I have searched and searched for advice and cannot seem to find any so I am hoping to obtain some insight here.<BR>A quick overview of my life:<BR>I have been with my H since I was 14, left home at 16 and moved in with him. Had a baby at age 18 and married. I am now 35.<BR>While dating there was physical abuse and I did leave him for 1 year, I ended up coming back and getting preganant. Whil pregnant I was beat so bad that my face was disfigured I should have left but didn't, somehow I convinced myself that he will not do it again. Now let me say this he is a good guy and I see the good deep down but it is hard to remain his shrink. Anyway, too speed up things my life to date has been filled with jealous obsessive behaviour. And further abuse. 3 years ago and 2 children later, he had an affair and left me, moved in with her and treated me so poorly throughout all of it I was reduced to alcohol. I ended up taking him back, he begged and pleaded and had both my mother and his convince me that we belong together and the kids need us. I took him back with one condition, do not make the ball and chain any heavier on me than it was. I had never had any affiars on him, but I will admit to some flirting over the years. We spent the next few years trying to rebuild, again, abuse, control constant badgering his insistance that he had an affair on me so I must be having one on him, I began to go crazy. I started to think that I might as well have an affair because I am being accused of it all the time. I could not even make myself look nice without him accusing me.<BR>Now, here is the problem I met a man with whom I have to work with. We live on each side of the country, but we were able to have conversations about work and family and eventually became friends. The problem is we ended up at an annual convention, and our feelings toward one another became sexual. We ended up in my room and suddenly realized the mistake we were about to make. Nothing happened other than the ideas and some kissing and hugging. WE agreed that this was too close for comfort and would never put ourselves in that position again. Well we emailed one another in order to sort through things and GUESS WHAT? my suspicious H hacked into my email and read all. Well now I am the one! He has made this to be more than anything, I cannot move now forsure, we are in councelling and it does not seem to work. I feel so trapped and smothered. He still hacks into my computer, questions every move, calls me at work all day, expects me to tell him how much I love him and then will start an arguement that I am the problem and I have no remorse and that I have a dual personallity. He writes letters asking me if I want to reamin in the marriage and every little word triggers him. He trusts no one! I am not allowed to have female friends, buy new clothes or breathe. If I want to have a hot bath and do some personal grooming he has a problem. He says he does not trust me and that I am not honest. But yet I find myself feeling guilty about things that I should not, only because I know how he thinks. He also has a high sex drive, wants to talk about sex constantly, and plans our day around "good Sex" on these days he is on his best behaviour!<BR>I feel I am loosing my mind! that the world would just be better off without me! Surely this is not normal? I do not know normal as I have been with this forever. I just want peace and happiness.<P>Help

"Now let me say this he is a good guy and I see the good deep down but it is hard to remain his shrink. "<P>Your definition of good and everyone else's definition is not the same. No he is not a good guy. So far I can't see that your marriage can last. I know people are supposed to be positive and encourage staying together but this is ridiculous. You should have left after your got beat, no before you got beat. There is no excuse for this. None, zero , zip. No man should treat a woman this way.

Honey this is not normal, this is classic and horrible abuse. You are placing yourself in great danger and your children will most likely grow up to find equally or worse abusive partners from your example if you don't do something now.<P>No one should tolerate or live with a physically abusive partner, this is not normal and I would say your reactions to it are actually way less than normal, a much stronger flight/ self-preservation reaction would be far healtier for you in this situation, and for your children too. Were you raised in an abusive home? I'd dare to guess he was, so I would limit your trust in your parents advice here.<P>He has cut you off from the world to control you, this is classic abuser behavior. Get help now from a trained professional, before he puts you in the hospital or kills you, please, and make plans to leave to a safe place- look for a local battered women's shelter in your area if necessary- go somewhere he can't find you and get a good public defender to help you file for divorce if you can't afford a regular lawyer, the courts or the shelter should be able to help you here. There are networks out there to support you through this, use them, please, and don't hesitate to call the cops over the least little threat to document it so you can get a restraining order if he goes psycho on you which he is likely to do. I say all this with the greatest of love and concern for you and your children, and all your safety. Please update us on how you are doing. You have alot of support here from people who really care.<P>

