So why do we do it? There are so many BS's on this site looking for help. We all desperately want to know the reasons and the details of the affairs. There is a lot of pain here, past, present and future.

What are the motivations?! Is it ego? When we discover the affair does it hurt our feelings of self-worth so much that we need to Plan A and win the S back in order to feel good about ourselves.
Do we need security? Is it safer to try to win the S back than to chuck them (and all of their belongings) out on the street. Are D's just too embarassing and therefore just the last possible resort? Is it easier to try to restart with the WS who has completely betrayed our trust, our feelings and in most cases our bodies than to go it alone for awhile until the day when we find someone with a clean slate? Can we ever really know for sure that the WS has completely returned to us? In body yes but in mind and sole? Are we to be compared to the lost OP forever.

I hope for all of us that these cynical thoughts are just that. I hope we all love our spouses despite their weakness. I hope that we can trust again and know that when we walk into the room our S's look at us and they melt inside. Recovery is a God send but if only for the right reasons.

Please share your thoughts.

cwmac,

You present some interesting and fundamental questions in your post.

Personally, my answers, are yes, yes, and yes.

My D-day occurred when I was jobless, emotionally spent, poor, and in a strange town (my wife waited until the very day we moved to this town to tell me!). If I had chosen to depart, I would have been homeless. This sounds like incredible cruelty, and I guess it was.

Truth be told, I intended to revisit my options once I was on my feet. My inclination was to leave; I had not been so injured before in my life.

Instead, I stayed. I did all the wrong things to win her back. But somehow it worked. Now that I had her back, did I want her?

The pains eased, and I moved on. We never revisited this trauma. I suppose I have many issues not yet dealt with.

But in answer to your questions, my eqo was shattered. Her return resurrected a bit of it. Of course, sticking around kept me from being homeless (we had moved to the town to pursue her career). And there was some security in having her back.

Also, being of fragile ego, I didn't really think I could find another woman who at the very least would love me for a time.

It has been quite awhile since these events. I do love my wife, but I have never fully recovered from these events. Even she says I might have found another without her "history" that I could have loved as much. I don't know.

My motivation...

I wasn't about to walk away from a marriage when I couldn't say to myself that I'd done everything in my power to make it work. Done my share, as it were. Both my FWH and I needed to really try because the dissolution of the M would not only affect us but our 2 kids as well. We both had invested alot of ourselves in our M and neither could see just throwing it away. A divorce wouldn't have been an embarassment...for us it was a last resort.

As for moving along to start a new slate... Affairs don't happen in a vacuum. I acknowledge that I helped create the conditions in my marriage that made it easy for my H to decide to stray. Yes, he made the choice but, I helped create the enviroment in which that choice took place. That being said, if I don't learn from this mistake then who's to say I wouldn't repeat it when I've started this new slate with this new person? I really believe you have to learn from your experiences before you move on.

If I trust in nothing else it's that my FWH wants to be with me. He made that choice as well. He had every opportunity to leave and be with the OW and decided to be with myself and our kids. The decision to stay was his, not mine. He has returned and I believe when he looks back on our 'dark days' it's not with longing for the OW but, he kicks his own a** for what he did! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> Who knows, maybe I'm wrong but, I can't spend the rest of my life speculating. I have to live my life, move on and try to learn.

Question & MGM,
Thanks for your responses. Maybe for men, ego is the primary reason and for women it's security/children protection. I also think that self-preservation kicks in because of the numbing pain that is caused by the discovery of the betrayal. You'd think that this would cause the easy way out, divorce but quite the oppsite occurs we choose the harder more painful path. Still can't explain it. MGM's point about what to give it your all befor quitting may be the closest answer there is.

I can't deny it - sometimes I have similar thoughts lurking in the back of my mind. Indeed, why go through the pain if you can just chuck it in and start from fresh?
Well, I still hang on. Why? Firstly, I do have responsibility vis-a-vis my daughter. I sincerely beleive that a family environment is the best possible situation for a child to grow up. I don't buy the happy-single-mum, better-separated-than-together, gay-parents or whatever crap.

Secondly, I truly beleive that no one understands me better than my wife, and vice versa. We've spent the last 10 years, roughly a third of our life, together and saw and experienced a lot. It's more than just the 'getting used to' factor - it's really a half of myself which would go missing.
But at the end of the day, what can I do? what can we do? If SHE chucks it all in for that other pr**k, then that's her (rather stupid) choice, and I wont be around & waiting forever. Life goes on. But for the time being, I'm here & ready & waiting.

