I was reading a post on another site by a guy struggling with not telling his kids. He seemed to feel that the consensus among therapists or 'experts" is that the kids should not be told.
So, what other folks that practice in this field agree with Harley I was under the impression that a fair number agreed with his position.
I've seen the exchange that Mel posted by Dr Laura Schlesinger on this issue. Not to be too disrespectful, but Laura is sort of like Dr Phil. IMO. a self promoting know it all/narcissist, whose legitimacy is called into question by the fact that she is willing to give specific advice over the airwaves for profit.
So, who else is in agreement with Harley? How about Dodson, Glass, Pittman, Abram- Spring, Lunderman(sp?), Peggy vaughn , etc? Where do these folks stand, if anyone knows.

I don't know. I don't really care either, since I figure it's sort of like the majority of "marriage counselors" who don't know how to save marriages; who have an 84% failure rate. Yet they call themselves "experts" despite the fact they can't save marriages. Dr Harley stands out from that crowd too, in that he actually knows how to save marriages.

The concensus amongst the traditional marriage counseling crowd - the ones who can't save marriages - is also against exposure and nonchalant about observing no contact with the affair partner. Yet we see how effective exposure is and how crucial no contact is.

I think the issue of telling children is no different. With absolutely no evidence that telling children the truth harms them, some "counselors" advise not telling them. And why? Who knows.

p.s. I don't agree with Dr Laura on every issue but her views on this are tightly reasoned and deserving of respect, IMO. What counts is the merit of the idea, after all, not a concensus. There is a "concensus" that exposure is bad and no contact is not necessary; doesn't mean that is wise.

" whose legitimacy is called into question by the fact that she is willing to give specific advice over the airwaves for profit."

What counselor gives advice for free?

What are they in business for their health?

Same for any person.

People work for income. So by you definition everyone must be bad at their jobs in this country because every one wants to get paid for their knowledge.

Dr Harley and his wife, Joyce, used to do the exact same thing. Have you listened to their radio clips on this forum? Marriage Builders Radio

I would not have told my DS if I in any way thought it would harm him...even if Dr Harley suggested it. I weighed the pros and cons myself and thought what Dr Harley said about exposure to the children made sense to me...

I 100% believe that any hurt that my DS has is about the A and his father leaving NOT me telling him the truth. If I didnt tell my DS the truth I have no doubt that my WH, OW and DS would be spending time together and my DS would be more screwed up by that.

To me it is old fashioned to sweep stuff under the rug, that was the problem with my WH, I was in a deep depression and never having to face any problems in his life before, he had no idea what to do...so he pretended it wasnt happening and found someone else...to me it has been proven that this method is harmful...

I may be wrong but I believe that children deserve the truth, age appropriately of course. MY WH cheating on me was his way of avoiding the truth, so he thought he would just cheat and I would never find out. Well when I found out the truth, It was much more damaging then if he just faced our family problems head on.

My WH told my DS that he wasnt happy anymore so he left...was that good...so would my DS think that if he wasnt happy with him that he would find a new son.

The truth can be very painful but lies can be much more painful, especially the longer they are kept from someone, even children...JMHO

Don't get me wrong, I am in complete agreement with Harley's position on exposing far and wide, including the kids.
But, this guy on another website felt that this was a minority position.
So, other than experts like myself and Harley, anyone else of renown taking this position?

Dang, I inserted my reply into someone's post, again, making it look like part of her post. Sorry.

I don't know because I never checked into it. To me, that has no relevance on the merit of the idea. An idea's value is based on its own merit, not on whether there is a concensus.

ME

Well, there you have it. Three of the brightest bulbs on the planet, aligned.

This from Peggy Vaughn: Full Article here.

Divorce360 sends mixed messages. Some of their writers advocate telling the kids others only in cases where they will find out some other way. Most of the articles point to holding off until you figure out whether or not you are going to separate or divorce.

My take is that since most people want to keep their affairs secret so they don't have to deal with the consequences of cheating, they feel that the kids don;t have to know what is going on. In cases of impending divorce almost all counselors recommend telling the kids at least in a benign way since their world is about to change forever.

The problem of course is that depending on the age of the children, they already know something is up and little minds when Mommy and Daddy are alternating between hushed whispers and loud verbal exchanges, often calling each other vile names, tend to fill in the blanks from their own imaginations.

A 4 year old can decide that Mommy and Daddy are mad because he did something horribly wrong. A 10 year old might think that Daddy having a new girlfriend means that she is no longer his special little girl. A 16 year old might become disgusted at the whole notion of a caring committed relationship even being possible and a college student might question if their whole life was just a lie.

So I think kids need to be told the truth, with the one condition that the truth be age appropriate. If the BS is telling the kids then every effort must be made to avoid berating the WS and making the whole thing into the BS building a support group out of the kids.

The other "experts" are mixed with some saying tell them as soon as the confrontation takes place, others saying tell them once you know you are not going to reconcile or even making the whole thing remain hidden from view until someone else brings it up.

Of course knowing if you are going to reconcile is sometimes not really known for more than a year and if Daddy is moved out and living with a girl half his age, the kids are going to wonder why they have to go visit him every other weekend when they and Mom still live in the nice home they always enjoyed.

And if someone else mentions that Mom is a cheating sl*t or calls her a wh*re, even a 4 year old is going to have questions.

The single biggest reason to tell the kids the truth IME is to teach them what is right and wrong with the whole situation. How do you deal with adultery and even attempt to save the marriage if you are pretending it doesn't exist. If the marriage is saved, they will always wonder what was going on and if the marriage ends they are going to find out sooner or later. Might as well be sooner IMO.

Mark

ROTFLMAO

Well, I pointed that guy on the other website to Harely's site.
I was surprised by the contrast between the posts over there, basically accepting the premise tha virtually everone agrees that the kid don't find out, and those on this site.
I mean, here is this poor guy not only being destroyed by the affair, but feeling guilty that two of his four kids, the older ones, have figured out that his wife is cheating. Bet his wife does not give a rat's [censored], except to the extent she gets some negative consequences from the kids.
Do waywards love their kids?

I often wonder to if waywards love their kids...all I know is that my WH left my home with my son literally attached to his leg crying and begging him not to leave...it makes me physically ill thinking of it...I could never leave my DS like that, I would do ANYTHING for him...

All I could think is that he hated me so much that he would even leave his son so he didnt have to be with me...

Z,

I don't know about any of the "reknown" that you mention, BUT I will tell that my DD's therapist about ripped me a new one for NOT being truthful ( and essentially exposing) about H's affair. She had over-heard the screaming match on Dday and "sorta" knew what was going on. Her dad and shamefully I then gaslighted her for a month.

When I told her counselor what WAS going on, she repermanded me something fierce for not being honest and CONTRIBUTING to her turmoil of the sitch......something I then corrected immmediately.

DD had been going to this counselor off and on for 3 yes. because of SA......

So while she may not be "well- reknown", she is very reputable in counseling community.....

And I agree with what Mel is saying.....who needs a consencous to KNOW what the right thing to do is??......

Not2fun

I hope you can get him over here.

My wayward father took me to meet his OW at a hotel when I was 4. AGE 4. Can you even imagine?

What nonsense...... Kids DO in fact find out. Sooner or later, one way or another they find out and SOMEONE needs to be there to stear them on the right path.....otherewise, they grow up thinking affairs are okay and normal........

Good job on pointing him here.....

Not2fun