Thank all of you for your support.<P>I know I must go, I have a great job am financially secure so no problem there.<BR>That is just it I do not know what the problem is!<BR>I have spent my morning on mSN with him fighting. He is blaming me for everything and I must admit I do feel guilty with my almost affair. Is this why I put up with it now. I just cannot seem to find my way clear.<BR>We are in counselling, but I find it not helping me. <BR>He is now on a fit of rage(on MSN) threatening, calling me a liar, a slut, and on and on.<BR>I find myself with excuses, to stay.<BR>I take full responsibilty for my actions and am truly sorry for even thinking about another man and I was wrong for that but at what point should I say enough. I am afraid of him, but I must tell all of you that he is a great father and provider and does have a warm heart. I think it is me that brings the worst out in him.<BR>I ask myself questions like, do I just leave a note and go?<BR>Do I obtain a court order? WHat about the kids?<BR>He will set out to destroy me. He has already threaten to "expose me" to work and he has emailed a very threatening letter to my so-called lover. I asked him not to read it to me because I could imagine. I was not abused as a child but come from divorced parents, I was very loved <BR>He on the other hand was very abused and recently made a decision to cut all ties with his siblings. Every move I make leads backl to my having and affair, and how are I, and on and on.<BR>I have read books, stories, etc. on jealousy, co-dependancy and cannot find hope or light at the end of the tunnel.<BR>I was also told to read a book on infidelity but cannot see myself as the one who did it to him. Should I feel worse for having feelings for someone other than him. In fact I was so scared that we have not even spoken about that moment again. and have only had casual business talk. <BR>I must be driving all of you crazy!<BR>I am sorry but I do appreciate your words<BR>

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by ruined:<BR><B>While pregnant I was beat so bad that my face was disfigured...Now let me say this he is a good guy and I see the good deep down</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>A good guy, huh? Boy, he is giving us (me) a bad name . Sounds like a real peach.<P>You know what to do, unless you want to pull a Nicole Brown Simpson on us...<P>AGG

Nope, not driving me crazy, so don't apologize at all. All abusers have a warm wonderful honeymoon side to them, sort of a Jekyl and Hyde routine, this is so textbook that it's just scarry. Don't think for a moment that Dr Jekyl isn't lurking in there still and always will be until he is ready to get serious help, which you cannot do for him.<P>As for your almost affair, I will not say it was the right thing to do, but hey, we all do things we regret in life, life goes on, in the end you made the right decision to not do it, so pat yourself on the back for that much at least. we all have our breaking points. You should have left instead, but DON"T listen to him on this and feel guilty into staying, you know you have to go, do it, please. <P>The problem you are having is that these types of relationships are addicting. you get addictedto the adrenaline of it, dependant upon him because he has been the center of your entire world for so long, by his force remember, but no less frightening to face such change. Deal with your sorriness for what you have done with God on your own, and get out of there asap and get yourself lots of help, please please please! You DO deserve better than this! There are men out there who will love and cherish you and your children and not hurt you. <P>You are in danger of going back to him or getting involved with another abuser if you do anything right after leaving him start individual couseling to help you rebuild yourself esteem, tomorrow if possible.<P>You can do this. Start making calls to battered women' shelters for advice and help right now, ok?<P>

Nope, not driving me crazy, so don't apologize at all. All abusers have a warm wonderful honeymoon side to them, sort of a Jekyl and Hyde routine, this is so textbook that it's just scarry. Don't think for a moment that Dr Jekyl isn't lurking in there still and always will be until he is ready to get serious help, which you cannot do for him.<P>As for your almost affair, I will not say it was the right thing to do, but hey, we all do things we regret in life, life goes on, in the end you made the right decision to not do it, so pat yourself on the back for that much at least. we all have our breaking points. You should have left instead, but DON"T listen to him on this and feel guilty into staying, you know you have to go, do it, please. <P>The problem you are having is that these types of relationships are addicting. you get addictedto the adrenaline of it, dependant upon him because he has been the center of your entire world for so long, by his force remember, but no less frightening to face such change. Deal with your sorriness for what you have done with God on your own, and get out of there asap and get yourself lots of help, please please please! You DO deserve better than this! There are men out there who will love and cherish you and your children and not hurt you. <P>You are in danger of going back to him or getting involved with another abuser if you do anything right after leaving him start individual couseling to help you rebuild yourself esteem, tomorrow if possible.<P>You can do this. Start making calls to battered women' shelters for advice and help right now, ok?<P>