I feel like I made a promise when I married her to be there for her. I can't, in good faith, dump her... yet. I need to know that she'll be emotionally stable enough to survive and I need to stick it out long enough to see the end from the beginning. Right now, I only see the beginning... that light at the end of the tunnel may be the true love of my life (her or someone else) or it might be the 2nd train that's about to hit me.

I suppose the only way I'll know is if I can pull myself back up enough to risk getting hit.

Im in a similar frame of thinking as Nick123.
And Im female, so yes, protection and children is a priority, I dont feel bad about it either.

And, I still love him. Some days I dont feel it because hes not with me.

And I know he wonders if Id still be trying so hard if we didnt have our baby boy. Im not in that position, so I dont know.

If he comes back, great, as long as he works on a better marriage with me, but if someone else comes along then he may just find his time is up.

Dancer

Thanks all for comments.
Sometimes I catch myself with that same thought as Dancer but it may just be the anger boiling to the top. I don't think I'd do it.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by cwmac:
<strong>Question & MGM,
Thanks for your responses. Maybe for men, ego is the primary reason and for women it's security/children protection. .</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I didn't stay for either of those reasons. I am financially secure in my own career and not dependent upon him. I stayed because he showed remorse and truly turned himself around. He has become an open, honest, devoted husband and I have fallen back in love with him. Had that not happened, I would not have let him stay. We now have a wonderful marriage.

The bottom line is that there are many others like me whose spouses have made a 180 degree turn. I think most people deserve a chance if they show the right attitude. That is reason enough to forgive someone and stay with them.

I should add one thing, though. When I first found out about the affair, I only wanted to dump him. He begged me to go to counseling and I decided to go to a few sessions so I could dump him with a clear conscience. I ended up falling back in love with him and here I am almost 2 years later!

Melody,
My W are in recovery but I still have these feelings creeping into my brain at times. I wish I could stop them.I think they stem from the fact that I found out from my W that the topic of D has come up between her and OM. (She probably tested the waters) He told her flat out "no" due to his children. My guess is that if not for that she would have filed for D and in her mind living "happily ever after." She knows that he is unattainable and is that why she stayed with me or have I truely made her happy with my revolutionary change in attitude and behavior? When his kids are teenagers is he going to come knocking?

I am the OW. I know you don't want to hear from me. I feel the same things you do. Why do I hang on? What's in it for me? Is it pride?

yes, I can tell you there is a lot of pride. We the OW, believe EVERYTHING the MM is telling us - "marriage is dead, no passion, no love, etc". We have to believe it. Do you think we'd stay if we thought we were fowling up someone's life so drastically? We think we're helping. We think we're loving and comforting a man who's lonely and desperate for love and understanding. To think otherwise, makes us a whore. We are not whores. I don't care what you think. We love your husbands. We want to make them whole. We do not believe that we caused their or your pain because THEY tell us differently. We cannot live if we believe we've wrecked your marriage. Flame me if you must, but I speak the truth. I was raised a pentacostal preachers daughter. I never would have selected OW as my call in life. I HATE being here. But I love my MM with all my heart. Flame me, crucify me, but I'll tell you all....you could be me.

Confusedasyou

You may need to duck for cover after that one.

Its not YOUR job to love them, care for them, be there for them, encourage them blah blah blah...

Its our job. So get your claws off them and give us a chance to do it better.

Sorry, but its not you Im furious at, its the OW in my Hs life that you sound like. Youre too close to home with this one.

Theres a mile more I could say to you, but youve obviously got your mind made up to be the mothering angel in our poor little H's lives.

Someone want to hold me back?

Dancer <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" />

Confused
A's are painful regardless of which end you are on. I agree with that. I am not going to flame you although others might.
Although my topic was for BS's, I'll ask you. Why do you hang on? You described the WH as having told you many lies. It sounds as though you are in the fog and he is just outright manipilating you as well as his W. Has his W found out about the A? Is he just sitting on the fence bc that's an easy place to be vs. making a decision?
I know it's easier said than done but please find a M who will treat you well. Don't wait for what is probably unattainable mainly bc it hurts you but also bc it hurts other people.
Take care

cwmac:

Warning Will Robinson: I'm probably on my soap box here <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> Long post.

I agree with your response to confused. Problem is just as that person's name implies: confusion. She may believe she loves the MM. But, the flip side is true also: she may be not facing reality in her own M and has her cake and eat it too there. Of course the MM tells them differently. He's giving the W the same routine. Not wanting to flame or hurt here, but here's a BS's perspective on why I will do what I can to make sure my marriage works and why I am motivated:

- We have a long history together, and I honestly know the man's quirks, personality, and integrity. The man I am married to is experiencing a severe MLC, and I understand that in no way reflects on ME as a person. Additionally, because he is undergoing a journey of his own and questioning his own life does not necessarily mean that in the long term he is willing to give up all that we have built together, honored together, and desired together. I think we both need to learn to face that second half of our lives together.

