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Hello. New member here, looking for some perspective.
17 years ago I was a young woman straight from an abusive childhood with a dysfunctional family and I met a 25 year old man in roughly the same situation. Our own relationship was the best we could make of it with the situations that both of us came out of with a lot of screaming fights and even some physical altercations in the first few years. We moved in together after only a couple of weeks of dating(dates that lasted 12 hours or more), mostly due to my own living situation, and have never been married although I do have an engagement ring and at one point we bought the bands and did an at home exchange of "with this ring I thee wed" with no vows, which he views as our wedding and I view as not our wedding(with other unfavorable implications added when I am feeling bad, unfortunately). I have been asking him to do a ceremony for the last 2 years and he has agreed, but only when we have the money to do it and he won't set a date. About 13 years ago his mother married his stepfather after they had been common law partners for 20 years. At that time he said to me, "Don't worry, I won't make you wait 20 years to marry you." We have had disagreements over whether we are actually married or not.

Over the years both of us have had important needs go unmet for long periods. Recognizing a few years ago the need for us to do something to improve our relationship, I've talked to him about it numerous times, looked over various programs with him, gotten his commitment to try multiple times. Since I've been reading this site, I've made changes to the way that I approach things, recognizing that my approach has often caused an argument where there wasn't one. I've asked him to do the EN Questionnaire and he assured me multiple times that he would, even asking me why I kept asking if he was going to do it. I was honest and said because I didn't think he was going to do it, as there have been numerous examples in the past of him assuring me he would do something, only to later refuse to do it. He assured me again that he would, and then a week later told me that he would not because it was stupid and a waste of time.

His assertion is and has been for more than 10 years that our marriage would be better if we had more money(ignoring the whole time that our relationship has been getting steadily worse while he has been making steadily more). He is extremely resistant to me doing anything to earn money other than what he wants me to do, which is work on the businesses that he's been building over the years while I do everything(except about 50% of the cooking) associated with the house and our 5 children. When I mention doing something else that I am interested in, he gives me reasons that I will not be successful or openly doubts using voice tones that I have thought it through completely(said in very doubtful tone "It seems like it would work. Have you thought about who's going to care for the kids while you're doing this?), even when I have spoken of getting a job(after all, who's going to hire a woman who's been a sahm for the last 13 years?) I am not interested in the businesses, I actually hate them because he works a MINIMUM of 14 hours a day on them, 7 days a week, and tells me there's not a moment to spare to do anything else, even take care of his own health, which actually bothers me at least as much as our poor relationship. I tried to work on the businesses, hoping it would help and all it did was double my workload. He didn't offer to help in any other area of our lives and it didn't bring in the extra money he was hoping it would. What it did do was give him grounds to say "See how hard my job is? You couldn't handle it!" when I told him that I could no longer do the work because I had too much to handle with that and the kids(who I homeschool at his request by myself - he has said many, many times that he would give them some of their subjects and then never followed through) and the house(which I clean and keep stocked with the brands he loves at the cheapest I can get them through hours of couponing each week).

When I tell him I feel like he is being selfish, he says that I should provide specific examples of what I am talking about and when I provide one, he shoots it down as not being selfish and asks for more examples which he will then systematically discredit and use to make me feel as if I am the one who is at fault. If I cannot provide immediate examples I am told that since I cannot provide the example I must be either blowing something out of proportion or seeing something that is not there. This was also a favorite tactic of my mother's and I have usually responded by ending the conversation and leaving feeling as if I cannot trust myself. After a couple of years of therapy I have learned to trust myself again and understand that this is a tactic I must refuse to be used against me. So I tell him that I don't have to provide specific examples for his behaviors that cause me pain, I am giving one to demonstrate what behavior is causing the pain, but even then he will pick apart the example and ignore the pain.

It seems like he doesn't want to tackle the big issues in our relationship, although when asked he says he does. About 18 months ago I convinced him to go out with me once a week for a "date night" although he said if we called it that, he wouldn't go because it was too cheesy. Our relationship improved quite a bit with only this small amount of UA and I was feeling a lot better about our relationship. I have been on the verge of leaving quite a few times and have talked it over with him, which is how we ended up with the date night, but now he claims that even that amount of time is too much and 15 hours a week is completely out of the question.

