Wow. Just wow. Not just to this post but to the big long one you first posted today.

That sounds EXACTLY like something my XH would say to me. Well, he DID say it to me....before the wedding he wanted kids...then years passed and he kept putting it off for one reason or another--usually something *I* wasn't doing right---then after 16 years when I finally convinced him to have unprotected sex and I got pregnant he tried to convince himself it wasn't his....yeah, sounds familiar.

Ugh. Sorry CWMI. You have my sympathy. Liars are the worst. Eventually I don't think they even know what the truth is.

I would rather he told me either that he didn't want them, or inform me that he thought he was sterile. Either one of those would have allowed me some input on decision-making.

GRAPHIC WARNING:












He would lay on top of me and say, "I'm gonna put a baby in you. You want me to put a baby in you? Yeah? Yeah? Oh yeah!!!!"

What. the. indeed. He shoulda *really* faked it, would have screwed up fewer lives that way.

I'm sorry, CWMI, but this is just priceless. How you managed not to burst out laughing is beyond me.

*I* was in lurrrrrve, wanting to give my son a sibling, so I found it quite enticing.

I also like, "I'm gonna spank you, you bad girl" and other laughable lines, lol.

What?

You say these lies were told quite a while ago (and they're nutty, by the way). What made you start thinking about them? Does he actually think these things still? Was he drinking or something? Even a bad liar would realize this kind of talk would set off the BS detector.

This must be so frustrating.

OOO, baby!

Well, I'd have to say I never stopped thinking about it. I thought things were going great until the topic that started this thread, and ever since, I just...think about things. I guess the catalyst was Sunday when church put out another Great Date pamphlet, designed for husbands to create great dates for their wives. After the announcement, I told him I'd like it if he picked it up and took me on it, we had such a good time the last one.

And then he didn't. Pick up the pamphlet.

Then last night, I'm setting the table for ds13's (now ds14's) B-day dinner, and H is coming behind me moving the plates to be about 1/2 inch closer to the edge of the table. It annoyed the crap out of me. I said, "Is that necessary?" He looked sheepish and walked off, I finished serving and we ate...

So later he said, "We need a date night. What would you like to do?"

I said, "I'd like to go on the Great Date our church has out. Why didn't you pick it up?"

He asked me why didn't *I* pick it up, and I kinda, er, went off. "I didn't pick it up because our church doesn't put it out as a way for WIVES to instruct their HUSBANDS, but to give guidance to the husbands themselves! Why would I want to be the only wife in a line of MEN picking up instructions for MY OWN DATE?"

He said that he doesn't like to make plans for us because he always gets them wrong.

I said, "Like the way I set the table wrong? Should I just NOT do it then because I can't do it right?"

He said the point was taken, but like many points I've made over the years, I think he doesn't get it and just wanted me to shut up.

This... this I find... *shiver*... creepy.

The spanking thing?

Hmmmm... to each their own, and each thing in it's given situation and intention.

Not TMI from me today, no sir.

lol. I shouldn't've told ya'll eh?

C'mon, don't you guys talk a little smack in the sack? lol.

So.....

He suggested a date night, and you used the opportunity to blast him about what he did wrong?

How was that helpful?

cwmi, just because he says now that he didn't want kids then, doesn't mean that at the time he didn't want kids. You already know

1. his memory is like a sieve
2. he has a habit of lying to you about what he thought in the past
3. he makes up stuff to make you feel bad and or get you off his case

If it helps, I had BTDT, H also told me a few years ago that he didn't think he could get a woman pregnant, and that's why he didn't choose to use protection when I got pregnant with DD14. And that he only married me because I was pregnant, even though we were already engaged before that. He said a year after that, when we were reconciling temporarily, that he not only didn't say that, but he never would have said that. And I remember how painful all that was at the time. But life moves on, water under the bridge, this, too, shall pass. At some point, cwmi, I think you're not going to care anymore. But I'd be happy to support you here in any way I can until then.

