Well...Looks like it's getting closer to finality.

Received a call Tuesday morning from my attorney. He told me that my stbXW was being deposed that evening at 4 PM EDT. He was really hoping that I could be there for her deposition.

On such short notice, I didn't think I was going to be able to be there. But...circumstances went my way (or not, depending on how you look at it). I was able to go.

Upon arriving at my stbXW's attorney's office, my attorney and I went into a private room to discuss matters. I had offered a settlement agreement a couple of weeks ago, even though I think all of you know that DV was NOT on my list of desires. But, hey, you still have to be prepared.

Anyway, her attorney made it a point to give us a counter-offer. I almost fell in the floor. My WW was wanting it all. She wanted me to pay off the mortgage and give her the house, give her half the 401k, and give back to her the half of the savings that I had. She also wanted the contents of the home, and the vehicle that was paid for. Wanted me to assume all the debts.

Where in the h3ll do they get these ideas? She was actually asking for ALL of it! I know that this is a strategy and that they never intend to get what they ask for, but let's be a little realistic, puhleez!

To make a long story short, I said no way. I might give a little on MY offer, but that was all. Needeless to say, that got the "negotiating ball" rolling. We came to a settlement. I can live with it.

Anyway, still had to give jurisdictional depositions. So...the attorneys decided that while we no longer needed the full-fledged depos, that we would go ahead with the formalities. I was then led into the room where the WW was. First time I had seen her in over 5 weeks. The last time being when she showed up at my door crying and talking reconciliation possibly, but then...POOF!...gone again. Looking at her sitting across the table, I still saw my beautiful W.

After the court reporter and the attorneys were finished, we began to leave. I think I shocked them, though. I proceeded to walk around the table and gave my WW wife a hug, and thanked her for the past 14 years. I truly smiled at her. She began bawling like a baby. I left.

I found out today that when she arrived back at her office next door(she works for another attorney in the next building), that she was still crying. Her co-worker remarked that she couldn't understand the fuss. She was getting what she fought very hard for.

She came over that evening(I knew she would <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> ). I gave her my "moving on" letter, and my wedding band. Went over a few little details and such. She asked if I had any idea where I would be moving to. I told her "sure"! I was moving into my new house that would be started immediately when the DV was final. She said she didn't think I would be able to do it that fast. Shocked her a lot when I informed her that I hadn't been sitting here for the past 5 months and doing nothing.

She realized then that I would more than likely be moved in a new home before the property division was settled and final. There are some transfers to be made, and they will take 2 or 3 months. I could tell she NEVER anticipated that.

Her next topic was that she hoped we could remain friends. Sorry..no way, I told her. Can't be that way. Told her that she probably couldn't understand, and that I hoped she never did because then she would have to have experienced what I have. Told her that nobody deserved that. Not even her OR the OM.

For some reason I felt more peaceful about the whole shebang than I expected. Maybe I really am ready to move on. I don't know for sure. For the first time I really felt that letting go was the BEST way to save my M, should I ever desire to in the future. Weird, isn't it?.

I think I have accepted it for the most part. Oh sure, there will probably still be sad times, but now I truly KNOW I will survive. I honestly know that.

For those of you who are close to the same point in your M's, let me say this.....

I know we all wanted very sincerely and deeply to salvage our M's. We fought hard. We gave it all. For the longest time we felt as though we couldn't make it. But...I'll tell you something. The feeling I have now is a whole lot better than I have had since D-day. Why? Because I KNOW I did my best. I KNOW that I could have contributed my part to make it work. I KNOW that I had become the EXACT person that my WW always dreamed that I would be. I KNOW that it is HER loss, and not mine.

I feel peace because I now know.

It's the not knowing that wrecks our emotions. Its the not knowing that causes us to think that we can change something when we "don't know" exactly what we are fighting. It's the unknown that unnerves us. Simple as that.

Everyone here has been a godsend to me. I truly appreciate every word that has been posted in reference to my posts.

My big Sis, committedandlovingit, who shoots straight from the hip with me, told me yesterday that she knew for a fact that there wasn't a man on earth that would have gone as far as I did, and put up with what I have, in order to try and make a marriage work. I cried after she hung up with me because of that comment.

Because I know she's right. Finally.

HCII

Yup, you're a star in my books...

