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Glad to hear you're doing well, TFC. I'd go with the radical honesty, if I were you. But I'd also POJA it (if I'm radically honest, so are you)...and let him know where the term comes from. I think he needs to get acquainted with SAA and start checking off some of the squares in the checklist for recovery. What do you think?

Good to hear you're getting yourself set up for the rest of your life. You've remembered to get your husband on your side in that process?

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His honesty has been overwhelming as of late. The girl that I was concerned about when I first came to MB lives out of state and now I know that they were truly just friends ... however I had found that inappropriate IM log and they haven't spoken since I showed it to him. She works in his field and he needed a contact name/number. She was the only person that he knew that might have it. So, he called me and asked permission to text her for it. I approved. That night, I came home and he offered his cell phone for me to review the message for appropriateness. I didn't have to ... the fact that he was willing to show it to me on his own accord said plenty. You know, she never responded to his message. I'm guessing she got word that we're trying to repair our M ... I always thought she wanted more than a friendship with him. Good for her.

As far as figuring out my future career:
This has been something that I have struggled with for a long time. My H was never really that interested in helping me figure it out. He always said that it wasn't something that he could decide for me. Now, I have brought up what I am working on in conversation several times. Each time he has spent more time discussing it with me. When he finally realized that I wasn't looking to him for answers, he became more interested. I had to explain to him that I didn't need him to pick a career for me ... I just needed him to talk things through and to get his acceptance on my choice (whenever I finally choose). Now he's even offering ideas of things that I would love, even though they are far-fetched financially. It is nice to finally have his participation.

I told him Sunday night: "In the past week, you have been a better husband to me than in the 6 years we've been married." He asked me with a smart-alek smirk - "Collectively?" I laughed and said "No, not collectively. But I am so appreciative of the efforts that you have made. It means to much to see that you want to try." He smiled and looked down. It was precious.

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Good on you. Keep up the great work, Lady.

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One question: The other night, we were talking about what a great team we are. During this, he states that we co-exist (I think he meant we're co-dependent - coexist has another meaning to me). And he wonders if that is a healthy way to be married? I explained my opinion: To me, partnership is about being a good team. We compliment each other in so many ways - in our finances, in our parenting, in our personalities, in our day-to-day tasks, etc. To me, being a good team is a foundation for a great marriage. He thought on it for a bit, and nodded with a smile. Was it a test? Does he agree? Not sure. But my actual question here is: Is it unhealthy to co-exist (as he put it)? Or is it a foundation for a good marriage?

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P.S.
I am so amazed at the 180 that he has done ... now, I would give anything to hear "I love you".

So, I'm off to read Fall in Love, Stay in Love.

Did I mention that I think he's been reading MB or the books? If not, he is a natural at this!

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To me, codependency isn't a very attractive state in a relationship. I feel that when one depends upon one's spouse for all emotional feedback and motivation, then that individual (and the relationship) is really terribly vulnerable. I don’t think that’s what your husband means though. I don’t see that kind of relationship in what you’ve written.

With just your few words to go on, I'd be more inclined to say he's rediscovering you two fit together as well as two pieces in a puzzle...and he's making sure you understand it shouldn’t devolve into something less healthy. It could be he’s doing some soul searching and wants to see how you feel about things that are coming up in that search…perhaps something like, “Do we love each other too much?”

So far as I’m concerned, instead of codependency, much better foundations for a marriage are a good partnership, communication such as you’re reestablishing with your husband, and lots of quality time together. Seems to me that’s what both of you are working toward. Way to go.

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Where I was coming from - one of us always picks up where the other leaves off, so to speak. Examples:

Parenting - we almost always make arrangements for one of us to be taking care of DD. We agreed when she was born that we never wanted her in a daycare.
Personality - I stress about things he's more laid-back about and vice versa. We compliment one another.
Home duties - when one is busier than the other, the less busy picks up the slack in chores at home. It is never really talked about, just done.

We have become a very cohesive team over the years in the day-to-day ... obviously we were lacking this in the emotional department, otherwise neither of us would have allowed for an affair to happen. Now we need to apply that teamwork mentality to our love/marriage, IMO. Maybe this is what he was truly concerned about?

Since this is something that he's obviously thinking on, would it be a good idea for me to read up on codependency just to be sure that isn't a road we're headed down?

Last edited by time_for_change; 04/27/07 01:30 PM.
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Sure, why not read up on codependency? The more you know about relationships, the better off you are, right? Call it research just to make sure neither one of you go down that path. Looking into it might help with a future discussion on “co-existing,” right? However, I wouldn't be too concerned about the concept of codependency being a part of your marriage. There are others more versed in codependency on MB, but I sure don’t see it in your marriage.

Remember, codependency has an aspect of manipulation to it and I don't see any of that behavior in anything you said about your relationship. Instead, I see more the partnership thing...fitting together...rather than manipulation. Being part of a team working toward a common goal is nowhere near the same thing as emotionally bullying your spouse.

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I guess I should read a little on codependency ... I don't see emotional bullying in us either, but it doesn't hurt to know a little bit more about it.

