I have been wondering how many people out there blame their maritial problems on the OP? My h. and I are both guilty of a., he blames my OP, but says that his OW did nothing wrong. Let me be specific about where I am going with this. Before my a. I used to count the days in between our bitter(and I mean bitter) fights. I questioned whether or not I should stay very frequently. I loved him with all of my heart-but I would have continual chest pain from the stress. I will always be grateful to my OM because he let me be me and also because it took having an emotional breakdown and then an a. to get me to have the courage to leave. I know that some situations are different, but I wondered if it was easiest to blame the OP because we love our spouses?? I'd appreciate some input.

well..as a WS no I don't blame MY marriage problems on the OP..I take blame for my share of them and place the blame of the rest on my ex-h..
It was our marriage..our problems..we just didn't work them appropriately between ourselves in order to save the marriage..<p>He on the other hand..blames the OP..

They are all to blame. They all knew exactly what they were doing, and they sure as hell knew better then to ever mention the private lunch dates, etc. to me.<p>They all just assumed I was some kind of crazy b*tch who made my H's life miserable, since we all worked in the same office but he made a point of acting like he didn't know me. What else would they think? So, his favorite single young gal-pals just felt free to go off and spend quality time with him whenever they felt like it, knowing f*cking good and well he was a married man.<p>I despise them all. There's plenty of blame to go around. I can only hope that when they are married, their husbands end up working with delightful, harmless female friends who behave exactly the same wonderful way.<p>Psycho_B***h

Blame goes to both WS and OP.<p>Yes, there are vulnerable sad married people who attract opportunistic men and women who take advantage of their pain, but I have always felt that the OP didn't make the vow, our WS did. Therefore, I put WAAAAAAAY more blame on our own WS.

Blame goes to all three...BS, WS, and OP.<p>The BS, and WS are to balme for creating and environment where an affair could occur.<p>WS and OP are to blame for making such a selfish decesion as to have an affair. Both of them knew it was wrong but choose to take the selfish, sinful path anyway. [img]images/icons/shocked.gif" border="0[/img] They will someday regret it....that is for sure!

Thank you for your insight. In my case I blame everyone, but mostly myself and my h. I don't know many people who are dealing with affairs and complicated issues so I need to ask something else to get some input from any BS or WS. I want to know if anyone else's a. wasn't a result of lust or EN's not being met. I was sexually abused as a child and never dealt with it. My h. always told me I was in league with evilness because I didn't want to talk about it to him. Before we got married one of my ex-boyfriends tried to rape me, and my h. for five years told me that because of that I was unfaithful to him. I felt terrible about it and always wished to change it. When OM (who was H. friend) came along-my h. told him everything about me and how that had made him screwed up and made him have to fantasize about me with other men. Two days after knowing him, my h. started throwing me out of the house after him in the middle of the night accusing me of being in love with him. He told me to take OM on a trip with me and I said no. After five months of this, we were on our way to a graduation out of town, he comes home and says he never wants to see my f***ing face again, no arguement had happened, nothing. I ran into OM on my way out of town and asked him to come with me. We talked and I went home and told my h. Nothing had happened and I tried to go to counseling with my h. who said I was just a screwed up person who would never make the right choice. Needless to say one night after I hadn't seen the OM in about 5 months my h. came home extremely drunk and we got into a fight about the OM, he knocked me into something trying to go get in the car and I got a concussion. The next day I had sex with the OM-I was in the process of an emotional breakdown that landed me in the hospital. When my h. had his a. he came home and said,"at least we love each other". I'm not a slut and I don't sleep around. The OM said he didn't want to have sex and I freaked out until I had him crying. My c. calls it the dominant affect. I needed someone to control. Sorry for blabbing all of this,but no one has understood yet and I wondered, is there a difference between an a. that is a relationship and one like this? I paid for this constantly after we got back together and I should have, but I just wondered about some opinions on how you would have reacted and wondered if he's right. Sometimes I know he's wrong when he says I'd sleep with anyone, but sometimes I feel like maybe that's all I'm worth.

To quote the OW, she would never had been an issue if there were not problems in the marriage. True<p>to quote the STBX, OW chased him all over the company<p>I blame her for not letting him go when he tried to leave even moving to another country, evertime he tried she called & called & called & called till he give in<p>I blame them both for us not being able to work our problems out<p>I blame myself for leaving STBX in postion where someone like OW could sneak her way in to ruining a very fine man<p>I wish I could say I wish them happiness but I don't.<p>but I have peace & I wake up happy most days, of course it took 3 yrs