I hit my sexual peak about 3 years ago and have been like a horny teenager ever since. Much to my dismay, it would seem his horny teen years are far behind him and he's more than happy to wait weeks to have sex, then say things like "You don't want to have sex" to me, joking, or "you don't give me enough sex", serious. I want to scream at him that it's all I've been thinking about, there is nothing I want more!, throw him on the floor and take what I want, but I know it's not right. I have never been one for masturbation, it's never worked out for me when I've tried it(too much childhood shame beaten into me I guess) my only ethical source of SF is him. I've tried talking to him about it, but he says if he doesn't want to have sex, he shouldn't have to have sex which I agree with, but leaves me in the lurch. I'm actually here today because over the last few days I've started fantasizing about having sex with other men, something that's never happened in our relationship before and it scares me to think about what it means for our relationship.

Things did seem to be getting somewhat better with the date night and everything, then last summer we got into a boat accident in which I nearly died. As we recovered, our accident seemed to make us closer, but then he shattered his ankle one night while we were out, about a month after the boat accident. Of course I had to take care of him, giving and giving and giving with little or no return for months, which is part of the commitment of a life together and I haven't felt resentment about it until recently when he's been withdrawing from me for not providing the same level of care I was providing in the months immediately after the accident. I am exhausted, the bank is empty and the outrageously large loans on that account are coming due, which he cannot or will not understand. Then came Hurricane Sandy which destroyed our home and forced us to look for a new one, which turned out to be extremely badly misrepresented so now we have to move again. It's a lot of stress at once, but we've handled worse so I know we could make it through this as well if our relationship were better.

Our biggest issue of all though, in my opinion is our communication. He says he feels like he shouldn't have to talk over every little thing with me. When I try to discuss how he handles our family finances he shuts down and tells me that he's not in charge of the finances and he just needs to make more money. I tell him this scares me because I trust him to be in control of our family finances and I personally know that he makes more than $100,000 per year. This should be enough for a family of 7 to live on decently, if not comfortably, even in NJ where we live, but there are times when we are so low on food that I have to run to the store just to have something for dinner. He says I have access to all of our accounts so I know where the money is going and the only time I bring it up is when we don't have any(which is not true, but it's what he chooses to remember). I try to explain to him that we don't ever have to have a time when we don't have any if we budget properly, but he refuses to even look at any budget plan or ideas and makes many arguments against a budget plan.

I think our second largest issue is his control issue. He seems to feel the need to control everyone around him as much as possible. I can have friends, but every time I did he talked so badly about them that I have given up trying to have any, compounding my loneliness. When I bring up the fact that he doesn't allow me to have friends he says I can have all the friends I want, no one is stopping me. When I mention the terrible things he's said about the women I've tried to befriend(I could never say I had a male friend, Whew! You'd see fireworks then!) he says those things are true and I need to pick better people to associate with. When I say I have no one to talk to besides him, he says he's in the same boat, then picks up his phone and calls at least 2-3 people to discuss what he wants to discuss. I literally have not one single adult in my life I can pick up the phone and talk to about anything and I have worked very hard not to talk about any of this with my kids, who also have no friends. He seems to believe everyone we want to hang out with is a bad influence while his associates are perfectly fine(I happen to know at least 3 of them are serial cheaters). When I wanted to become healthier I started to change my diet and he started making his own food and the kids of course wanted the foods we were eating(which he is cooking), not the healthier fare I was now providing. We're still having issues over that as he claims I'm trying to control him and what he eats. He wants me to massage his ankle, shoulder, etc every day while never offering to massage anything for me. If I refuse, no matter the reason(like I've been doing it every day for a week and I'm tired) he withdraws. His most effective weapon against me is his full withdrawal which he's been using against me for years. Half the time it's something I've done(no matter how trivial, it can trigger weeks of withdrawal), the other half I have no idea what's going on. He just withdraws for days, sometimes weeks and I'm left in the cold to guess what's going on. My response in the past has been to pour more effort into getting him to come back to me, but the well of effort that used to be there ran dry about 2 years ago and now when he withdraws I just withdraw myself and wait for him to come out of it. I know this is not a great response but it's the only one I've got for being ignored when I'm trying so hard. I've literally done every single thing I can think of, put so much effort into understanding him and his needs and meeting them, changed myself so much to be everything he wanted and needed from me and yet, here we are. He is full on against doing any program. He thinks we don't need anyone but us to solve our problems.

I think I'm coming to the end of the line. I don't want to end the relationship because I am concerned about how it will affect the children, but I also do not want them to think that this is how marriage is supposed to be. Please give me your perspective on this. I really need some outside looking in type of advice.

