Some of you may have remembered me and my story. I've learned some things about myself, thought I would share it with others who may be drifting into an EA.<p>I have not been on this site for more than a month, but today I dropped in and found some of the posts so helpful. Maybe this one will help someone who is in the spot I was in just a few months ago. And, finally, I would like advice from people as I move on to the next stage of my life.<p>The history is that I became convinced about 10 months ago that a woman I had to work with on a project -- not a co-worker -- was my soulmate. We had to meet for dinner every couple weeks to work on this project, and over time I told her how I felt. I became completely obsesed with this woman. As someone else said in another post, my heart soared when I heard her voice, when I got the chance to be with her. I admired her, thought she was brilliant and when I looked in her eyes I felt as if she was my soulmate. I felt exctiement and life just looked better when I had contact with her. It was never about feeling sexually driven. I found her attractive, but it was if our hearts locked. I was much more open about my feelings. Although she was never as open as I was, it was clear that I filled some kind of role in her life.<p>In a strange way, I would come home and be a better husband because I was so happy. I discovered that I became addicted to her. I would leave voice messages for her on my private mail box and check back all the time to see if she picked them up. I would wait to see if she would leave me a message. I was consumed by this, and my mood would fluctate -- high and happy when I got a message, low and despondent when I didn't hear from her. Intellectually I knew what was going on, but my heart totally ruled my head.<p>I tried having no contact, but I would break down and leave a message. Once, she told me that she missed my messages and that was all I needed to hear.<p>Thoughts of this woman totally consumed my life --I thought about her day and night. I never would have expected to find myself in this situation. At home, I became sullen at times, wondering why I hadn't heard from her. My family noticed something was different, but didnt know what was going on. I didn't really care. I was a drug addict.<p>People who are in the early stages of an EA will not believe how all consuming this becomes. It destroys you from within. If I could go back in time, I never would have told this woman how I felt. Once I crossed that line, I was drawn in and I still feel like I am trapped in a maze and trying to find my way out.<p>What you may not realize is that the happiness you feel vanishes the moment you listen to the message, or have the lunch, or whatever the case may be. And then you are lower than before. You need another jolt and another and another and it just will not stop.<p>I am really trying to get my life back in order, and I can tell you that it far harder than you would imagine -- giving advice her to those toying with the idea of an affair. I can be at home, in a great mood and suddenly find myself thinking about this woman. And I slip and leave a message for her and then I spend the next two days checking to see if she picked it up. It is such self-destructive behavior. You will do thingss to yourself that you never imagined.<p>So now I am trying to go on with my life, dealing with the damn pain of withdrawl. Some days I feel great and then she will cross my path and I slip back two steps.<p>There are times when I so miss this woman and how I felt when I sat across from her and talked. It is irrational, of course, but still so powerful. Home is work and kids and the real world. Talking with her on the phone is fantasy and beautiful. It is fiction and I know that, but it is still such a lure.<p>To those of you who have been down this EA path, how did you finally recover?

MM, is the project over?<p>"Some days I feel great and then she will cross my path and I slip back two steps".<p>What is the reason for her crossing your path? Is there a work/project related reason? Does she call you, leave messages, What? <p>Continued contact can keep you sick indefinately.<p>Replaced

mm...<p>I have not been in an EA... I am BS... (probably full of BS too... [img]images/icons/grin.gif" border="0[/img] ...)<p>...anyway... how to recover from EA...<p>figure out what it was you were missing... and what 'she' did for you... <p>... check out stuff regarding midlife crisis ... ( www.midlife.com )... something in her struck you and connected w/ you... <p>Do some recovery work w/ an individual counselor or some reading (Dr. Phil's books?). I personally like don Miguel Ruiz's books, "The Four Agreements" and the "Mastery of Love."<p>Finally... I posted to you on your earlier threads and am thrilled by the tone of this post... that you are now recognizing what we were saying to you was true... <p>Don't ignore it and hope that it goes away... <p>Cali

You won't really recover until you:<p>1. do not see her/talk to her/contact her AT ALL
2. work with your wife to find out what's missing in your marriage or inside yourself
3. go to counseling<p>good luck

