I'm reading "Surviving an Affair". In the story about Jon, Greg and Sue, the last time she returned to H, she stayed. However, she reports had OM called her once again, she would have left again. In so many of these stories, the OP ended the affair, which made WS return. I don't think the OW in my situation would ever end it. She has laid low for a long time (no pun intended).
In thinking about my WH's actions, the A appears more serious that he admitted (what morsels I got out of him in the beginning).
In addition, changing jobs and/or relocating wouldn't be considered by WH (in the event he returns).
Pretty down this morning. While it is obivous the Harley books work, they work because two people really try and think. I don't think my H would ever put that much effort in it.
Thoughts?

Hi can't sleep,<p>I'm also reading SAA right now. It took me about a month to get it - must be a popular book. [img]images/icons/frown.gif" border="0[/img] <p>You're right, for the M to recover both spouses have to work at it. But you're not at that stage yet. Your H is still in the fog. He isn't putting any effort into it, because it's not what he wants right now. You can't control him and make him want it. He needs to come out of the fog and want it himself. <p>I was lucky in that my H came out of the fog shortly after D-day. But you know, once they come out of the fog, there's still alot of hard work. There's still alot of questions, doubts, pain, etc. So, it is a long process.<p>But I found that once my H came out of the fog and "got it" he really put the effort in to make things right. It's something they have to want though - to really put the effort in. <p>I was amazed at the difference in my H's attitude, once he came out of the fog. I can understand how you feel your H would never put the effort in. The way he's behaving now and the things he's doing and saying. Yes, I've been there. It just seems hopeless. But there are so many success stories out there and I believe your's will be one day too.<p>You've seem to come along way. I think it's great you're reading SAA. Stay stong and keep focusing on yourself and the kids and try to be patient. That was a hard one for me too.<p>H&S

Can't sleep,<p>I have felt like you so many times, exactly!! And low and behold this week WH has waivered some, not much just some, and I want to shake it all up for him, but can't, that would not be fair of me!! I don't know if WH will ever come around completely. I have viewed my WH as a person with an illness or disease, (MLC) and didn't realise how ill he was til this week. He needs love and support, I would prefer that it come fro me, as OW is just feeding in to his illness. Just a coping thing I have learned in the last 17 months.<p>My point somewher in the above is that don't believe everthing that he is saying, consider the source of where it is coming from, he continues saying the things that he does so that he can believe in them and only can if they are said out loud!!<p>As WAT said to me today stay "above" it all!! It's hard but I am!!<p>Just wanted you to know that there have been others where you are and have continued on and so will you!!!<p>Take Care, God Bless!!
Dawn [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img]

In reference to the title of this thread, I think things work more by diligence than chance. A lot more!<p>Do you love your husband? Do you want him home? Do you want your marriage to work? How badly do you want these things? Do you want them as badly as you want your job, your friends, your religion etc.? Then you must put time and effort and sacrifice into your marriage, your spouse and yourself as a spouse for it to work. Now might be a good time to let a few other things go by the wayside in order to focus on your marriage. Work, work, work. Persevere!!! Keep your chin up and diligently work at it. The Harley's didn't just dream this stuff up. It has proven to work, and you can only do your part of it. Best of luck to you.

Hi Cant- I understand how discouraging it is when the OW wont be the one to let go of the A. In my case OW was a single coworker who wanted my H TOTALLY- our house, our kids, basically MY entire life! I worried constantly that she was going to get all I had worked so hard for during our 15 yrs of marriage. I found out 2 mo after d-day that H had tried to end it with OW several times but each time he would get lonely for her ( the addiction thing!) call her back up and she would be so mad that she would demand he take 'further divorce action' against me in order to be back with her again! This is how he ended up getting to the point of filing for D on me 10 wks after d-day! He claimed it was what HE wanted and that our marriage was 'hopeless' but really it was her influencing his thinking in a horrible way ! After he finally broke down after filing for D- we went to a counselor together and he told the C that he was caught in a cycle he didnt know how to get out of with OW. The counselor gave him specific directions to him on how to break it off with her once and for all. She of course got ticked at him but he finally saw the light by then. Patience is a key thing here when dealing with an OW who wants to marry your H! Dont be so horrible to H that he prefers to be with OW- thats the key thing! Because eventually she will start to drive him nuts and he will be thinking if the A is really WORTH all that! lifeismessy

hi all. Thanks for replies. I have read them a couple times even though I haven't written back. I keep reading them thinking "I think I can, I think I can."
Happy Mother's Day to where applicable! This is a day where we'd spend it together as a family. H is spending it elsewhere-I am sure with OW as he has had the kids all weekend (until noon today).
Yesterday, he asked me what I wanted for Mother's Day. I said nothing, you don't have to get me anything. How passive is that? It's not what I wanted to say. I should have said something! What I wanted to say is "I want you to try to work on our marriage." Now, when he doesn't get me anything from the kids, I'll be disappointed. I need to say what I want.
I want him back so badly. I asked him to keep the kids longer today-I am having a hard day and it's difficult to keep up the cheery facade. He said he couldn't. I didn't tell him why. I am doing well with no LB's this weekend.
I have been listening to the his/her needs tapes. I suspect that my husband's EN are SF, Physical Attractiveness, Admiration, and Financial Support. Since I am extremely overweight (gained since married, it seems like I can't fill this one for awhile (I have lost 30 lbs since he left). He told me that he was pissed that now that he was gone that I was finally doing what he asked. He said "You are going to end-up being the most attractive person in the world [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] and get a good job and you didn't care enough to do it for me, etc"
Do you believe that to people who think Physical Attractiveness is important (not me) are ever really satisfied with aging spouse? It makes me paranoid that he will keep looking at younger women. OW is younger, petite, in shape, blah-blah. I understand that Harley said "It's in the eye of the beholder." I just don't know if H has a realistic idea of PA as we age.
Regarding the SF, H is definitely not interested and I haven't approached that subject matter area.
Thoughts?
-CS

Update: WH dropped off kids. He had flowers, magazine, and pop (my favorites). His card was signed, With Love, XXXX. He always signed his cards, "I love you, XX"
I said thank you and started arranging flowers because I was going to start crying because I am so sad. He came over and said "Can I give you a mother's day hug? I shook my head no, Because if he did, I might never let go. He started crying and said good bye and left.
What a sad situtation.
Thanks for listening.
-CS

Bump!

What I can tell you from where I'm standing right now is that I have seen my H do things he's never done before to maintain this M, things I never thought he'd do, like listen to Dr. Phil tapes and read a Harley book, plus specific changed behavior towards me correcting chronic problems we had before the A ever became an issue. There is still a long way to go, but seeing the things I've seen gives me hope that I may see the other things I need to see.<p>How much of this change in him has to do with me and anything I've done, I have no way of knowing, but what I did was commit to the program, to my plan for improving my LIFE. Once I made that my focus, instead of him and/or the M, things got better for me, and then I noticed my H was behaving differently towards me as well. *I* started treating myself and him differently, and now he's treating me differently.<p>So, what I think you CAN conclude is that you never really know what your spouse will or won't do. Most of us thought they'd never have an A, and they sure surprised us there, didn't they? [img]images/icons/shocked.gif" border="0[/img] I'd assume it's just as likely to happen in reverse if the conditions are reversed, so to speak.<p>[ May 12, 2002: Message edited by: Conqueror ]</p>