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Welcome to MB.

Have you seen these? Preparing for Marriage

I would pay special attention to the articles about living together.


FWW/BW (me)
WH
2nd M for both
Blended Family with 7 kids between us
Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.



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I have seen all of them and read them over and over. The only articles I haven't read on this site are the articles that have to do with infidelity because we don't have that issue. I feel that the articles are judgmental and about proving what a terrible choice living together is, without offering a clear way to remedy the situation besides moving out. These articles leave me with no hope for continuing to keep our family together. We have 5 children together and I don't want to mess up their chances of having good marital relationships because of our mistakes.

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Originally Posted By: 5kids4me
I have seen all of them and read them over and over. The only articles I haven't read on this site are the articles that have to do with infidelity because we don't have that issue. I feel that the articles are judgmental and about proving what a terrible choice living together is, without offering a clear way to remedy the situation besides moving out. These articles leave me with no hope for continuing to keep our family together. We have 5 children together and I don't want to mess up their chances of having good marital relationships because of our mistakes.

Then why not get married?

You have a volatile relationship relationship both sides, correct?

How does that not align with what Dr. Harley says about living together?

Have You seen this?
Buyers, Renters and Freeloaders

Which one are you and your boyfriend?


FWW/BW (me)
WH
2nd M for both
Blended Family with 7 kids between us
Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.



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Do you see the "renter" in him though, right? About coasting along, the status quo is "good enough", without any serious commitment to improving the situation for you.

You are asking - how to turn a renter boyfriend into a buyer husband? And (unfortunately) the general answer is that he probably won't want to change and in a dating situation, you would be advised to consider dating others until you find that buyer.

Anyways, 5 kids, obviously you need more practical advice. Your post is quite long - have you actually told him that you are considering leaving him?

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Originally Posted By: 5kids4me
I feel that the articles are judgmental and about proving what a terrible choice living together is, without offering a clear way to remedy the situation besides moving out. These articles leave me with no hope for continuing to keep our family together. We have 5 children together and I don't want to mess up their chances of having good marital relationships because of our mistakes.


Yes, living together is a terrible choice; that is an accurate judgement. As you have learned yourself. It is a lack of sound judgement that leads to such predicaments. As you have learned yourself.

However, Dr Harley does give solutions in his book Buyers, Renters and Freeloaders. Go to the chapter titled "The Curse of Living Together before Marriage" and he explains why shacking up is a bad idea and then gives solutions on how to turn a renters relationship into a buyers marriage.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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Originally Posted By: 5kids4me
I feel that the articles are judgmental


Judgment is a good thing.
The dictionary defines judgment as:

"The ability to make considered decisions or come to sensible conclusions"


What part of that is a bad thing? If you had exercised better judgment, you might not be where you are today.

But, you said judgmental. Which is different.

Are you saying that in your opinion you think Dr Harley is being harsh or biased when it comes to the decades marriage research he's conducted?

Quote:
because of our mistakes.


Mistakes are made when there are errors in judgment.
We teach our children to (hopefully) exercise good judgment and to make fewer drastic mistakes.

Isn't this the point of coming to a marriage related forum run by Dr Harley ? ~~~> To learn relationship dynamics which Dr Harley learned during his decades of work? Aren't we here to sort of 'borrow' his wisdom?

If Dr Harley wanted to actually be "judgmental", he might say "So-and-so is a bad person." <~~~ That would be opinion based. That sort of opinion goes beyond the scope of the research Dr Harley has done.

"Living together before marriage creates an incompatible lifestyle" <~~~ is a judgment, not judgmental.

Thank you for bringing up this very important difference.

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College grads have a greater lifetime earning potential. <~~~ A judgment based on data and research.

Non-college grads are stupid. <~~~ A very judgmental comment not based on research.

It is in your best interest to understand the difference. If a person understands the difference, they have the potential to make fewer mistakes !!!!!

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Might as well go for what you want to focus on....

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Our biggest issue of all though, in my opinion is our communication. He says he feels like he shouldn't have to talk over every little thing with me.


This is not a communication problem.
This is an attitude problem.

HUGE difference.

Your partner's attitude is one where he feels he is perfectly within his rights to make independent decisions without getting your input.

He is 100% capable of communicating his attitude that he is entitled to this independent behavior regardless of how it makes you feel.

