So if I begin plan B then I stop counseling with WS?

Not a simple question to answer. I haven't a clue because you did not provide enough information from which a rational answer would be generated. The more information you provide, the more answers you will get. Look at some of the other threads for the way people talk.

The post things like how old you are and your spouse, Are you a male or female. Got kids, how long married, is he/she in an affair, what kind of counseling are you getting.

You have done the equivalent of driving up to the mechanic and said, "It is making a funny noise, sometimes."

Larry

well you told me!!! Sorry I am in the middle of shock and chaos and that's all I could manage to get out at the moment.

I am a 31 year old mom of 2 (3 y/o boy and 1 y/o girl). My husband is 35 and is having an affair with a married woman from work.

I originally found text messages that seemed inappropriate and confronted him in Sept of 2008. He said nothing was going on, but it freaked me out enough we started counseling. He supposedly told her he could not talk to her anymore.

About a month into counseling things started getting more intense between them and their friendship became more than friends. By the time I was 9 months pregnant (Dec 08)it had gotten sexual. I had no idea. We were definitely not doing well, but we both thought the counselor was a joke and stopped going.

In March of 2009 I returned to work. It seemed we were doing better. We had created some rules together and he was coming home earier from work. I obsessively checked his phone though so obviously it wasn't that good. He would get blocked calls and I just had a gut feeling something was to it.

In May of 2009 I drove up to his office on a Saturday and saw the 2 of them walk out together. I freaked out. He cried, pleaded, promised that it was a coincidence...swore they were just friends and that he was only guilty of remaining her friend. I wanted it to be true. We started a new counselor. He swore nothing was going on to us both. We did a bunch of activities and life got pretty good. I tried to stop looking at his phone so much and move on, but I was still stuck.

On December 1, 2009 I opened an email from a hotel that had a survey for his stay on Veterans Day. I called the hotel, pretended I needed a receipt for work and that the hotel was under my husbands name. They faxed me a receipt with his name, work address, paid in cash. I confronted him. He tried to say it was an emotional connection...blah blah. Finally admitted they had a sexual relationship for about 5 months of that time. Said it was never about that. I think they believe they were in love, although he will not say this. I did not want our marriage to be over.

We started with yet a new counselor and I started reading and we did the activities through Marriage Builders. Life got really good. We were talking more than ever, he said frequently how in love he had become with me again. He wrote her a letter saying never to contact him, etc... He started interviewing for a new job and got an offer.

On March 31st I picked up his phone yet again. No idea why...hadn't been doing that. For some reason all his email from 2008 came through. I found out he had a gmail acct. Had asked him a million times if he had another email and he said no. Hacked into his gmail and there was an email to her from that day saying...I know you are upset with me for not seeing you. I don't know what our future holds, it is out of our control, but I love you.


He has since tried to explain that after the written ending things letter she contacted him and told him she didn't believe him and that he had to tell her to her face...so he did - and then 3 more times in the span of 4 months she had a reason he had to see her. They were communicating about 4 times a week through phone and email. His last day of work there is April 23rd so he maintains that was his exit strategy, that he didn't want to have to hurt her and insists that it was not the same, that they just talked about counseling and work. He was proud that he had said no to seeing her for 3 days in a row, even though she kept asking.


I told him in the presence of our counselor that if he ever did this to me again it was over...and so I told him he had to leave. Yesterday was the first night without him. He BEGGED and CRIED and tried everything to try to get me to change my mind. He says he will do anything to fix this, but I maintain that he should have done that before.
I don't know what to do. I do not want to end my marriage. I do not want to split my family, but he can't have us both.

He wrote her an email today saying she was not to contact him and if she did he would hang up on her...but we've been through this before and it only lasted 6 weeks before he was seeing her again. He wants me to continue seeing the counselor with him and is totally against moving out. He cannot see how that could possibly help.

I know this is one place where everyone understands what I am going through and I need help!

