I guess that might be a confusing title. But that's basically where I am. I guess some background is needed...(this is going to get long, probably- I have never had anyone I could talk to about this)

I'm 26, my WH just turned 29. We've been married 8 years and have 2 children (ages 7 & 5). We dated in high school and started talking about marriage when I turned 18. The plan was that WH would go into the Air Force & I would go to college first. But, I got pregnant, and we bumped up the timeline- a lot!

I always knew that marriage wasn't all lovey-dovey, sunshine and roses, but these past 8 years have been a constant struggle. Every time something comes up, we fight, I beg for counseling, WH refuses (he used to say he'd rather get a divorce than see a therapist- he's mellowed in the last few years- now he just insists we don't need it). After he refuses, we have a week or two of talking about our issues and concerns, we agree that we both need to change- and I end up making all the changes.

To my knowledge, WH has never had a PA- but I can't be sure. He swears that he never has and, therefor, has never cheated on me. What he has done, though, that I feel is hurting out marriage...

Adult Dating Sites: He started creating profiles for himself on adult sites after we had been married for a year or two. When I first confronted him about it, he said "well, I knew you didn't want me to look at porn, this is different" I would tell him how wrong I felt it was- and how trying to meet other women, even just for "erotic emails" was a violation of trust. He would delete the account, and in a few months open a new one.

His excuses were
1) I wasn't sexual enough & neglecting him- which I agreed was an issue. I have/had a lot of self esteem issues, mostly related to my weight at that time, and I didn't like being touched. I have made a real effort and with that, and losing 50lbs- I feel more confident and don't see how SF is really an issue (he agrees now)
2) I spent too much time at the gym/with my weight loss friends-- so I scaled back my workouts to only be done when he was working, and cut myself off from the only friends I had at the time
3) He now feels unattractive because I have lost weigh & he hasn't- and wants to be reassured that people still want him-- I don't know what I can possibly change about myself to combat this!? I can't force him to eat right and exercise- and I have never made negative statements about his current weight. Our sex life hasn't changed, so what is he expecting from me???

He swears he hasn't joined one of those sites in 2 years- but he created 2 new accounts in July (with an email address he didn't know I new about) and several last year as well.

Short Lived EA with ex-girlfriend: When WH got out of the Air Force we moved back to our home town. It took longer than anticipated for him to find a job, but I got one rather quickly. This left him with a lot of time on his hands and, for a month or two, he spent that time emailing, calling, and going to visit his ex girlfriend. He swears he only saw her once, at lunch (in a public place) and nothing happened but 2 old friends catching up. I wanted to believe him, but he sent her emails telling her he was dreaming about her nightly, and wishing for what could have been between them.

I was hurt, but I made excuses for him. I know that not having a job really hurt him, and I assumed that part of this reconnection was just longing for an easier time in his past- where he didn't have to worry about how he could make ends meet or support his family. He swore he would stop talking to her (and to my knowledge has) and that we would get counseling when we moved into our own place (that happened over a year ago- still no counseling)

Ongoing EA with old "friends with benefits"- this is the one I struggle with the most. WH swears again that she is "just a friend" but he keeps all communication with her a secret from me. When I bring it up, he says it means nothing and "I'll stop talking to her if you make me"

What is bothering me and concerning me is that, in the last year he has called her every month when he goes out of town without me (guard duty) He IMs her, but usually ends the conversation with "wife is in the room, have to go" (he's not always so bright- usually just minimizes the screen and walks away

Lately, I've noticed that he texts her whenever he has a day off- and then suddenly has a mysterious reason for why he can't stick around the house that day. Like last weekend. We were sending the kids to stay with my parents for the weekend so we could go out of town, just the two of us. Thursday night he sends her a text asking what she is doing Friday- and then tells me he has to go to our hometown a few hours earlier than me to "look at some trucks" Luckily- I guess, my car died Friday morning- so he had to take the kids to school and ended up staying in town helping me fix it (I swear I didn't sabotage my car! )

Monday we got in a fight about her again- and he agreed to NC- sort of. He deleted her from his facebook, myspace, and xbox accounts. I asked him about the phone and he swore he didn't have her number. I reminded him that I had her facebook too- and she has her cell number posted. It just happens to be saved in his phone under his boss's name. He looked at me weird, didn't say anything- and didn't delete the number. This last week he's been acting like everything is perfectly fine, like he's oblivious to the fact that I still want him to cut off ALL contact.