Nope, not driving me crazy, so don't apologize at all. All abusers have a warm wonderful honeymoon side to them, sort of a Jekyl and Hyde routine, this is so textbook that it's just scarry. Don't think for a moment that Dr Jekyl isn't lurking in there still and always will be until he is ready to get serious help, which you cannot do for him.<P>As for your almost affair, I will not say it was the right thing to do, but hey, we all do things we regret in life, life goes on, in the end you made the right decision to not do it, so pat yourself on the back for that much at least. we all have our breaking points. You should have left instead, but DON"T listen to him on this and feel guilty into staying, you know you have to go, do it, please. <P>The problem you are having is that these types of relationships are addicting. you get addictedto the adrenaline of it, dependant upon him because he has been the center of your entire world for so long, by his force remember, but no less frightening to face such change. Deal with your sorriness for what you have done with God on your own, and get out of there asap and get yourself lots of help, please please please! You DO deserve better than this! There are men out there who will love and cherish you and your children and not hurt you. <P>You are in danger of going back to him or getting involved with another abuser if you do anything right after leaving him start individual couseling to help you rebuild yourself esteem, tomorrow if possible.<P>You can do this. Start making calls to battered women' shelters for advice and help right now, ok? And do clear your cashe on your computer so he won't see your threads before he gets home, or leave before he gets home, I'm afraid you will be in danger if he sees these posts and thinks you might leave him. Go to Tools at the top of the browser, click Internet Options, in the middle where it says delete files, push it, then ok, then also push clear history, then ok.<P>If you can leave today, do, and don'tleave your kids, they will be his next target if you are gone. You don't even owe this guy a note really, definitely do not tell him where you are going if you leave one. Switch jobs and towns if it gets too bad and/or get order of protection. God bless you and I will be praying for you.<P><BR>

you know the he's a realy nice guy thing, it has been said by every other woman who has been in abusive relationship throughout time. It's textbook. There is a honeymoon period where he is perfect, romantic, wonderful, then wham, Dr Jekyl appears, right?<P>I will not say that what you did was right, but you did stop yourself before you made a huge mistake, pat yourself for that and do what you should have done instead which is leave. Do not let him convince you that his treating you this way is your fault, I wouldn't let anyone treat my dog like that, you deserve better!!<P>If you do anything today, before he gets home clear your cashe so he will not see these threads, I am afraid for your safety if he sees you have outside help and might be leaving. Go to tools then click internet options in the middle hit the button that says delete files, then ok, then hit clear history, then ok.<P>Do please call your local battered womens shelter or group for help in getting out safely NOW. You do not even owe this guy a note, but if you do do NOT tell him where you are going, you might even consider a new location/ job. Do not leave your kids with him, they would be his next target if you did.<P>If you do anything after you leave please get individual counseling for yourself to help you rebuild your shattered self esteem. This was not your fault, and you will end up either back with him and eventually dead or with another one just like him statistically if you do not.<P>Be safe, you can do this. I will be praying for you. Please update on what happens. God bless.<BR>

you know the he's a realy nice guy thing, it has been said by every other woman who has been in abusive relationship throughout time. It's textbook. There is a honeymoon period where he is perfect, romantic, wonderful, then wham, Dr Jekyl appears, right?<P>I will not say that what you did was right, but you did stop yourself before you made a huge mistake, pat yourself for that and do what you should have done instead which is leave. Do not let him convince you that his treating you this way is your fault, I wouldn't let anyone treat my dog like that, you deserve better!!<P>If you do anything today, before he gets home clear your cashe so he will not see these threads, I am afraid for your safety if he sees you have outside help and might be leaving. Go to tools then click internet options in the middle hit the button that says delete files, then ok, then hit clear history, then ok.<P>Do please call your local battered womens shelter or group for help in getting out safely NOW. You do not even owe this guy a note, but if you do do NOT tell him where you are going, you might even consider a new location/ job. Do not leave your kids with him, they would be his next target if you did.<P>If you do anything after you leave please get individual counseling for yourself to help you rebuild your shattered self esteem. This was not your fault, and you will end up either back with him and eventually dead or with another one just like him statistically if you do not.<P>Be safe, you can do this. I will be praying for you. Please update on what happens. God bless.<BR>

Ruined, you sound like the typical battered woman. Making excuses for him, saying how great he is with the kids! Ok, he is great with the kids, shouldn't all parents be great with there kids, he deserves no medal of award for that. His treatment of the kids and his treatment of you are two different things. You having an affair was wrong, his having an affair was wrong, affairs are wrong period...end of subject. But his physical and mental abusive is psychotic and will only get worse before it can get any better. You can't help this man by continuing to show love and acceptance of his behavior, the more you accept it the more he will continue to do so. He needs a good therapist and I would suggest you start looking for a better one, because if you counselor has not told you that your husband is ABNORNAL then you have a counselor that went to a MICKEY MOUSE COLLEGE!

