PLEASE READ!!! I NEED INPUT ASAP!!!<p>My wife went to get her hair colored last night. She left me with the kids at 5:20 and did not get back till 9:00. She said she went down the road to drink coffee by herself. I do not believe she was by herself. I guarantee the OM was there. The hair salon is less than 1 mile from the OM's office, her old office.<p>She wore her nice lingerie too, and heavy lipstick and liner which was all worn off when she got home.<p>She said that she left the salon at 8:15 and decided that she would get coffee. Since it was raining, (not at home), she stayed inside to drink it.<p>Well I snoped on this one. I found her receipt which she crumpled up and burried deep in the trash can. 7:12 PM!!!! [img]images/icons/mad.gif" border="0[/img] [img]images/icons/mad.gif" border="0[/img] <p>I am mad. I thought we were doing so much better. I have been Plan Aing myself to death. I have not brought up the OM at all. Only let her bring him up.<p>Here is what I am going to do. Tonight I am going to call her. I will miss my typical calls so she knows that something is up and will have to think about it. I am going to preface the conversation with:<p>"You know how important to me that you are 100% honest with me. This is the most important thing to me now <I have told her this in the past>. Have you seen the OM this week?"<p>Her response is most undoubtably going to be "NO". The problem with the evidence I have is that the time clock on the register could be out or she could have spent the entire time thinking by herself about all of this crap and she is embarrassed to tell me because she knows that I would suspect something (thats a long shot).<p>I am trying my best to be rational. My new rule to myself is that if I find out things like this, I am going to give it a day before I confront my wife, and I am not going to show her my cards unless I have 4 aces. This is just two pair. <p>The problem is that the clock is ticking. My end to Plan A and start of Plan B is Late June. The timing was set because my wife has to go back to work Late June (she is on maternity leave). (Her birthday is the 14th so I do not want to screw up her birthday). I do not want to take away her oportunity to make money. I will give her an ultimatum June 18, leave him or I will leave you.<p>Please post your thoughts on all of this. It is amazing how a happy day can turn to crap in just a couple minutes.

If you confront her like this and she was not with him, it could back fire. So don’t corner her or accuse her outright. Instead tell her how you feel about it and what you need her to do in the future to protect you. <p>Instead you might want to tell her how it makes you feel that she has a period of time for which she is not accountable. That her dressing the way she did makes you suspicious too. Tell her that you can only assume that she was with OM. <p>Remind her of the rules of radical honesty, protection, and care. The only way she will be able to earn back your trust to for her to live by these rules. They dictate that she has to be accountable for her time, at all times. This is the only way she will earn back your trust. They also dictate no contact.<p>By doing this you are not accusing her of seeing him last night. You are saying that she was not honest about the time frame. She did not protect/care for you by calling you to let you know where she was, etc.<p>Hope this makes sense.

Dreamland,
I'm not aware of what's happened in the past with you and your wife.
I think it would be best to avoid LBing. You need to be careful to be the safe place to be and not accuse or judge.
Zorweb is right with her advice. Let your wife know that you noticed she was dressed up when she left and then she was gone longer than expected and you were worried/made you wonder. This has more to do with her present actions than past. It also shows how her actions affect you.
You want her to see you care for her.
Leave the receipt info out altogether, snooping won't impress her.
I try to get the truth from my W without her having to lie first then change the story.
Is she afraid to tell you if she still has feelings for OM?
Can you help her with "withdrawl"? When my wife came back I was "logical/right/2nd" choice. She still wished OM would have worked out, hung on to him for long time. It took me a long time to be able to listen to her feeling and not take them personally, or try to fix her. I found out where she was at in her thinking. It sure beat guessing. It is not easy either to hear her say she was so uncertain about us without telling her to pack up and go. If I had the A I'm sure I'd be just as mixed up and hopeless.
She has been able to see by my actions and his, who cares for her. She also knows that I can get on with my life if needed.
I'll watch for further posts.Take care.