So, my big question- what am I supposed to do here? I know that it takes 2 to cause problems in a marriage but I have tried and tried to change over the years. I have read every marriage book I can come across trying to make things better. I've tried talking to him- which usually ends in a nasty fight- and I've tried just trying to accept that I am apparently flawed in someway and incapable of meeting all of my husbands needs. Neither option is really ideal.

I can't force him to change, he has to WANT too, but he has no desire to. I have thought of moving out so many times- but I just cannot afford to do it. I'm trying to find a better job, something with a salary and benefits that will help make ends meet on my own- but without a college education my choices are slim. Without being able to put my foot down and move out- and without being able to get marriage counseling- what options are left??

Your H is in an active affair, probably a physical one. You can't rebuild anything while he is still in his affair. I see you posted on the Scotland's thread for newbies. Have you read everything on that thread, to include the links? Start there, gathering enough information about what your H is doing; then expose the affair to everyone that can help end it.

Read, read, read on this site.

AM

PS There are few marriage counselors who provide any benefit. Most do more harm than good.

I'm sorry you're here under these circumstances, MJ, but welcome.

Yes, armymama is right. Your H is 100% having at least an EA, most likely a PA. And possibly with more than one woman.

I would suggest that you start some world-class snooping. Get a keylogger for the computer. Get a VAR for the car. Can you access his cell phone records? Can you go through his phone and get ALL his contacts & numbers? Get those and keep them for now. Later you may need to call all of them to be sure they're really who he has them listed as.

The goal is to find enough solid intel that you can show him to confirm the A. You need to provide proof. As far as I'm concerned, the nail went in his coffin when you found OW's number under his boss' name. My FWH had OWs number listed under a fake business name in case I ever looked at his contacts.

Also - his attempt to blame you for any of his failings is a typical WS trick. Don't let that upset you, and don't accept any blame for his actions. You have done nothing that would give him permission to be unfaithful to you. Too many BS's come here, blaming themselves for their spouse's A. The BS is NEVER to blame for an A.

The thing that alarms me the most is the adult dating sites. No faithful spouse uses those for visual entertainment. They serve one purpose - to find a mate.

Please start reading all of the articles on this site. It will prepare you for what you need to do. Snoop and get the goods, then tell us what you have found.

Don't tell your H about this site, and don't let him know about your snooping! This will require some fine acting on your part, because you need to act normal, regardless of what you find. Can you do that?

armymama- I have been reading through the info on the other thread. I can't say I've read everything yet, but it's a lot to take in and I do have a day job. I am trying though, because I can tell that there is just so much available- something is bound to help!

I have read how important exposure is, but I'm not sure I'm ready for that yet. First because I don't have anything solid as proof yet- I usually see one or two texts, but generally he deletes his messages.

Second though- I don't know how exposure will help. I'm afraid that people will tell me I am making a big deal out of nothing- so he keeps in touch with a friend from high school, so what? In all other ways our marriage seems (and often is) very good- and I don't think I can handle having my parents, his parents, and his friends (long story- but I don't really have any friends of my own) telling me to calm down and stop trying to cause problems.

I know that being scared will get me a virtual 2x4 to the head, but that is honestly where I am.

maritalbliss- I have been snooping (for years) but I don't have a keylogger. I'll be honest, I don't know the first thing about them. WH knows a lot more about computers than I do, and I've always worried that if I install one he would find it. I do have his passwords on everything- and every time I have come across something online I have emailed it to myself. Websites, usernames, passwords, messages sent, information posted, etc... I don't now how to do this with re: to text though- I'm sure there is a way but it usually takes me a while to catch up with technology

I know its a WS trick to pass the blame- but I also know that is the reaction I have in store for me. I hear everything from why can't you let this go, it's in the past? to I can't trust you if you're going to spy on me!