P.S. Was this more than you wanted??!!

Yes. Only one problem. My eyes glazed over. Please help these old eyes to focus by providing frequent paragraph breaks.

Like this one. If you do, I promise to read and give it my best shot at an answer.

Larry

even after the email telling her not to contact him again, she put a letter on his desk today!!! He made one of his collegues watch him shred it unopened so they could tell me he didn't look at it. I would give almost ANYTHING to have read it.

Do they still work together?

My suggestion would be Plan B. You are about TWO YEARS LATE for Plan B. I would send him a plan B letter, change the locks and stay dark as night until you are assured - for several weeks - that contact is ended. I would then only agree to get back together if it is in another town.

Has the affair been exposed to EVERYONE? Is the OW married?

Ask him to leave, wash. If he won't leave, then I would file for divorce and get him out. He doesn't believe you will do anything to stop him after all this time. It will take alot to convince him you are serious this time.

Even if you read it, it would have done you NO GOOD. Have you read all of the free info on this site? Start on the right hand side of the page in Popular links, "How to survive Infidelity." This will help us help you.

Has her husband been told? Has Human Resources been informed Her parents, his parents, your family, friends, etc? Has everyone been told of the affair?

His last days is April 23rd. He is taking vacation for the next 2 weeks.
He has been out of the house for 2 nights and counting.
Her husband has been told.
Work talked to them in July 1, 2009 I found out. The bosses know and many coworkers.
His parents know. Some of our friends know. My family knows. I have no clue about her side. Apparently her husband is pretending everything is okay per her to my husband.

I know it won't do any good to read it. I guess I just like to torture myself : (

By whom? Was he told with your lips? And was it RECENTLY? Does he know about the most recent developments?


And how do you know this? Does work know the affair is ongoing?


Told WHAT by whom? If they all were not told by YOU, then they have not been exposed to.


I would take it upon yourself to expose to all her side of the family. You can do alot of this via facebook.

Wash, my suggestion would be to get him out of the house and change the locks tomorrow. Then proceed to do a mass exposure to all of the above in the same day, starting wtih the OW's husband. You can go on the OW's facebook page and send a letter similar to this to all of her facebook contacts, via email:

Dear friend of Skankyhola,

It grieves me to write this letter but I believe all of her friends should be aware that Skanky is having an affair with my husband, Joe. We have been married for 5 years. They have been having this affair since October according to the evidence.

I would be happy to provide the evidence to anyone who asks.

I would ask that you use your influence with Skanky to persuade her to leave my husband alone. You should also watch your own husbands around her because she is no friend to marriage.

I would appreciate it if someone would notify her parents and ask them to call me at xxx-www-xxxx.
Thank you, BW

They have all been told by me. I called his boss, I emailed with her husband until she finally confessed and have still been emailing him what is going on, I have told his family and mine.
The OW is estranged from her mother and apparently isn't much better with her father. Neither are on facebook. She has no siblings.

The problem with changing the locks, cutting contact, etc...is that we have a 3 year old and a 1 year old. The 3 year old asks me daily where daddy is. I don't want to keep him from them. How do I handle that?
I appreciate the advice.
Also learning to blog...so sorry if I am screwing it up!

Wash, Plan B is a separation where all communication goes through a designated intermediary. You would start Plan b by sending him a letter asking him not to contact you unless he has ended his affair for good and is ready to commit to the marriage. It would emulate divorce.

what you do is set up visitation through an intermediary and allow him to pick up the kids for his visits from someone elses house. Or you could have him pick up the kids from your house and maybe get someone to put the 1 year old in his car. Plan B should emulate DIVORCE and he should not be allowed in the house. Do you have the book Surviving an Affair? I would get that and in the meantime, read up on Plan B.

http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi8113_ab.html

Keep in mind that not keeping your children from their father is not the same as encouraging contact between them and bearing the burden of it yourself. Is your husband staying away from the children now? Well, he is destroying his relationship with his children. He must bear the cost and burden of that, not you. It is not your job to tell your children that their Daddy loves them or try to make sure that they do not see him negatively. Nor is it your job to tell your husband that he should be seeing his children and be a good father, etc. In Plan B, you shouldn't even have to think of that. That is his screwup, and he should be the one who tries to fix it.

