AV,
I am not sure how much more I can help. You have not acknowledged any of the info I have been posting. Here is a few comments regarding therapists and a few suggestions. I hope they help.
It sure makes me sad to see you hurting so much.
Here's the link to that thread:
going crazy's threadSome of the posts from that thread:
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Spacecase:
<strong>GC; 2 things I did. I called the therapists I found in YP and Internet and asked them some questions. Dr. Harley posts the right questions to ask in his article on choosing a therapist.
Another thing that worked was posting here on MB asking for referals to MB-like therapists in my area...I got 2 from here...
AND MB did have a few "Old" names from therapists who sttended their seminars. Told me then they were working on publishing a list, but I imagine that has all kinds of legal/endorsement complications...</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Spacecase:
<strong>I found this, which is interesting while on the subject of Affair Therapists. This is part of an affairs book review:
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> If marriage counselors were emergency room doctors, they would always be asking questions like, "We need to understand why you stepped in front of that car, and why the driver needed you to do it." If they were cardiologists, they would be asking, "We need to understand why you needed to occlude your arteries, and why your spouse wanted you to."
An article of faith, not a fact that anyone has discovered or theory that makes any logical sense, the notion that infidelity always reveals something about the marriage continues to impose on couples demands that no one in any other realm of health care would countenance.
That an affair has occurred obviously means that the marriage was vulnerable to an affair--that the pattern of marital interaction allowed for an affair to happen. That does not mean that the affair is a function of that pattern.
Nothing ever makes an individual trustworthy except his or her own good character. An affair need not show anything wrong with the marriage, but it ALWAYS shows unreliable character--a person who does not keep promises and engages in deceit is (by definition)unreliable. If you are the betrayer, you will never become a reliable partner without reforming the moral callousness that enabled you to use betrayal to make yourself feel better. If you are the betrayed, you make a serious mistake in believing that anything you can do will make your partner more reliable. Yes, you might be able to decrease the partner's unhappiness; but then you will have taken responsibility for keeping the partner happy enough that he or she won't do what they should never be willing to do anyway.
I've seen marriages destroyed by well-meaning therapists who convince partners that something is wrong with the marriage, when there isn't, really--when some individual therapy or moral education for the betrayer could have saved the marriage. I've seen therapists ratify the betrayed person's broken sense of self by telling them they had a role in bringing it on themselves, thus forever warping their understanding of themselves and of the moral demands of marriage.
All in the name of a dogma-both partners contribute-that makes no scientific or logical sense.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"></strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"></font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Spacecase:
<strong>And an even better one:
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><strong> “Well-Meaning Therapists" in chapter 1 of "Divorce Remedy" by Michelle Weiner-Davis</strong>
(It starts on page 29).
This is where Michelle describes the problems traditional therapists have in dealing with affairs, and the whole chapter is devoted to all the different people who might be a part of your life who influence these situations, usually in the wrong manner, and lead to divorce. The section is called "The Divorce Trap"...very good stuff about therapists, and how NOT to listen to well-meaning friends & family.
Reading this, and my experience with 2 traditional family therapists, convinced me that the only way to go are "Infidelity Experts"; Harley people, Weiner-Davis people, etc. there's probably others too.
2 short excerpts:
quote:
...Although it may seem strange, the whole premise upon which traditional therapy is based may not be conducive to helping people work out problems when the going gets tough. For instance, therapists are trained to encourage people to pursue the parts of their lives that will bring personal happiness and satisfaction, even if these goals are at odds with what's best for the marriage, the children, or even the individual in question in the long run. The therapist wants you to feel good and do whatever it takes to make that happen.
quote:
Another significant aspect of therapists' training that makes marriage preservation more challenging is the idea that in order to solve problems, people must first understand what caused the problems. What this means is that if a couple is having marital difficulties, instead of helping the couple identify things the can do immediately to feel closer and more connected, many therapists first gather lots of information about how each spouse was raised. This is unfortunate because research shows that the average time a couple experiences problems before initiating therapy is six years! Six years! So by the time most couples seek help, they are in desperate need of answers. They don't need to become experts on why they are stuck! If therapy fails to offer an immediate sense of relief or hope that solutions are possible, most couples become more despondent and more likely to throw in the towel.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"></strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"></font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by going_crazy:
<strong>I have been doing a little research, found a therapist that was listed in our insurance network and a member of AAMFT, she just called me back and I "interviewed her"
No particular order:
She told me she asks the therapee on what their goal is and wants one of the following answers:
1. do they want to save their marriage
2. do they want to end their marriage
3. don't know
that gave me a red flag there.
I asked if she knew about Harley and started mentioning books he had written, she had never heard of him.
I gave a brief sunopsis of the Harley principles, about emotional needs, love busters. She said "yes, I try to identify what each individual wants in life from their partner, but sometimes I find that they married for the wrong reasons and have different goals, that it would never work.
Asked her success rate with infidelity, she said about 50/50.
Well, needless to say, if I can "convince" my husband to call Steve, he's getting my money, I don't care if it costs twice as much.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />
take care,
L.
<small>[ August 21, 2002, 07:32 PM: Message edited by: Orchid ]</small>