Guys, I apologize- I have NO idea what happened earlier. I tried to reply and it just sat and sat and then said the page could not be displayed, so I hit back and it was empty- so I sighed and tried to fill out the same thing- once or twice I got smart and copied it all before I tried to submit incase it happend again. I really wanted to reply- as you can tell, and it kept saying the page would not got through- so I gave up and went to a PTA meeting- now I check it and they are ALL there??!! I'm so sorry. But my heart was in the right place.<BR>

Gee ScaredinNY, maybe someone wanted your message to be heard...you think. <P>Ruined:<P>Please listen to what the others have said...there's truth there and wisdom...you just can't see it because your blinded by the situation. My sister was so much like you...beaten and scared by her cop-husband into a life of just existing from one "honeymoon" period to another beating until the day he finally pulled a gun and threatened to shoot her...and she too had strayed outside the marriage. Oh, they stayed together and eventually he began to include the children in his beatings. Is this what you want for your children??? At the very least children who are raised in and abusive family tend to abusive their own wifes/husbands and children. <P>You say "I think it is me that brings out the worst in him"....no you are just the only one who will put up with this kind of behavior...anyone else he treated this way would have him arrested. Abusers have problem that are not fixable by anyone else...they need professional help in dealing with their anger and possessive behavior. Your H may well be a "nice guy and good father" but apparently his upbring has left him with scars that need healing and he will never get that help unless he is threatened with losing you and his family and is forced to deal with it...and even that may not be enough to make him change...but it is a first step...and the best thing for you and your children. <P>I know this is hard for you...but in the end it will be the best thing for all. We'll be praying for you.<P>Faye<P>

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by ruined:<P>[Surely this is not normal? I do not know normal as I have been with this forever. I just want peace and happiness.<P>Help [/B]<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Ruined,<BR>(first, I apologize that my post is going to be kind of long)<BR>Yes, please do listen to the posters on this thread. You are in a very bad situation and what makes it worse is that you are motivated by FEAR to stay with your H. I know, because I am in a very similar relationship with my H. <P>Back in the beginning of our relationship, my H was physically abusive to me two times. We were engaged then, and I was so shocked by his behavior that I convinced myself I was the 'cause' of it. Reason? Fear. I was afraid of losing him, afraid of losing this 'great guy' to someone else, of being alone again, of looking like a failure to my family and friends. So, I ignored his abusiveness. He promised to never touch me in anger again, and for the next 15 years, he kept his promise. I congratulated myself, thinking that I was right to ignore his very mean streak.<P>Then one day, he just snapped. He decided to have an A with an OW and I found out about it. I cannot tell you how horrible his verbal, emotional and mental abuse has been these past few months! Although he hasn't hit me at all, his words and actions have done a number on me emotionally to the point where I was thinking of suicide. Then, one day, a turning point happened. After months and months of being ignored sexually by him, he forced himself on me and then I knew: THIS IS NOT LOVE. Although I truly do love him, I realized that what he had felt for me all these years was not love, but some kind of sick attachment. Like your H, mine was (and still is) also very controlling and untrusting and I found myself constantly accounting to him for my every move. It is a wonder I never had an affair myself, I was so unhappy! I was too afraid to even consider it (again, FEAR). I was afraid to do anything but stay in the marriage and do my best. After all, he had so many good qualities and "deep down was a good guy", too.<P>I am now attending a support group for battered women, and it is saving my life. They are helping me to see things as they truly are, not as I wish they were or thought they were. Each day, I am becoming stronger and learning to love myself again. I am also slowly realizing that being "alone" is preferable to being with someone who hurts me. My fear of what others will think is almost nonexistent now, because they are not the ones who suffer his abuse. Most of all, I am learning that I was very wrong to ignore one important fear and that was the fear of being abused. I should have listened to myself 15 years ago and slammed the door on him, but I didn't and now I am paying the price. <P>As for your having an almost affair, the fact is that you didn't follow through. In a moment of vulnerability, you caved in but were wise enough to not let it go all the way. Perhaps you were so relieved to receive attention from someone who treated you nicely that you responded to that, and I don't think you should beat yourself up for that one moment longer! It's unfortunate that your H found out about it, but if he is anything like mine, down deep he is GLAD. NOW, he has a "reason" to control you and continue his abusive behavior (this is called justification). That alone should tell you something, Ruined. <P>You need the help of a support group or a counselor who is very experienced in handling abuse cases. This is something you cannot do alone, Ruined. First, you need to recognize the problem, then you need to rebuild your love and respect for yourself. Once you do that, you'll be on your way to a healing and recovery. I am still in the beginning stages of recovery but am having many victories, anyway. One day, I hope to be strong enough to tell him HE needs help, too, but I'm not quite there yet.<P>The sooner you get started, the sooner you will be safe again. Please listen to all of us and take a step--a real one--in a positive direction. We care...<P>Hugs and prayers,<BR>Winny<BR><p>[This message has been edited by Winnytoo (edited June 06, 2001).]

