Hi all WW...<p>I am a betrayed husband, looking for some insight from WW....<p>1. While the A was going on, did you think about the pain of the BS? What did you think about it? How did you rationalize it (if at all)?<p>2. Now that my W&#8217;s A is over (but she&#8217;s in pretty bad withdrawal), she&#8217;s angry and mean with me. Did you go through something similar? If so, can you help me understand what was behind it? Was there anything your husband could have done to change your behavior toward him while you were in withdrawal or in the fog?<p>3. When did you begin to emerge from the fog/withdrawal? How long did it take? Was there anything your husband could have done to help clear the fog?<p>4. Why are you so mean to the person you loved for so many years ?<p>5. Why are you so STONE hearted towards the BH who has taken care of you all his life and still wanting to take care of you.<p>
Will appreciate your honest response.<p>thelion<p>[ June 21, 2002: Message edited by: TheLion ]<p>[ June 21, 2002: Message edited by: TheLion ]</p>

Lion,<p>Good questions. Just a suggestion. Rename the thread something like:
?? for all WS Wives.......<p>It might better represent your post. There are several good Xws wives out there that should shed some light. If you don't get a response by tomorrow, we'll send out an APB for them! ok?<p>L.

Lion,<p>I hope you will not be offended if I reword your questions a little bit. Your tone is almost confrontational. But I know you’re really looking for information, not a debate, so I would like to help.<p>1. While the A was going on, did you think about the pain of the BS? What did you think about it? How did you rationalize it (if at all)?<p>2. Now that my W’s A is over (but she’s in pretty bad withdrawal), she’s angry and mean with me. Did you go through something similar? If so, can you help me understand what was behind it? Was there anything your husband could have done to change your behavior toward him while you were in withdrawal or in the fog?<p>3. When did you begin to emerge from the fog/withdrawal? How long did it take? Was there anything your husband could have done to help clear the fog?<p>[The original questions 2 and 3 seemed to be getting at the same thing, so I combined them.]

Thanks Orchid:<p>Hope you are having a nice day!
Hang in there....<p>thelion

Thanks curious53:<p>I will change the Q ?<p>thelion

I'll give it a shot Lion -- but you do sound kinda angry.<p>1. Figured that if he neglected and ignored me for as long as he did -- he probably didn't care much about me. I never considered his feelings in regards to my affair, cuz I never thought he would find out.<p>2. I had a lot of anger towards my H. I think my a was a direct result of that. I don't think I've been "mean" I just want him to leave me alone, and sometimes he pushes me to be cruel.<p>3. Too little too late was how I felt. Never cared about me before...why was I supposed to go back to caring about him?<p>4. Never went back to my marriage -- we are divorcing.

Your post is kind of angry, even though you seem to be seaking answers. I am not your WW, so I might not feel the same as she did. I don't know how you treat her, or any other information about your M.<p>My H has a problem controlling his temper, never hits me, but can be very verbally abusive. It got worse as years went by, and I could see it was really affecting my D. She was having obvious signs of anxiety at 7 years old. Every time he "went off" it made me more distanced to him. I was easy prey for an A. I already have self esteem issues because my dad was verbally abusive, and a bad alcoholic. I was very self destructive as a teen, and I was back in the same pattern. <p>Most on here would say there is NO EXCUSE for an affair, I should have dealt with it differently. And I couldn't argue with that, but we are talking about humans here. We don't exactly always do what we are SUPPOSED to. I just know every time he screamed at me, he pushed me closer to OM. <p>After the A was out in the open, I started telling him I wasn't going to take that anymore. Suddenly, I deserved it though, he officially had an "excuse" to berate me. So this caused even more escalated fights at first. If I tried to say anything in my defense, I must be back with OM. I was supposed to just take whatever was dished at me.<p>I've told him over and over, I am not trying to deny your pain, but you need to consider how you approach me. When he comes to me and says he is feeling anxious/upset and we talk it out, it is so much better. When he comes at me in a rage, I shut down, get defensive, wonder how much more I can take, wonder if I'll end up leaving him eventually. At first he was trying to deny that his anger was a problem before the affair, it took the help of his family for him to truly see that. <p>It took a recent incident for him to wake up and smell the coffee. He came to me afterwards crying and said he needed counseling. That he knew he was affecting all of us with it. I told him I have flaws, and I wouldn't want him giving up on me because of it. This is really the only thing about him I would want to change. It is something that has influenced our relationship from the beginning.<p>All I am saying is to take a good long look at the relationship you have with your W. Has she answered these questions for you? How long ago was D-day?