Communication is intact. He has a Renter's attitude.

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So, the BIG ISSUE you want to focus on is a particular love-buster Dr Harley calls

Independent Behavior .... here ya go.

Link to your partner's attitude ... love-buster

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Quote:
I think our second largest issue is his control issue. He seems to feel the need to control everyone around him as much as possible. I can have friends, but every time I did he talked so badly about them that I have given up trying to have any, compounding my loneliness. When I bring up the fact that he doesn't allow me to have friends he says I can have all the friends I want, no one is stopping me. When I mention the terrible things he's said about the women I've tried to befriend(I could never say I had a male friend, Whew! You'd see fireworks then!) he says those things are true and I need to pick better people to associate with. When I say I have no one to talk to besides him, he says he's in the same boat, then picks up his phone and calls at least 2-3 people to discuss what he wants to discuss. I literally have not one single adult in my life I can pick up the phone and talk to about anything and I have worked very hard not to talk about any of this with my kids, who also have no friends. He seems to believe everyone we want to hang out with is a bad influence while his associates are perfectly fine(I happen to know at least 3 of them are serial cheaters). When I wanted to become healthier I started to change my diet and he started making his own food and the kids of course wanted the foods we were eating(which he is cooking), not the healthier fare I was now providing. We're still having issues over that as he claims I'm trying to control him and what he eats. He wants me to massage his ankle, shoulder, etc every day while never offering to massage anything for me. If I refuse, no matter the reason(like I've been doing it every day for a week and I'm tired) he withdraws. His most effective weapon against me is his full withdrawal which he's been using against me for years. Half the time it's something I've done(no matter how trivial, it can trigger weeks of withdrawal), the other half I have no idea what's going on. He just withdraws for days, sometimes weeks and I'm left in the cold to guess what's going on. My response in the past has been to pour more effort into getting him to come back to me, but the well of effort that used to be there ran dry about 2 years ago and now when he withdraws I just withdraw myself and wait for him to come out of it. I know this is not a great response but it's the only one I've got for being ignored when I'm trying so hard. I've literally done every single thing I can think of, put so much effort into understanding him and his needs and meeting them, changed myself so much to be everything he wanted and needed from me and yet, here we are. He is full on against doing any program. He thinks we don't need anyone but us to solve our problems.


This is very sad. frown I really feel badly for you.

You have held onto this relationship of 17 years almost exclusively by using your "GIVER" to keep your man happy at the expense of your happiness.
Whenever your "TAKER" tries to get your needs met, you are told that you are "controlling". This is the 17-year relationship paradigm that your GIVER has created !!!!

Please, take the time to read, and perhaps re-read the link in my sig line Buyers/Renters/Freeloaders.

Pay attention to the GIVER/TAKER as described by Dr Harley.

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Quote:
When I tell him I feel like he is being selfish


Your comment to the man you love is far more judgmental than anything Dr Harley has said about the perils/pitfalls of living together before marriage!!! shocked


Dr Harley calls such comments "disrespectful judgments". DJ's are one of Dr Harley's "love busters". There is a way to voice your displeasure without making a DJ.

"When you do X-Y-Z, I feel (neglected, unhappy, unloved, sad, confused, whatever feeling you have)." You can comment on how you feel when your non-husband does certain behaviors.

The general theme I get when I read your story is that (more & more) you do not feel loved, respected, appreciated or important in your relationship of 17 years.

Am I correct?

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I did a quick internet search for Common Law marriage in New Jersey:

Quote:
Common Law Marriage in New Jersey
A "common law marriage" is one in which the parties may hold themselves out as a husband and wife, and under certain circumstances, be deemed married without a marriage license or ceremony.

New Jersey does not allow the creation of a common law marriage, a relationship in which a couple lives together but have not participated in a lawful ceremony. Unlike some other states, in New Jersey a couple cannot acquire marital rights and responsibilities by living together for a particular period of time. You do not need legal action to end such a relationship, if it was created in New Jersey.

However, New Jersey does recognize as valid, common law marriages created in other states if the legal requirements of those states have been met. As a result, legal action is needed to dissolve legal common law marriages performed in other states and foreign countries in compliance with their licensing and ceremonial regulations. The courts are available for determining the rights of parties now living in New Jersey.

As long as a couple lives together as husband and wife, the question of validity of their marriage is unlikely to arise. However, for purposes of inheritance or the benefits of pension plans or social security, a valid marriage is required.



