Well, I trust you wise ladies and gentlemen (much older and more full of wisdom than me anyways :-p) to help me sort this one out.<p>My WH, (now more than ever getting closer to drop the W out of his MB initials), did something today he had dreaded, and at the same time, needed terribly. He spoke his mind and let go off some deep and buried pain from his younger years.<p>My WH on his time was also an OM. He felt so ashamed and appaled by this that during most of his adult life all his relationships were pretty much screwed up.
His first experience was with a MW, and it was just the tipical "comming of age" situation. The MW was having problems with her marriage, so she decided that "breaking in" the youn fellow would help her, and make him a "man". <p>I am not sure if all my male friends are just weird, but most of them had had rather very much older women, married, come on to them and if not seduced them successfully, or well if they were rejected they'd go to the point of manipulating their way into "making them men".<p>It is alarming to me, because men cannot normally say "Oh I got sexually harrassed by a woman", they might get ridiculized, etc.<p>Anyways I am going off topic again...<p>My H went through the whole story with me. It took a great toll out of my respect for him, only because I thought he had more integrity. I mean... I had been there, having at least 2 married men trying to push our friendship into something else, yeah it was confusing, but in both ocassions I did not downplay anything, and told them to their faces that what they were doing was terribly awfully wrong. Yes I lost two friends, but no friend is worth it once you realize that their honor and values just don't measure up to what you consider at least minimal.<p>After a while getting to grips with my own gut wrenching feelings about this, and trying not to LB, I managed to sit with him, hold his hand, and let him re-tell me the story again, with me as a friend, not as his judge.<p>I put myself into his place, and after a while he, on his own, started to realize what awfull thing he had done. He started to realize how sordid and terrible it sounded. He started to feel even more ashamed than he was in the first place.<p>Through that self-discovery, he got to accept all his faults, all his self-sabotage, all of the lies he told himself. And eventually he discovered that he had made the mess, but not by himself.<p>At the time he had cared about the MW enough to say he really truly loved her. He expected her to get divorced, marry her and have a family or something of some sort. He trusted her, but he realized that she did never say anything that was true about any love she felt for him.<p>He recalled things he decided to ignore, as her going off and sleeping with more men than him, getting back at her own H's infidelities. He remembered how she "paid his services" by buying him a bit of stuff for when he got his own apartment.<p>He remembered a lot of things she did that cheapened him, and a lot of lies that he couldn't believe she would say.<p>He felt violated to some point. Repulsed by himself. Terribly torn.<p>Months passed, and as I was fighting with this new info (he had taken me to her house, and I had tried my best to be amicable to her, because yes, she was-is family), trying not to go over there and beat her up the head! When I say she screwed him up majorly, believe me she did. He thought that love was to be treated badly, punished and pushed, that if there was sex then he was obligated to feel love, even when he didn't even want the sex in the first place etc etc etc...<p>My H was trying to deal with his past, putting in front of him, and getting his pink colored glasses off, and saw something terrible. His love life had been terribly sordid, desperate, needy, and when he grew out of that, he decided to take it up on me to pay off for all the distress his previous gfs had put him in.<p>For this he has apologized and admits he will have to dedicate his life time to make up for it.<p>Finally today he took a piece of paper and redacted a sort of NC letter for this MW. Yes she was family, but we dont ever want to see her again, for no reason whatsoever, and he wanted her to know that NO she did NOT "make him a man", therefore a favor. That he knows he was screwed up doing what he did, but that she had to know that she was wrong too.<p>He wrote a rather professional, very tempered letter, took the phone, and made the call.<p>Now what I need you all to explain me is this:<p>When he talked to her she didn't, for once admit that she had done wrong. Her excuse:<p>"God made me the way I am, and so God made me do what I did"<p> [img]images/icons/shocked.gif" border="0[/img] [img]images/icons/shocked.gif" border="0[/img] [img]images/icons/shocked.gif" border="0[/img] <p>Ok I am a not religious person, but this... is just... CRAZY!!!!<p>She then proceeded to say she was not ashamed of what she did because:<p>"God has plans for people and so whatever we do we never should be ashamed of because that is what God wants"<p>Ok Ok someone paint me blue and call me smurfette, because I really don't get it and doesn't make any sense.<p>For those more holly than me out there, that have more knowledge of this spiritual part of the human beings... could you pleaaaaase, explain this to me????<p>(BTW this affair of my H happened about... 12 years ago, so go figure, now I understand how people can whistle atrocities they do away)

