Hi. I am on vacation. WH and I have been separated 4 mths now. No progress made. I hadn't called him for a week and I made the mistake of calling him and trying to talk about M. I asked him point blank if the relationship was over and he said yes, I thought we'd decided that.
He told me the night before I left that he loved me, cared about me, I was a good person,etc but couldn't give me what I wanted right now.
I talked to him a second time on the phone yesterday and asked him-
"you've said you want to be friends with me. DO you want to be civil when we exchange kids and talk about them or do you want to be friends that do things together once and awhile?"
He said, " I want to be able to do things once and awhile but I can't feel like I'm on trial."
I had also asked him when he left he said he wanted to try to work on things, why the change? He said, "In four months, we haven't had a civil conversation (not true) and too much has happened."
We started MC three weeks ago, and all WH seems to use the sessions for is to confirm his decision to leave.
All signals indiciate that he is done with this marriage and cares for me like a friend. Like the love is gone. I don't know where he and the OW stand-he has said he is not seeing her anymore.I don't know if this is true or not.
When do I know it is time to move on? That I am hoping for something that is gone in the other person?
It hurts more that he wants to be a friend rather than a lover and is not interested in me in that sense. It really hurts my sense of self and makes it difficult to be nice to him. I
It is so difficult to not feel attractive in my husband's eyes. I have gained weight since we've been married and it's an issue. He told me when he left that he needs to feel something more in his life (Ie. passion) and that if I lost weight, he may feel that again. We used to have a great sex life. I understand what he said but it also makes me feel like his love is very conditional and at what weight do I magically become attractive again? It makes me feel horrible. What if I lose the weight (I have lost 40 lbs since he left and have 40 more to go) and he still isn't attacted to me?
I need tough answers. Thanks
-CS

It has only been 3.5 months. Give it some time. These things take an enormous amount of time. You are expecting too much too fast. Take the friends approach. I know that this is difficult, but all relationships start out as friends. You can not expect him to jump into a full passionate relationship with you just like that. It takes baby steps. Be a friend. Do not judge or force him into decisions or try to get him to talk about your future. This is not helpful and it makes him feel bad. (Major LB'ing)

He is reaching out to be friends with you. This is a good sign. Talk about fun things and positive things. Show him your strength and resolve. If you talk about negative things with him, he is going to look at you negatively.

Do not get hung up on the attractive part and do not take his words as being true. No matter what society says about looks, guys truley look at the whole package, not just appearance. Feel attractive and sexy inside and he will see you as being attractive, and do not forget that he probably does find you very attractive. He probably just does not want to tell you this so you do not get clingy with him.

Work on yourself and your self esteem. Be his friend and no negative talk or M talk. Try to get him to do fun things with you. Show him that you are fun to be around.

STOP ASKING HIM THOSE KIND OF QUESTIONS...

You are NOT going to get the answers you want. I know. I tried too. There are posts and posts where I lament the AWFUL things he said to me. (last year this time through February this year.) however, it was ALWAYS in response to something I had said or asked... later he told me he said those things JUST TO SHUT ME UP... not because he really meant them... he just wanted me to stop asking questions or sometimes, to just stop talking...

So what do YOU do?

What is your spiritual life like? As long as I asked questions and tried to DO SOMETHING... nothing happened except more anger, frustration and separation...

I established a stronger relationship w/ God through Christ and let Him work in my life. I looked to Him for answers. I feel blessed that my H was raised w/ God central in his life and he couldn't turn his back on his 'raising.' I told his mom that yesterday and thanked her.

But how does that help you? Accept that you cannot control this... that a Higher Power is in charge... The Melodie Beatty books "The Language of Letting Go" were very helpful. You have to let go of your OLD relationship w/ him and start anew.

What brought you two together in the first place? I focused on that. H and I went and did the things we did when we first got together. I kept my mouth SHUT a lot at first and just listened to him. Later, I learned how to talk to him w/out giving suggestions or 'negating' what he said... bad habits I had gotten into.

I made sure we did lots of family things together FOR THE KIDS... but I was there too... I made sure I kept these times tension-free on my part. (We went to the beach, the drive-in, dinners, church).

I worked on building a 'new' relationship w/ him... but I used OLD things... things we had in common that had been enjoyable... to cement it together.

Ultimately, for my H, it was him putting God central in his life again that cleared the fog... well most of it... more and more dissipates everyday....

Stormy OMartian's book "Power of a Praying Wife" helped me focus on what to pray about... "Secrets of the Vine" by Bruce Wilkinson helped me move closer to God...

