What my H did right: He called and asked me about going to [OW's workplace] while he was on that side of town to pick up some equipment that's ready for him.<p>I told him that we needed to talk about it, and he even called me back to do that. I told him that I have been paying the consequences for him for 8 months as far as his choosing to make that place a key component of his infidelity. He tried to argue that he was paying consequences too because of having to try to explain to people (translation: lie to people) why he doesn't want to go there anymore and giving up his favorite place to do his sport and the discounts on equipment, etc.<p>I pointed out that there are unavoidable consequences as part of the fallout of infidelity, but that this is an avoidable one. I pointed out the difference between other-inflicted consequence and self-inflicted consequence. I reiterated that that place was used as a floor sander to hollow out my chest (thanks go to Lor for that imagery! [img]images/icons/wink.gif" border="0[/img] ) and that I was given no choice in the matter. I also pointed out that he made the choice to be with someone upon whom he had inflicted those wounds, so there were natural consequences to that choice as well.<p>I told him that because of his history (BS in his previous M) that I have expectations regarding things like this, expecting him to understand how such things affect my feelings as a BS. I even told him that what I need most from him I cannot help him with. I said I could point out specific actions that will help me, but ultimately it is going to boil down to a heart condition that's either there or not there.<p>I told him his difficulty cutting the umbilical cord to that place is a symptom of the underlying problem for me--that it isn't so much the place itself, but his lack of insight as to why that place needs to be out of our lives. I told him I was tired of being the one to have to protect these boundaries, and that my hope is that someday he'll do that without my having to ask.<p>What I did wrong: Ultimately I told him *I* would go pick up the equipment. Even though that is more than I should have to do, given the choice between the two of us, at least if I go, I will be cognizant of what is going on and I can be sure that I am protected because I KNOW I will protect myself. And I said this would be the last time I would accommodate this place in my life. I forgot to thank him for asking me about it ahead of time instead of just going there without telling me.<p>So, I touched on many of the bottom-line issues, and we managed to get through the discussion without either one of us LBing. My stomach is still tied in knots, but I feel pretty good about facing it head-on instead of doing the old conflict-avoidance dance. [img]images/icons/grin.gif" border="0[/img]

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<strong>So, I touched on many of the bottom-line issues, and we managed to get through the discussion without either one of us LBing. My stomach is still tied in knots, but I feel pretty good about facing it head-on instead of doing the old conflict-avoidance dance. [img]images/icons/grin.gif" border="0[/img] </strong><hr></blockquote><p>Find the good in every situation! I strive for your strength in dealing with conflict. I just thought you deserved a "pat on the back" here.
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I have had a tough time with boundries until recently. Now, of course, my boundries with [censored] are going to be much different than yours with H. 2 very different situations, but boundries are boundries.<p>This may seem like a really stupid thing, but it really helped me keep my boundries. It was way too easy for [censored] to prey on my sympathy and take advantage of every inch I gave him, so I tossed the boundries thing around with the shrink in a couppla sessions.<p>The boundries have to be written down. They are as much your rules as the other persons.<p>I won't explain it as good as the shrink, but when you do not uphold a boundry you are giving a positive reenforcement to the person you let step over them. Maybe not out loud, or even that they realize, but it is like with kids. You let them get away with it "just this one time" but then the next time comes up and they ask the forbidden question because it was OK last time.<p>When [censored] steps over my boundries I had him a copy of the rules and regs. I have them in my car, in my dayplanner, and a stack at the house.<p>When I am tempted to cross them myself I sit down for a sec and do the worst case scenario. Worst case, what will happen if I hold tight to these lines I have made. Usually you come out much better holding on then letting go.<p>Anyway, just what helped me with my boundries, and even if we fudge a little we still keep the strides we made before the fudging. Which means we all deserve a piece of fudge!<p>E

JTW,<p>Could you list your boundaries on here? I would like to compile a list as well, to help me remember what I am trying to maintain for myself. but having had few boundaries ever with my H, I almost don't know where to start. Some ideas about what is important to you as the BS I bleieve would be helpful to me. I would really appreciate it. C

Firefly, not gonna hijack, but starting a new post just for you!<p>E

I think writing them down is a great idea! The book I just finished, Too Good to Leave, Too Bad to Stay, has a chapter on bottom lines, and she encourages writing those down so you are really clear on what your personal bottom lines are, and then you need to tell your partner what they are so they are forewarned and can't claim they didn't know they were crossing your bottom line.<p>I thought of two right away--that the OW's workplace and I can no longer occupy the same M. One of the cords is going to have to be cut. And the other bottom line I bet he has no idea about, though I think I've alluded to it, but I probably need to spell it out. It is that if he starts treating me the way he treated me during 2000 and 2001, I will assume he wants to end the M. I won't even wait for proof of recurrent infidelity--just feeling the way I felt back then will be enough for me to exit the M.<p>A couple years ago, I came across a website that helped you figure out what your boundaries were and how to establish and maintain them. I have no idea how to find it again, but I remember thinking it was very good.