We just crossed our one year mark in recovery on the day of our nineteenth wedding annivesrary.

You would hope that the day would be filled with some sort of joy but instead there was no celebration, there was no dinner and there was not even a "Happy Anniversary."

The other day my WW had a confrontation with neighbors about a child discipline issue that DID NOT involve our children. They were here to talk. The next thing I know, she's calling them names, swearing, and telling them to get the hell off of the property! This all happened in front of our kids. I know enough of the story to know that my W should NOT have been involved! They handled themselves like adults, no yelling or anything else negative said. We really (W) did not speak after that, except for her TELLING me, "I better not be taking their sides."

On the morning of our anniversary she came and seemed to want to discuss it further and "move on." I am STILL so angry by the whole event! The conversation went something like this:

Her: What can we do?

Me: "As soon as you can go over there and straighten this mess out then we'll talk."

Her: "You're going to take their side and support them? Not once have you asked me what happened!"

Me: "No, there is nothing to support you on. They came here to talk to you about it and YOU lashed out at them. I'm just tired of you not considering my feelings, our neighbors and friends. I've gone a long way over the past year with them (neighbors) to save face, respect and my dignity. You decided to tear it down (again) in 30 seconds without any consideration or discussion with me and our family. I'm tired of walking out of my house and walking down the street seeing it in our neighbor's eyes, "there's the guy that's married to that B#?*h who had the A!"

Her: You just said it all, as far as I am concerned, this is over from this moment!

Something "snapped inside of me" during that episode. I've been able to take her outbursts personally over the past year but seeing it transferred outside the home is to reminiscent of the A. I just no longer want to be a part of her madness!!!

Our neighbors were also affected by the A, as they did not approve (they were also friends with OM). They lost friends on both sides. My W has NEVER attempted to talk with them since the A. I pretty sure it's "mainly" becasue of guilt, but you could never get her to admit it. She "twists" the story into other issues. I on the other hand, have maintained a relationship with them with little problem.

Well, those were the last words we spoke. I feel so drained and tired. To tired to try and repair. I just feel nothing more is going to change. We did give it a hell of a run, at one point it seemed there was no stopping us, it was better than when we first met.

Yes, it started to slide. For me it was when I realized she only seemed to engage in S when she was drunk or had a few. I talked about it with her and she said "that's not true." Since bringing this to her attention, we have only engaged 2 times, MAYBE 3 over the past five months! "I'm tired" seems to be the standard answer.

I think I know what your thinking - is the A going again??? I've had to ask her and myself this. My conclusion, no, I don't think so (98.5% sure). I 've been watching, looking and we have been together in most spare time. So there has been little opportunity.

At this point, I don't know what to do. I'm so tired of the "flare-ups" (a flare-up to me is yelling, name calling, etc). They occur not only with me, but with her family and friends. She's not speaking to her sister for something goofy as well. This was one of her big complaints before the A, "that I never supported her." I've tried and I've tried to support her on various issues, but does this mean doing so even if I think what she says or what she is doing is wrong??? I know we should support our spouse's, but to what point?

These "flare-ups" seem to be worse than what they were pre A and there seems to be more than what I remember. I've blamed and joked with her that she has major PMS. At the same time I'm not joking and have pleaded with her to be checked by a Dr. (she's "near" the menopausal stage) but she refuses to see a doctor. I just want her to verify everything is OK. She thinks as a man, I am quick to blame it on hormones. Maybe I am, I don't know...

The other day I was talking to her about something here on MB. She stopped and said, "I don't want to hear any of this. It brings up a lot of feelings that I don't want to deal with, I don't know how you can stay so involved." I replied, "I only want to give back to those who gave me help when I needed it."

I'm not sure what to do at this point. When the A was going, I felt so compelled to try and bring things back together - to work them out. When I felt the "snap" the other day, it seems like hope and "together" are gone. At this point it only seems right to end the M as I will and CANNOT go through any more humiliation like I did the other day. It seems as though we've put in over a year of trying and still have MAJOR communication problems. Counseling is OUT on her end. She will NOT do it! Does not believe it helps. I have counseled with Jennifer on numerous occasions and other IC's.

Our anniversary was destroyed (again) and she feels she has also put in too much effort without any change. Obviously, I feel the same way.

I'm considering a letter with a final attempt at trying to come to an understanding, but I find myself giving up on several occasions out of frustration. I just wish I had some direction or probe to know what she is feeling???

Any suggestions??????

MITT

What a tough situation you're in. I'm sorry that your love bank is near empty. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

I'm torn on suggestions for you. The usual MB way would be to start by filling out the EN and LB questionnaires, and live by them (kind of like a M bible! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> ).

I'll make the assumption that you and your W have already done this. However... when is the LAST TIME you both filled out the forms for each other?? Remember... our EN's and LB's change, and those forms should be redone regularly - every year it sufficient I believe.

At the same time... it doesn't seem as though your W is willing to keep within your boundaries (by her consistently 'freaking out' instead of changing that behaviour that is an LB to you). I'm sorry that your W isn't willing to see a counsellor. But you have to admit... she's obviously not ready to deal with these emotions yet - she even admitted to that fact!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> I"m sure she just wants it all to go away. Wouldn't that be nice? I think she needs a gentle reminder that that cannot happen. In order to "get over" anything, we must GO THROUGH IT first.