It's going to sound naive- but I really do believe that he hasn't met anyone from the adult sites. I confronted him about them when I would see them in the browser history- I never told him I had the passwords and usernames. He always sets his profile to say he's just looking for talk/email- and only once has he actually contacted another woman. He adds a lot to his "favorite list" so he can look at their pictures- which bugs the heck out of me. The one woman he contacted he sent a message to, she responded and asked him to meet up, and he wrote back that he wasn't interested.

I think part of that is the thrill of someone real flirting with him. And I can get that. I don't like it, but I understand it. Since losing weight, I get hit on a lot. I always blow the guys off and it actually bugs me that people would hit on me since the majority of them know I am married- but I can't deny that a little part of me is always happy to have some sort of attention. Like I said- I get it- but I do think he's crossing a line in seeking out that attention.

I think if you snoop, you will find there is way more going on than your H keeping in touch with a friend from high school. He has lied about speaking with her; he kept her number a secret and he has unaccountable time.

Gather information about what exactly is happening. There should be a link to the spying 101 thread. Take a look on it, and figure out what information you need to know. Then expose to those who can assist in breaking up the A.

I discovered my H's A when OW sent him a text message. A few days later, when the phone bill arrived, I discovered H and OW had been talking/texting many times a day. It was easy for me after that. H admitted to the A. Others here have hired PIs to gather information. Many As have been busted via the use of keyloggers.

Figure out what information you might need to gather and how to do it.



AM

When you have solid proof that there is an A occurring it will be difficult for anyone to pass it off as 'just keeping in touch with a high school friend.'

I'm not going to 2x4 you. I understand where you're coming from right now - this is all still new to you and you're trying to process everything. And that's fine. But you need to keep reading here and learn how to kill this A.

Most newbies are afraid of exposure - it sounds counter-intuitive. But believe me, it works! My H's A ended the day he was exposed. He is eternally grateful that he was exposed, because he felt he was on a terrible ride and didn't know how to get off. Exposure got him off the ride.

Keep reading, MJ.

Still reading- I promise. I have read your responses, and I will try and address them tomorrow. Working my way through all the articles and Q&A columns.

Question: Maybe I missed it in the other thread- are there any posts of Plan A's that worked really well?

I am attempting a Plan A with WH- it's not going too easy right now. The article on Plan A & Plan B says that one thing I need to do right now is find the root behind the A and figure out which EN's of my WH he feels are being neglected. I am happy to work on that- but he denies that there is anything "missing".

It sounds a little like the husband in the article, Can a Marriage Be Saved By One Spouse?

WH insists that we don't need help- that everything is fine- that I am a great wife and he loves me and there is nothing to worry about. (Nothing but the EA, apparently) It sounds nice but, since I have proof that he is talking to her, and know that he is lying every time he denies it- I feel that something is missing, KWIM?

Anyway- it's late and I am rambling. I guess I was just hoping to feel encouraged a bit- to see that some people had Plan A's with good results (and I do know that most end up in a Plan B- but let me delude myself for a little while since I have to majorly overhaul the budget to even consider that!)

Bumping from page 6. I know I'm really long-winded and it's a lot to read, but I really need some advice/help figuring all this out!

editing to add:

I tried my hand at spying on his phone (I already have his computer and email passwords) I installed an SMS tracker on his phone to have all sent/received texts sent to my email. (since he deletes texts before he come home usually)

It didn't work. He found it, uninstalled it, and called me to tell me he can't trust me if I am going to spy on him.

I've got to learn to be more "sneaky" about this spying thing!

This is such a busy board- I'm going to reply to myself again. I have a question about Plan A-- maybe I am misunderstanding it.

I know that during this time I need to get WH to agree to NC and cut everything off. I need to expose to everyone if he won't go "cold turkey". I need to work on making our home life as pleasant as possible, work on improving myself, and meeting his EN's.

Are we allowed to discuss the A's and causes during this time? I know that, in the Q&A column on Plan A & Plan B- Dr. Harley says that during the negotiations to end the A- all the causes should be addressed. On the other hand- WH becomes very angry when I want to discuss why this happened.

To do a plan A the "right" way- which one is more important if I have to choose just one for now? Getting to the root of it, or making him see what a good marriage we could have?

