I am new to this forum, but have communicated with another. I have not yet found anyone who has dealt with a lengthy affair. I will try to keep this as short as possible.

My husband had an affair for five years. To summarize: 1)He lost his job and started a new career 2) He was under a lot of pressure - no excuse 3) A friend who was also a past coworker continued to go out with the "guys" 4) She pursued him - again no excuse 5) The affair began and lasted for five years 6) Husband explains it was an escape and it was easy 7) The day I found out, all contact ended, it has been almost nine months since that day 7) Husband was actually relieved that I found out 8) I did call her husband to let him no what was going on, he said thank you and hung up the phone 9) We have not heard anything from them since.

It's still so hard for me to understand this. We have been married for 17 years. We had a great marriage (or so I thought). I always took care of myself and stayed in shape. We always got along, enjoyed each other and had fun. We had great sex 3-5 times a week. Everybody thought we were the perfect couple. He claims he always loved me. Now he has become somebody I love, but am not in love with. We are still together. It's easier for him to move on than for me. I constantly think about the affair lasting for five years.

They were not in love. They used each other. She was in a bad marriage and was content to have something on the side. My husband used her for an escape from all of his responsibilities and pressures. He was selfish and stupid. He has worked very hard to help us both recover from this, but no matter what he does, it's just not enough.

Is it possible to be involved in an affair for so long without meaning? Any responses to any of this from anyone would greatly be appreciated.

MarieB.

Frankly I don't have an answer to your question. There have been people on here dealing with affairs as long as your. Some much longer. 2Long's W was in an affair for 11 years, mostly EA but PA at the beginning and the end. Usedlongago's W had an affair for 28 years and one of his children turned out not to be his. He found out when this child was in his late 20's. They are still married.

So yes, it does happen and people can recover. 2Long is working on it now.

As for your question, I don't have an answer but I do have a few thoughts. It seems to me that if they were truely "in love" they couldn't have and wouldn't have continued the affair. They would have filed for divorce, especially the OW who was in a "bad" marriage. But, that didn't happen. My guess is that your H didn't love her, and she didn't love him. I will also guess that the sex wasn't even that good, but it was like a cup of coffee in during the day; something to take ones mind off of the issues at hand.

I am not trying to excuse your H, but my guess is that you were always #1 in his book and he had a choice. I realize that this doesn't really solve your problem or make you feel better, but I do think it means your status with your H is and was much higher than his status with you right now.

Short answer, I'm guessing convenience and they thought they wouldn't get caught.

By the way, don't be too discouraged. It takes roughly two years before a marriage fully recovers from this, and certainly a year before you will start feeling better and a bit more confident.

Hang in there and God Bless,

JL

Marie B,

I think you are going to find several, perhaps many, with very similar stories to yours. Mine is almost word for word the same as yours with a couple of exceptions.

1)"He lost his job and started a new career."

My H also lost his job twice during the course of the affair, once at the beginning and once during the affair.

2)"He was under a lot of pressure - no excuse."

WE were under alot of pressure, him without a job, me with a new very stressful job and a very, very sick child.

3)"A friend who was also a past coworker continued to go out with the "guys".

Yep, that's how he met her,,going out with the guys for a drink.

4)"She pursued him - again no excuse."

Yes, no excuse, and in my case, IF that's how it actually occurred, I don't think she had to "pursue THAT hard.

5)"The affair began and lasted for five years"

MY H's "secret friendship" and resulting affair was even longer than that. Probably closer to 10 years. Aughhhhh. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

6)"Husband explains it was an escape and it was easy"

My H also used her as an escape, a refuge from our problems. No disagreements, no problems at her place. Just her undivided attention.

7)"The day I found out, all contact ended, it has been almost nine months since that day"

All contact ended the day after I found out and it's been 4 1/2 years.

7)"Husband was actually relieved that I found out."

My H said the same thing. "I feel sooo much better and like a 1000 lb weight is off my shoulders." Great, off his and onto mine!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

8)"I did call her husband to let him no what was going on, he said thank you and hung up the phone."

I had no one to call that cared. She was already divorced.

9)"We have not heard anything from them since."

And neither have we and for that I'm grateful.