Just FYI. You are financially at risk unless you created a valid common law marriage before you moved to NJ.

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"Don't worry, I won't make you wait 20 years to marry you."


This comment alone mr eek should send chills down your spine.
His attitude towards you is communicated 100% by this one remark!

HE won't make YOU wait 20 years for the privilege of HIM making a decision.
You wait. He decides.
He is the trophy you need to wait for.
If you're good another 3 years .... this might happen.

YIKES !!!!!!!

Quote:
We have had disagreements over whether we are actually married or not.

The State of New Jersey gets to decide if you are, or are not married. This is not a debatable issue.

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Quote:
a woman who's been a sahm for the last 13 years


Greatest non-paying job in the world!!!

In order to better understand your situation, you need to educate yourself about child support in NJ. Why? Because you need to understand all the angles, should things go from bad to much worse.

How many of your 5 kids are under the age of 18? How old is the youngest child? Are any of your children special needs?

YOU need to educate yourself about all YOUR options.
Waiting for HIM to make up his mind is a very dangerous thing for you to do.
Look up a NJ legal aid office, and ask about child support should you separate.
It's a formula, it is not your non-husband's choice of the amount he thinks is fair.

Don't discuss this with him first.
Just do this, and then post your findings here on your thread.
This is not the same thing as separating. This is positioning yourself to make better future decisions based on facts, not wished.

One of the things you will need to do, in or out of this relationship is learn how to state a boundary.
In order to state your boundary, you need to know the potential outcomes of any decision.

No threats. No warnings. Just educate yourself & let us know you are serious about improving this situation.

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I'm actually here today because over the last few days I've started fantasizing about having sex with other men, something that's never happened in our relationship before and it scares me to think about what it means for our relationship.


Your thread/story is filled with example after example of what not to do.
It's classic, really. I've bookmarked it so I can reference your story in the future.

The current state of your relationship is this .... you are both falling out of love with each other. Both of you. If it were not for the 5 kids you've made together, one or both of you would have left a long time ago. Both of you are deeply unhappy.

The near-empty love banks are due to love-busters, yes. But, your relationship is a classic Renter's agreement. Dr Harley explains how this sort of agreement (alternating sacrificing) over time creates an incompatible lifestyle. You have never , during the entire 17 years of auditioning to be his wife, created what Dr Harley calls POJA. Policy of Joint Agreement ~~~> This is the Buyers agreement. This Buyer's POJA is nearly impossible to achieve in a living-together arrangement.

The following is Dr Harley's description of The Renter's Agreement.

Quote:
Renter is willing to provide limited care as long as it's in his or her best interest. The romantic relationship is considered tentative, so the care is viewed as short-term. It's like a person who rents a house and is willing to stay as long as the conditions seem fair, or until he or she finds something better. The person is willing to pay reasonable rent and keep the house clean but is not willing to make repairs or improvements. It's the landlord's job to keep the place attractive enough for the renter to stay and continue paying rent.



This is your situation, exactly.

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5K .... I am not usually very interested in live-in relationships. Your situation is so sad because you have subjected 5 kids to this 17-year-audition.

If you want FREE advice, you should write to the radio program and ask some questions.

Here is the link telling you how to contact the radio program

Quote:
Email your questions to Joyce Harley at mbradio@marriagebuilders.com. When your email question is chosen to be answered on the radio show, you will be notified by email directing you to listen to the rebroadcast. If you would like to consider being a caller, include your telephone number. You will be called by us to explain the procedure to you. Every caller will receive a complementary book by Dr. Harley that addresses their question.


Best of luck to you, and your family.

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Originally Posted By: 5kids4me
I feel that the articles are judgmental and about proving what a terrible choice living together is, without offering a clear way to remedy the situation besides moving out.


Whenever a new poster writes something like this about MB .... I am suspicious that they never did the reading they claim to have done.

I am also suspicious that what the new poster actually means is that there is no EASY solution .

I suspect that this particular new poster is pretty certain that her live-in partner will NEVER agree to POJA ... and so she must convince herself that "POJA" will never work. What she actually understands is that POJA is miles from anything that her Renter/Freeloader partner will be willing to try. He does not want to become a BUYER, and she is stuck with a RENTER. She knows it. It's more comfortable to blame MB, and say Dr Harley is "judgmental".