Dear mm,
I read your post earlier today, have been thinking about it, and would like to reply - I hope you find what I have to say helpful. I am the wife of a man who is involved in exactly the kind of EA you describe - in fact, when I read your post, I almost believed that my H may have, by chance, found this site - your description is eerily similar to that of my H. So I will try to present to you my side of the picture.<p>I love my H very much - every change in his mood is something I perceive keenly, although I rarely intervene - I realize that I am not there to smother him emotionally, but to be there when/if he needs me. Perhaps he thinks I didn't notice when he became fascinated with another woman, but it was something I became aware of quite soon - this isn't something I felt I had to interfere with - everyone can develop a "crush" on someone - feelings are just that - feelings - they come and go - I thought my H loved me and was committed to me - I wasn't so insecure that I needed to make sure he never looked at another woman - he had his freedom - I didn't "check up" on him - in short, I trusted him, and didn't mind that he admired other women for their talent or beauty - I thought that was a given for men.<p>But over the course of several months, his behaviour changed subtly, but decisively. He became moody - instead of waking up cheerful, he woke up irritable and depressed - he snapped at the children over his morning coffee (we have 2 boys, aged 6 and 9) - his mood veered from tremendous positive energy to depression - he was working with this girl and I noticed that the only days he was happy were the days when he had seen or talked to her - I noticed that he took an interest in her boyfriend and smiled to himself when he described them breaking up - he began to find fault with me - zeroing in on the children and how I cared for them - we have never had a lot of money, but I never nagged him and always let him know how much I admired him and that I was happy with the way he provided for us. One day last year, when we were trying to decide on which computer table to buy, he exploded at me and shouted "Nothing is ever good enough for you!" This shocked me b/c nothing could have been further from the truth. Looking back, I now realize that he was picking a fight with me in order to justify his own wayward behaviour. He needed to demonize me in order not to feel guilty.<p>My point to you is this - you said - "I am a good husband - and whenever I talk to this OP, I come home happy - IT MAKES ME A BETTER HUSBAND" - because you are able to feel happy at home. This is only what you perceive yourself to be. I'm sure my H thought, and probably still feels, the same. My H is a very talented man, who has achieved a lot in his field, and I have supported him all the way in his drive to achieve. Two years ago, he stood in our kitchen, wrapped his arms around me and told me how every one of his successes was possible b/c I had done such a good job at home, b/c I was there for him, b/c he knew he always had home to come home to. In Feb, in the turbulent aftermath of my discovering his EA - he had been meeting OW2 behind my back weekly for 4 months, and was in daily e-mail, phone and TXT msg contact with her - he exploded in front of our youngest son, calling me a "crazy ***** - stupid ***** - stupid gormless *****" - you name it. By then, all I wanted was out. I had been lied to, betrayed and now I was being blamed for his compulsion to be deceptive.<p>My beginning thread is on JFO - you'll have to use the SEARCH function if you want to read it. I then moved over to GQII where I continue to post. I am currently doing plan A, and my situation is this. My H's EA is with a 22-yr old French grad student at the Univ. in our town (in the UK). She goes home "for good" end of May, beg of June. After several confrontations, my H is now in IC (4 sessions so far) - he has yet to move towards MC, but I am waiting for this. I found out how to access my H's e-mail ac and watched it until Easter - by then, I had had enough of his lies and I told him I wanted a divorce/separation. I think this shocked him (temporarily) into reality - this is when he went into counseling. It is only b/c he is in counseling that I am still with him.<p>For the last month, I have stayed off the subject of HER or the EA - the only way I could continue to live with my H was to find all the good things about him that I knew were still there - since 4 April, I have made it my point to compliment him EVERY DAY on at least one thing I GENUINELY like and can find to admire about him - I have also tried to find things to do with him that he enjoys - playing backgammon, etc. - I have handled being available for sex by getting an IUD (we are Catholic and this was an issue for him) - so now I never say no - I realize he needs sex in order to feel loved - of course, I ALSO need sex and feel loved when he desires me - (maybe I'm clueless) - and the atmosphere has improved enormously between us. I am hoping my H realizes that I still love him and I can understand and forgive him.<p>HOWEVER - and its a big HOWEVER - I think that he thinks everything is hunky-dory when it's not. I am very aware that the OW is still out there - I suspect my H is still in contact with her, perhaps daily. My H has never shown any sign of the depression of "withdrawal" - I suspect he's on Cloud 9 b/c his marriage seems to be OK and he still has his EA intact.
This is a fantasy, but I'm letting him live his fantasy a little while longer. I am aware that I am dependent on him financially, so I am working on gaining my independence - I want to work in Speech Therapy and am trying now to get on to a training course. While I love my H and am encouraged by him following through with his IC, I still feel trapped, and I am working behind the scenes, without his being aware of it, to get myself into a position where I can decide what I want in my life.<p>I am not willing to accept my H indulging himself emotionally with another woman while I provide him with all the material comforts of home and face emotional abuse if I try to talk about "us". I have not put surveillance software on the computer b/c I know that if I had to watch what they say to each other, it would hurt me so bad I would lose my head and blow any chance of our recovery. I am, in short, keeping a tight rein on myself, waiting for the OW to go home to her BF, working on getting myself financially independent, and hopefully, in that time, he will have made some progress towards understanding what he wants out of our marriage. If he loves me and is willing to make the emotional commitment I need in order to feel safe and protected with him, then I can happily go on living with the man I love and once admired. If not, we will be history.<p>My point to you is that while you may think your wife isn't aware of anything, or isn't noticing - unless you brave the "dragon's fire" which you are bound to get when you first confess, and hold on to your hat - you don't really know. It's highly likely she does know and is in a lot of pain right now, and you are assuming a lot by thinking everything is OK at home.<p>Nothing my H could have done could have hurt me more - if he had slept with another woman it would have hurt less - I even think if he had died it would have hurt less - someday we are going to have to talk about this.<p>I know you are hurting too - but like an alcoholic, you have a choice as to whether or not to take that first drink - be brave enough to say no - if the OW contacts you, tell her it is over, that you love your wife and have decided that what you are doing with her is wrong and that you realize what you really want is to get that kind of affection and attention from your wife, so you are going to go back to your marriage with a whole heart and try to heal what has been lost - you are the only person who can do this - and you have to be willing to try to learn to make changes in yourself - your wife also has to make changes - I have learned that - but she cannot begin to make these changes if you withhold vital information from her - you need to get into a safe environment (MC) where you can both air your needs in a constructive way - then these compulsive feelings you have towards the OW may begin to die down. As to the mechanics, you can put a block on your phone and e-mail a/c's so that the OW can no longer connect. You can also give your wife your passwords to your e-mail accounts. Alcoholics have to do concrete things to let the people who love them help them be accountable for their actions - you need to allow your wife to help you be accountable since this is your particular weakness. <p>I hope this helps.
Odile