- Yes. WE both contributed to the state of the marriage. However, commitment to me means not to bail on someone because we both royally screwed up. Because my S has said things and done things to hurt me, damage this marriage does not mean that he necessarily did it to end the marriage. I am not sticking my head in the sand here and saying that we may not divorce. But, relationships definitely have their ups and downs. I'm willing to leave the door open to tell H I'm still here for him, that despite a gajillion mistakes on both of our parts, that yes, we can work it out. It's not my ego at play here. I honestly do love, care for, and respect him. This is really the first honest to god bigger than life crisis we've had in our M. And, we've had a few zingers of other problems too in the past (like hospitalized children, financial problems, etc). IOW, I want to be his friend, his partner, his wife. In many ways, I see a few manipulations on part of my H in order for him to maintain his A when it was ongoing... confused really brought those to light for me. In my case, A ended because she thought H would return home. She became terrified perhaps because she was seeking the security of a stable relationship? I don't know... just my random thoughts there.

- There's no real security issue long-term for me, at least this I'm beginning to realize. At least financially. Sure, I'm strapped right now. But, the more I think about it, I've always been highly independent, had a career for who knows how long, make ok money and decent bennies, and am pretty strong-willed. So, financial security isn't all that big of an issue long-term. I am pretty sure I can make it short-term despite some problems now with house and a couple other things when I look on my own past history.

- Emotional security is another issue. Maybe this is because of how I was raised and my religious background (non-practicing CAtholic), but it does provide me with a good frame of reference and ethics with which to guide MY life. I enjoyed having the security of knowing there is one in my life who will be there to weather the storms and good times with me. And this is nothing to do with hoping we can go back to the past. I honestly love the guy enough to move forward with him as I am changing too and believe life is a journey and I know the interior of the man well enough to say I would like to continue that journey with him.

Right now, my H is fence sitting, teetering towards D, and I'm just keeping my mouth shut, letting him stew and fume. He's deep deep into withdrawal and we've had such a rough time of it. I blew it so many times and we've had so many difficult problems ongoing during this A and separation that it's really going to take some time. My patience will probably wane and tide, and we'll see what happens. But, long run, I am motivated to work it out if it is possible.

What about the children that are the victims of your 'love' for the MM? Do the feelings and life and impact on the children ever get any consideration??

Being in or having an affair is just a selfish act in my opinion. Its always ME ME ME.

Sorry I lost it there last nite guys - I LBed the OW!!! Whats that?

Thanx for following thru her reply graciously, I just couldnt (wouldnt?) do it last nite.

Dancer

I agree LiveAnew. But, unfortunately, the family is often the reason that it seems that MLC men do bolt--my perspective only again. The family seems to become too much responsibility and overwhelm them perhaps. At least in my view, that's part of the modus operandi. Even if the H doesn't admit it... and it would be hard to I guess. Guilt vs. freedom? Tough balance there too. I can honestly say I have a hard time understanding that because I have always been pretty independent and yet really a family/homey person too. But I'm sure I also shirked my share of repsonsibility around here too and I really LB'd my H with my mouth and attitude about family during the A, so it reinforced his need for independence and fun too.

That's just my view from my experience, though.

My H, first A, was when we were living together. 2 children. He left when baby was 6 mo old. I was always one step away from welfare. I still loved him, but if it wasn't for the boys, he would have been long gone.

I took him back, we got married, had baby no 3. I'm not sure to this day, why he wanted to marry me, was it to get out of the child support? He still contact her daily. Did this end and resume or did it never end?

Why do I put up with it now. The kids, the financial security. I could not afford the home, the kids, the kids sports on my paycheck with child support. However, when I am done with school, he will be making some decisions. Because then I will be able to support my children w/o child support. I will make almost what he makes. (Sorry, slight vent thrown in there)

Geez, Sue, you do have it pretty rough.

But it sounds like you're holding up.

I hear you about the school. I'm still there myself. Have six to nine hours to complete... basically a research project. I don't know if I'll have the tuition to finish (my employer pays a good portion, but I have to chuck some it too) as planned this fall... but, I'm gonna check into a few things. I just want to be DONE with it!

Good luck!!! Sounds like you have every reason to vent, but sounds like you're gonna pull through with that determination.