This is exactly what i am going thru and the exact same thoughts right now towards my W.

My problem is very recent less then 2 weeks since i confronted the A and its only been a month or so going on.

I hope it is normal.

Well, I suspect what you're experiencing is a normal human reaction to a highly stressful period. Until now, you've been so heavily involved in your reaction to the WH's infidelity that you've put off actually considering all the implications of what has happened. I think you've been reacting instinctively since you discovered WH's adultery. Now that you have time to take a breath, you're second guessing yourself and wondering if you made the right decision.

I don't think that's wrong or unhealthy. We all take another look at what we’ve obligated ourselves to when there are difficult things to do and when we make serious commitments, dedicating ourselves to a huge amount of work we know will be very emotional draining. Don’t misunderstand me. I support the right of every betrayed spouse to make a conscious decision whether to stay in the marriage or decide to separate one’s self from the betrayer.

The thing is, I think you have to also pay attention to your instincts in making that conscious decision. Instincts are your subconscious mind telling you things it can’t do in a logical process. If your first instinct was to turn away from an OP and rededicate yourself to the marriage, it was for a reason you might not be conscious of right now. If your first instinct was to save your WS from his adultery and bring him back to the marriage, it was because something in you told you it was the right path for you and him.

You married your spouse once for some very good reasons. Examine those reasons also, in addition to your doubts. Your marriage was probably vulnerable before the adulteries occurred – perhaps for some of the reasons you enumerate. Fine…but it doesn’t mean there aren’t good reasons for staying together too.

Dr. Harley wrote the last half of SAA because marriages ARE vulnerable at times. That section of the book is dedicated to healing the vulnerabilities and making the marriage stronger than it was before. Take another look at the passages in SAA, and listen to SH’s advice, okay?

Give this time…a lot of time. There’s no need to make an immediate decision, particularly at 3:00 in the morning, the darkest hour for any human being. Stay with this, TFC. Working at the problems through counseling will show you the proper course.


DB: I don’t know much about your situation, and my response is directed to TFC, but I hope you can read enough between the lines above for your own use. Hang tough, pardner.

I am so humiliated ... that is the worst part. I know he is too. I had an A, in secret (aren't they usually?). He went out and had his right out in the open for everyone to see - introducing her to people and everything. On top of that, in the midst of his A, he decided to tell everyone & their brother about mine (conveniently leaving out the fact that he was in one too at that point). He did things for her that he never did for me - even before my A, when we were "happy". I suppose that is the hardest part. I would have been less upset if he had just had sex with her ... but he didn't - he gave her time, affection, and attention he was never willing to give to me.

However, all along my instincts all along have been to save this M ... so that is what I'll try to do. The waiting sucks. But he is really trying at the M now, so I can't ask for much more than that! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

Going to an attorney today for a consult. I've had this scheduled for several weeks now. I'm wondering if I should go ahead and have the MSA drawn up? I don't really want to, but in some way I think it might wake-up my H to realize that we aren't going to just live like this ... that things will have to start being worked on in order to stay married.

His MO has been to do what he wants, when he wants - until I get to my breaking point and show that I am serious. Case in point: OW wasn't really broken-up with until I told him that I had found several apartments within his price-range and would happy to place a deposit on one of them so he could move out since he wasn't done with her. After that, he got his you-know-what together and began actually trying at this M.

He's sort of like a teenager sometimes - he'll push until he realizes that he's actually going to get in trouble, and then he straightens out a bit. But he usually goes right back into what he was doing to upset me after I've been placated for a week or two.

So, any tips for me before I go to this appointment today? Any suggestions? Any warnings?

TFC-
Now that the Revenge A is ending and he is moving towards you, you are going to see an atty. I dont get it. What is your goal? The results of Plan A does not happen over night.

I hope the DJ'ing the H here is just venting.

What is a MSA?

He is still talking about D, so I think I should be prepared. I don't expect overnight results, that's for certain. I wasn't trying to DJ, is it DJ when its the truth? We've discussed it numerous times ... he would even admit to being that way. Maybe I came across too harsh. But I don't mean it to be ugly about him, its just the way he is and I accept that. I put it out there so that everyone offering advise would understand what I'm up against for recovery. Not as a vent or tirade about him.

MSA = Marital Separation Agreement ... he wants one (excuse me - he says he wants one).

Well, I went to the meeting ... and I def do NOT want a D!

But, I did get an interesting tidbit:
He cannot sue for D on the grounds of adultery here - well, he can, but it won't be granted. Because he continued to live in the home and remained married following the discovery of my A, its called "condonation" (meaning he legally condoned it and accepted it as part of our M). Not to mention, he had his own A and it would be pointless.

The attorney was actually really nice and encourages trying to work out the M for a period of time before deciding on D.

Hopefully we won't get to the point of ever filing for D. I don't want it ... I hate that we're going through all this. I want so badly for us to work things out. Now, I am even more encouraged to continue Plan A and exhibit patience!

Well ... he checked her email, but did not respond. Did she not get the point? Can't he just block her?

Now, let's see if he tells me about it ...

I'm pretty sure that he will let me know about this contact. Once he does, how do I respectfully, kindly, lovingly request the following?

1. NC Letter to OW
2. Login/passwords to other accounts
3. Blocking OW

(This is all reasonable to request, right? Or am I expecting too much too soon?)

Good news & Bad News ...

Bad News: he lied about contact. I asked if she had tried to contact him in any way, he said no.

Good News: we all went as a family yesterday and adopted a new puppy!