The answers are there for you too, but you have to take your focus off your H and your 'old' marriage and focus on YOU.

Hugs,
Cali

Very Good advice above, I know what you are going through!!! I am in that same situation, however, I do not talk to my husband about our relationship anymore...I am doing Plan B..and it seems to be helping me from being hurt by his hurtful words...One thing that I have come to know..is that WH's are confused...they will say things that they really don't mean...if they see you losing interest, they will try to communicate with you!!! We can't trust their words, because after all, look at their actions....I just say seek God...talk to him when you are feeling sad...He will comfort you..I know...He does that for me all the time...ask Him to work on your WH..he will!!

You got some very good advice from Cali.

Relationship talks are a HUGE downer in his eyes. Please stop pursuing those.

Focus your time and attention on YOU and YOUR actions -- not him and his actions.

There is nothing you can do to change him. No amount of hoping, wishing, or pleading will do it.

So use your energy to your best advantage -- and that is to work on yourself.

hi. I am back from vacation. Bummer. Thanks for your replies. I haven't talked to WH since my last post-he's called a few times but I've stayed away when the kids talked to him.
I went to IC this morning. C'er thinks Wh is still in the A and I need to move on. Wh is going to the beach for the 4th. My guess is with OW. He says no. Things don't add up with what he said.
It's hard to be back knowing the decisions that I need to make.
I've been foolish holding on to my situation.
Unfortunately, my WH doesn't have God in his life. There is no pull back to morality.
While going ahead with my life and D papers and yet holding myself out to the possiblity of being friends with WH is ideal-I am not able to do both. I am trying hard to withdraw from WH and go on my way.
I am crushed that WH is going to the beach-one more holiday that he has missed with the kids (and me). I do suspect that he is seeing OW again (still?).
I guess I go on and quit trying to deny the situation. It'll be a long weekend.
Happy 4th everyone.
-CS

Do not file for divorce yet!!! Wait..if he wants a divorce, let him file...what you need to do is start focusing on God, yourself and children...I tell you that his affair is not going to work..Mark my words...in the meantime you need to act as if this thing is a game....Start showing the WH that you are not focusing on him any longer...dress up, plan activities with your children...do other things..I bet you will then get some attention...maybe not at first...but believe me, he will be watching..I know this is hard to do, but it can be done...I know, because I am in the same situation you are...(WH is not saved) but, that's OK..cause God can work that too..

T-Hi. I wish you were right about WH.
In our state, we can't file for D for one yr from separtion date (March) but I can do the other pieces. We've done custody and I'm working on the other stuff. It's been advised from c'er, friends, MB friends, atty, etc to get the other stuff done. So, no, I'm not filing for D yet, I can't, but the other issues (child support, spousal support, property). I hate doing these pieces but need to protect me and the kids.
Thanks for your reply.
-CS

I agree with you on the support issues...I am just saying don't give up on your marriage..I know it's hard, but God can change things!!! Do what you feel is right...don't let no one tell you to get a divorce if that is not truly what you want...!! Read alot on this board, they are a lot osf cases like ours that became a success, when you need to talk...come here..anytime and someone will be here to help you get through the rough times...I will put you in my prayers...

How does everyone do it? Act friendly with WS when you are angry? I decided to move on with my life and try to focus on me and be business friendly with WH (Yes, back to that). I think everyone's advice about being friends is ideal but I can't do it.
He stopped by to see the kids for a minute before he left tonight for three days. I haven't seen him in 12 days and I couldn't even give him eye contact or smile. I am so angry that he has missed the last three holidays with the kids.
I said, "Have a great fourth without us and I asked one question about his beach trip-indiciating I believed he was going with OW."
He asked if he could work on the house on Sat. I said yes. (2 other people are coming over too tp help) He has the kids Sat. and Sun. That was the sum of our contact. Not pleasant.
I plan to leave after he gets to the house on Sat. He is in such a different emotional stage then me. He has play time and then when OW is working, he wants to be over at my house for awhile. He continues to insist that he isn't seeing her-I don't believe. Why does he continue to lie?
Focus on me? I am sick of it.
Do you just fake it when you are with WS or am I simply not capable of plan A?
I keep reading these posts and I am truly happy for those who have had recovery with spouses but it seems they were able to have more of something that in four months I still don't have.
Isn't it possible that WS knows exactly what he is doing and he just wants to be a friend cuz of the kids and that's it? He is not in a fog and he means it when he says he is done?
-CS

Bump!

