Glad you are still with us!! Keep us posted if things change. Nows your chance to really demonstrate your Plan A. Leaving out LB's is the biggest part. <p>I doubt things will work out with OM, so that's a point in your favor.<p>Hang in there! you're doing fine!

Good on you Mr F, keep posting, keep plan Aing!

Thanks Sea Horse. I am venturing into uncharted waters of sorts. I have been continuing to Plan A my butt off. The way the whole thing unfolded and ended was that I had gone out for a hair cut Thursady night and my WS was going to chat with OM in video chat as normal etc., upon returning, WS was in her chair crying her eyes out.<p>As anyone knows who has been following my roller coaster ride, my WS had given the OM until June 11 to tell the other old flame in his life about my WS, so that she could then return to Texas to live with him. It was the OM who made her leave. Although, my WS told me that she felt if she stayed longer, she would have left on her own in time.<p>Anyway, when I returned she was crying her eyes out and told me that he wanted her to move to Texas ONLY when she could afford to move on her own and live along and NOT with OM. He told her that he loves her, but he is independent. My WS is not, actually due to some childhood issues, she is codependent. Something he does not like and has told her repeatedly about. In any event, I did LB a bit. After waiting seeming for ever to talk with her, I asked her if she was going to keep her promiss to me, which was - When she got an answer from OM, if it was not favorable and she was not going back to Texas to live with him etc., that she would disappear totally from online and also immediately change the phone numbers etc. Her reply was, eventually. That was all I needed. I pushed her for a simple yes or no answer. Nothing more. She said no. Not yet. Well that set me off and we ended up in an argument and I told her that I was changing the phone numbers and going to make sure no calls could be accepted or made to anywhere in Texas with a call block. Mistake on my part. Was not pretty there for a while believe me.<p>After we calmed down an hour or two later, we talked. She told me that she could feel inside that he was not going to keep true to his word and that she had begun to wean herself from him slowly, like an addiction to a drug etc. She just did not expect him to return with an answer this fast etc. That I will attest to, she has cut way back on communication with him. It still continues, but not to the same extent. <p>She told me last night that if she had left on her own terms, that it would have been different. But since she did not end it all, that she feels she still must try etc. She told me that she figured out how much it would cost her to move out there and live alone. It would be several thousand dollars by her accounting and she knows it will never happen. She asked OM for help and he said sure... of course. But she also told me last night that she knows that he will never help her. She did tell him that whatever they had was over, until he could prove to her that he could keep his word to her. Something he has yet to do in any arena.<p>I surmise (and I may be totally wrong here and would like opinions) that she has to in her own way end it from within her and make it her decision and justify that to herself, which would make it right to work on us again and our marriage. <p>I know that she must go thru withdrawals etc from reading SAA by Dr. Harley. I tried in vain last night just to spend a little time with her and watch a movie and all I got was an ice cold shoulder. ICE COLD. She told me the she needed time to think and be online chatting with friends and try to get this off of her mind etc. So I took my laptop and left and told her that I knew when I was not wanted and left the room and told her to have fun. She sent me an instant message online from her computer (we have four computers in the house between the two of us) and she told me that it was not that she did not want to have anything to do with me. She told me that she just wants to pick the time. Which after reading the Recovery section in SAA..... makes sense I guess. I know that until she withdraws and SHE is ready to work on us, I cannot expect miracles to say the least and for perhaps a few weeks, I should not expect anything at all. <p>She is very depressed and just cries. Went to Dr. yesterday and got a script for anti depression meds etc.<p>Ok, thoughts.... suggestions.....<p>thanks<p>Mr. Florida.... [img]images/icons/confused.gif" border="0[/img]
Confused

MrF,
Just buzzin thru real quick here... I have a reading assignment for you... Just a suggestion though... read through Spacecase's rather lengthy "Affairs that Don't End..." thread. he just had some WONDERFUL news in page 18, but I suggest you start at page one and skip through and read some of his stuff. There's a lot there, but you could pick through and get the jist, and see some valuable experience, as well as advice from Steve Harley on there.<p>Hang in there... I'll be back later, and I'm sure some others will pop in too.<p> [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img]<p>[ June 01, 2002: Message edited by: Faith1 ]</p>

Thanks Faith<p>Mr. Florida

You are correct. She needs to find it within herself to end the affair and detach from OM. Let her go, it is hard, be patient with her. Let her know that you support her, respect her. I have done this with my H and it has had good results. I tell him that I love him and want to be with him, but he must choose who he wants to be with as it is his life.<p>The cold shoulder is fog. But consider this, as you have 'lost' the M you had with your wife, you begand to grieve. As OM has ended it with her, she is grieving too. She's lost someone she thought she was in love with. Go easy on her, let her greive, and when she's done and ready she will let you know.<p>Its sounds like she is 'on the fence' about your M, but she obviously still cares.<p>Just be the loving, caring MrF you have been. Plan some fun activities for with or without her. Show her you will get on with your life regardless of whether she chooses to join you.