Quote:
As you point out in your letter, you want commitment. That's what most people who marry want. But let's make sure we understand what the commitment will be. For most couples, it is to "love and cherish each other in plenty and in want, in joy and in sorrow, in sickness and in health as long as you both shall live." You mention that you have money, health and happiness at this point in time. Will you care for each other as much if you lose all of those advantages? I'm sure you would like to have that assurance, and wouldn't want your husband to abandon you at the first sign of trouble.

Let's imagine what will happen to you after you both make a commitment in marriage. Will you both make a greater effort to "love and cherish" each other. If that's what marriage would do for you, you should marry as soon as possible.

Sadly, couples that live together don't seem to care for each other after marriage as they did before marriage. Why is that the case after they make a commitment to care for each other? The answer is found in how the commitment is usually interpreted after marriage. It turns out that when you and your spouse make a commitment to care for each other unconditionally, instead of being motivated to do a better job, you tend to relax with the assumption that your spouse will care for you regardless of what you do. You don't need to do anything to keep your spouse caring for you since he made that commitment.

So the commitment of marriage often has the reverse effect that couples who live together hope it will have. Instead of encouraging each spouse to make a greater effort to care, it actually takes away the incentive to care. After all, when you live together, one of the only things keeping you together is the other person's care for you. If that care is taken away, you're history. But if care disappears after marriage, your commitment is expected to keep you together.

That kind of commitment doesn't work, of course. The proof that it doesn't work is the extremely high divorce rate among couples who live together before marriage.

I suggest that you and your boyfriend spend some time discussing what a marriage commitment means to each of you. Is it an assurance that regardless of what you do, the other person will continue to care for you, or is there more to it than that?

Chances are, you and your boyfriend have tried to give each other as much personal freedom as possible while you have lived together. That's what cohabitating couples usually do. After all, they're not married, what right do they have to try to change each other. They make adjustments when absolutely necessary to stay together, but nothing more.

The rule you have been following is "do whatever makes you happy and avoid anything that makes you unhappy." Once in a while, you will have a conflict where what makes one of you happy makes the other unhappy, but you probably solve it by sacrificing: I'll let you do what you want this time if you let me do what I want next time. You may also have tried to overlook or avoid areas of conflict whenever they appear.

I believe that the rules you have used in your relationship of seven years will become your undoing when you marry. Those rules that have protected your independence will destroy your marriage. They don't show you how to grow together and create compatibility, they encourage you to grow apart. When you follow them you eventually become incompatible.

So I recommend that the "commitment" you make in marriage be a commitment to a rule that protects your relationship from each other's self-centeredness and helps you build compatibility. That rule will guide your decisions so that they take the feelings of both of you into account simultaneously, instead of just one of you. Yes, you lose some of your independence -- you will not be able to do anything you feel like doing. But you gain a solid relationship that will help you survive "want, sorrow and sickness."

That rule that I recommend is the Policy of Joint Agreement (never do anything without an enthusiastic agreement between you and your spouse). This policy, more than any other, guarantees marital compatibility and lasting love. But couples who live together prior to marriage tend not to follow that rule before or after marriage. To me, that is the most important reason that their marriages do not succeed.

Couples who do not live together before marriage usually begin their marriage with an understanding that they must both accommodate each other if the relationship is to last a lifetime. So without ever being told what rule to follow, they tend to know enough to follow the Policy of Joint Agreement. That's why their marriages are much more successful.

So the solution to your problem is quite simple. While you are still unmarried, try to follow the Policy of Joint Agreement whenever you make a decision. Assume that every decision you make will affect the other, and ask how the other feels whenever you plan to do something. If you can follow it while you are unmarried, there's no reason why you would not be able to follow it after marriage. And the longer you follow it, the more compatible and in love you will both become. You'll find that marriage will become an easy choice for both of you, and the marriage itself will be as successful as you hoped it would be.

Last edited by Pepperband; 05/20/13 09:56 AM.
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Originally Posted By: 5kids4me
These articles leave me with no hope for continuing to keep our family together.


Okay, I'll fix that:

You have nothing to worry about. Everything is fine. There's a bright future ahead.

Better?


If you are serious about saving your marriage, you can't get it all on this forum. You've got to listen to the Marriage Builders Radio show, every day. Install the app!

Married to my radiant trophy wife, Prisca, 17 years, who is a beautiful angel.
Attended Marriage Builders weekend in May 2010

If your wife is not on board with MB, some of my posts to other men might help you.

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