If I try to get to the root of it and he becomes angry, then aren't I just driving him back to OW? Wouldn't that create the mindset of "at least OW doesn't expect me to have difficult conversations like BS does" BUT- if I don't get to the root of it, and find out why ENs are being filled by this A- how can I work on meeting those needs?

I'm asking b/c last night WH wanted to talk about whats wrong with me (I mentioned to him that I was looking into going back into IC) He was at work, and could only text, so I told him I appreciated him wanting to discuss this, and let him know that I do feel its important to talk about, so we set a "talk date" for Friday (when we both have a day off)

So, is there a way to have that conversation that follows MB principals during a Plan A?

I think you have to get at the root of the problem but maybe decide together a time line to discuss things, a few questions a day, and hour a week whatever you decide and the rest of the time you work at just re-building the relationship.....
my husband doesn't like discussing the why's either, but he does understand why.
Keep everything safe and he won't mind the discussions, let him explain how he is feeling and why he got to where he got to....you can tell your side and have him understand how you have felt and how you feel now.......
The marriage is both your responsibility and the problems are from both sides and need to be understood and corrected by both of you...
The affair is his decision and his responsibility and something he needs to work on and understand, he will make sure he puts a plan into effect so he will never be in any kind of position ever again to let this happen.....
He must understand that while he is involved with someone else that he cannot work on your marriage, if he is not willing then you will have to go to a Plan B until he does.....Tell him you will work on things if he can offer you this, that you love him but not while there is someone else in your marriage.
good luck

What are you going to IC for? You do your Plan A. Do not forget to adminster the stick of Plan A with exposure and not engaging in WH's wayward "logic." You can't control WH's reactions. If he goes running off to OW, then let him go. Do not be a doormat or let him gaslight you. If you fear WH's anger, his reactions, or worry about what other people think, it will be your undoing.

Stopping his cheating, PA, EA, internet activity is the first step. There are many "reasons" why people justify their cheating but at the end of the day they choose to put themselves ahead of their spouses out of selfishness and thoughtlessness. That is the root of the A.

I wouldn't do this yet, not if you are in Plan A and still trying to end the A.


Showing him what a good M you can have. If he's still in the A he is so foggy he cannot even begin to see the "root of it" and it's fruitless to discuss it.


Possibly, yes.

Is he still in the A? Is he admitting that he is?

How long have you been in Plan A?

Have you tried a Voice Activated Digital Recorder hidden in his auto (secured under the front seat with velcro)???

It won't catch text massages and IM's but eventually, with patience, you'll get the exact conversation you were meant to.

Trust HIM... give me a break

Mr. W

not sure which program you used/phone company/ or phone but there are some of those prgrams that you can install without the other person knowing it. It runs in the background of the phone and doesn't show up as an active program. There is an app for the Iphone and for the blackberry.

black_raven is right to do a good plan A there needs to be a carrot (nicey nicey) and stick to it... i think Pep has the threat about that here some place will try and bump it for you. As for exposure, evidence then expose... NUCLEAR style.

Thank you for all the responses, you've given me a lot to think about.

Jessi-


I think that's a good point. I want to get to the root of this, but you're right, it shouldn't be all our time together. I need to make sure I spend most of our UA time focusing on the more pleasant things.


This is what I am anticipating as a problem. We have had these conversations many times in the past. He always (A) apologizes that his actions hurt me and (B) promises to never do it again. Which sounds promising. But he's never admitted that it was an affair or even wrong. He's sorry that I am upset, but doesn't think he has crossed the line. That, and he always does do it again.

Maybe if we can discuss this in bits and pieces we can make some real progress.

Black Raven-


A few reasons. I've been struggling with depression for a long time now (years before I met WH). I haven't gotten help consistently since we've been married though. I know this is something I really need to get a handle on. Also- I'm getting to the point where I don't think WH will ever change. I hope he will. I hope we can save our M. I will fight tooth and nail to do so. BUT- this, the way things have been and the way things are, is killing me. I need something to help me through this.


Thank you for that. I don't like hearing it, but I know you're right. And it reminded me that I wanted to print out that stick and carrot post. I read it a few days ago- I need to keep a copy handy though.

Married Forever-


As far as I know, he is. I've been having trouble getting concrete proof, but when I asked for NC he kept OWs # in his phone.