Also, I think you should be completely honest with those new readers and admit to your previous PA that your wife also does not know about.

maggierose,thanks for bringing that up. [img]images/icons/cool.gif" border="0[/img] <p>mm, when is the last time you "crossed paths"?
Was it in person, phone, email, regular mail, IM,?
Are there any reminders of her in your possesion such as cards, letters, emails you have saved or copied, pictures, gifts, anything she may have left behind that you have kept?<p>ZERO contact forever is what will START your recovery. <p>Are you willing to directly answer our questions this time around?<p>Have you told your wife yet?<p>Have you ever been on antidepressants? Some people have a problem with obsessive thinking in many areas of their lives, not just during an A.
Maybe it would be good to see a doctor and explore all the possibilities.<p>Have you come to terms with the very real physical aspects of your affair that you shared with us previously. Her sitting on your lap, your kissing her, your stroking of her hair, the hugs with her head on your shoulder, sitting on the floor with her leaning back in your arms her cheek against yours? <p>I'm very glad you came back, I may share what you are saying with my H.<p>Replaced<p>[ May 20, 2002: Message edited by: Replaced ]</p>

(((ODILE)))<p>YOU Odile..... YOU are a very, very good writter! Have you ever considered writing as a vocation? .... I'm not kidding ... YOU are GOOD! [img]images/icons/grin.gif" border="0[/img] <p>Keep writing!<p>Pepper [img]images/icons/cool.gif" border="0[/img]<p>[ May 19, 2002: Message edited by: Pepperband ]</p>