Marie, we have been in recovery for 4 1/2 years, something I didn't think at the beginning was going to be possible. That first year after discovery is a killer. With the new and applied knowledge of MB principles and help from this forum we have survived and thrived.

Welcome to Marriagebuilders. Be sure to read all parts of this site. Learning and using the principles is going to help the recovery of your marriage. You're going to find lots of help here and people you can really indentify with.

Remember, that first year is a toughie. Hang in there and be strong.

<small>[ September 05, 2002, 12:27 PM: Message edited by: Nerlycrzy ]</small>

Marie B. - Would my FWW's affair of 6 years qualify?

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">It's still so hard for me to understand this.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I'm not sure that we (BS's) will ever truly and fully understand. I find that we can understand some of the things that resulted in EN's not being met and can work to change that. The rest is usually something under the heading of "rationalizations" that they use to "justify" the affair while it is ongoing. Once they are clear of the "fog" they usually see those rationalizations as false and deal with a lot of guilt.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Now he has become somebody I love, but am not in love with. We are still together. It's easier for him to move on than for me. I constantly think about the affair lasting for five years.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I don't know from your post how long you have been in recovery, but I am assuming that it is not that long. Your feelings are normal following such a betrayal, but they will change as time goes by. That is, if you are both working on making the necessary changes and fulfilling each other's EN's. Love NEVER starts as an emotional "in love" feeling. It begins with caring for someone, liking to be with them, understanding that no one is perfect but that you like the person regardless of the faults.

Thinking about the affair is normal. But if you have truly forgiven your H, then you need to "let go" of the past as best you can and not dwell on it. Dwelling on it talks yourself into a "taker" mode and inhibits recovery. I know it's not easy, heck, I think about the same thing a lot. I suppose the difference is that I choose to believe the changes I am seeing. That she is with me, not the OM. That she says ILU (never said it during the A) frequently. That she has shown remorse, etc. If I choose to keep the "mistake" ever present, how can I expect the recovery to progress to where we are "in love" again? Realistically, it can't be done that way. I guess what I am saying is that if you love your husband and want to stay with him and build a better marriage, then you have to do whatever is necessary to put the past behind you and start fresh today. If you have made that decision then it is unfair to both yourself and your husband to dwell on the negatives. Start believing that as you both work on your marriage, the rest will come naturally in time.

If it helps at all, my wife and I are 3 months into recovery now. She has gone from a feeling of no love, just liking me as a person, to being in love again. Why? Because we have been following God's commands regarding marriage and the roles of husbands and wives. We have chosen to rebuild and correct what was wrong. It's not "smooth sailing" every day. It may never get to a point where we no longer have any thoughts about the "lost 6 years", but I am convinced from what I have already seen in our marriage and from what others who are much further along in recovery have written, that in some years down the road, we will have a much better marriage than we had prior the affair. And you can too.

Dear JL,

Thank you for your response. Suddenly I find myself feeling desparate to understand fully what the affair meant. It just hurts so incredibly bad. I know things will never be the same. I hate it when people say it can even be better. How do you improve something that didn't need improving?

I do realize the affair was about him and not me. Through counseling and a lot of conversation, that was made very clear. There was nothing wrong with us, and a lot wrong with him. He does take full responsibiltiy and hasn't tried to make any excuses. That has helped.

If my marriage does survive this, it will be without the passion I once had for us. That makes me sad. I know I can never say to him how much in love I am with him. Maybe I can be in love again with him someday, but right now I don't see that happening. The passion has been destroyed forever. I feel like my heart has been shattered and put back together with some pieces missing. I have to learn to live the rest of my life without those pieces, whether I stay married or not.

What is your story, if you don't mind me asking?

Nerlycrzy,

Thank you for your response. It helps to know someone is dealing with a similiar situation, although I wish none of us were in this forum. I can't even imagine 10 years! Boy, can I learn a lot from so many of you.

You have given me hope that it is possible to survive this. I will continue reading the posts. They can only help. I need to listen to ForeverHers and try not to live in the past. That is hard to do. I am already dreading the Holidays. That is when I became very suspicious. I found out on New Year's Eve. I don't think that holiday will ever be the same. There are just too many bad memories that are still so fresh.