I think you handled things great. I loved the hug. Her reaction is telling, I think. No matter what she's thinking today, there will come a time when she regrets her hastiness. SC posted a great excerpt from Private Lies recently, wish I could recall the thread... talks about how future R's for infidels are so often doomed unless they do the "hard work" of repairing themselves... and that means getting real, real honest about what's happened. The crazy thing is... IF THEY DO THAT... they'll hit that "wall" / "rock bottom" that shakes them to their core.

She may be back on your doorstep yet, my friend. A good friend of mine had his WW go off with his BF... They got Dv'd, and several months later, she was crying to him, "willing to do anything". So yeah, it happens.

But I think you're right... the best way to live going forward is for YOU... when the dust settles, get out and have some fun, meet some new folks, and enjoy them... Who knows what - or who - is waiting!

I'm so sorry it came to this for you but you should be very proud of yourself for handling it all the way you did. You DID do all you could and conducted yourself with pride, dignity and love.

She's going to regret her decisions and is obviously shaky about them already. She is losing a great guy and is going to have plenty of time to reflect on "what could have been."

Good luck to you!

<small>[ September 13, 2002, 11:07 AM: Message edited by: Nerlycrzy ]</small>

hcii:

Ditto JR. I don't post much but lurk constantly and I have been following your story. You are an inspiration to those that need to 'let go' and work on themselves (which is a large group on this forum!). Please stick around and help those that you see needing your expert advise. And yes, it is expert advise because you have lived with the pain, the misery, the fear, the elation, the hope, and finally the acceptance. In other words you are an official expert roller coaster inspector <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> !

Good luck, God Bless, and build that dream home!

Gib

Wow, hcii! You did that PERFECTLY! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Because I KNOW I did my best. I KNOW that I could have contributed my part to make it work. I KNOW that I had become the EXACT person that my WW always dreamed that I would be. I KNOW that it is HER loss, and not mine.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">This is precisely why all of us BSs are here - to be able to look at ourselves in the mirror and know that, even if the results aren't what we desired, we did all we could.

I'm sorry things turned out the way they did, but I'm glad you're at peace with yourself. Your wife may never find that peace.

Stay in touch and let us know how you're doing.

Dave

HCII - I just wanted to say thank you for giving me hope that someday I may be feeling what you are - I know I have given my best also and though it was always one sided with only me trying and him making excuses - Last week I did come the realization that he had given up everything - the kids, house, pets, our life as a family - all because he didn't want to try and put it all back together - and he doesn't want to answer to anyone anymore. Next week I go for my divorce and I hope I handle it the way you did - though I can just see my WS coming up to me and giving me a hug and asking me if I am alright - but I was thinking of decking him at that point.... Good Luck in the future....

hcii,

I am sorry and I am glad. I am sorry it has come to this, but I am glad that you have come to this point. Isn't life confusing?? You have handled this about as well as it can be done. As you say you left nothing in the bag and you did your level best in this case.

Your acceptance of yourself and your efforts will stand you well in the future. I know that there will be down moments as this finishes up, but you will do well and you will succeed in your life of that there is no doubt.

Please keep posting here. There are many that can use your insights and advice.

God Bless,

JL

hcii,

Yes, you did your best to help your W, yourself and your M. Keep us posted...

take care

HCII;
You were a constant source of inspiration and support for me, and I am very, very happy that you have reached this point in your life the way you have: with honor, dignity, and your head held high. A true gentleman. She will be hard-pressed to find another like you.

I'm sure HCII doesn't care to read this right now, but since JR mentioned it, and in case others would like to read it, here's that excerpt from Private Lies:

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><strong>Private Lies by Dr. Frank Pittman</strong>
He has a very good summary of reasons why second marriages between persons involved in an affair very seldom succeed.

Generally he notes that disasters are only inevitable when people use romance to jump from marriage to marriage without a rest stop between. He says that there is something inherently doomed in those marriages that begin as marriage-wrecking affairs.

He noted that in his practice while over half the people who get into romantic affairs end up divorced, only one-fourth marry the affairee. It is likely that over three-fourths of these affair marriages end up in divorce. He says that there is a greater likelihood that the divorcing partner will be back with the original spouse in five years that that the romantic affair will be a stable marriage at that time.