Well "our" marital problems were primarily my H's depression and his MLC. He admittedly did everything in his power to hide these things from me for as log as possible because he "didn't want a conflict and just hoped it would go away on it's own." If I'd had any inkling of what was going on in his head I would have done everything in my power to fix it. As a matter of fact the second he started acting strangely (which was when the A started) I was a the bookstore and searching the net to figure out what was wrogn and how I could help.
I blame him for not telling me how he felt and giving me the chance to help. I blame him for betraying me, lying to me, breaking our vows yada yada yada. And he took full responsibility once the fog cleared. No lame justifications.
As far as the OP - In my eyes I have ALWAYS considered people who have affairs with married people to be low life dirtballs who don't care about anyone but themselves. I felt this way long before I was married and have ended friendships with people who knowingly became OP. I figure people like that can't be trusted and might stab me in the back if I ever have something they want. The OW wasn't responsible for "our" problems or his problems. IMO she's just a rotten person who I never would have been friends with even if I knew her and she was banging some complete strangers husband.

Raine,
Of course you were looking for control...You couldn't control the abuse, you can't control rape, no matter what anyone says..including that little voice way deep inside of you, you are not responsible for the actions of others. You didn't deserve those things, just like you didn't deserve to have your husband dictate how you should feel about them, or make you responsible for how he feels about them. <p>I'm not giving you excuses for the A, or holding you blameless, but I sure can understand the feeling of being in an uncontrollable world.<p>You didn't say, but I hope you're working out some of these issues with your MC and H.
T

Twyla,<p>Yes. I have been in therapy for months, but now that I am not working on my h. anymore, I am focusing on me. It feels good, although someday he may hunt me down and kill me. He still calls in the middle of the night and comes ringing the doorbell at three a.m., my life is just going to be that way I guess. <p>I didn't sleep much last night because soon after I fell asleep my stbx called and started up this whole thing about how I ruined his life. I guess I should start unplugging the phone.

i get tired of hearing that the BS needs to take some blame for an A. in a position like Rainfalls i can understand why she had an A(abuse, mean husband ect.)
But when a WS has an affair because some EN are not being met, i think that is a terrible and unexcusable excuse.
in my case-i went out of town on a trip to visit my dad. my H went out with his friend and a co-worker girl went along. she held his hand(he didn't stop her)then when they were alone again she kissed him(he didn't stop her).then they all went out another night and were drinking and she came onto him again(no suprise)and they slept together.when i came home from my trip, he said he was unhappy in our marriage and fealt like he needed space and was overwhelmed with the responsiblity of our home,children and me. so he said he wanted to go to counseling and try to work through it. so i went on another trip to see other relatives to let him "work through" things. he let the A go on for a month without his friend or me even knowing. they would meet privately. and he of course never went to counseling.<p>my point is, he slept with her and THEN told me he was unhappy, then even after i told him i would do anything to help him, he continued to meet and sleep with her. it makes me sick! i didn't even have a chance to meet the EN he was unhappy about.<p>i blame him and OP. she is married too, and he didn't have enough love and thought of me to stop the initial advances. <p>i know he feels guilty but i wish the A made him realize how much he has to be thankful for in me, but it seems that it has only made him feel like maybe i could never make him happy. so i stay here waiting for him to decide if he wants to put the time and energy into making the A up to me and working on our marriage, when i feel like i should be calling the shots after what he did to me. it is all too unfair! i will take no blame for his actions!<p>M=5yrs
son=4, daughter=due in June
D-day=4-20-02

I don't blame the OM for the problems in our marriage at the time of the affair, however, I do blame him for taking advantage of them...

Heenie- lots of hugs your way. That sounds just really selfish. Take care of yourself and your kids. Hang in there-at the end of the tunnel there is light.<p>Hurting Deeply- I agree. The OP isn't to blame for the problems existing in the marriage, but for allowing themselves to become involved in them and take advantage of people.

Truce here .....ok?<p>I the BS/BW, accept my share of failing my WH needs and aiding in his weakness. I DO NOT ACCEPT THE BLAME FOR HIS CHOICE TO HAVE THE AFFAIR!!!! That is his and his alone. Yes, I do BLAME THE "OW" for jumping on my "WH" vulnerability, thus adding more pain and suffereing into a marriage that "SHE HAD NO BUSINESS STICKING HER NOSE INTO". She started out "being a sympathetic friend", showing concern for him "MY HUSBAND". If she had been "A TRUE FRIEND TO HIM OR BOTH OF US"....she would have encouraged marriage counseling, encouraged him to continue talking to me "HIS WIFE"......even show concern for "BOTH OF US" by coming to me.<p>She was "WH Friend", she knew exactly what she wanted and how to "reel him in". She was ging though her own divorce......<p>I am guilty only of not understanding him, not listening better, not meeting ALL his needs. "WH" also DID NOT COMMUNICATE THEM WELL. He is a quiet man and lets thing go until he "explodes". Then apologize after the fight and I didn't know whether to believe what he said in anger or after he calmed down. It didn't match! (I also was in pain reeling from stress coming from all directions that I had no control over,)but I did not "CHOOSE" to allow my self to "get reeled in and have an "A" on him!!<p>I blame them, (WH & OW) for the "A". I blame me for leaving my "WH" hurt and vulnerable. Stress makes us "BLIND".......it also sometimes makes us potray the "exact opposite" of what we really want or want to accomplish.<p>If I could have eliminated the stress...my brother would not have died at the hands of another, my mom would not be an invalid today, I would have insisted more that we move closer to work so we had more time together and less on the road.......I would have gladly freed the stress, devoted more time to my husbands needs and marriage. I'd chew my arms off for that right now.<p>WH choice to continue "A" and "OW" contribution by staying in the "A", is what is keeping "MY" husband and I from making this marriage the best it can be.........He is to "FOGGED UP" to see the greatest love he'll ever find IS RIGHT HERE!

