or how not to proceed. First off, I should say I only found this site about a week ago and have read all the steps and am hooked. I very much want a marriage that is open and honest...where both our needs are met and one that is considerate of both our feelings. Here is my life story: I was just married on June 22nd. This is my second marriage and my H's as well. We both were the ones to seek divorces in our first marriages and didn't meet until we'd both been separated for 7 months. We have 3 daughters between us. Two (mine) are living with us. His daughter lives in another state up north. We see her every few months. My girls and I are in the process of moving to his city away from my home and job of many years. We had a long distance relationship (2 1/2 years) before we married. I am troubled by my husbands past behavior and I'm not sure if I should be concerned about this as we set out in our future together. Hopefully, I can gain some great wisdom here. My H's marriage ended after he had a one night affair with his former g/f. The g/f and he were great friends for many years and lovers when they were both single. They never had a relationship where they were together. It was a come and go thing. They met when they were both at camp together as young children. He was her first lover and they met up ever so often after that but never were "in" a serious relationship. He has had this great emotional attachment to her over the years and they have remained in contact. His first W didn't allow him to be friends with her and made him write a letter telling her to stay away and to make no contact. Well, he did maintain contact with her despite this through email and phone. He's first marriage was bad. She was very needy, smothering, insecure person who was ill all the time b/c of her own (not taking care of her health, history of depression and suicide) doing. He was her care-taker for many years and wasn't getting anything in return but grief and more kicks in the teeth. It was bad. He ended up having a one night affair with this g/f (I'll call her J) and he said it turned his life around. He and J did not pursue a relationship. She was still working on her failing marriage and remember they have never seemed to have a serious one on one relationship. Soon after this he filed for divorce and we met 7 months later. He told me of his infidelity the first week we met. I told him at the time it seemed as if J was unfinished business for him. I told him that if we began an exclusive relationship I would need to be informed of contact with J. We began an exclusive relationship soon after that. He decided to write her a "goodbye" email. He did and allowed me to read it. I never asked him to do this, he did it on his own. He never mentioned J again. I brought her up from time to time to see how he was doing with it. He said he hardly thought of her and that was that. Let's fast-forward to last March...he proposed to me. I accepted. That same week thoughts of J kept popping into mind. I didn't want a repeat of what happened when things got tough in his first marriage....him running to J for whatever reason as he had done in the past. I asked him to be perfectly honest with me about his contact with J since our relationship. He told me he'd met her for dinner (on a business trip out west) once since we'd been exclusive. But that dinner was all that it was. I was hurt that he hadn't been honest but was happy that he'd finally "come clean" so we could build an open and honest relationship from there forward. He also told me he'd recently emailed her but she'd not responded. Now Fast-forward to our honeymoon...he told me during a conversation that he'd met his travel agent (a woman) for a day on the beach during his first marriage. Nothing physical, just company for a day outing at the seashore. Again, it was a hard time in his marriage. This agent and his First W spoke more than he and his wife did and he was traveling allot. The agent and he built a friendship over the phone and decided on a day outing. As I said, he told me there was no physical contact at all. I believed him as he was honest about his infidelity with J in his first marriage. Red flags and curiosity got the better of me (I did this about 2 weeks ago, while he was sleeping)though and I snooped into some old email from years ago. All this email was on his work laptop he uses for work. I found that the agent woman thing was innocent but I also found that the dinner with J wasn't so innocent. From the email, it looked as though they stayed in a hotel with adjoining rooms. And that they were tired from staying up late and that he snoring kept him awake. That they were to meet that night as well. That was all I could gather from their notes to each other the day after. Well, I was extremely upset that he wasn't totally honest. He woke up to find I'd snooped and was angry with me. He was hurt that I didn't trust him. He had to leave so we could not discuss things. We did finally talk. He told me he'd stayed at her apartment. No adjoining rooms. They slept in the same bed but they never had sex. (The email was not lovely dovey with words of how wonderful their night was together) He asked me how we could get past this enough that I could trust him again. I told him to look me in the eye and at the same time tell me EVERY thing. He had me right on up until it got to the part where he said he couldn't remember if they got together the next day. He did say he could look back at old CC bills to verify his hotel stay the next night. During this "dinner" meeting he hadn't informed her that he'd been in an exclusive relationship with me for the past nine months. She was in the middle of a divorce. My thoughts were this: She was single and so was he (except for our exclusive relationship)...what's to stop them from having sex since they did before when they were both married? He told me that he absolutely did not have sex with her. That all he had was his word. That he loved me and married me and she was not and would never be a factor at all in our relationship. He promised to inform me of any and all contact with her. I told him that I wasn't going to stop him from remaining friends with her as his first wife did. I am beginning to think I should not have said this. I am going to stop here on this. I would love to have any and all input on how we should proceed. I don't want this dishonesty to screw my marriage up. I want us to be close enough that meeting up with J again is never a thought. I don't want him or me to repeat old mistakes. But how?