When children have a parent who is more interested in his or her adultery than them, it is sometimes best for them not to see the parent at all.

He would tell me it IS over for good. He tells me it is over. He tells me he wants no one else, that he is so sorry, that he can't believe he did it, that he will do anything to fix this, that he wishes she would disappear. Tells me he never intended to leave our marriage and told her that. He forwarded me the email to her and it was very clear.
The problem is he gave her a letter before saying the same thing and then saw her anyway. He says they talked about our counseling and her counseling, about his new job, about me telling people.
He is desperate to see the kids. Can't stand to be away from him and I do believe that.

So MelodyLane...how do I know when it is really over? How long do I keep him away? I can do it and am willing, I just don't know how to know when it is done.

I have the book and have been reading it.

Was his sunshine

But it is not over. You can see that with your own eyes. He still sees her every day at work. If I tell you I am a cat but you can see I am a woman, then you know my words are meaningless, right? Talk is meaningless coming from a wayward; you can only go by his actions.


When it is really over. That is how you tell. You go by his actions, not his words. If he is still seeing her every day at work, then you know it is not over.

How close do you live from the OW?

Was --

He needs to come up with extraordinary precautions.

He obviously has boundry issues.

Let HIM figure out how he is going to prove to you that its over.

In the meantime, what YOU need to do is make your list of requirements before he is allowed to darken your doorstep.
That is how you will prevent the agonizing false recovery that you have been dealing with all this time.

Set that bar HIGH washissunshine.

Okay, that makes sense...make a list of what it would take.

Definitely boundary issues! He had been justifying seeing her because it wasn't sexual, and then the second time he justified it because it was only [yeah only =( ] conversation.

We live probably 30 minutes apart.

So forgo counseling with him then?

And also...would you give me some examples of requirements? That sounds stupid, but my brain is like mush! He is leaving his job already, he deleted the email account he used, I'm blanking.

So I started a list for WH. At the risk of being criticized I am going to post it here so you can give me advice...

XXX,
This is the beginning of a list of what I would like you to accomplish before I consider whether I will let you come back home. I am completely serious about each and every item. DO NOT ask me if you can alter what I've asked. DO NOT forget a piece. DO NOT ignore any item. DO NOT ask me how to do something. You figure it out.

1. Quit job
2. Move stuff out of your office before XXX (OW) returns from Mexico
3. Take vacation until the 23rd when you begin new job.
4. Only be at the office the MINIMUM neccesary on the 23rd for last day.
5. Cancel ALL email accounts
6. Change your cell #
7. Read the book "Surviving an Affair" by Dr. Harvey
8. Complete all the activities in the book
9. Prepare all the agreements he suggests.
10. Sign the agreements when you truely believe you are ready and can fulfill them
11. Write a personal statement
Include where you see us in 1, 5, 10, 20, 30 years...as a family, as a couple,financially, etc...
12. Make a list of how you intend to make sure this never happens again
13. Describe how you intend on changing
14. Describe how you are going to handle it when I regress, when I am having a bad day, when I am feeling hurt and angry and it has been 6 months...
15. Send an email to XXX (bosses and OW/WH friends at the
office(do not leave anyone out) stating what happened and with whom. It does not have to be long and detailed. I WILL NEED TO APPROVE FIRST
16.Tell me immediately when she contacts you and give me any communication
17. Apologize to my family in person for what they have gone through and seen (They came to our rescue when we were losing control physically and verbally )
18. Write a letter or email to OWH. I NEED TO APPROVE FIRST