dear dreamland,
i am sorry for your heartbreak and worry today. please be careful. It sure sounds like you are right, but being right doesn't mean you win. I would do something nice for her today, maybe a rose or a box of candy. Compliment her on something good you have noticed. (i know its acting) cook dinner, Stoffers lasanga (sp) at walmart is about 10.00 and taste homade. just something. feed her love bank. my wh is killing me right now to and all i can do is warn you. i keep after him with spying and such and sure enough i have pushed him until he wants to be seperated, still living with us and acting better all around but seperated. (scary huh) you have two kids(me to) and they are worth it, when was you first d day??? second?? I will say special prayers for you and yours today, sara

Say nothing.
Do nothing.<p>Save your information for later. For your possible Plan B. <p>Right now focus on your plan A. Be the husband she wants to return to. Buy her flowers today. Meet any needs she will let you. Be the absolute best husband you can be today!<p>
Confronting her, accusing her, (even if its true!) is going to be a LB. <p>If she did see him last nite, he's going to look even better by comparison. He will look even more attractive to her because you're all negative (needy,demanding,angry,controlling,etc)<p>So instead, be the better man. Be the absolute best husband you can be today.

I guess I still am being a little irrational. We have talked before about her feelings and she said she still has very strong feelings for this guy and she is not ready to give him up. I have told her that the three of us will not work together and she is eventually going to have to choose. I have not given any ultimatums yet, but time is running out. I am really really scared. I do not want to go to Plan B.<p>I should know better. I need to keep reminding myself that she has not made any promises not to see or talk to him. I have asked her though to be honest and forthright with me. However, I think because she has caught me snooping before and I have confronted and caught her in lies, she has stopped being honest and forthright. I guess I should not blame her for this. <p>It just ticks me off so much that she is lying.<p>I think I will buy her flowers or something. Gerber daisies are her favorite.

What Lexxy is suggesting is the right thing to do. Seems it fits your situation better then what I said. It will be hard but worth the effort.

dreamland,<p>could I ask why you have a timeline? would you extent if you thought she was over the OM and being honest? would you shorten it and move into plan B sooner if you saw her with the OM?<p>I'm asking because having a time line seems to defeat the purpose. It seems that if she doens't conform to your expectations as soon as you think she should, then that's it. But if you are willing to work on your marriage now, what is another few months if you have no real proof that she is still lying.<p>I can tell you from experience it takes a long time to get over the OM when you really believed that you loved him. And it takes a very safe place to be able to let those feelings show in order to cope with that loss. I have heard all the rheortic here about who is to blame and the BS's getting the raw end of the deal and I know that is completely true, but it is equally true that the WS has to work thru all those feelings and find that security in order to really come home to the spouse that was betrayed. And thinking may have been all she was doing. I took lots of time for thinking. thinking about my family, my H who loves me enough to want to work things out and about how much I missed the OM, but family is what always drew me back. <p>Give her the benefit of the doubt and love her today like nothing happened. Let those doubts go for now and show her that everything she could ever want or need is right there before her.<p>My prayers are with you,
Debbie

<<<I need to keep reminding myself that she has not made any promises not to see or talk to him.>>><p>Excuse me -- but are you married? If you are, then she *did* make a promise not to spend time alone with other men.<p><<<I have asked her though to be honest and forthright with me. However, I think because she has caught me snooping before and I have confronted and caught her in lies, she has stopped being honest and forthright. I guess I should not blame her for this.>>><p>Excuse me again??? Why are YOU taking responsibility for HER actions?? So, you're blaming yourself for checking up on a lying spouse, and because of this she no longer has an obligation to be honest and forthright?<p>The anger and pain of the betrayed spouse is a natural consequence for a lying, cheating H/W. No, you do not have to "lovebust," but you don't have to take this kind of treatment, either.<p>Now, this is just my psychotic opinion here, but if you go out and buy her flowers, take her out, etc. etc., all you are doing is setting up a competition with the OM. Who's going to benefit from that? Answer: Your wife. She will LOVE knowing that if she lies to you, not only can she spend time freely with OM, she will get EXTRA positive attention from you!<p>Please think about this. I am one of those who sees this behavior as nothing but a reward for the spouse who lies and cheats, so feel free to disregard it and go on with what you've been doing - but as Dr. Phil says, "how's that workin' for ya?"<p>Psycho_B***h

psych_b,<p>He would only be rewarding her if she knows that he knows she lied about being with this guy. If she thinks she got away with it, then the flowers aren't a reward for lying from her point of view. Also the flowers and other niceties shouldn't only come when she is caught with a lie, or coincidently with the other man, otherwise it would be a competition. Plan A is all about making home with the BS a better place to be than with the OP.<p>But I could be wrong since I'm new at this.