I'd say you've got a lot of red flags waving around.

Its concerning that he has his own definition of "honesty."

And before you jump into bashing his ex-wife, you may want to think about being in her shoes with a man thats not trustworthy.

My initial impression is that you are with a man that values his personal freedoms and individuality over intimacy within your marriage.

And I don't think J should have ANY place in your H's life going forward -- he's already proven that he cannot be honest in this situation with both you and his ex-wife. His ex-wife was completely justified in asking for him to have no further contact. You tried to give him some trust by letting you know about contact -- and he totally let you down.

I'd be VERY concerned about J -- and I think you're totally justified in snooping.

Good luck

(and whats with the name???? ewwwwww)

I totally agree with everything Lexxy posted.

Sounds like your instincts and intuition are screaming at you to delve deeper into this "J" situation. My advice: Trust your instincts. Where there's smoke, there's fire.

Lori

snotstew,

Please first let me tell you i am sorry you are in such situation, second let me warn you, this is very very typical!!!

I was in a very very similar position when I started dating my now xWH. He had had this gf for less than two years. She had kept it going on as friendship, but made clear she wouldn't mind the sex if it was only a kind of one night stand thing. My husband declined saying he couldn't just "Have sex" with no emotional attachement (of course that was a lie but either way).

While on our first month of being engaged and on a stable relationship he asked me if it'd be alright to let this woman come over to his place because she was visiting town and didn't want to pay for a hotel. He claimed they were good friends, and I decided to leave it up to him, (I was overseas, long distance relationship situation).

He let her come over, the first night he slept in the sitting room, the second night she insisted he shared bed with her, he was stupid, and he accepted.

They had sex the following morning.

The next day he told me they had shared bed, but that nothing appart from "cuddling" (that word still makes me want to vomit nowadays), happened.

I believed him and believed he was so very sincere and sweet that he was crying out of guilt just because he had shared bed with another woman!!!

The rest of the time there he would call me very late at night and inform me he was sleeping in the floor and talk to me for long periods of time. His exgf didn't like that so she kept being nasty to him.

Forward a year after that, I had moved in with him leaving family, career, friends behind, one night after we got married I ask him again what exactly went on that day. He admitted to some petting, but nothing more. Red flags kept comming up on my head, he gets defensive and I leave it alone.

Forward another year after that one, he had been abusive psychologically since the first day I got here, comparing me to his ex and checking out girls while being with me. I am jealous, but never said a thing, I just expressed I thought it was unappropiate to compare me, which he just ignored. I ask again other night, what really went on that day. He repeats the same old lies, but I can feel there HAS to be more. I plead for him to be truthful to me, I had had the worst 2 years of my life while being there, being disrespected and abandoned when I needed him the most. I had just lost our first baby, and he knew I was done, cracked and a complete mess.

He continued denying anything, we stayed up all night, finally at about 6 am he decides to tell me they indeed had sex, there was heavy petting, kissing etc etc.

After that revelation he decided he had nothing left to loose and during 3 more months he let out more important and terrible background information he was holding away from me and that everybody knew, and which had put me in stupid situations and humiliating positions the years before.

snotstew, the "we only shared bed" story is the most used, oldest in the book. I have heard it being told to EVERY female friend of mine, and it ALWAYS ends up being "We shared bed before-after we had sex".

It is the typical, "Yeah and I have a bridge for sale" story.

This man is not being completely truthful, he is not ready for a committed relationship. I think you may have rushed things a bit.

Please be careful out there <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

Thank you to all who have replied. I guess I just needed to know if I should let this go or be aware and concerned for "our" future together. So where do I go from here? Do I confront him again about J and get him to tell all? I have J's email and could (more than likely) get her phone number too...do I contact her to find out what really happened? Do I tell him now that I want him to have no contact what so ever with J? I want him to learn to be open and honest about EVERY little thing that has to do with us and realize that contact with J does effect us. He told me that if the shoe were on the other foot he wasn't so should he'd want to know about what happened in the past before we were married and still dating as long as I had put whoever it was behind me for good. He says he's done that. So once again, I'm asking for input. And once again THANK YOU!

snotstew,

I think your H needs to:

1) Be completely clear with what happened.
2) Cease any contact with this J woman.