Thanks for the reply SeaHorse. Much appreciated. We talked again last night and tis now just before 5 a.m. and I cannot sleep.... what a surprize lol. Mebbe I should go polish my Harley! Soon. Anyway, as I had mentioned in a previous post, OM told her that only way she could return was when she could afford to do it on her own etc. During the discussions, which were actually pleasant, she told me that she has found that OM is rarely online much anymore and always goes out and does not come back when he promissed to talk to her etc. But before they met, he was constantly there for her. I also asked her, what if you had the money in your hand right now to move to Texas under his rules and live alone without OM (that is what he wants - WS is codependent bigtime and always has been - which OM HATES) would you go ? Before she could answer, I told her the reason why is that if that is what she had to do, I had a way to get her the money. I suggested that she discuss with OM..... that was at about 11 p.m. or so. I woke at about 3:30 a.m. and WS was online playing a game. I asked her what OM's reply was. In a word and ONLY a word - kewl.<p>I just shut my mouth and listened ;-) She told me that she plans to return early in the third week of June to Houston as long as when time draws closer to actual date that OM, does not come up with another excuse why she should not be there, even by herself. I told her that I loved her dearly and that she now truely knows how I feel and that I have proven time and time again for the last 2 plus months how I feel and shown her. She agreed. OM has done nothing to prove a thing to her. She has mentioned that to me and to the OM.<p>I told her that I respect and love her and that it is indeed her life and she and only she can decide with whom she wishes to share it with. She told me that she just has to get this out of her system once and for all or she will never know..... be it with this OM or another etc....She told me that if this does not work, we can work on us basically and that she will never stray again. Oddly enough, I believe her. Prior to this order, in six years I know for a fact that she has never lied to me once. Ever.<p>I understand the Plan A concepts very well etc and have been doing a bang up job there.... gave her a good massage yesterday. She has a very bad back and just so happens, I was also a Licensed Massage Therapist a few years back. She enjoyed it ;-) Funny thing is though, the WS in all cases receive in all or many cases a heavy duty Plan A treatment from the BS. Who actually does want to save a relationship. Oddly enough though, the WS who has made the conscious decisions to have an A and done it all wrong, receives love, care, tenderness and treatment fit for a king or queen from the BS. Not that there is a thing wrong with that, but it is almost like a reward for the WS and a seal of approval from the BS in ways. Just my two cents and does not change my thoughts, attitudes, beliefs nor plans to Plan A my [censored] off lol.<p>Okay, tis after 5 a.m. and mebbe time to think about waxing the Harley lol. And yes SeaHorse, I am going to plan things for ME.... and show her I am ready to move along with, or without my WS.<p>Thoughts or suggestions ?<p>Mr. Florida [img]images/icons/shocked.gif" border="0[/img]

I know what you mean about rewarding the WS for their behaviour, but look at it this way, you are showing that no matter what she has done, you love her, and you can forgive her. You have made it clear that she cannot have you both if she decides to commit to your marriage. If you need to go to plan B and I sincerely hope you don't, she will remember these times. <p>Make sure you look after yourself and do nice things for yourself too, that way you can keep giving for a while longer.<p>OM is LBing big time, he's obviously out and about a fair bit, and probably your wife's not his only one. <p>Keep going MrF you are doing really great! Keep reading, keeping living for you and having fun.