PATIENT: mmseekingadvice<p>CHIEF COMPLAINT: Recurrent infidelity, prolonged withdrawal.<p>HISTORY OF PRESENT ILLNESS: The patient presents with acute withdrawal syndrome secondary to continuing an extramarital affair, which has been prolonged over some months now. He has been admitted to this facility multiple times, and many treatment options have been prescribed by the various specialists who were consulted on the case. However, the patient continues to be noncompliant. The patient is also a poor historian.<p>PAST HISTORY: The patient reluctantly and intermittently admits to a history of a previous affair some years ago, that one also not disclosed nor treated adequately.<p>ALLERGIES: The patient breaks out with acute denial when diagnoses and treatment plans are discussed.<p>FAMILY HISTORY: Unknown.<p>SOCIAL HISTORY: The patient is married and, regardless of the danger, continues to fail to care for and protect his wife by refusing to advise her of his condition.<p>REVIEW OF SYSTEMS: The patient's condition involves both the emotional and physical components, though patient continues to deny the physical component.<p>EXAMINATION: General: A middle-aged male apparently in no acute distress. Vital signs: Stable. Head, eyes, ears, nose, and throat: All severely involved in disease process, but difficult to assess due to patient keeping eyes and ears covered. Neck: Stiff. Lungs: Clear. Heart: Very distant, almost inaudible heart sounds. Abdomen: Nontender. Genitalia: Obviously involved in process, though patient denies. Extremities: Difficult to assess secondary to running from the truth.<p>DIAGNOSES:<p>1. Acute denial secondary to ongoing recurrent extramarital affair<p>2. Acute withdrawal symptoms secondary to above.<p>3. Acute lack of insight and judgment secondary to chronic deception of self and others.<p>4. Status post previous extramarital affair, untreated.<p>5. Noncompliance.<p>PLAN OF TREATMENT:<p>1. Wellbutrin (bupropion).<p>2. No contact with toxic substance. Needs urgent admission to detox.<p>3. Radical Honesty with self and others.<p>4. Accountability. Patient was prescribed Surviving An Affair with all extraordinary precautions outlined on page 66.<p>5. Policy of Joint Agreement. Patient was advised to do nothing without his wife's enthusiastic agreement.<p>6. Patient was advised by multiple consultants of the risks of noncompliance, most notably immense pain and suffering for all involved parties.<p>PROGNOSIS:
Good with compliance, poor without.<p>NOTE:
This consultant hopes and prays that this modality of communication will help patient to overcome his addiction and seek recovery before more damage is done.<p>[ May 20, 2002: Message edited by: Conqueror ]</p>

Mmseekingadvice,
I hope you haven&#8217;t disappeared. I can so identify with your posts. You and I came to the forum around the same time, both being &#8220;happily married,&#8221; but having found ourselves madly in love with people we work with. I can 100% identify with everything your wrote. Like you, I thought about the OM 24/7&#8230;but for me it was for 2 years. Taking anything I could get from the OM, and making it bigger than life. My final contact with the OM was on April 8,2002. It&#8217;s been really hard, but I&#8217;ve hung in there and have been so strong. I still think of the OM often, but since we no longer work at the same place, we haven&#8217;t run into each other or seen each other since 4/8. I get discouraged that I haven&#8217;t gotten over the OM yet&#8230;I still think of him a lot, when I hear certain songs I think of him, when I see the same kind of car he drives my heart lurches, and when I see a man with similar physical characteristics, my heart skips a beat. <p>I did come clean with my H. But he always knew about the OM, he just didn&#8217;t know how long we remained in touch. We still love each other and we are doing really well, all things considered. <p>The advice I have to give is no contact, now, and probably never. I haven&#8217;t totally lost hope that I&#8217;ll never see him again, that just makes me too sad. I do get a overwhelming sense of sadness when I think about all that I lost&#8230;but I try to move on, I can&#8217;t help it that I fell in love with the OM. I know that I&#8217;ll always have fond feelings for him because I respect and admire him. He&#8217;s an incredible man, and I&#8217;m lucky to have been able to get to know him. <p>I too, regret the fact that I told him how I felt about him&#8230;if I hadn&#8217;t done that, perhaps we&#8217;d still be friends, which is all he ever wanted&#8230;but I&#8217;ll never know and I just have to live with that. <p>Good luck, mn, please stick around.<p>AS

For the gazillionth time...<p>The BEST/EASIEST way to handle withrawal is to tell your wife. THEN your fantasy is replaced with your W's pain and YOU will be able to SEE more clearly. Your heart will no longer race, you will have diffused what is keeping it together - the secrecy/the fantasy. Boomb, your over it IMMEDIATELY. Otherwise, you are just pining away over her, wasting everyones time - your wife, yours, and OW's. <p>You have not grown, nothing has changed. You are in the same place and have no desire to change it. Your too in love with the "secret".