When I asked my H about all of this stuff I made sure he felt safe. I had to be nice, sweet, loving and caring, even through the worst lies. I wish I had insisted more about knowing the truth.

I kept my cool when he started heating up getting all puffy and defensive.

He stopped contact with the xOW right before I arrived here. We haven't heard a peep from her, so much for friendship, and I never asked the contact to be stopped because I didn't think things had been that bad.

It is obvious J has no real sense about boundaries, neither your H. They seem to be pretty much into this casual encounter thing.

He has to make the concious decision of stopping, or he will do as he did to his former wife. He'll say he is done talking to J and then go back at it sneaking behind your back.

I am sorry this is difficult snotstew.

Hi,

Don't mean to state the obvious but you have serious Trust/Honesty issues with this man. "J" is not your problem. If it's not "J", it will be somebody else that he "connects" with. You cannot spend 24 hours a day worrying about "J" or anyone else but until honesty issues are dealt with, that is what you will be doing. You will not suddenly convert him into an honest person. He needs counseling. Dishonest people need incentive to choose truth. They also need the guidance of a competent therapist to understand the internal issues that cause them to lie to the most important people in their lives. Will he see a C?

Hello again. Hubby went to see a counselor for over a year and a half after his divorce. He dropped it because he changed jobs and they didn't cover it as well. It was costing lots to see one using the other job insurance as it was. I do think he'd be open to seeing one though. He was also on anti-depressants for about a year after I knew him as well. He has trouble at times sleeping well and takes a sleeping pill on occassion. The reason for the anti-depressants (he told me) was he father had died the April before he had the A in June. He filed for his divorce in July after asking his first wife to leave. I am not making excusses for him here, just giving info so you get a clear picture of things. He is a product of divorce (when he was 2) lived with his mother. His first step parent was an alcoholic. The second step parent seems to be normal except he hasn't worked much the last 25 yrs or so. His mother had affairs on his father and on the second husband. She has remained in this marriage for quite some time now. My H has major trust issues with his mother. He has told me he could never completely trust her because she would always turn any thing he trusted her with around on him at a later date. He wasn't even sure he wanted to play "our" song at our wedding because he thought she'd gain to much information from it then use it against him. Enough said here. I'm starting to see the light I think. Maybe all these old feelings left over from childhood are haunting "our" relationship? Any thoughts on this?

H is really a great person. He's loving and EXTEMELY respectful of me and my children. I know you all would not believe it from what I've been saying today. But to be TOTALLY honest I would have NEVER suspected a thing had he not said anything about he and J eating dinner. My love bank was way full of deposits all the time before this. And I truly believe his is that way even now.

I just can not believe that I've dated this man for over 2 and a half years, thought this marriage would be the best thing that could have ever happened to me and now this. Will this always be hanging around haunting us? I don't want to ALWAYS wonder what he is doing and with whom he is doing it with. Do I have a right to make him accountable to me for everything he does? Do I need to ask to see the bill for the hotel room for the second night stay? And if the hotel bill does not prove he stayed that night either should I tell him he better tell all or else I'm contacting J to find out from her? Do I have a right to do all this? How do I begin a conversation like that? This is horrible and really I just wish I could wake up tomorrow and it all be a bad dream. Help?

BTW For those who wanted to know about my nick...Snotstew is a children's book. It's my favorite.

Honesty, honesty, honesty, one of the true keys to the marriage.

This situation needs to come clean now before its too late. If not, you will be seen as the nagging, jealous wife to him. You have already lost trust in him, and will wonder about every woman he seems close to.

I highly recommend both of you to go to counseling, now. He may not think so, but until the air is cleared, this marriage is off onto a bad start. Even if it is not physical right now, past history shows it could easily be an Emotional Affair.

Have you ever considering meeting J? I would not contact her without your husbands knowing because that will definitely anger him.

Please, get this issue resolved, or you will always wonder and worry. and remember, "Worry is a waste of your imagination!!"

snotstew (Hate to call you that)

I do believe your H childhood experiences have played a great role in making him who he is today. People who grow up in dysfunctional homes learn quickly not only how to create internal relief systems to ease the pain, but also learn how to manipulate in order to get their own needs met. Children in healthy families get their needs met naturally and normally and do not have to resort to manipulation. Products of dysfunctional families do. I don't see any way for your H to overcome his issues without C. Otherwise, like I said, all you will do is wonder if he's telling you the truth. That is no way to live. I wish you the best.