Has anyone read this book? and if so what is your take on it?<BR>For those of you that dont know.<BR>Dr. Dobson says that at the first incedent of infidelity you sould tell the spouse that you will not put up with it and basically tell them to go. Kind of like straight to Plan B.<P>His believe is that if you sit and cry and beg them, that make the WS want to leave more. And usually if you just stay with them they think they are having their cake and eating it too. They have their OP and their spouse.<P>So he suggests, telling or writing you WS and telling them basically. When you decided to take responsiblity with your marriage and family then call me, untill then stay away.<P>And he claims that usually(not all the time) the spouse will come back around cause they are finally face with the reality of what they will be losing.<P>What do you think?<BR>I do believe that you should be as nice and loving to the WS as you can. Which is PLAN A.<BR>BUT..... I think that sometimes your WS just love the idea of being able to have you at their beck and call, and still have an OP.<P>------------------<BR>Experience is what you get when you don't get what you want.

I used Dobson's book upon discovery. I think it was extemely helpful to me at a time when all of this was new to me. I wasn't mentally in the condition to think things out entirely -- my whole world was crumbling. Love Must Be Tough was very helpful during the first, chaotic times. It helped me show her that I did indeed have some modicum of respect for myself.<P>That said, I never had to resort to the instant Plan B. When my W told me about the A, she had already ended it two months prior.<P>Ultimately, she did reinstate contact about 4 mos after D-Day, but fortunately, by that time (which I found out 2 mos after that), I understood things about myself and relationship better and had started the MB program.<P>I'm not sure that Dobson's Plan B approach would be so great right off the bat (although I'm not unconvinced); I think the MB Plan A/Plan B fits much better with who I am.<P>I think that everything short of Dobson's Plan B is great though. I can't tell you how much that book helped me early on -- everything from gaining insight and finding out that I wasn't alone, to knowing how to act at a time when I felt absolutely insane.<P>I would consider Dobson the starting point and MB the ending point. Make sense?

I've read Dodson's book on tough love and his parenting books. I think he he right on. There is actually not a lot of difference between what he says to do and what Harley says to do. In many ways they are both saying the same thing. Give the WS a chance to take responsibility (Pan-A). If they do not then it's Plan-B. The main difference is that Dodson would make Plan A very short.<P>E

BioMan:<P>In the <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/forum/Forum29/HTML/000554.html" TARGET=_blank>notable posts thread</A> (Just Found Out), there's at least one discussion of <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/forum/Forum1/HTML/010263.html" TARGET=_blank>Love Must Be Tough.</A>.<P>My issue with the Dobson approach is that it's a somewhat manipulative Plan B. And the claim that they "usually" come back is probably more like a less than 50% proposition.<P>Plan A is an effort to demonstrate good marital behavior---changing areas in the marriage that you contributed problems to. You're absolutely right in that some spouses will stay on the fence (or enjoy) during Plan A. That's why there's Plan B---and one shouldn't wait too long to get there (too long is when you go to a divorce as opposed to a separation). So my take on this is that Harley's methodology is more complete, and gives a greater chance for marital restoration AND it also gives the betrayed a leg up on the recovery process, should divorce occur.

excellent book! I read it and followed his advice. Then went to plan A, did not work straight to B.

See i love the book, and I love Surviving an affair too.<BR>But.. i didnt read either of these untill i had done everything the books said dont do.<BR>I cried and begged(love must be tough said dont do).<BR>and i said really hurtful things(certainly not a PLAN A).<P>But i really wish i would have went to a straight plan B, cause i know my STBX really well and i think that would have effected her more.<BR><P>------------------<BR>Experience is what you get when you don't get what you want.

BioMan - don't beat yourself up over this. I didn't find this site until over a month after my wife moved out, and over three months after the moose brain worms hit. I was doing Plan A, sorta, but looking back on what I know now, and my circumstances, I should have gone to Plan B when she moved out, but I didn't know.<P>But we don't really know if it would have been any different. I've been where you are, second guessing, but my critics here rightly slapped me around. Now it's my turn to slap YOU around. Don't do this!! You're a good guy and you WILL be the winner.<P>WAT

Hi Bioman,<P>That book was recommended to me several times here. After much prodding, I picked up a copy at Barnes and Noble. My copy also came with an added bonus about what men know and women need to know (something like that). I have been reading back and forth between the 2 of them and find it helpful. <P>For me, using the principles in the Tough Love book was necesary. It is similar to plan B. Looking back, I believe plan A is good but from what I see many have been in plan A to long. When being in plan A begins to hurt the BS, then it is time to reevaluate and go to plan B &/or tough love. I don't have the book in front of me right now, but there are some quotes that were real helpful. I will try to look them up tonight. <P>What it has done for me is strengthen my character. I learned to be ready for whatever comes my way and still be ok with myself. It kept me from losing 'my' self-esteem and be able to hold my head up during this whole mess. Yes, I was sort of there already since I am that type of person in other parts of my life, but this A thing is a whopper no matter how strong a character you have. So it was good. Dara and Kevin on the d/d board really helped me. Despite my struggle, they kept me in place and I did not lose my santity. <P>I hope I can help someone else someday as well. I am indebited to them and many others here. So I think the book is good. Pull out the good and discard the bad is a motto I carry with me. <P>Take Care, <BR>L.

Love Must be Tough worked for me! I too espouse the position that Plan A should not go on for very long. There are many consequences to long Plan A's. We are all humans and as such, most often we do not change unless there is something to lose.

<BR>God, thanks for telling me about this book. I'm going to the bookstore now. <P>Adrian!<P>