HIll .. if you go over the last few posts i made on your thread .. one of them tells you my experience with the vasectomy. But to call it a surgery .. i think that is a misused word in this procedure. ITs more like getting a needle. YOu will have no stitches ... and its pretty painless. Getting a filling at the dentist hurts more. I was pretty ramped up and adamant about not doing it when my wife and i discussed it .. but she persuaded me that it was only fair since she gave birth x2. So i reluctantly agreed. Even tho I reluctantly agreed .. i was well rewarded for my effort and compliance!

SO .. whatever you two descide together, I am sure things will work out. BUt IMHO the V was the best choice .. even tho I couldnt see it at the time when i had to make the decision.

MNG

Apparently you are a fan of the IUD? Just guessing.

You think?

Pregnancy, at this point, could be disasterous, and possibly life threatening to me. It's important that whatever we use is as close to 100% as possible. It was important to me that it be reversible, because we'd like to try for children, at some point, if I'm able. And, I was against barrier methods. The pill was out. So, this was the best option for us.

FWIW, I have Lupus and my heart and kidneys are currently affected. My health is very unstable, and we've had three failed pregnanies. Even though I don't want to get pregnant, SF is imporatnant in a marraiage and sometimes pregnancy is a result. It just happens, no matter how careful you are. If it happens to us, we'll deal with it. If it doesn't happen, until we want it to, we'll be thrilled. And, we may never be that blessed.

I'm glad it worked out for you. We are working on our decision together. In the mean time we are gonna come up with a temp solution to take the pressure off both of us.

WTH, Hill. Stop reading women-bashing sites and stick with this program. Seriously. You will boff up your whole family. There is nothing that can go badly for you in the MB program.

Get serious here.

I don't subscribe to any other method other than MB. I was searching for better ways to understand how I'm feeling in this marriage. I found an article that I related to in a big way, in fact 80% of it was verbatim on exactly how I feel. We are continuing on our path of MB together and are committed, however I continuously struggle with this general feeling of being weak in this marriage. Its not that I want to "fight back" type of weak, what I mean is I've come to a point where I have very few opinions on much of anything, I'm afraid to make decisions, I'm afraid of messing up things that my wife wants me to do, and I am afraid to tell my wife what I need. So although we've made some progress, I currently go through life receiving what she'll give me, living with it, and not asking for more. Why is it so hard to express myself? My wife said my Mom and sister are the exact same way. When I do say how I'm feeling it never turns out so I become timid about it. I'll try again to use the workbook, or maybe write stuff down in my I-Phone as they happen, and then compile them to be shared with my wife later.

In other words, you found something that communicated how you were feeling.

Ok.

Were you guys not using LB sheets?

Hill, I understand that you are going to do a lot of reflection, but wallowing in past pain isn't going to help you move FORWARD.

Hill, ignore the genders, and go through the articles here;

http://www.marriagebuilders.com/mb2.cfm?recno=4&sublink=29

Yes it was helpful to find out some of the feelings I have because "playing in the game" I'm not always sure what they are if that makes sense. I know I feel bad, but I can't always tell why. Its like a big confusing haze that is hard to navigate.

No we were not using the workbooks to track LBs.

I wouldn't call it "wallowing in the past", I am making an honest effort to try and comprehend what the hell is going on in an effort to express myself which is the first problem. I tend not to. I bottle up. After 38 years of bottling up, it is hard to just change the next day you know? Many of my efforts of expressing myself are misguided or full of "guesses" as to how something makes me feel. When it comes to asking for EN's to be met, I just don't know how to handle the rejection, so I typically get upset and don't ask again. I told my wife I might want to meet with a therapist or SH to help me express myself better and not take rejection so hard.

Why are you expecting success when you skip important parts of the program like this?

I can't count the number of times I've mentioned that Dr. Harley and the coach he assigned us have told us that very few couples can successfully have a conversation where they tell each other, on the fly, about abusive behavior. It just doesn't work. It causes a fight, and you guys need to avoid fighting at all costs.

We've given you the way to communicate this without having a fight. Why don't you do it? Then plan doesn't work if it's not followed, Hill, and we really, really want you to follow it, because it really does work!


I do not believe expressing yourself is the first problem, and I do not recall Dr. Harley telling you this.


The way to handle that is to quit giving up and keep practicing inviting Grace to join you, while avoiding demands, disrespect, and anger.

I've written this before. It'll work if you do it, it won't work if you don't. If I write it again, will you try it? Can we get you focused back on working this plan to make things better in your marriage?

By the way, most marriage-counseling style material out there is written for depressed women and doesn't translate so well to emotional men.

Hill, I'll save you the money. Let me teach you how to express yourself better:

"How would you feel about ... ?"
"I'd like it if you'd ..."
"It bothers me when you ..."

That plus avoiding demands, disrespect, and anger, is all there is to expressing yourself.

The real problem is that when you express yourself and Grace doesn't respond the way you want, you respond with demands, disrespect, or anger. You don't have a problem expressing yourself; you have a problem wanting to control Grace's response.

Until you learn to graciously accept Grace's response even when it's not the response you wanted, you will be stuck here. Until you learn to graciously accept Grace's response even when it's not the response you want, you are making demands, and you can expect no improvement in your marriage.

Grace is probably not going to be enthusiastic about meeting your needs, long term, until she has seen a track record of you NOT responding with demands, disrespect, or anger when you express yourself and she responds in a way you do not want.

I see Grace is still arranging babysitting.

Since coming to Marriage Builders, how many times have you arranged babysitting? How many times has Grace done it?

It will deposit valuable love units if you do more of the planning and arranging for dates.

Hill...may I ask why you are unwilling to get a vasectomy but at the same time expect grace to take care of the birth control issue herself...through IUD, bc, etc. You seem frustrated that she is not willing to choose one of the options women have while you are refusing the option men have.

For what it is worth...my H had a vasectomy and was back playing golf 3 days later.

Male Birth Control Pill Coming Soon

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3543478/ns/health-sexual_health/t/male-birth-control-pill-soon-reality/

I asked her specifically and she said verbatim, "I don't want you to arrange for babysitters."

Huh? Where did you gather my wife and I are not exploring all options together? I sent her a list of the issues I have with getting a vasectomy. We have yet to meet with doctor to go over all other options, that is next week.

I'm glad y'all are going together.

It just appeared to me that you are unwilling to do what you can for birth control (vasectomy) but expect your wife to be willing to take birth control, get an IUD , whatever. I guess the only options I see you focusing on are options that require her to do something be it take bc, get an IUD, etc.

I realize you have legitimate concerns regarding an vasectomy and why you don't want one...do you realize your wife has legitimate concerns regarding bc or an IUD and why she doesn't want to go those routes?

I'm not saying you aren't discussing options together. I'm saying the only options seem to be focused on her.

Rubydoo,

Having not read my wife's post on that subject, I know not what you mean! We are using POJA to decide a solution, no one has decided the solution has to work only for her. Either you came to that conclusion on your own incorrectly, or my wife has posted something that has said something similar. Either case, let me say it again, we are deciding together on the best course of action for us whether it be me, her, or both of us.