So, you said how you handle it is to call him on his stuff. Did you ever hear how LA describes it, lovingly handing their words back to them? Not a shame thing, just reminding them you're not playing that game anymore, "let's pretend to get all upset as if you and I believe what you just said." He's simply doing what he does, because it had a payoff for him at the time. Are y'all working a plan that will address that over time?

I think he may have married someone like you, because he likes to be the rebellious bad boy, and feel like he's getting away with something. Renter thinking, not realizing these patterns are unsustainable. But that's neither here nor there. How can you make a plan of attack that doesn't add to these huge withdrawals this behavior already brings? Or maybe you do already, it's hard to read tone. When you mentioned about that Great Date thing, were you getting exasperated on the inside, or calmly remembering this is just what he does, tries to make you feel bad, because that's more important to him than building a strong marriage? His choice, not about you, you are making an awesome life for yourself and your family, with or without him?

If you were calm, I think you may think, you know, it doesn't matter if we follow the Great Date plan or not. Sure, it'd be nice, but he's not a failure if he doesn't pick up that paper. It's just a suggestion, take it or leave it. What do you think?

How are you holding up, ned? Don't worry about me, unless you need the distraction...

Oh he gets it.



But yes, he just wants you to shut up.

I struck through some text above....things you could have kept to yourself....what do you think you could have said instead? When he said,


Could you have looked at him and nodded to acknowledge his point (even if you don't agree with it AT ALL). And then said, 'well. You asked what I'd like to do...that is what I'd like to do.'

And then leave it. Would that have worked?

I see patterns of myself in you. Saying too much. Trying to educate. Wanting a truth that you may never get...because I am not sure your dh knows his Truth, so how can you know it? But you can live with him--as the man he is...at his core...IF he will do the ACTUAL things you need. Is that possible?

cwmi, distraction is right. I have houseguests coming, and I'm one of those folks that has a hard time staying calm when everyone else is upset. It's enough work to keep putting one foot in front of the other as it is. I'll go update on my thread.

Hang in there ned. Lots of prayers for you, such a shocking and brutal time.

We did discuss the kid thing last night--he, of course, just like your H, denied ever having said it. It was a good conversation otherwise. He said he knew he's said a lot of awful things over the years, but he doesn't remember saying that or feeling it. I told him I wished I had his memory of it, cause mine stinks and makes him look like a jerk, and me like a fool.

SW--I was too irritable and ready to lash out. He's not the intentional turd he was, but he still isn't...well, here comes a big DJ: he lacks competence in the relational department. Sex is good, he's a great financial supporter, if he wasn't OCD he'd be an awesome Domestic supporter, but there's more to life than sex, money, and spiffy cribs.

I'm cranky right now, so I'll stop...I'm in finals at school, and am disputing a grade. I had five graded assignments in this class and scored a 93, 94, 92, 94, and 94, and my prof gave me a B. wth? He lacks competence, too??? lol. I'm hoping it's just a mix-up and he recorded it wrong on my transcript. I sent him a very nice email even though I wanted to say wth can't you add???

Lord grant me patience today!

I hear you CWMI...if you are like I was in my last marriage, I felt like I responded correctly 90% of the time, but when I would come on here and share the details of the other 10% I would get hit hard with the 2 X 4s.

It was not until I began seeing my now dh that I realized just. how. hard my first marriage had been. Most of that was because WXH had ZERO interest in really making it work. Part of it though WAS because he just didn't get some things...

So you have the advantage of your dh wanting to do better.

Well now I'm just piggly pleased. My prof responded well to my email and adjusted my grade (to what it was supposed to be!) and I finished my final final for the semester and still have my 4.0.

There's more to life than grades, though, too.

Still...*squee*

Validation, that's apparently a big need of mine, eh?

Gotta give you a little somethin' on that. Well done!

Thanks.

I'm so done, I'm blistering in the heat. He's been gone all day, and has another Wed evening engagement, he claims today is required but W is not, and I'm forked. Done.

Please today, just today, refuse to be mean or speak badly to your husband. Try and be nice or kind to him.