He's not admitting it. He has "trickle down" honesty. He will "come clean" about the things I confront him over. But he won't admit to things he thinks he might have successfully hidden. EX: he will talk about the adult sites he joined "years ago" but no mention of the ones he signed up for in July. He admits that he used to IM and call OW- but claims it's been over a year- when I saw a text from him to her at the beginning of this month.

Plan A? I guess officially only a week. But, before now I didn't know about this site or that what I was doing (trying to do) had a name

I have been trying to meet his needs, keep our home clean, make sure everything runs smoothly so he has minimal stress, and make time for the two of us for at least four years now.

There are times that are harder than others- deployments when he was active duty, guard drill & the police academy since then. Sometimes I lose my patience and it takes a while to get back on track.

Mr. Wondering-


Not yet. I am trying to find a time to actually get this. I know that sounds like an excuse- but this past week has been so insane with all the "other" stuff that needs to be done. My job, meetings with my boss who only comes to town once a month, meetings with the school and scouts, and church- there just hasn't been any spare time. I should have time to go look for one tomorrow though.

StrongerThanB4-


We have the android with cell. south, and I chose a free app. I know that wasn't the smartest choice, but this time of month is hard money wise (mortgage, insurance, electric, and tuition for the kids all come out at one time- yikes!) so I couldn't find the money for one of the better ones.

I get a bonus at the end of the month- it's the only money I make that is just mine (usually I put it towards continued education to keep my training certification up to date, or registration for races) It sucks that this month I will be spending it to find out the extent of WH's A. But, it will have to be done.

MJ there is an application on the android market. As soon as i get to my phone again i will look up the exact name you need to type in and about how much it will cost you.... i believe it was 1.99.

Now as for you having a hard time finding time to do things or get them done, you just need to make that time.

I know that there are family and work obligations, BTDT but i have even now had to be come creative with how i get things done that i needed to or need to.

In this case you need to snoop and get evidence.

Have you talked about or thought about investing in the MB coaching?

STB4-


I'll look at those again. I read the reviews for some of them, but there's always a fair amount of negative ones. That, and I stayed away from anything with "spy" in the name- in case he did find it!


I do understand this. I wasn't trying to say that I wouldn't/couldn't get the VAR- just that I literally had NO time earlier this week. I was up and on the go from 6am-8pm the last three days- this week has been killing me! I was able to leave work at 3 today- and, miracle of miracles- no scout meeting, science fair meetings, or 1st communion meetings. I actually got to come home.

I did go to Best Buy before coming home though and picked up the VAR- now I just need to wait for a moment alone with WH's car.



Yes, and it's not going to happen. At least not now, with the way WH reacted to it. I wish it was something that could be considered, but when I first brought it up (when I asked for NC) he had a couple of objections...

1) He doesn't think our insurance will cover it (any military spouses know if he is wrong about this?) If he's right- it is a valid point. It's going to sound like an excuse- but money truly IS an issue for us. There is no price tag on what our marriage is worth to me- but paying nearly $200 out of pocket for each phone session is more than we can afford right now.

That's one of the reasons I am here. It's going to take a lot of saving to be able to afford all of this- and I had hoped that the forums would be a useful tool in the mean time.

2) He is adamantly opposed to counseling- and particularly MB. Things got pretty heated when I brought up the book I was reading, and some of the information I had found online. He refuses to consider anything that "advocates a wife moving out, taking the kids and refusing to talk to her husband" And why why would I "even consider that breaking up a marriage and not talking at all would fix problems that mostly stem from not having enough time together?"

Quoting myself from a few days ago...

Trust me when i tell you i do know. I am a single mom to an awesome 3 year old and my job is very demanding. Less demanding than my previous employer but non-the less still time consuming. I know what it feels like to have those weeks and you are just so happy to be HOME and no place else so congrats on that.


very cool.... that's what i ment about trying to find time to get things done... As most people will tell you you need a plan. No need a plan/list/ goals to achieve. Right now yours is to get the intel. Did you read the carrot and stick of plan A that was bumped earlier?


ok again i know what you mean. I was asking merely for the fact that you said something about the bounus... i was thinking more along the lines of you contacting them and having atleast one session with Steve H or Jennifer to help you get your plan together. The information they can provide as the professionals from my understanding is nothing but exceptional.

