I didn't go into great detail no. I explained that things between us had just gotten to the point that we weren't able to work things out. That we had both done too much to hurt one another. I also let her know that he had met someone else that he wanted to spend his time with and that it was her decision if she too wanted to spend time with this person when with her father but not mandatory.
I didn't really tell her about his affair directly. She's older now and was able to put two and two together and we've talked about it. I still don't place any blame on him or the other woman. She knows I don't believe in affairs, that your word should always mean something and that hurting people you love isn't an option if it can be at all avoided but I've also let her know that there isn't always a good enough explaintion for why things happen so sometimes it's easier to just accept what happened without looking for answers that might not be there to our liking.
Make sense?
I geuss what I"m trying to say is that she was looking for a reason that would validate or even make OK what he did and that reason will never be found so I would rather she accept it but without accepting it as something that is OK to do.
So anyway, she knows and has moved on and is a pretty decent person who has a set of morals and values and a belief system of her own. Shse knows right from wrong but she also knows there's not always a valid reason for why others choose to do wrong so she doesn't always hold things against others or base her whole idea of one person on one incident. Her father made a mistake, one that cost him more dearly and her too but she's able to have a fairly desent relationship with him inspite of it all and that is what was most important to me. What he did he did to me and our marriage but it wasn't something I wanted my daughter to hold against him.
Kids are to often put in the middle of thier parents marriage and I think that should be avoided at all costs, they're young and don't really understand everything that goes into making or breaking a relationship and I dont feel it's something they need to learn in a negative way.
I also know that I am sometimes hard to understand. I don't always word things the exact way I'm trying to say them so I hope I haven't confussed you more!

thanks. no you have not confussed me at all. you seem to be a very strong person. God bless you and your family.<p>hope.

need2know,
thanks for sharing about your W. Just knowing that she too is a Christian makes it so much easier to pray for her. It may not change a thing, but we both know that prayer is a powerful tool that God give his children to use.<p>I can very very much relate to your W. I too felt very neglected and so it made it that much easier for another man to enter my life. and it was only by the grace of God and many many praying people that I was able to break thru the fog and start again with my H. <p>I will pray that the fog lifts from your w's eyes.
Just be sure everything you tell your son is tempered with God's wisdom, not man's. <p>Debbie

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by need2know:
<strong>I did a pretty lousy job of it because I am absolutely obsessed with having my W see the A as I do. there is no way I will ever think he can be a good man. My morals and principals and honor say he is a weak piece of !@#$.
I am open to the changed hearts the Lord may provide, but I am also moving on in my mind. I cannot allow him to influence our son without knowing what he did.</strong><hr></blockquote><p>Dear Need2Know,<p>As a Xn who is the BS, I must throw in my 02¢ here. I'm "famous" for "calling a spade a spade," so get ready to get it!<p>I copied the major points that I want to address above...first of all, you said you did a fairly lousy job of Plan A, cuase you are "obsessed" with your W seeing the A as you see it. As a "committed Christian," you KNOW that can't happen! She is only going to moved as the Holy Spirit moves her, so there is nothing you can do to achieve this....WHY continue along this path? This is only going to do more harm in your future relationship w/her than good. And, YES, you WILL have a "future" relationship w/her. You have a child together.....even if you DO div. (And I will pray you DON'T), you will still be "bonded" with her in one way b/c of your son. Pray that GOD will show her what her relationship w/OM looks like TO HIM if you really want to see contrition.<p>The way you talk, it doesn't sound like you are "open to the changed hearts the Lord may provide." I think in order to be "open" OR even for God to BRING openness to any hearts (yours, OM's, OR W's), you are going to have to change your attitude. God ALONE is able to bring about change in our WS's, or even in ourselves. But that is what WE must be praying about, US! And only us. Yes, we can pray that God will open their eyes, that God will lead them home, show them their sin, cause repentence, etc. BUT there is nothing IN US that allows us to withhold forgiveness from them. In fact, even harboring negative feelings for OP is bad for US. I am just now learning this. I have been "convicted" these past 2 weeks that I need to be praying for OW in my H's life. This is harder, really, than anything that I have been through w/him so far. BUT it is what I have been told to do. I thought putting him on the "altar" and being willing to drive a stake into the heart of our M was the hardest. Nope. I found that relatively easy to do (sorta, and after many months of seeking God's will for us), but when God started saying that "OW needs to know God's forgiveness and gift of salvation, too" I balked! <p>However, the ONLY thing that will free YOu from him and from his influence on your (future) life and YOUR SON is for you to forgive him, and pray daily for HIM! I know, easy to say (NOT) and very hard to do. You are judging him! To call him "weak piece of !@#$" is to judge him. God is not pleased with that attitude. I hope you can see that, and change it (with God's help). It may be exactly how you feel, and he may feel that way about himself,too, but God doesn't want YOU to judge him, so that YOU won't be judged by that same standard!<p>As far as his future influence on your son, here again, I fear you are going about this all wrong. As long as you JUDGE him, and hold hatred (you hold SOME KIND of strong feelings....maybe hatred is too strong?) for him in your heart, that is going to eat at you and destroy YOU. Please don't let that happen. That will begin to corrode your relationship with your son. It will. It's a biblical principle. We become like what we most hate.....please let go of your feelings for him, OR your need to try to "expose" his sinful side to your son. It will be destructive to both of you. Your son will either "pick up on" your hatred and take it as his own, and then it will begin to eat at HIM, OR he will begin to look at YOU as a vengeful, angry, hate-mongering man and pull away from you. Not good prospects, either way. As far as what to tell your son about this? I think you need to put that on your W! SHE's the one who is having A. Let HER tell him about it! Maybe that will be the moment the "fog" lifts for her! Having to explain an "inappropriate" relationship w/OM while divorcing his dad.<p>Need2, please know that I AM NOT a "holier than thou" anything. I am just a BS, like you, and when my H left to go live w/OW, I went through all the same emotions, feelings, hatreds, thoughts, depressions, etc. However, in the last 2 months or so, I can feel that God is making me into a wonderful creature. A woman who pleases HIM, and I like it! I want to please Him, I want to stay in His Will. I FEAR being out of His Will, and missing His blessings for me. I try to follow his commands now, like the one He recently gave me to PRAY FOR OW. I'm sorry.... THAT is/was hard!! I'm still struggling with it. BUT it was disobedience to God that brought us to where we (H and myself) are, and I don't want to live like this anymore, with or WITHOUT my H. I don't know what our future is. My WH is STILL living w/OW, and STILL pursuing Div. from me. It's HIS problem....and God's. God HATES DIVORCE. I'm standing on that promise. I am going about everything else I can in my life, and letting God take care of what HE will. I can't change WH's mind or feelings about me or OW. I can't "force" WH to come home, or even to want to talk about working on M. That's all up to the Lord, too! All I can do is stay in obedience, and all that that means. If it means praying, or helping OW get saved, well, God's ways are "higher than our ways...." and I'll just know He HAS a better plan than mine!<p>I hope none of this offends you. I have a tendency to "sound" offensive to some people. I try to temper what I say with love and patience, but I have a strong personality, and I guess the words just gush out and "fall where they may" regardless of how I try to "sugar-coat" them. I am simply afraid for your future, since I sense a lot of pent-up hostility (not that it's not warranted! Just NOT Godly), and I know God doesn't want that in you anymore. Also, having a son who you are trying to raise in a Godly fashion, consider YOUR ways some more, and see the long-term effects of your actions and words on him as a man years from now.<p>Love and peace to you.
God Bless,
Lupo