Thanks SeaHorse once again. I say it is Plan A all the way, for now. Plan B will not do me a bit of good here. If and when she returns, she will remember nothing but the last weeks etc. I want those memories to be plesant etc. Yes the OM is on the LB bandwagon bigtime and I am not about to tell him about this site lol. Nope, not gonna do it. He has not done a thing to prove anything to her, not had to go out of his way for anything. Does not want her to live with him... says he is too independent and not ready for a live in relationship. For example, this week, WS told me today that he will be out every night this week, except tonight Monday. He plays pool on Tuesdays at some bar and on Wed, Thurs and Friday ? Hmmm... <p>Anyway, WS and I had a great talk again today and I told her I wanted to start over if you will with our relationship and start as very good friends and see where it goes.... she agreed... I am trying to do anything to please her and ensure she is happy. I also told her that I won't do anything to harm the relationship that she is in, as it would only make it last longer if anything. She agreed with that bigtime. I told her about SAA and the fact that this relationship will most likely go the way of the others Steve Harley writes of.... and when it did die a natural death, that I would not want any part of being held accountable for the death of their relationship. Think that surprised her a bit and she did not argue the point at all.... we talked for well over an hour about a great deal .... I had my list ;-) In the end, we were both doing pretty good and as I said, Plan A it is..... for as long as it takes.....<p>Mr. Florida

Mr F,
saw your post on my thread and came by to visit. Looks like you're doing pretty well, (considering the crazy stuff we have to go through!) and there really is nothing much more you can do but Plan A, and couseling, until little things start happening. As they do, get advice, ask for help, and just keep going.<p>If you read parts of my thread, you'll have seen that no matter how hard I tried to predict, plan, anticipate, nothing ever works out that way! It's amazing; their uncanny ability to just throw us for loops!<p>You've gotten good advice and you've handled things well, as far as I can see.<p>So keep Plan Aing, plan for the worst, expect the best, and keep your head down! [img]images/icons/tongue.gif" border="0[/img]

Update 6/6 8 a.m. Just an update on my situation. An interesting and unexpected turn of events.... Wenesday night after saying good night to WS, who sleeps in bedroom at other end of house.... I went to bed. An hour later or so, I heard my bedroom door open and guess who climbed in bed... yep, WS... I was in disbelief. Then yesterday, Thursday we were together all day long and I did a major Plan A all day, as I have been. We had a great day actually and we were in the pool in mid afternoon. I was getting back into the pool and she said "I've been thinking..... maybe if I don't move, or even if I do move..... after a few months, I want you to come to be with me. Or if I don't go to Houston, maybe we can move away and start over... said we have a great chance of making things work in a new environment.... I was errrrr ugh...... floored, speechless and well.....<p>Fog lifted..... at least for a bit lol...... let us see what today brings.<p>Mr. Florida [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img]

yay [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] . That was refreshing wasn't it?<p>Keep up the good work, and keep expectations low.<p> [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img]

Hi Mr F, these kind of exchanges are great for keeping you going, it just gives you that bit of hope you need, to keep plan Aing for another day! She's definitely on the fence. Keep doing what your doing, because you're doing it right mate!<p>I have to go with Faith1 on this one, keep expectations low, no pressure on her (or yourself), and don't make decisions about your life based on what she wants-she's still foggy don't forget. <p>Do you want to move to Houston? I don't mean for you to start a war about it with her, just listen for now until you decide what you want. My H wants me to move into the city, something I always wanted to do anyway, I never wanted to live where I do now, but I want to move when the time is right for me, otherwise I'll be unhappy and we could potentially be back in the same sorry mess - see what I'm trying to say?<p>Great plan Aing MrF!

Plan A is surely the best way to go. BUT, it ain't been easy that is for sure. I really OWE all the tthanks to everyone out there for pointing me in the right direction. Today was ok, a bit of fog rolling in and out, and instability. She sent the OM an ultimatum email and I think he probably bought some more time again and is putting her off would be my guess and she is falling for it hook, line and sinker to a point. But I think she is catching on to his ways and he is BIGTIME LBing!!!! I have even seen WS do her share with OM too.... <p>If nothing else, progress has been made from day one of me finding out. Then it was, just forget it and we will never be together again..... that was quite a bit over two months ago... This site and all of those who reply here, are my saviors!!!! I have like everyone else, the ups and downs..... at least past couple of days have been ups.... today was somewhere between fair and ok.... yesterday was great. This morning, I wrote her a note to thank her for yesterday and told her what it meant to me..... after a while she told me that I was reading way to much into it all and that she thought that I felt she was ready to try again.... buzzer sound.... wrong she said. Oh joy! UGH
FOG FOG FOG FOG FOG!!!!!!<p>Anyway, breathing deeply now lol. I am in for the long haul here I really do believe. So, I will just keep on with Plan A for as long as it takes... regardless. After MUCH thought, I do not see Plan B being of serious benefit in this situation. She also mentioned that if it does not work out for her with OM, that she may just go off on her own for a few months... she has never been on her own.... ever... She visited a friend today who told her that she has been on her own a couple of times and went back to OM after she realized what she had.... She thinks it may do her some goood....... Like I said.. FOG!<p>But by the same token, I can tell by watching her and listening to her talk and her actions that she is terribly confused about what to do.... Early today... about 7 a.m. she asked that I just give her the morning to think, which I did.... <p>There is my latest update in my nightmare....<p>Mr. Florida [img]images/icons/rolleyes.gif" border="0[/img]