After my DD is all tucked in i will do some research to help you find a "good" program for the android. I have one and a tech savy person that can help with that. Will be back later with that info for you.

STB4-



Would they talk with just me? I always assumed that any type of MC (or coaching, in this case) wouldn't work w/just one person involved.

I do need someone to help me figure out a plan but would it be the right plan to truly recover our marriage if Steve or Jennifer only hears my side of the story?

I just know that I am very frustrated, hurt, angry, confused, and overwhelmed right now. By everything. And I know me, once I get started, it's going to be hard to keep all those emotions from from clouding my perspective- I'll end up making WH look like a monster and that's not my intent.

I HATE what WH's choices and actions have done to me and our marriage. But the part of me that is clinging to reason and hope knows that it takes two. He chose to cross the line. That's on him. I know that. But there are a lot of other issues with LB that we both need to work through.

Has anyone had experience doing the MB phone coaching w/o their spouse?


I read that few a couple of times, and printed it out. And left it on my desk at work, under the "to do" list

I have a list in my head though

-I need to gather more intel. Which means an SMS tracker on the phone & a keylogger on the computer since WH deletes everything
-We have a "talk date" scheduled for tomorrow. I need to insist on full NC again.
-Since we both have this weekend off, I am planning time for our talk, a "date night" at home for the two of us, and some family time with the kids.
-I need to start calling the IC's that are approved by our insurance
-Read, read, and read some more. I wish some of the forums here weren't closed. There are a lot of MB concepts that I am still trying to really understand- not sure if I agree with everything and I don't know if it's because I just don't "get it" yet
-Yard work. It needs to be done. Before the talk date, preferably. Don't know if I can be trusted around WH after the talk date with heavy machinery at my finger tips.

Yes they will and I highly recommend it. When we were in our FR (False Recovery) I had a session alone with Jennifer.


Yep because an affair is an affair is an affair...they are all the exact same. Your H is foggy and taking hits from the crack pipe daily; that's all they need to know.


You need to kill the A first ~ you can eliminate YOUR LBers at the same time (it won't hurt you) but truth be told ~ the A needs to die before he's going to notice any big changes anyhow.


I'm going to urge you to use the program as a whole ~ I've yet to see anyone use MB "cafeteria style" and FULLY recovery their M.

To tell you the truth MJ you need to get the goods FIRST ~ all this other stuff hardly matters until you have cold hard proof that there is an A AND you do nuclear exposure.

My H's A died the DAY I went nuclear with my exposure. The first time around I half-*ssed my exposure (didn't know about MB) and all that got me was 10 months of pure h*ll in a false recovery. Don't make the same mistakes I did.

MJ -

I'm not a veteran but I can give you a few pointers on your Plan A. The big picture with Plan A is to be the best spouse you can be to show your WH what he would be missing if he didn't stop the affair. You do not discuss the affair or your relationship. You simply let your husband know that you love him and want to recover your marriage but cannot do so when a third party is involved - then CHANGE THE SUBJECT. You won't discuss causes or changes until after your husband commits to No Contact and send the NC letter to the OW.

If WH continues to not commit and Plan A'ing him his becoming emotionally impossible, that's when you go to Plan B in which you will outline requirements he must meet in order for you to accept him back into your life.

Vets - If I got anything wrong or you can add some helpful stuff, please feel free to correct me.

EDIT: Woah. Just realized I was not reading the latest post. This reponse is a little late. Sorry about that!

aBetterMe

I am sorry for not responding to the advice given before now. I try not to get online on the weekends when WH has off of work (attempting to work on UA since that was always one of his complaints about me)

MarriedForever-



Maybe I am misunderstanding your meaning, but these two seem contradictory. I have read that, in order for MB to work, it needs to be followed to a T- and I am not disagreeing with that. Which is why I am doing so much reading, trying to understand everything.

I'm not saying I don't agree with some of the MB principals, just that, since this is all new to me, some of it is a little confusing to me, and I am trying to figure out what it all means.

"All this other stuff" is me trying to make sure I understand the program so that I can follow it as it is laid out. And, while I am waiting for enough evidence to do a full exposure- what better thing to focus on?