Thanks again and I'm glad to hear you are doing well.

Dear ForeverHers,

First, I am sorry that you are going through all of this. Second, I admire your strength in dealing with the affair. The strength is what I find myself lacking from time to time.

You gave great advice about not living in the past. That is still hard for me to accomplish. I found out on New Year's Eve, so it has been almost nine months now. The entire month of December was a nightmare!

I'm sure in time I won't dwell on the actual affair so much. Every month seems to get better as far as that is concerned. However, there are triggers now and then that set me back. I'm already dreading the holidays!

It sounds as if your marriage will survive this. Best wishes and thanks.

Marie:

Yes, 5 years is a long time, but as JL pointed out, I'm dealing with an 11-yr A. It ain't easy, 2 be sure, but the thing I keep reminding myself is that I have 2 learn all I can about Rs and Ms and about myself, if I'm going 2 grow from, or even survive, this experience.

D-day for me was in January, and unlike many here, I haven't gotten my W 2 agree 2 sever contact with her OM even yet. But my experiences with Cing, communicating with my W, backing off from LBing, and even trying 2 plan B for a week in July, have all contributed 2 my education. And that's the point. "Recovery" of your own sel-esteem and love for your H has 2 be something you do yourself, FOR yourself. You can help your H along by discussing things that are on your minds, but HE has 2 "rebuild" himself. You can't do that for him.

I am very optimistic about our future. I think that MOST of my optimism is due 2 the fact that I feel much more self-secure in the past month than I have in the previous 6 since D-day. Why? Well, I relize that my W's happiness is so important 2 me that I'd let her go if that's what she decided she needs. About 3 months ago, I told her this, saying "I can see myself carrying on as a single father if we can't end your EA and work out our problems". My W had always said "I just figured I'd have 2 be alone." After my remark 3 months ago, she actually said 2 me "I realized that I never wanted 2 be alone."

The bumps and ups and downs continued (still do, though not very radically lately), but I'm seeing signs that my W is coming out of her fog and really thinking about what's been said and what's happening in our lives. So that's why I'm optimistic. I can go either way now: Stay M'd and work out our problems, or DV and be ready 2 have a fulfilling R with someone else. But I think I'll "get" 2 stay M'd. And I think I'll enjoy recovery.

This is probably why you hear so often that M can be better after an A. Not because As are "good for" M, but because any trauma has the potential 2 make you a better person, if you choose 2 recover and accept responsibility for the things that you can control or fix.

Take care, it WILL BE worth it!

Marie:

Oh yeah. And 2 answer your Q from my POV:

Q: Is it possible to have an A without meaning?

A: Ol' 2long doesn't believe it's possible 2 have an A WITH MEANING. They're all completely meaningless, self-indulgent fantasies.

<small>[ September 05, 2002, 02:00 PM: Message edited by: 2long ]</small>

Dear 2long,

Thank you for your response. I understand your explanation about how a marriage can be better after an affair. I never looked at it like that. I especially like your remark about it isn't possible to have an affair with meaning. I really needed to hear from those who can understand what I am going through. For some reason, it has been very difficult lately.

I found out about my husbands affair on New Year's Eve 2001. It has been almost nine months now. I really admire your strength. Sometimes it just gets so hard to remain strong through all of this. Everyone who responded has been very kind and encouraging. Thank you. I wish you the best with your marriage.

To have an A affair for that long and not care about/love one another!?!? Hmmmmm, I'm not sure what to think. It's possible that either your WH is lying to you about the depth of his A or they are two really 'cold' customers. I really don't have an answer, sorry.

Marie B.

You said </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">If my marriage does survive this, it will be without the passion I once had for us. That makes me sad. I know I can never say to him how much in love I am with him. Maybe I can be in love again with him someday, but right now I don't see that happening. The passion has been destroyed forever. I feel like my heart has been shattered and put back together with some pieces missing. I have to learn to live the rest of my life without those pieces, whether I stay married or not. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Marie, ever found something dear to you that you thought you had lost? Do you remember how good it feels? Ever reunite with an old very close friend? Do you remember how good it was to feel the memories come back, and feel so close to someone who knew you so well?