I can see how it is that your W feels as though you are not supporting her. IMO, as long as her decisions/actions are not breaking the law, there is no reason why you shouldn't be there for her. Agreeing with her is a totally different thing though. But you've heard it on here enough times... "would you rather be right or married???". I think this is where you fit in right now.

My H feels similar to me. He often tells me how he is never able to buy anything for himself. He accuses me of not allowing it. Then when I ask him, "what's the last thing you weren't 'allowed' to buy?"... he can't come up with an answer!! Why? Because he HAS been able to purchase these items (within financial reason of course! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> ). What actually happens and how he FEELS are two totally different things. What I need to do is to change my behaviour. My wording of things is fine to me. However, his interpretation of those words makes me, ummm, 'not so nice' in his mind.

As far as being more supportive of your W goes... you have to do whatever it takes to make her feel safe. You need to choose her over anyone and anything else. That's what it's all about, isn't it? If it means that you don't have any friends outside of your M, then so be it. As long as you and your W get along, then that is all that should matter.

Now... if that cuts into some of your EN's... then that's where the POJAing comes in. And if your W is unwilling to work with you on that, then there really isn't much point in saving the M. BOTH partners need to work on it TOGETHER.

I know you already know all of this... but sometimes some reminders help to refocus on what it is that we really want.

Karen

p.s. What did YOU try to initiate for your wedding anniversary? You didn't try to leave it all up to your W, did you? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

Sorry you're discouraged. I think communication is one of the toughest problems to overcome because it involves, well...communcating, which is the problem in the first place.

Topie gave a great response!

I also wondered what you initiated for your anniversary. It would have been nice if your W had done something, but you weren't waiting for her, were you? Was she waiting on you, perhaps?

JMHO

Hi Mitt:
I dont know if I can offer any suggestions but I can say that i understand what you are going through regarding angry outbursts. It is a major LB in a relationship.

My H always seemed to be miserable and it didnt take much for him to flare out in an angry outburst where he would always seem to blame me. When he lied, cheated, and deserted me and the kids, I was devistated and he was quick to say that I was the one who destroyed the marriage. He has been gone 2 years and I am now in Plan B. I have such a peace now that he is not in my life. I still love him but I don't know if it is even possible to rebuild a marriage that was orginally stressful from his temper & perfectionism, and now add on all the pain he has caused me and the children due to his selfishness.

I read a book once about co-dependancy and realized that part of the problem of my H's angry outbursts was me. I allowed him to get angry at me and put up with it. I am a peace maker. During his angry outbursts, I would do anything to correct the problem and have peace, even if I wasnt at fault. What i was doing was enabling him to do it again and saying that his outbursts are acceptable. What I should of done was say to him that his tone of voice is not acceptable, that I would listen to him only when he talked to me with respect and then walk out of the house without trying to resolve the problem. I am sure in the beginning it would cause a lot of problems but eventually he would realize that I would not accept his behaviour.

I wish I could give you some hope or some wonderful advice but I know how tough it is and it takes 2 people trying to make a successful relationship. I imagine your w doesnt seem happy at all in her life if she is fighting with everyone. I can't imagine her having any self respect when the A was out in the open. She probably doesnt forgive herself, therefore doesnt believe you can forgive her also. If your w will not get councelling, maybe she would read some books on Marriage and self help, I did and it opened my eyes more than what any councelor could teach me. You are in my prayers. God bless, Kim...

Hi Karen,

Thank you for responding.

Well let me start from the bottom up. We had plans for the day, but we did not do anything for the ann. as it was also the morning of the discussion I referenced. At that point nothing could be done except discussion along with apologies and I really did not think it was my place. It was short but HOT, so I also felt it was better to "cool" rather than stoke the fire.

I will say that I will / would support my W on just about anything she wants. BUT, I think before making decisions that will affect both of us (or our family), these should be discussed prior to exercising "an option." In this situation, she chose to exercise an option without discussing it and unfortunatley shunned yet another person(s) away from our family including children's friends (their kids are now forbidden to be with ours). This is where I have a big problem...

Unfortunatley W and I just don't live by some of the same standards. I am generally a more passive person letting many things "just roll off" (although I do have 1 MAJOR grudge that I hold <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> )But she is highly agressive and holds many a grudge, sometimes not able to let go of. Never could I expect to see myself like that! I'm not saying she is bad, she is not! Don't we all need to have our own indivduality? Our own self respect? I just could not live my life in someone else's shoes.

In my observation, she has shunned everyone who has had a viewpoint about her A. I think I see this behavior because of guilt and maybe shame. Rather than deal with it head on, it's much easier to say, "I don't like that person anymore" than it is to go up to these people and say, "I made a major error in my life, I'm sorry you were dragged into it but I'm stronger person we're a stronger couple, blah blah blah. I sometimes feel it is a slap in the face to me!

As far as the EN's questionaire. It is WAY overdue. Things have been on such a big slide lately no time seems appropriate. Admittedly, I have not asked her, but I do know she thinks many MB principles are a "little hokey" and does not understand my continued participation. As you can see, we hold a completely different set of values.

I hope this helps answer your questions...

MITT