<BR>I am really worried about you ruined. What happened last night, what have you done, decided to do? How are you, where are you? If you are out there please update.<P>

What awful things to live thru.Honey you need to get out.You are making excuses for this animal.If not get out for you get out for your children.This is not love he is showing you this is a sick control.The abuse im sure will never stop,and does your mother his mother know what he has done to you.If you can take care of your self and your children why do you stay.You need to do whats right for your self and your children.I will be thinking of you,be safe<P>------------------<BR>Tracy<p>[This message has been edited by Traci493 (edited June 06, 2001).]

Hello everyone,<BR>I am so sorry for not responding earlier I soooo appreciate all of your support.<BR>I do not know where to begin, I spoke with H and told him how I am feeling, controlled, manipulated, abused etc. he responded by saying that I am a liar and that is why he is like this. I reminded him that he has always been this way and it is only now that I am not wanting to take it anymore.<BR>Then of course, the I love yous and I am so sorry and on and on. God I feel like such a fool. One good thing is that my mind is made up to get out it is just a matter of time.<BR>This is where I am at, I just can't see the light. I have a good job with a good income, so it is not money. I worry about the kids and uprouting them. There is so much to plan and consider that I find it so difficult. Then of course there are the threats, he has said he would ruin me, tell my work that I am a slut, call the almost affairs wife, and take the kids away. There seems like so much to consider that I find myslef just acting to keep piece because I am not ready to make the move. But yet if I could I would today! The games he plays with my mind are destroying me, but I keep telling myself that I am normal he is not. <BR>All of you have been very supportive and please do not think that I am not listening. I just wish I could curl up and make this all go away. It is the weekend, and I have to spend it with him. We have no friends that come to visit so I am stuck with him, and beleive me I cannot even have a bath without him sitting in there. He claims it is because he loves me and wants to be near me all the time, I have too say I love you at least 20 times a day and if I do not say it right he thinks it is a sign. <BR>Why do I always feel sorry for him and try to protect him?<BR>Why can't I just get out? Dr. Laura, says that you should stay a family unit at almost all costs. So I have guilt when I think about the visitation and all of the stuff that goes with divorce. <BR>He has made it very clear that he will not leave the house, so should I go and uproot the kids?<BR>These are all things that run through my mind.<BR>I am reading a book called "Uncoupling" I am hoping it will help.<BR>He is here now I must go .<BR>

What is more important to you? U and your childrens life or what everyone at work will think? If President's can't have affairs and still be looked up to BUSINESS wise so can you! I have to ask you, if you don't say I love you or if you don't let him watch you bath what happens? Is he physically abusive like b4 or verbally abusive? If physical then that would be your way out by calling the police and having him escorted out, change the locks, get a restraining order and set-up visitations with kids by way of a third party. I can tell you are afraid and you have lived over half your life with this man and you don't know any other way to live. If verbal abuse, then walk away, leave the house, or turn up the tv to blast him out, but show him that you are not the same 14 year old girl anymore. You are a woman and will be treated as such. He is afraid of losing his control over you and he is trying to keep it by his cruel words and threats. Better yet, tell him u just found out that SLAVERY ENDED!

trying 2 4 give I know you mean well, and I double the sentiment but if she ever said that she'd get beaten, not a good idea. Think it though honey, feel it own it. make your plans and make them fast, get out of there!<BR>Don't take his threats to heart and let me stop you, don't tell him, just do it.<P><BR>