Dear lupo,<p>Thank you so much for your post. I agree with in completely. I am asamed of the way I come across judgemental of OM and W. I do want to see them as Christ sees them (and me and you). I talk with my pastor and decon and tell them how much I want to do the right thing. God reveals to me the right thing time after time. It is just so hard to follow and let go. <p>The second time I conforted man i actually tried to witness to him. My W is so far in the fog she actually told me maybe God brought Om into her life to get him saved. I am not judging, my W is not into his word like we should be and I assured her God did not bring them together. <p>I have told W to start considering what SHE will tell son. I said as long as it is true I want it to come from her. I do love W and son and am not trying to hurt them. I just want the facts laied out. Son as always seen me and knows what kind of man I am--- good and bad. I just want him to know about the things that are so important that he cannot see.<p>I am ashamed about the piece of !@#!@ comment. I can't help myself. This is how I refer to him to my W. I know it is wrong but I am trying.<p>Thanks so much for your prayers. It means a lot to me and my family. I know my W is in there somewhere. <p>Peace and love to you.
N2K

need2know
I just read the whole thread and had to respond. I'm a ministers daughter who has been married for 30yrs no A. I'm also the Mom to a single OW. When I first found out about the affair, I reacted as you have. Anger, hurt, judgement. Then I found MB. You might say that God led me here where there are angles doing his work wheather they know it or not.<p>Please, Please , before you continue with the divorce, take a deep breath and read the book "surviving an affair". My Husband and I have read it and it has changed our perspective. Hold on! I'm not saying that it has changed our stand, our moral knowledge that this is WRONG, just our perspective. I'm actually beging you to read this book!!!!!<p>One thing that you said that julted me. You said, that you spent a lot of time in the basement DRINKING. Now, tell me, "in the eyes of God, is alochol abuse a lesser offence (sin) than an affair?<p>In the eyes of God, is divorce a solution that he would choose?<p>Please tell me, I want to know your thinking.<p>Now, run and get that book.

Gottruth,<p>I don't want a diviorce! Trhough Christian articals I came across saa. I had it the next day and read it in a few. It is W who is in fog. My bad plan a may lead to diviorce. I am still in family home and open to reconcilition.
I know I am a sinner and am no better then anyone else.We are all sinners in need of salavation through the Lord Jesus Christ. I don't claim to be any different. The Lord is working om me as I am sure he will be working on W if she is his.
Please pray for my family and me. I want her back and the courage to do a better job.<p>peace.