IF (big if) I am wrong and the EA really has ended- then all this information can go to good use anyway. And if, in the more likely situation, I am right, shouldn't I fully understand it and be prepared to act on it once I have the evidence? Besides, just sitting here waiting for him to slip up so I can catch something is driving me nuts!

Abetterme-

Thanks for your description of a Plan A. I think I have a better grasp on it now. WH and I ended up not having our conversation about the EA this weekend. I wish we had, but it seems like now is not the time to really discuss this with him.

My only problem with Plan A- and I am just going to have to trust that it will work- is I am afraid that he is going to think my redoubled efforts to make our home life and marriage better mean he is off the hook, know what I mean?


Can I ask what you meant by that? I am not sure what was too late.

One more update...

I have the VAR, and have not gotten anything "good" from it. But wow, can that guy talk about fishing until my head hurts! I guess it's good that there is no proof on the VAR though. Whatever he is doing, it's not with someone (at least, not this past week)

I have an SMS tracker on his phone, but I didn't get the nerve to do that until this morning. I was worried about him finding it before. Now I am so mad I couldn't care less if he does.

Last night we had a great night together. Watched a movie, and then stayed up talking for hours, something we haven't really done in a while. We went to bed together around 11. This morning I looked at his phone while I was getting ready for work. Apparently, after I fell asleep, he decided to come downstairs and text the OW for a little while. So now all his incoming and outgoing texts are being sent to my email.

I have also called our phone company- Cell. South doesn't give detailed records on unlimited plans, but you can request them from the store and have them mailed to you. I did this on Monday- I am having the records sent to me at work just in case.

No money for a keylogger yet- but I have been checking his emails and nothing suspicious there. I think he is primarily using his phone anyway. D*mn unlimited everything plans- he has text, email, internet, etc... all right there, doesn't need to use his computer.

I'm hurt and frustrated, especially since I have a conference to go to that I cannot get out of. Everything has been paid for by my boss- and I don't have $1500 to pay them back for canceling at the last minute. I guess this is just the "make or break" time for us. I have all the monitoring stuff set up, and me being gone for 4 days is going to give him enough rope to hang himself.

EDITED TO ADD

Any advice for how to handle a confrontation once you have evidence? I'd like to hope that he will be faithful, but I doubt it. I think I am going to come home with more than enough evidence, and I am wondering what the best way to present that to him is. Those who have done this before- how did it go?

Hi MJ, I just skimmed thru your thread.

Great job on all the snooping. Come back here when you've got the goods and we'll help you with the next steps.

I totally hear what you're saying. However Plan A is supposed to show WH that you are capable of change and making a happy home and putting effort into meeting his needs. PAIRED with exposure, it's supposed to make the relationship with the OW much less appealing. It definitely does NOT get him off the hook.

When he commits to the marriage, that's when you make your list of requirements, one of those being he joins the MB train. At this point you are BOTH basically working on meeting each other's EN's and putting boundaries and expectations in place.


Can I ask what you meant by that? I am not sure what was too late. [/quote]

I had only read page one when I posted this but there were 2 additional pages. You had already gotten a ton of great advice so I felt silly!

aBetterMe

No confrontation, that will only drive the affair underground. You must EXPOSE it to EVERYONE. His family, your family, friends, co-workers. We can help you prepare the exposure letter. I'm not exagerating when I say exposure is CRITICAL to killing the affair. Once the affair is out in the open, you better believe the relationship is going to lose its appeal, and FAST. During this time you Plan A the heck out of him and avoid talking about your marriage or the affair until he RECOMMITS to your marriage.

I know exposure is scary, but YOU HAVEN'T DONE ANYTHING TO WARRANT HIM CHEATING. There is nothing for you to feel ashamed of or embarassed by. NOTHING! HE should feel terrible for his mistake.

So many other posters either avoided exposure, did too little exposure or did it too late and they regret their hesitation. So steel yourself for the inevitable so you are ready to do the right thing and get your husband back. We're all here rooting for you!

aBetterMe

So, I expose to everyone without telling him that I know? I thought I was supposed to tell him what I know, ask for/demand NC and then expose.