Welcome back CS! I hope that (besides a few down times) your vacation was enjoyable and you were able to relax a bit.

Just a few thoughts from the confused-as-a-3-legged-dog-in-a-firehydrant-factory mind of LHS. First, what is your primary objective in all of this? Do you want to save your M, or are you ready to write the last 12 years off as a bad investment? From reading your posts, I know what the answer is. It's the end result that you need to think about right now, not the daily crap that you are going through. Second, your WH is going to be a part of your life forever, there is nothing you can do about it. Even if you do D, there are all those birthdays, school events, holidays and (dare I say) grandkids that the 2 of you are going to have to share in some capacity. Unless WH just completely disappears, you will have to deal with him.

I understand how you feel, I too would like WW to make a commitment and start working on rebuilding the M. But, they are not ready for that yet and that is what is so frustrating to us BS's. They have a lot of things to work out themselves (for my W, I believe it is her drinking, feelings of anger/revenge she has towards OM and his W and self-esteem issues) before they can even begin recovery. But that really isn't any different than our Plan A efforts, is it? I guess both the BS and WS have to Plan A, which makes sense because it is a lifetime commitment, not just for the spouse, but for everyone we come in contact with. In order for us BS's to really get into an effective recovery, we need to deal with the issues that allowed our M to deteriorate to the point it was prior to the A starting as well.

Marriage is a journey that the W and H are supposed to take together, side-by-side. It hurts when us BS's want to continue this journey with our spouse, but they are either too busy running around looking for greener pastures to graze in or licking their wounds from the effects of the A and avoiding commitments of any kind. You and H are at 2 different places right now, but honestly, do you really want H to make a commitment to you right now knowing that his heart really isn't in it? You are dealing with 2 completely different H's, the pre-A and the one you have now. The Pre-A H was the one who said all the things that gave you hope, the current H is the one who says and does things that give you a valid reason to question your future together.

Take what has been said here to heart. If you are still committed to your H and the M, then you are going to have to do some things that may not seem to follow normal operating procedures, but then again, does any of this follow what is considered 'normal'? Try starting as friends, like Dreamland says, and build from there. Lay off the R and M talk, there will be plenty of time for that later. Don't discourage WH from counseling, even if he seems to be using it to justify his leaving. The more he talks, the more ridiculous he is going to sound and eventually he is going to see things as they really are. But, only you know how much you can handle of this.

To me, I see you struggling with coming to some kind of acceptance of all of this. The emotional CS says that this isn't right, its not fair, why cant WH see this and come back to the me , the family and the M. The rational CS is saying "look, here are the facts, only one conclusion can be drawn, its over." This battle is what is causing you so much turmoil and pain. But that's ok, almost necessary, I have gone through the exact same things and quite frankly, it sucks. Struggling with this helps you sort through all your feelings and allows you to come to terms with all of this in a healthy way. I was struggling with this at the same point you are, the DDay + 4 mos mark. Then, all of a sudden, it hit me and things became very clear, I realized that I am a wonderful person, that I am not to blame for the A and that I can correct the mistakes I have made and become an even better person, and if WW doesn't see it or doesn't want it, too bad for her. I believe that soon you will come to this point as well.

At the very least, you should be a 'business partner" with WH, for the sake of the kids. Not the nicest place to be, but a helluva lot better than being bitter enemies. If you don't want to be his friend, don't. I don't consider myself and WW friends either, right now I am cordial with her and that is it. CS, its hard, and it isn't fair, but God never guaranteed that life would be, but He did promise all of us that He will protect us and comfort us in our times of need. Let this be CS's time, go out and have some fun, be who you want to be. WH doesn't have any control over you, not physically, not emotionally, not mentally, just like you don't have any control over him.

One more thing if I may. Pay very close attention to the subtle things WH does and says. I have noticed that if I don't call or email WW at least once a day, she will call and start asking a lot of questions as to my whereabouts (why would she be so concerned?). I have also gotten very good of repeating her fog-ese back to her and watching her reaction. For instance, she likes to tell me that it is her house now and not mine, that I am the one who moved out. When she asks me to do something for her, I repeat this statement and add on that it was her who filed the RO to get me out of the house. She says that isn't what she meant and when I ask her to clarify, she trips all over herself and finally says that it isn't the time to discuss it. May not be the right thing to do, but I think she needs to be reminded sometimes of how ridiculous she sounds.