Those events lead to passion Dear Lady, they really do. The passion can come back and in an odd way you will appreciate much more this time, because it was lost. I am in no way saying this A was good. I am saying how you and your H learn and grow following the A can be not only good but great. I know you don't trust him, but as Harley points out in his articles we all should not so blindly trust our spouses. THis will take time for your H to show you that you can trust.

The pieces of your heart aren't missing, they just need to be carefully and slowly put back in place. You and your H can do that, but again it takes time. This takes time and processing. If you need to understand why, ask him. I suspect he won't be able to really tell you, especially since this seems to have been an A of convenience.

If you read here carefully, the site espouses two things. You can rebuild your marriage with time and patience, and you can learn to have a better relationship than you had. I realize you think it was perfect before, but something was missing. Perhaps it was something from your H. If that is the case you will now have all of him in a very focussed way. I think you will find that is good. If you need something from him, don't be afraid to ask. If you fear something don't be afraid to tell him.

Marie, this can be done. It just takes time and patience. The forgiveness will come, and the love will return, and then the passion as you discover things you didn't know. How is that going to happen? By talking with your H about your fears, your desires, you hopes, your pain, and in turn having him talk to you. The key is you two must listen to each other and not make judgements. THe feelings you each have are your feelings and they will change as you each share.

I hope something I have said helps.

God Bless,

JL

PS: One of the hardest things to realize, yet consciously we do, is that our spouses are human. That means ultimately you must come to love your H not because he is perfect, but because he is imperfect but is trying to do as well as he can. It is how people overcome their failures that is really the measure of that person.

<small>[ September 05, 2002, 08:03 PM: Message edited by: Just Learning ]</small>

Finding "meaning" in tragedy is difficult. I'm not sure I can give you answers that will feel right to you.

I have been taught this: "all behavior has meaning".

I think your H can possibly be compared to someone who finds out that he can easily embezzle money from the company by juggling the books ... and apparently can do so without being caught (at first). So he justifies taking funds by saying things like... "I deserve this because I've been so loyal and good. I will only take a little bit, then I'll stop." But, he doesn't stop stealing, because the money brings him pleasure, and he feels good when he can buy things he ordinarilary could not afford. He comes to rely on the "little extra" he takes ... and it becomes a part of his life .... as long as he can quiet his guilt. The guilt nags at him, and he feels bad about himself ... so in order to get rid of the bad feeling (the guilt) .... he steals a little more to get those pleasurable feelings once again.

I think if I had not discovered my H's A after 18 months ... it might have lasted longer ... even though he stated he was glad it was over when D-Day arrived.

Immaturity plays a big role in this, I think. Maturely developed ethics would not permit such self-loathing behavior to continue.

It is hard to respect someone who does this foolishness. Having said that .... the actions of reconciliation and responsibility he takes during the first 2 years in recovery can demonstrate his ethical maturation and thereby restore your respect for him.

I loved my H after the D-Day fiasco ... but i sure as heck did not respect him.

Pepper <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />

mgm.,

You are right about one thing. They both are really 'cold' customers. Each one was having the affair for different reasons. They both were very selfish and used one another. When it stopped, they each moved on, no contact. I believe my husband when he sais he doesn't miss "it" or her at all. Personally, I would have a hard time walking away from someone I was involved with for so long, but that's me. My husband has learned a lot about himself through all of this. he is now the person he should have been. It's just a shame he couldn't "find" himself before all of this. Thanks for responding.

DearJL,

Wow! Your post has really lifted my spirit. You give such good advice. I quess it's still too early into recovery for me to see things as clearly as you state. I will read your post again and again. It makes great sense. I feel very lucky to have found this forum because of you and all the others who care to respond. Thanks!

Dear Pepperband,

Immaturity has played a key role in all of this. Your whole analogy about the money really hits home. During the affair my husband ran up a huge amount of debt. I did not find out about the actual total until the day I found out about the affair. Both my husband and the therapist decribed his actions about spending money exactly as you described in your post. Spending the money made him feel good. It was like an addiction. The more he spent, the greater the debt, the greater the debt, the more he spent. Spending money gave him a temporary high. He felt good at the time. Later, when he realized the debt, he felt bad. He didn't like feeling bad, so he shopped again.