I know MrF, its hard, it hurts, and it seems at time they just give you enough to get a little bit excited then take it away with one remark. But you are clear, you know your (real) W and know whats fog and what's not, that's half the battle, the other half is not taking it personally, which can be real hard. This plan A stuff really helps you get a thick skin and see what life's priorities are!!<p>Keep on rolling MrF, the weekend's coming up and I imagine that its nice weather there, lucky you, its FREEEEEEEZING here!!!

Hey Seahorse! Thanks for the words. It has been rough indeed. But yes I do know my real W and I can see the fog indeed. And after some after thought, at least any form of a positive comment back to me is much better than not receiving one at all. It has not been easy regardless. I am still continuing the Plan A thing in a major way and I really go a long way out of my way to do anything I can with and for her. I know, in my heart and in hers that inside she really appreciates the things that I do. My real W, is a great woman. That is why I married her and why I love her so much. So, that is why I deal with it all and as I have said before, kind of like that Alan Jackson song that has the words "god gave us the gifts of faith, hope and love and love is the greatest gift of all". That keeps me going, every single day. <p>My W and I had a chat when I came home for a bit and after a shore while, we talked in the office and she broke down crying, we both did then. Told me that she was going to tell OM that unless he gave her the answers and assurances that she needed and gave them to her tonight, that she was ending it. In retrospect actually, she has also gone thru an awful lot of emotions as well.... <p>She generally chats with OM online etc and actually, believe it or not, as I sit here and write this very reply, she is behind me chatting with OM and crying badly. It is rough to sit here like this.... ugh.... She is apparently not getting what she needs and I feel badly actually to see her go thru this.<p>In any event, we talked about it and I suggested to her that if she would like to and things for any reason do not go her way, that we would get out of the house for the weekend and go away and just have some fun..... Interestingly enough, she actually agreed whole heartedly with me and it would be great to just get away......<p>Time will tell...... what a night.... more as anything develops, but regardless.... Plan A bigtime.<p>Mr. Florida [img]images/icons/shocked.gif" border="0[/img]

Mr Florida you are to be commended for your emotional fortitude in the face of all the crap your W's fog is creating. It speaks volumes as to the kind of person you are and your W is unaware how fortunate a woman she is to have such a man for a loving husband.<p>Keep up the good work

I have to agree with TMCM, you are obviously a great friend to your wife as well as her husband/lover. I hope she realises soon what she is putting at risk. You are a very worthy man MrF.<p>Its true, we get so caught up in our anger we forget that WS are hurting too. Yes, its their own doing, maybe they deserve it, but when you are a true friend to someone, it hurts you when you see them hurting, even though in a way your glad because the A is ending. <p>But I guess what we have to do at this point is be the friend and not the H or W, we have to help our friends through their grief and pain and let them go, let them know we love them enough to want to see them happy. Is it at the cost of our own happiness? only temporarily, because who wants a relationship with someone who dosen't love you, that would be misery.<p>You're doing great, sorry for all the philosophy, but that's me lately... (too many books)

Thanks for the replies TMCM and Searhorse. Well indeed it IS over. We were up until 4 a.m. with WS crying..... then she finally fell asleep in the same bed and I held her and did not really ever get any sleep. Just wanted to make sure she was okay. It has been a trying day. It is hard for her, we were going to go away for the weekend and actually got on the road and she asked that we come home. We ended up going to blockbusters and rented ten movies for the weekend. I am just staying with Plan A bigtime and trying to be there for her and to hel p her in any way that she can....<p>I cannot say enough about the folks that are here on this site that reply to messages and also to Dr. Harley for this site. This site has been my SAVING GRACE. If I did not have this site, I don't know what I would have ever done. I am going to continue to come here every day as normal and read and read more and more and slowly, day by day work with my W to build a new relationship again.<p>More to follow... [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] <p>Mr. Florida

Any update Mr F?