He gives 12 reasons for this phenomenon:
• Intervention of reality
• Guilt
• Disparity of sacrifice
• Expectations
• General distrust of marriage
• Distrust of affairee
• Divided loyalties
• The nature of infidels
• The nature of affairees
• Romance
• Scapegoating the betrayed
• Unshared history

Out of 100 couples, (Pittman’s sample in his book private lies)
He said 50% of affairs couples divorced.
But, only 12% (12) actually married OP.
And then 75% of those failed (12*.75)= 9
Thus only 3 married betrayers are left
These are the defects he lists for marriages between the spouse and the OP.

1) The intervention of Reality: Divorce in these marriages tends to take place very early in the marriage. During the affair, the infidel and perhaps the affairee are in a state of intensely stimulating unreality. The second marriage itself seems to be a switch that throws the lights on and illuminates the mess that has accumulated. It is as if the romance had seemed real, while the divorce didn’t. Only after the remarriage did the divorce become real enough for the lovers to see that it was all a horrible mistake. The affairs that become marriages typically were so intense they were never questioned at all. During the divorce, reality never set in sufficiently to let the romance be evaluated and questioned. The romance was so romantic on one ever got around to asking if it was sane.

2) Guilt.. People who have wrecked a family have inflicted much pain, and they have a lot they could feel guilty about. As reality sets in, they see many things they were overlooking. They may have felt no guilt during the affair and divorce, and the guilt they feel after the romantic marriage may come as a surprise to both of them. It is generally assumed that people who don’t permit themselves to be happy must be feeling guilty about something and are unhappy as a way of punishing themselves for their misdeeds. One aspect of guilt is the reluctance to enjoy ones ill-gotten gains. Another aspect of guilt is the urge to return to the scene of the crime and in some way make amends. As a romantic newlywed resists the joys of the ex-mate who was deserted so blithely, the new mate can feel disoriented and betrayed.

3) Disparity of sacrifice... Divorces are expensive luxuries. Whatever the financial cost, the emotional cost is far greater. Anyone after losing that much, will be drained, exhausted and depressed. It is particularly difficult when the exhausted survivor of a debilitating divorce marries the triumphant winner of the struggle. If the romantic partner is marrying for the first time, and especially if the courtship has been treacherous and insecure, the new mate will be ecstatic. A new couple may feel a disparity in what had to be sacrificed to bring them together. The partner who has never been divorced may have difficulty understanding the complexity of emotions toward the previous family.

4) Expectations.. Then there is the feeling that anything that cost this much emotionally had damn well better be worth it. The greater the sacrifices, the greater the expectations from the new marriage. Now that the promised land has been reached, it should flow with milk and honey. But instead, the new couple are just 2 tired warriors with no fight left in them. Whatever these people were expecting, the best they are likely to find now is the ordinariness of real life, the dubious peace between glorious battles. The more people enjoy the battles involved in wrecking and escaping marriages, the less they are likely to enjoy the business as usual of the new marriage that was the destination of it all.

5) General Distrust of Marriage.. Of course, anyone who has been unhappily married is likely to develop a strong distrust of the institution of marriage. People whose marriages fell apart during affairs are likely to end up distrusting marriages rather than distrusting affairs. People who distrust marriage have a very hard time being in one.

6) Distrust of affairee...It might seem appropriate for someone to go out with them, or even to marry them, but not quite appropriate for someone to have an affair with them. Affairs are considered dishonorable acts, and people who feel guilty for having affairs believe that they are dishonorable and their partner must be dishonorable too.

7) Divided Loyalties...During the affair and the divorce, the romantic couple isolate themselves. It is not only the betrayed spouses who are erased from awareness, but also the children, the families, friends, anyone who attempts to pull the romantic couple from the quicksand of their affair. But after the remarriage, there may be a longing to reestablish connections with families and friends and this may be more difficult than expected. Each close relationship and some that were amazingly casual may have to be renegotiated in view of the hurt caused to others.

8) The nature of infidels.... People who get themselves into affairs have some specific characteristics that must influence the course of their subsequent marriages. Each kind of infidel is different. Most of those who end up marrying an affair partner are romantics who drift hypnotically through this romantic high without taking much responsibility. Romantic remarriage seldom works, not only because of the unrealistic nature of romance, but also because of the reality-avoiding nature of romantics.

9) The nature of affairees.... Affairees want whatever they want from a relationship, just as everyone else does, but what makes them unusual is that they seek their goals among the married rather than the single. They choose partners who are not in position to marry them, and who are engaging in the relationship at great risk. People like this are clearly angry with marriage, and perhaps with the opposite sex. They believe marriage doesn’t work, and they demonstrate that by breaking up another marriage as they find a partner for themselves.