Any way, that is all over, thank goodness! The debt still exists, but the spending has stopped. The affair was also like an addiction. That is over as well. The best I can do is try to pick up the pieces and move on. I still have a hard time believing it was MY husband behaving this way. He sure had me fooled for so long. I understand completely about the love but no respect. I am still at that point. I have a hard time believing he was so stupid and selfish. Sometimes I dislike myself for accepting all of this. I don't like the fact that I am always so forgiving. I wish I could be just a little less forgiving. Although, I know in the long run it is best to forgive. Thanks for your response and best wishes to you and for your marriage.

Dear Pepperband,

Immaturity has played a key role in all of this. Your whole analogy about the money really hits home. During the affair my husband ran up a huge amount of debt. I did not find out about the actual total until the day I found out about the affair. Both my husband and the therapist decribed his actions about spending money exactly as you described in your post. Spending the money made him feel good. It was like an addiction. The more he spent, the greater the debt, the greater the debt, the more he spent. Spending money gave him a temporary high. He felt good at the time. Later, when he realized the debt, he felt bad. He didn't like feeling bad, so he shopped again.

Any way, that is all over, thank goodness! The debt still exists, but the spending has stopped. The affair was also like an addiction. That is over as well. The best I can do is try to pick up the pieces and move on. I still have a hard time believing it was MY husband behaving this way. He sure had me fooled for so long. I understand completely about the love but no respect. I am still at that point. I have a hard time believing he was so stupid and selfish. Sometimes I dislike myself for accepting all of this. I don't like the fact that I am always so forgiving. I wish I could be just a little less forgiving. Although, I know in the long run it is best to forgive. Thanks for your response and best wishes to you and for your marriage.

Marie - it sounds as though we have experienced much the same pain - long term affair, huge debt built up over this time, and loss of passion for our WH's.

I would love to talk further to you about how you are coping.

6longyears,

I am sorry to hear that you have a similiar situation. We also have two children, 15 and 12. We have been married for 17 years. This was my husband's only affair. The whole thing makes me sick! We never separated. My husband has been doing everything to make things right. He realizes how wrong he was and the damage that has been created. I have two issues to deal with, first the affair and secondly the debt. I mean HUGE debt!!!! I was in therapy for a year before finding out. It's a long story, but if you want to read it, I can write it. What is your story?

Marie B., I am the BS as well, but I am a man, so I would like to give you my opinion on your situation.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Is it possible to be involved in an affair for so long without meaning? Any responses to any of this from anyone would greatly be appreciated.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Absolutely. For a man. This may be quite sexist of me, but men separate sex from emotion. It is entirely possible that he never, ever loved this woman, and just used her as a f@#$-buddy. It seems to me that he loved you the whole time it was going on.

For most women, I don't think an affair is possible *without* deep emotions involved. You are projecting your female point of view onto him, ascribing to him what *you* would feel in his circumstance.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">He has worked very hard to help us both recover from this, but no matter what he does, it's just not enough.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Well, I don't have the 'luxury' of a WW who gave up the A immediately and 'worked very hard' to recover our marriage, so I can only comment that I am sure he wants this all to go away sooner rather than later, but you have been deeply hurt, and you must heal in your own time frame.

If you want your marriage to last and to heal, let him know that, but that you must heal at your own pace.

If you have not already, please get Surviving an Affair, available on this site.

Please please check with your doctor for a mild Anti-Depressant. They will help you cope with your emotions well. They help you think alot more clearly, and keep negative emotions from taking you over. You won't dwell on the bad stuff as much either. A-Ds were an absolute God-send for me. I had no idea about them, but my doctor heard my situation, saw that I had lost *alot* of weight, and put me on them right away. Within 3-4 weeks, I had a much more objective view of the situation, and hearing my WW tell me how much she loves the OM hurt, but I was easily able to keep my composure. I am able to be there for her, to listen to whatever she has to say. She now feels safe to confide in me about ANYTHING since I don't blow up anymore.

Hang in there, your H is doing his best, and if you give it time and allow him to make it up to you, your feelings will come around! They really will!

Good luck!

NSST