Thanks Lexxxy:<p>It helps to unravel why people have A. In your situation sounds like you needed to get out of the M. <p>Why wouldn't you consider divorcing before the A. and than do what you want...<p>Wouldn't that be logical...
Sorry if I have offended you!<p>thelion

Lion,<p>I am a FWW so I will try to answer your questions.<p>1. For me my H had a revenge A, so I think I do understand the pain he went through. I went through many sleepless nights and lost over 20 lbs, that I didn't have to lose waiting for him to come home and stop lying about OW. Prior to my knowledge of his A I tried to understand but I don't think you get it exactly until you go through it - the whole not being able to breathe thing was unbearable.<p>2. My EN's were not being met, and there was a lot of verbal abuse from my H. I guess you could say after several years of this and drifting apart I was starved for attention. I never intended for anything to happen with OM and never wanted to hurt my H. I went to great lengths to hide my A. When I look back and try to explain my selfish actions the only thing I can come up with is that I had to have been out of my mind. I am just at a loss for words when trying to explain why this happened there is really no excuse for my behavior.<p>3. For me I was stonehearted to my H at the beginning of my A mostly because I hated the fact that this OM could, and was meeting my EN and my H could not, or would not. Then maybe partly out of guilt sometimes before d-day I couldn't even face my H because of what I was doing I suppose it came out as me being coldhearted when I wouldn't talk to, look at, or touch him. In reality it was shame.<p>4. I can't speak for everyone but I think when you are involved in an A you don't realize the big picture at first. I wasen't thinking this A is going to hurt not only my H but our children, and our families. I wasen't thinking gee I will have to sell my house and move into an apartment. I wasen't thinking this OM lives an hour away this will never work. I wasen't thinking this OM is younger than me an has no way of supporting 2 children emotionally that are not his no matter what he says. I needed to realize what my H DID do for us, and once I looked at the big picture and saw that the love for him was still there it was a no-brainer. It is almost like I was in LaLa land for 3 months and one day a brick landed on my head and woke me up to reality. I don't know what made the brick fall though(I wish it would have fallen before my A)<p>Hope that helps answer your questions. I have a question for you though. If this applies, do you ever think there will be a time when you forgive your WW and not think about her A(at least not on an everyday basis)? This is just where H and I are at in recovery.<p>DU

Hi findingmywayback:<p>Thanks for your reply.
you can read my thread @
http://www.marriagebuilders.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=30&t=001268&p=1<p>thelion<p>I now understand why you did what you did....

oh crap -- now you changed all the questions and my answers make no sense.<p>Poof -- I'll try again later....lol

Thanks definitely unsure:<p>I appreciate your honest reply.<p>Regarding your question, NO I can never forget the A, however, I can forgive my W, and would live my life... but I cannot forget.. Thats the truth.<p>
thelion

You guys are close the the same ages as me and my H. I am 31 and he is 32. Married for 6 years, together for 9. I got pregnant before we married, and that is one thing that gets thrown in my face, that I only married him because he's the father. Oh yeah, and I love his family (he has an awesome family). This comes up when he's not getting enough sex. Most things seem to revolve around sex for him. I think he has a VERY high testosterone level. (I'd be interested if any men here have information on that.) He agrees, he knows he is above average when it comes to sex drive. I would do a lot to try to please him sexually and it would only seem to lead to a higher and higher expectation of what he wanted from me. <p>When we first were together, I didn't know how to do BJ's all to great, I was young and niave to it. He would tell me, I'll never marry someone who doesn't do that. So I learned to do it (with his help), then it was I'll never marry someone who doesn't swallow. Emotional manipulation, it's a game he loves to play. <p>I was young then, and didn't see it that way. Now, I am more in tune to when he is trying to EM me into something he wants. We had a huge blowout one night over where would move next. He tried to accuse me of denying him his dream retirement home because I didn't want to move where he wanted to, we are in our early 30's!!!! It would have added a lot of extra time to my commute, which is during rush hour. He doesn't drive during rush hour. <p>He has chilled a lot on this, and is starting to realize the affect it has on us. Also, he will argue a point vehemently (this has happened so many times) only to be proven wrong later. I think he's tired of eating his foot.<p>I wish you the best of luck Lion. Sometimes these things can slap both people in the face and tell them something needs to change. I hope your wife comes to her senses soon.

