I was talking with the brother of a friend over the weekend. He has recently gone through custody mediation and he had some advice. Both he and his W wanted primary custody, and like my W, she thought she should get it because she's the mother. He thought it would be a waste if time, but he said it was a real eye opener for his W. She realized that custody is not cut and dried like she thought and mothers don't automatically get custody anymore. The mediator worked wonders and they agreed to 50-50 shared custody with no child support. He gets their daughter Mon/Wed overnight & every other weekend (Friday night thru Monday Morning). It gives both of them their daughter 7 nights out of 14. It's not what she wanted, but she realized the system doesn't work the way she thought. He advised me to let my W do most of the talking and dig her own grave. The mediator will quickly see her attitude regarding custody is self-serving. I'm not crazy about shared custody, but it may be the only fair arrangement. The letter I have from my lawyer to hers stating that I'm willing to sell the house and share custody will work to my benefit. He said it's important that the mediator see I'm only looking out for our daughter's best interest and trying to be fair. All in all, it was a very informative talk and it appears the best and the worst I can expect is shared custody, which I can live with. Hopefully we can agree to try this, at least on an interim basis (maybe 3 or 6 months) and see how it works out. <p>sad dad

Hi SD- Sounds like good advice your friend gave you!It is a good negotiating tactic to let your W lay out her case first. When is your mediation appt scheduled for? I went to see the movie Unfaithful by myself yesterday afternoon after lunch. I was really curious about seeing it- I was surprised that when Richard Gere had solid proof of his wife's A he didn't go right home and confront her about it. Are you interested in seeing that movie? lifeismessy

lim,<p>There are three mediations sessions scheduled, 5/23, 5/28 & 6/4. That's typical from what I understand.<p>No, I have no desire to see that movie. I've noticed on TV that alot of shows have storylines about affairs. I cringe every time I watch one.<p>sad dad

sad - sounds like you're ready. I'm not surprised by what you heard. For the benefit of others, I gather that the details can vary from state to state in the US, but that overall, it's far from automatic that the mother gets any preference. Sadly, the other side of the coin is that "adultery" carries no weight, either.<p>WAT

SAD DAD- <p>There are about a gizillion websites out there representing groups for fathers rights with lots of info on them that may give you some support for your position. I'd just do a search of father's rights, custody etc. Shared or joint custody is pretty much now the norm and there is alot of info. out there supporting it. You should do fine. K

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by worthatry:
<strong>.... Sadly, the other side of the coin is that "adultery" carries no weight, either.
</strong><hr></blockquote>
WAT, I disagree. Legally, yes it carries no weight but remember the judge, the social worker are human too and probably married and probably have kids !!!!. I ties my WW's A to the neglect of my 2 D, I didn't dispute that she was a good mom. I get awarded as primary custodian [img]images/icons/grin.gif" border="0[/img] since I have all prove and fact about the neglect and her fanatasy about OM is misplaced ... even the social worker put it in writing about "depictions of OM" !.<p>sad dad ... it seems you are ready, be yourself, bring prove as much as you can ... center the whole agument on your kid, what best for them !. Even I counter file for 100% and I probably could get it w/ 90%-10% ... I wanted to end this pain as soon as possible and I take what the social worker gave me. The judge don't even entertain my W's lawyer arguments and go straight to the decision !!!, the judge knows that I gave my W more than I could fight for.<p>-RH-<p>The bottom line is show our kids first !.

Hi SD- what is your W's emotional reaction when you mention the mediation sessions to her? Does she seem angry and defensive about them? How was the CUBS game? Did you confide anything to BIL? Who won the game? LIM

Redhat - a very good point indeed about the human side of the decision makers. Thanks for the reality check.<p>Dave

redhat,<p>I am ready. I've been as good a father as anyone can be, especially these past 18 months and have always put my daughter's interests before my own.
The only reason I've been able to hold on as long as I have was with the hope of keeping her family together. I plan to talk to my lawyer before mediation just to get some advice on what to bring, whether to mention OM, etc.<p>lim,<p>We haven't talked about mediation. I saw no reason to get into anything until they begin.
BTW, the Cubs won. Sadly, they haven't won since. I did confide in my BIL. I've kept him in the loop the since last summer. I plan to talk to my W soon (possibly today) about Steve's plan for marital recovery, as he has advised me. I doubt she'll be responsive, but I want to at least present another option. Unless she's willing to talk to him or we come to some agreement on custody and selling the house, I intend to have my lawyer get the D process started. I simply cannot continue to live in limbo any longer.<p>sad dad

Yep, the courts are realizing more and more that that both parents are important to a child. <p>In my case I have my son 60%, his dad has him the remaining 40%. In the beginning he had our son only 20% of the time. The courts told him that if he wanted more time with son he had to go to joint and individual counseling with our son. And he could get more time only if the counselor felt he was working on anger issues and was building a healthy relationship with our son. Since he now has more time, obviously he did some of the needed work.<p>My H has full physical custody of his children and shared legal custody. Their mother has 2-3 weeks of visitation a year. For the first 2 years after separation, she only got supervised visitation. The idea was that she had supervised visitation until she could pass a drug/alcohol test. It took her a while to clean up her act.
In both of our cases we forced an in-depth custody evaluation. The court did his. Mine cost around $2500 as our joint income was above the limits.<p>I did a lot of what you are talking about. Just gave the evaluators the basics and then told them I that I was willing to follow their recommendations as I knew my outlook was very skewed. On the other had my ex-H went in with guns loaded. His attitude was that he is an MD and therefore more deserving. People had a lot of nerve evaluating him as a father. When he realized that things were not going his way, he tried to sue the evaluators, had them go through a deposition. Threatened them and started sending out threatening letters to any of our friends and family who sent in letters of recommendation that did not side 100% with him.<p>On the other hand, I just did what was asked. Went to all the interviews, took all the psychological tests, etc.<p>In the end they said that my H had some real problems and did not even have a working relationship with our son. It was very hard to put my fate as a parent in the hands of strangers. But in the end, their evaluation report was almost exactly what I would have said. And I did not tell them what he was like, with a month of evaluation they figured it out themselves. <p>As for the monetary part of this. Generally if one of the parents makes a lot more then the other, then even with 50/50 shared physical custody, there can be child support from the higher income parent to the lower income parent. That is how it has worked with us.

Z,<p>Thanks for the info. Like I said, I'll just sit back and let my W take her same attitude about custody into mediation. I'm sure the mediators have seen and heard it all, and can weed through the smokescreen. My W makes a good living and I do make considerably more, but it's not about money. I could care less about that. I just want to be with my daughter as much as possible.<p>sad dad