10) Romance... People who believe in the chemistry of romance don’t bother to learn much about the physics of relationships. When the romance begins to fade, romantics know little about how to solve those problems that they have relied on romance to transcend. It is painful to watch a romantic relationship dissolve. It happens so suddenly, and so totally. These people have already demonstrated that they would rather get divorced than learn physics, so it is far easier for them to follow the same pattern.

11) Scapegoating of cuckolds... During the affair and divorce, the romantic couple conspired to convince each other that the defective marriage was the fault of the cuckold. To acknowledge otherwise, now that remarriage has taken place, seems a betrayal of the rescue fantasies that fed the romance.

12) Unshared history... Even if the new marriage survives all of these obstacles, there is one further characteristic of all second marriages: The absence of a shared history that brings familiarity to relationships that began earlier in life. If a romantic marriage has wrecked a previous marriage or two, the history of the relationship is painful to both partners, and possibly somewhat embarrassing to others. The new partners keep thinking about it and justifying it, but it is hard to talk about lightly, in the familiar, safe manner of people who can tell their old war stories without guilt. However intense their commitment, people who share a guilty past aren’t totally proud of their new marriage.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">

My W is number 9

J.R.,

Don't know about the star, but I sure feel like that I've earned my "stripes".

NC,

I really wished that I had more in me, though. But...I guess we all have limits as to what we can and cannot do.

Gibby,

I'll still be here. Maybe not as often. I have to try to reciprocate what has been given to me. I couldn't do it any other way.

2Long,

Nahh...Not perfectly. I do know that I did my best. Perfect to me would have had a different outcome. Something like one would see in the movies.

siSF,

Yes, the peace that we all try to find is inside us. If only WS's could actually see that we sacrifice OUR peace, and sense of well-being, for them. What an amazing sacrifice we make. With no promises of rewards. Now THAT is truly a sacrifice!

maw,

Hang in there. It does get better. I think we all have to experience the pain, in order to receive the true pleasure. We wouldn't appreciate if it happened any other way.

JL,

Man, I read your posts with so much enthusiasm. What great insight you have. You have been a tremendous help to me.

H2BP,

Now, I can only hope that someday the WW will wake up and help herself. Even if I am no longer with her, it would be a shame if SHE didn't become a better person after all of this. What a waste it would be, after all the pain that has been suffered for her.

Spacecase,

Now I'm at a loss for words. (((((SC))))). But... I do think you have that reversed. Even though I know that I did all I could, and am accepting of my outcome, I wished that I could have been a success story. That would have been a true inspiration to everyone.

Ya know, deep down she knows what she has done, but she hasn't "comprehended" it yet. I truly believe that she senses this as the only way. At least today.

I did ask her what the 3-day, teary-eyed, remorseful, wanting to still "be close" was about 5 weeks ago, and then disappearing. She actually told me that she was indeed serious those 3 days. But then, she doesn't know why, but it changed. Told me then that she returned to that feeling briefly, and now concedes it wouldn't work out.

Major fog and confusion. I really, really hope she gets straight.

HCII

hcii:

"Gibby,
I'll still be here. Maybe not as often. I have to try to reciprocate what has been given to me. I couldn't do it any other way."

Then we've GOTCHA. For a long time, I might add!! perhaps 2long?

"2Long,
Nahh...Not perfectly. I do know that I did my best. Perfect to me would have had a different outcome. Something like one would see in the movies."

But that $h!t ain't real!

"Now I'm at a loss for words. (((((SC))))). But... I do think you have that reversed. Even though I know that I did all I could, and am accepting of my outcome, I wished that I could have been a success story. That would have been a true inspiration to everyone."

This is where you're selling yourself short. You ARE a success!!! One day, maybe your W will be 2, but YOU are NOW. Don't forget that.

"Major fog and confusion. I really, really hope she gets straight."

We all do. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />

Oh....Wanted to throw out a little bit of irony...

Final papers will probably ready around week after next. The week of the 23rd.

September 23......Our anniversary.

Imagine that.

HCII

HCII:

You are truly a gentleman. It's great you could finish off with such dignity. As you rightfully point out, knowing that you did your best and being at peace with yourself is the most important thing. Your STBXW has lost a wonderful person. I hope you move on to better things and hopefully there's someone waiting for you, out there. Thank goodness there were no children involved.

Good Luck to you.