Lion,
As I remember, you were trying to work on your conversation skills so you could better meet your wife's needs in that area. Can you tell me what specifically you are doing to work on that?
Also, I thought you were in Plan B. If that's the case, then you have no contact with your wife right now. So she has no opportunity to be mean to you anymore (and thus not deplete your love bank balance further). Are you indeed in Plan B? If so, why the contact?
Curious

thanks findingmywayback:<p>Thanks for sharing your story, all the best in your recovery, I wish you all the luck you need...<p>Regarding the sex drive you need to get some counseling with a sex therapist to figure out what you can do...<p>thelion

Thanks curious53:<p>I was trying to meet her conversation need until I was in plan A, by talking to her nice, joking, discussing subject which she has interest in, her work, her life, her family just fun stuff, never LB'ed or brought up R issues,<p>yes I have moved to plan B but without the letter of no contact, however, I did write a 4 page letter in which I clearly wrote that "until you have contact with OM I dont see how we can work on our M" I see no other way but to have a complete closure.<p>we are building a house that is the only reason we sometime talk on the phone which is once or twice a week... for 2 minutes or so.<p>Also, I have given up, I have run out of steam and would throw in the towel soon... I have depleted my love bank, I am exhausted with everything I could do...<p>thelion

Bump up...

Hello WW need your help!!!<p>thelion

TheLion:<p>
I was trying to meet her conversation need until I was in plan A, by talking to her nice, joking, discussing subject which she has interest in, her work, her life, her family just fun stuff, never LB'ed or brought up R issues,<p>TR- When you talk to her do you plan A?<p>{yes I have moved to plan B but without the letter of no contact, however, I did write a 4 page letter in which I clearly wrote that "until you have contact with OM I dont see how we can work on our M" I see no other way but to have a complete closure.<p>we are building a house that is the only reason we sometime talk on the phone which is once or twice a week... for 2 minutes or so.}<p>TR- These two comments are complete opposites..
in one your saying "NO Contact UNTIL" and then the next one your saying but I talk to her a couple times a week..How can she trust your word that she needs to stop ALL contact with the other man before you talk to her again when you don't follow it? See the conflict?? It sounds like you are double talking..and she needs to see your actions
and your words match..<p>my ex was the same way..he'd say one thing and do something completely opposite of what he said..I didn't know what the heck to believe..so maybe your wife needs to see consitancy in your words and actions actually matching???<p>Also, I have given up, I have run out of steam and would throw in the towel soon... I have depleted my love bank, I am exhausted with everything I could do...<p>And then you say your building a house for your future together then you say it's over and your throwing in the towel..so what is she supposed to think??<p>Maybe this is one of the problems she has within your relationship??? Your words and actions don't match--something you can work on about yourself??

Hello TR<p>You need to read my story, @
http://www.marriagebuilders.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=30&t=001268<p>What I am saying on this board is not what I am talking to her.... these are just thoughts and a place to vent....<p>Throwing in the towel is only on this board, because I am exhausted....she is not aware of that.<p>Also, the reason I have to talk her is we are building a custom house there are at least 20-25 decisions everyday most of the time I make those but rarely in 2 weeks once in a while we get stuck and my contractor want to speak to her that was the only reason I talk to her. No one knows about this A, so it is hard for me to tell that we are not talking and cant make decisions.<p>
I was trying to meet her conversation need until I was in plan A, by talking to her nice, joking, discussing subject which she has interest in, her work, her life, her family just fun stuff, never LB'ed or brought up R issues,<p>TR- When you talk to her do you plan A?
(yes I do without LB perfect plan A)<p>I do exactly what I say, I will do it and I believe in that....<p>
And then you say your building a house for your future together then you say it's over and your throwing in the towel..so what is she supposed to think??<p>{we were building a house together for the future until the D-day A. 3/29 but she was aware of this all along the EA/PA is about 3 years so she fooled me all along}<p>ThanksTR
will appreciate your comment.
thelion