I was not suggesting that he tell her , or confronts her in any way, i was suggesting making home a safe and happy place to be. Right now he can do nothing about her behavior that will help him. All he can do is have a plan for himself and a plan for his future. PLan a is part of his plan. WORK THE PLAN even when you don't feel like it. I know i sound bossy, but i am bossing myself everyday to make my life better. I have decided (my plan) to take care of what i can. leave the rest up to GOD he CAN

Debbie,<p>I have made a timeline mainly because I care for my wife's ability to support herself. She has a great job (even though the OM is there). Her boss is expecting for her to go back to work after maternity leave in June. I am willing to keep Plan A beyond June, but if I do that, it may risk her job when and if we ever get separated.<p>I agree with Dr. Harley that a timeframe is necessary so that I can protect as much as my remaining love for her as possible. If WW continues without making a decision to stop seeing him, there is no hope of recovery, and I am not willing to stay in a relationship forever like this. Maybe I can take this for 3 months or a year, I am not sure.
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psycho_b,<p>I appreciate your opinion. I know I am being manipulated and abused. I have accepted that as what will occur during Plan A. <p>As far as I am concerned, right now we are only married by law. She has broken our marriage and is currently separated from me, but only just living in our house for her convenience. She has not recommitted to be my wife. In my mind she is not my wife until she decides that she will end all contact with him and be my wife again. I believe we are only currently dating and I am trying to win her back over to me, courting her.<p>Like any courtship, if she continues not to respond, I will need to give up to keep my identity and take care of my family and health. All of what is going on is bad for our health emotionally and physically and has a tremendous effect on the children because of that regardless of their age.

DL,<p>Everyone is different, but I think you might be expecting too much too soon. Many here have been at this a long time and success is possible. I think you are doing good in Plan A and should go until at least June and see how you feel then. But I don't see why your WW's job has anything to do with anything. I just don't get it. Also, I don't get why you care. You WW has screwed you over, who cares about her job.<p>I would not confront her with your info. Keep a journal and note your evidence. but since she has not said at this point that she won't see him, I don't see what you are going to say about it. Also, it made me very nervous to hear that she is going to go back to work with OM. I think you have real troubles ahead. I feel very badly for you.<p>Good luck.

Thanks Conan.<p>I guess I need to be patient. I have always had problems with this in relationships. I try to smooth things out as quickly as possible regardless of what boundaries I have to give up in doing so. (Sounds very bad, huh.)<p>I am working on it though.<p>Thanks for kicking me in the butt a little. I need that quite a bit now.<p>I will not let her decision about going back to work affect my decision for Plan B.

Sorry I don't have much time, WW will be home any minute and things have been touchy at home this week [img]images/icons/shocked.gif" border="0[/img] .<p>Just a thought but I think you should hold off on the flowers and other things till Mothers Day. I have the impluse to try and show my wife the attention I think she wants but it needs to be timed right. There is such a thing as showing too much attention and pushing someone away.<p>Although, I do not feel like my WW is deserving of a Mothers Day gift, I will try and make this the best one she has ever had.<p>I think the other advice you have gotten is good. Just try to keep your cool and see what happens. My wife has also not agreed to stop seeing OM and she works closely with him. She knows how I feel about this but I can't make the decison for her. Surprisingly, my outburst at OM earlier this week does seem to have had some effect, but I may never know if I this is a ggod thing or I blew it.<p>Good luck, and try to take it one day at a time and not let too much get to you. At this time there are no promises and commitments so you have to focus on yourself.