Rainfall-
thanks for the response. i am trying to decide how best to take care of me and the kids. i am wondering if a seperation would be best right now. at least for a little while. it just is so unfair because i live in a state where i have no family or close friends near by. i would really like him to leave and rent a room somewhere so he doesn't get the luxury of our house. <p>you see the affair is over but he works with her and sees her everyday. they speak infrequently about business(once a week) and she has not tried, nor he, to make "friendlyl conversation". i do believe all this to be true.<p>the other day i was just disgusted by the thought of him and her and said i just wanted this to be over and that i thought i might leave and IF he ever decided that he truely wanted ME, then maybe we could work things out.i also thought that maybe it would help "preserve the love i do still have for him". he somewhat agreed that maybe that would be good, that maybe he would really realize what he was losing. that broke my heart too. see i want him to say he can't live without me, but that never seems to come out. i am still debating whether or not to "take a brake".

Raine,
Off the subject, but what measures have you put in place for your safety?
T

Heenie,
In the advice of my c. When everything is at it's best and you still don't want to be there, than that's the time to leave. Don't let him ruin you. Write him a list of what you expect and what you will give. Either he accepts it or not, but at least you have said it. Don't give up until you are certain you have tried as hard as you can. <p>Twyla,<p>I haven't done anything. He broke into my house last weekend while I was gone. Everytime I'm around him he tries to grab me and gets mad when I pull away. He said that if we tried to be friends "for the kids" than that's one more thing that I get. I said, "like you didn't get a 19 year old girl to screw while purposely getting me pregnant so I wouldn't leave". I don't know what to do, I'm going to try ignoring him, unplugging the phone. <p>BetrayedAgain,<p>I feel for you. I can tell you are hurting very deeply. I blamed the OW for going to him when she knew we were still married and knew that I was pregnant. my stbx, well he says, "she could give me what you couldn't. She understood me, she's not bad. She's a decent person with morals, unlike you". Well, let me vent for a minute because I've had enough for today, F**k you, she knew he was hiring her for a relationship, she met me, with my ring on, I said how nice she was. I let her call me when he was rude, I let him belittle me so that she wouldn't feel so bad, I wished i wouldn't have because they can both go to hell. He delibertly got me pregnant, he admitted it and two weeks later he's screwing some teenager, not to mention that I found out he's had thought about her the entire 7 years we've been together. I have morals, I broke down, but I'll be damned if I'm going to let him get away with being perfect. He even has a stupid bumper sticker that says, "nobody's perfect and I'm nobody." Sorry, I kind of went off, but his whole family says totally rude stuff about me, but leaving your wife for someone who would call your wife a slut, that's real courage. they even got mad at him for leaving her. Ok, I'm going to calm down or else I'll be wheezing. Thanks for listening, nobody in this stupid town understands. Oh, btw, they thought it would be just fair to tell the OM that I broke down on that my child might be his. Even though he knew it wasn't and I kenw it wasn't. For crying out loud I had sex with him for 10 stupid minutes a year before I had my child. Blame me, Blame me I feel like punching him. Again, sorry this is a real ranting session

Raine,
Please go to this site http://www.dvsheltertour.org/safety.html
and start making a safety plan..your husband is unpredictable and could become more violent at any time. Do this tonight. Make some phone calls to friends and family and have some safe places to go.
T<p>[ May 06, 2002: Message edited by: Twyla ]</p>

RAINE,<p>Please take Twyla's advice.<p>REPLACED

I had to take a breather for awhile today. It's been a long 24 hours. I am just so frustrated. I need a day off a day to relax. I will go to the website, although right now he is being nice, for the most part. I don't think I'll have real problems until the d. is final and I move on. But hey, one of his OW from last year came in to "see how he was doing". I said, "go for it, then you can blame your life on her and leave me alone." He got all mad, nothings going on. I told him it was none of my business. Is it bad to say I wish he would just find anyone so he would leave me alone?