We have been so much better about communicating with one another lately. This is what I wish we'd had in our M all along! I think I mentioned before that I think he's read my EN questionnaire, but I didn't leave the LBQ out for him. So, I've been sure to lovingly mention when he does something that constitutes a LB for me. And he does the same for me ... except he says something more like "um, that drives me crazy". He doesn't mean it to be ugly to me and he doesn't say it in a hateful tone, so I don't call it a LB when he does. (LOL)

Today, however, I got this icky feeling that maybe he is still talking to the OW but hiding it really well. I know I should just try to have a little faith. After all, I'm still checking up on him and there's no proof of any communication between them or any A friends. So ... probably just a bad day?

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Probably a bad day, but don't let your guard down. I've seen accounts from the radio show that say Dr. Harley and his wife check up on each other and have for many years. If you can think of another way to check, it might be worthwhile.

I don't think you'll find anything, based on what you've relayed from your interactions with your WH lately. The communication is too open now between you, for one thing. Normally, if a WS has just received a "fix" for his/her addiction to the OP, there is some detachment from the BS. They don't need the BS meeting any of their EN's because they've already been met.

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True. I could always tell when he'd talked to her b/c he was so mean and standoffish to me. This has definitely not been the case lately! He will be out of town most of next month, so I hope we can maintain this good communication through the distance.

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He is doing everything right, but something is just missing ... The things he is doing now are things I wished for all along in our M. But they still aren't enough? That seems so wrong to me. Our friendship is better than ever, but that's really all there seems to be between us (aside from SF). I need to be patient ... just a lonely night with him out of town. May will be a long month, as he will only be home about 3 or 4 days.

P.S. Sorry for the Debbie Downer post!

Last edited by time_for_change; 04/28/07 09:15 PM.
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Confronted H on another lie today. He now claims that all our arguments surface because of my "snooping" ... I explained that had he not lied repeatedly, I wouldn't have to "snoop" and that the real problem here is that he continues to lie to me. I am over the lies. And he still won't agree to MC.

He does, however, feel that it is in the best interest for all involved for he & I to work things out and stay married. He & I are on different pages in this ... he says that he is working on the friendship, I think we're working on the M (which includes our friendship). I am at a complete loss on what to do next.

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Last night, H and I cuddled and held each other. He went to bed with me for the first time in a looooooong time. (He usually stays up much later.) It was so nice to feel loved. But of course something had to break it ...

We are not morning people, so we snap at each other in the a.m. from time to time. This morning was no exception. But then, on my way in to work, he called. He wanted to tell me that living with anger, hate, resentment, and fear is no way to live and that I need to get it out of my system. I didn't realize I was living that way, but something to ponder. He says he understands that I am stressed out because (1) I don't know where our M is headed and (2) I only go to work and come home. I explained that yes, what we're going through is stressful, but also that I don't feel appreciated for what I do at home and at work, which leads to more stress. He seemed to understand. I think he may have been talking more about himself than me, because he followed all this with a comment about not having the luxury of going to therapy every week.

Then I get a text message from the xOM's XW. She is yet again sending hate-filled messages to me. While I certainly understand that she is in pain, I would like this to stop.

And one more thing: H has not apologized for his EA. I think he feels like he was entitled to it? Not sure - that could be a DJ. Maybe I should help him find a good IC?

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Quote
Then I get a text message from the xOM's XW. She is yet again sending hate-filled messages to me. While I certainly understand that she is in pain, I would like this to stop


change your phone number. she ahs every right to be angry with you... as you have every right to make it impossible for her to contact you. I hope you have previously apologized to her.
I think if I were a WS or FWS and hurt another like this... I would constantly sleep with one eye open and watch my back.
But... changing your number is the way to handle this... the OM should not have a way to contact you either... so all phone numbers and email accounts should be changed.

MEDC

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I agree that she has every right to be angry with me. I prefer not to "sleep with one eye open", as I will get what I deserve (if I haven't already), or God will forgive me. I must find my own peace within and accept the choices I've made in the past and use my lessons to become a better person.

I have emailed her an apology ... she didn't think it was sincere. I have never apologized for something I'm not sorry for, that's not how I operate. I have asked her nicely to stop contacting me. The email address she sends me emails to is my business email. I can easily change my cell phone number, but not my email address. I have blocked her on email though.

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I told my H about the contact from her. He already knew. She had messaged him, but she failed to mention her hate-filled text message to me. She made it out to him like I sent some lame apology and asked her to stop contacting me and told him she wasn't planning on it. He told me that he believed my apology was sincere and said that it wouldn't matter how I apologized to her, she probably wouldn't accept it. He understands (obviously) that she is hurting, but agrees that she needs to quit contacting me - he feels that it is childish. So, H is going to ask her to stop contacting me.

Last edited by time_for_change; 05/01/07 09:28 AM.
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your H should have NO contact with her for ANY reason whatsoever.
Marriage builders 101.

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MEDC - you say he shouldn't be in contact with her either. How do I suggest this without LBing?

Last edited by time_for_change; 05/01/07 10:53 AM.
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TFC, I don't understand. You don't want your husband to have any contact with the wife of your affair partner? Wouldn't you want to still be in contact with the husband of your husband's affair partner to make sure there is no re-firing of the affair in this very early stage of reconciliation? Remember, your husband has not healed from your affair. He’s entitled to have some things in place to assure himself your affair is over also. It’s just part of snooping on each other, isn’t it?

I think you must accept the fact your other man’s wife is going to hate you for the rest of your life. Why torture yourself by reading any of her text messages?

What’s the status of getting into counseling?

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