Alostwife, you are a good wife! You put yourself in H's shoes so you could see things through his eyes and helped him do the same for you.<p>You love him without judging. You agreed together to put the past behind you.<p>Please be assured this former OW is no Christian!! People can justify a LOT of things in the name of God but it doesn't make it right. My H's father divorced his wonderful W and married a woman who manipulated him into it--he chose Wife #2 because he knew Wife #1 was stronger????Puh-leaze!! Anyway, H and I were visiting friends of Dad and Wife 2 and she tried to tell us "it was God's will" that H's parent divorce and his Dad marry the next one. <p>It was NOT God's will for him to even entertain the thought of some other woman.<p>You are a very perceptive lady to realize this woman (who you are wisely breaking contact with even though part of your family)really does not represent the true God in any way. She represents evil and warped minds. <p>You raise a good point that men often suffer things women openly discuss. Shame on our society for underestimating the hurts of men. Yes, we can all make a choice but I know from personal experience we can be heavily manipulated to make the lesser choice. Thank God there is hope because there are forgiving people like you in this world!!

Thanks so much for your kind words freshstart. I was just blushing because of the compliments.<p>I do try my best to be the best wife I can be. I do love my husband with all of my heart and soul.<p>You see, I am not a christian. I have read the Bible, gone to theology class, and was baptized a catholic and raised in a catholic school. I don't have much of a religion, because I chose to attain from believing in God. I might be wrong, but I am not enough proud and all-knowing as to say everybody else who disagrees with me is crazy. As a matter of fact I respect those true Christians very highly, because afterall it takes a great amount of faith in believing.<p>Just as I have so many friends that love their religion, it outrages me and saddens me that people like this woman can make use of something that is supposes to be sacred and pure to others, and make it a kind of "getting out of jail" card for any situation.<p>"Oh I killed this guy, but that's ok, God made me do it!"<p> [img]images/icons/rolleyes.gif" border="0[/img] <p>Sometimes I truly cannot understand people.<p>Good news is that she is out of our lifes as I am concerned

Dear Alostwife,<p>What a show of trust in you it was for your H to share this information with you!! That he felt safe enough with you to make himself so vulnerable is a tribute to you.<p>He realizes his big mistake. Now he is free to heal. It sounds very much like he was a naive, young victim of this woman. (Not blameless, but manipulated by this relative none the less) Has she abused other young relatives in this way? Will your H consider therapy? It could help him learn to forgive himself. BTW, I bet that one thing that is really eating away at your H is how he allowed himself to be suckered in by her. He knows now he was used and that she never loved him. I'm sure he feels foolish and ashamed. <p>Now about what the woman said. Absolutely ignore anything she says in reference to God. This is an evil cop-out. Her actions had zero to do with God and everything to do with her selfishness. This woman obviously has some major problems that have nothing to do with your H. What a creep! Blaming God is a pretty common thing for adulterers to do. It's one of the ways they rationalize their horrid behavior. My son's wife attributed the wonderful euphoria of her affair on God's blessing to her. Told everybody that God was sooo good. Really sick. Seems to be to be treading on pretty thin ground - blaming infidelity on God!<p>I suggest that you and your H avoid this woman in the future. Never bring the A up to her again. If because of family gatherings, you MUST be in the same place with her, put on the best act ever, and do not acknowledge that anything ever occurred. That's the best come back, that what occurred was so unimportant that it never crosses your mind.<p>You sound like a very mature person, Alostwife. I hope that the trust that this disclosure required is one more block in the foundation of a long, strong marriage for you and your H. I hope he is strong enough to look into therapy because he needs to learn to forgive himself.<p>Take care,
Estes