Other Good News: He seems to be in his own sort-of Plan A ... very nice! Asking me questions, paying more attention to me, recognizing things I do for the family. I think he might have even read my EN Questionnaire b/c he's doing things that are listed on there that he never really did before.

I would like to write him a letter. I would like it to list the things that I would like to see happen for recovery. I would also like to know what he would like from me to begin recovery. Is this a good idea? Bad idea? Suggestions?

TFC, I don't know about the letter thing. You and he are working at getting closer together, bit by bit, and a letter seems so impersonal in the context of what you two are achieving. I think this would be one of those things to bring up in front of a counselor (i.e., in a neutral forum).

How's the counseling session plan developing? I think it's vitally important you two get into couples counseling during this period.

About him lying about the attempted contact...he's probably trying to "protect" you from what he thinks would be bad news if you found out. In a way, it's good because of his intent, but it's bad because he's not yet ready for radical honesty. But...can't radical honesty wait a little while, until you and he are in counseling and more comfortable discussing such things? That he's not opened the email is a good sign to me. I'd be inclined to let the details slide for a time in favor of addressing the major issues. What do you think?

We are on a good path here and I don't want to ruin it. I agree with you - those things are best discussed with SH. (And we are discussing when to set up a next appt tonight.)

As far as the email - he did open it, but did not respond. I appreciate him protecting me from its contents, however. He's been honest about the more important things, and has been willing to meet my ENs ... that is probably far more important than telling me about an email that he didn't bother to respond to.

We have actually been able to joke a little bit about each others As ... sick as it sounds. When we were thinking of names for the new puppy yesterday, we each suggested OPs name and laughed it off and said some insult about OP. Seems mean and kinda immature, but I think it shows that we are beginning to be on the same team again ... becoming an "US"!

K, I didn't understand he'd actually opened the email but the reasoning is the same. He's very probably not admitting the receipt in order to keep from introducing what he thinks might be a disruption in the way things are moving now.

Please do check into the counseling. You two need a professional counselor involved in this process so you can get your relationship beyond the next bump in the road, one that will surely come no matter how hard you two try to smooth things out.

BTW, your ability to joke about the adulteries is not unheard of, though it generally doesn't happen until far later in the process. I would think so long as you keep it light and non-accusatory, it's probably a healthy thing to do but there's also a possibility one or the other of you might hit a nerve someday without meaning to. You don't seem to need the advice, but be careful, okay?

Sounds like things are going very well, TFC, but please get with SH or a local, very pro-marriage counselor as soon as you can.

IMO, the joking about your adultery is ridiculous. I can tell you that if I were him... YOU had better never joke about something like that. That would be a major LB and frankly NEVER something to joke about.

Your H's relationship with the OW is not really over untilo such a time is there is NC... and because he did not tell you about the email, I would have appropriate concern about that. I believe you should bring this up to him and see what he says. You should not "appreciate" him failing to be honest with you. In the face of both of you having affairs, I would suggest that there is nothing more important than honesty right now. Both of you let your character and integrity take a vacation.... it is time to reclaim that.

He isn't quite ready for MC yet, but he said that he wants to find an IC for himself soon. I'm still trying to convince him to do the EN Questionnaire.

As far as the joking goes - we have kept it light and about OP, not each other. I guess having some humor about it makes it a little less serious all the time.

Last night, he mentioned letting things be for a while ... no pressure on the M. This is what he feels that he needs to see if we can make a go of it. Which I completely understand. We've enjoyed each others company for the last week - which has been the first of that in a while. Becoming friends again is probably a really good start, wouldn't you say?

You're the one there watching his eyes and his reactions to what you say and do, TFC. Your instincts initially told you he was wandering and now those instincts are telling you to go slow and build this relationship back up incrementally. Keep watching, but I think your instincts can be trusted. The trick will be to not allow "letting things be for a while" extend out too very long, right?

I think becoming friends again is fine. One of the things Dr. Harley recommends in SAA to rebuild the relationship is to spend as much quality time together as you can. You'll see references to "15 hours a week” or more. He even recommends getting away on a long trip together.

I'm sorry he's resisting MC, but that too is almost routine for some folks. Keep working for it, okay? SH or a pro-marriage counselor from your community can help a lot getting past the bumps in the road that will crop up in this process.

Good work, TFC.

Righto! I was just talking to my IC today about setting a time-limit for myself on this "letting things be" thing. So, I figure another 3 months is all I can handle. Too long? Too short? Not sure, but I'll just play it by ear. We certainly need to regain our friendship and our trust before anything else. I will work on him for MC. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Longhorn - Your encouragement and calm demeanor are always the exact thing I need when I post here. I can't thank you enough!

How're you doing, TFC?

Thanks for checking in on me! I am doing good! H went out of town yesterday, but made time for a surprise lunch with me first! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

We are getting along really well and making great efforts at meeting ENs (I just wish he would do the questionnaire). I had asked about meeting up with him on an upcoming trip for 2 days, but he didn't seem really into that idea. I figure I can give it some time.

He's been asking about my meeting with the atty. and I haven't really answered. I was hoping that he wouldn't remember that I had the meeting, and I thought he didn't think I was serious. But I want to be O&H with him ... should I just tell him that I did go and inform him about the meeting?

I am in the process of figuring out what I want to be when I grow up (LOL) ... seriously, I am trying to make a career change, but have to figure out what I want first! This has been a challenge for me. All my life I just wanted to be a mom, and never thought about a career. But I really need something for me, that I love and enjoy. So that is a big part of my personal journey right now. Its easier to think about things like this when the M is going a bit more smoothly.