has this wonderful excuse not to commit, and nothing to lose, so "yee haw - a beautiful married chick to play with". And she is willing to keep going. I expect that even now, regardless of what is happening, they probably envision this lifetime special friendship if the passion wears off.<P>Anyway, just curious as to what everyone thought. Thanks.

Rick<P>I was going to jump in here, but it looks like you have gotten a load of advice here, or at least scenarios.<P>I will add the one I was going to say. I think it lies in "dancin with the devil." What I mean is that it is so darn exciting to be doing the deed. You have already dealt the blow to the family, so you do not have to replay that. You can just enjoy it as long as it lasts. <P>But it is like holding on to the wisps of a good dream. Eventually you know that it will be over and so you hold onto sleep as long as you can until reality bursts in and it is over.<P>I hope dawn breaks for you Rick. She is a nut. I think all WS are. Mine included.

ok what is WS?

wayward spouse

Hi Rick,<P> I enjoy your posts. You have a wonderful sense of humor, a very admirable quality. In spite of your situation. I hope to keep mine.<P> Your situation sounds just like my D. She left her H and 3children. She is living with her OM. She even has the audasity to blame him because he recieved custody of the children. He took them away from her, she has no car, no money, no home. I suggested to her that if she had kept the kids herself he would not have been able to take those things from her. She has no comment to that.<P> My H who also had a E/A P/A actually thinks I am being unkind to her. Like I am high and mighty and being judgemental. What do I do reward them?? Do I say ok you are right in your choice? Her H is a really nice person.<P> I guess I need to pray for her. That is all I can do. Maybe pray for myself for being so hardnosed??<P>------------------<BR>Deb