Iluvandprotectme,
I wish it was that easy. Confessing/sharing our EA's with our partners, unfortunately don't make our EA's go away poof. The problem is that some of us that have EA's find ourselves in love with the OP and it does take a long time to get over them...and I suspect some never really do. Yes, we can have wonderful, fulfilling marriages, but there will always be a hole in our hearts for the OP...At least this is true for me bc my OP never crossed the line with me, he always remained a friend and I know how much he cares for me and my happiness bc he isn't contacting me. But, I can't imagine ever loosing my fond feelings for him...No they won't be obsessive, but if I were to come in regular contact with him I would be back to square one before I know what hit me...if of course he treated me like he had done so before...warmly and with care and concern.
For what it's worth. All of us WS wish our feelings would just go away...but they don't go away fast enough for any of us.<p>The key is to never allow our marriages to get into the state where these "friendships" hit the innocent like a hammer from behind.<p>AS

ashirly
It doesnt sound like you told your H the whole truth because of your statement that your H didn't know how long you remained in touch. So you are not being radically honest with your H nor are you reaping the consequences for your actions by doing so. THAT IS why you continue to carry that little burning amber for OM. If you were radically honest with your H and let him know who you really are and therefore give him the choice of whether or not he EVEB wants to be with you. You are cheating yourself, your H and your marriage by keeping your little secret. You keep this little fantasy burning in your mind about OP and that is why you are cheating your H and your marriage. Spare me the "never really get over them". Have some courage and divorce your H and go fullfill your fantasy, then you will wake up and realize years down the road what a mistake you made. Of course you still have the hole in your heart BECAUSE he never crossed that line. If he did and you had your fullblown A you would know the real OP, all you know now is a fantasy. I guarantee IF my H had any feelings for OW, I WANT radical honesty. He is free to leave. I do not want someone to love me like that. That is not love, that is lies and deception. the problem is you keep this "little" secret place in your heart for OP and keep this "little" secret from your spouse and you take away your spouse's choice of whether or not they even WANT to be with someone like you. <p>And you seem unwilling to accept responsiblity for your actions because you CLAIM the key is to never allow our marriages to get into the state where these "friendships" hit the innocent like a hammer from behind. First of ALL you are NOT innocent. Second of ALL your marriage is NOT ALWAYS going to be in this "perfect state". Hard times come and go. It is a decision on your part. I can see why you relate to MM, your both in the same place - fantasyland with OP AND lies and deception for your Spouse. Take a long hard look in the mirror.

I'm no expert, but here is my prediction:<p>1. MM will NOT tell his wife either about this EA or the previous PA
2. He will disappear for a few months before he posts again
3. He won't take anybody's advice regarding this
4. In the future he will find himself in another PA or EA
5. His marriage will never have true intimacy and he may wonder why

MM,<p>I don't normally post on this thread but your post was haunting to me because your words told my story. Well, at least how it all started anyway. I have felt your feelings. And I still feel your pain. I too am a fws. I've been out of the A for 3 months and some days I feel good and relieved about being out of it and other days, I too long for the op.
My story doesn't end where yours does. We went on to a PA which lasted for many years. It took the emotional pull and strenghened so much so that we could not end it and could not stop it even though we had tried once or twice over the years. The truth was, we didn't want it to end because it was absolutely an addiction. The low was so very low but hell, that high made me feel happy and alive. I was a better wife and person when I was feeling good about him.
The pain that the next level caused us is beyond words. You have done right by yourself and your M to have ended it here. You have taken step 1 to save yourself if no one else. If you think it hurts now and you feel the pull now, imagine how bad it would get if you cross over into a PA. If you continue contact with her, it may only be a matter of time before that happens.
In my case, once our feelings were disclosed to eachother, the PA was only a few months away. And the emotional connection became more addictive and exciting knowing our feelings were mutual. The emotional connection was so intense and once the physical intimacy began, it intensified the emotional feelings so much so that we nearly both destroyed our marriages and ourselves in the process. It took us over 6 years to end it. It was good and it was also hell. Please end all contact. Please stop calling her. Give yourself a chance to get past these feelings of missing her, it will get easier and the feelings will fade. By doing this, you will eventually be open to your wife filling those voids that are within you. Continued contact, at least in my case, only enabled me to continue the fantasy and it hurt me and my M terribly because I was closed down to my H. I tuned him out and obsessed about OM continuously everyday.
My A began exactly with feelings that you described and my family too noticed a change in me. I didn't care either and I went further and further into it. The EA/PA ended and I am left 1/2 of the person I was. I lived a 1/2 life for all those years and the high that I got from being with OM ended, I came down from it. I landed, but not on my 2 feet. On my head. I have a broken heart, a broken spirit, and a broken life. Safe yourself now.<p>I am not fully recovered MM. But I am in process. It gets easier, I promise you. But you have to give yourself a fighting chance.

I don't see how you can be a 'better wife' when you're involved with another man. Makes NO sense to me. Perhaps you thought you were better, but how could that be? You were lying to your H and sleeping with somebody else.