Hi SS
"So, wait it is. Hard, isn't it. "

Very!! Particularly as this morning I woke up feeling a bit low- no reason just one of those days. I had thought to get a builder in to quote for the work I'd like done on the house but feel unsure again so back it is to waiting and doing nothing. I'm sure god is teaching me something in all this- patiience in dollops!!

In the meantime have had an email from H with a list of the things being sold in the castle and the price the buyer is prepared to pay. Its really hitting home to me that this is the end as far as our family home is concerned!!

Hope all is well with you and your family.
Jante

Hi J,
Family is - OK. Had problem with my 16 year old last night. Ended up hurting W's feelings. Think all is ( almost) well today. Hope it will be really all well by tonight. I still make mistakes - some days it seems like more than my share.

I have been thinking today about the pain we go through in life. I have talked about it as necessary for our growth, but oh how hard it is to take it and not give it back. I am sorry you started out having a down day. It is hard to wake up to that. You may not see this until Thursday morning, I hope sincerely that you wake up feeling much better.

Seems there is so much hurt on the board today. I wish I could help people more, but I should be content with the time and talents given me.

I hope your Mum continues to do well.

Did you ever get the card from T, and if so, was it a pretty mild card?

SS

Hi SS , sorry to hear that there was an upset in your home- but thats what living with teen agers is about as you keep reminding me!!
Mum is doing very well I hope to see her in December if not before. T's card never arrived so no idea what it said . Spoke to him last night about the sale of furniture, he was insistant that I should have a say in it all as its "our furniture". We agreed anyway so no problems there. Hes coming up at w/e as normal. Just trying to plan something for myself to do on the saturday which I can open up to him and boys if they want rather than the revers which is the norm.
Jante

Hi J,
I thought I would say some more about comments you make to H.
I believe he must think of you sometimes. Everyone doubts themselves at times. He is doing what is wrong, and God must bring it to his mind also. He has to ask sometimes "would she ever take me back" or even perhaps " I don't think she would ever want me back." We don't know his thoughts but he has normal doubts and fears.

So, I suggest making comments that will let him know how you feel, and when he thinks, he will have something to go on. Sometimes the stories around here report that the WS considered going back but figured the BS would never take them back.

I also thought that he hates others to think he cannot do something, so it could be put to him as a challenge, it may help him to actually do something, rather than just think about it.

That's why I suggested comments along these lines:
" You know T, the boys want their dad back, and I could even be persuaded to take my H back. As smart as you are, I bet you can figure out a way to make coming back work for all of us." As always, you would have to asjust it to your way of speaking.

As reported by you before, it can even be fun. This is just to keep you thinking.

Here are some ideas for the weekend, and I'm sure they would cause H to wonder.

1. water ski
2. take up motor cycle racing
3. bungee jumping
4. skydiving
5. get your pilots license.
6. Dye your hair bright orange.
7. Wear the spotted socks.
8. Announce you are running for Prime Minister.

I'm sure you can think of better ones than this, I just wanted to get you started. I was wondering what the boys would say if you asked them about #8.

SS

Hi SS , thanks for making me smile <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> .Now to your ideas for the w/e!!

1. water ski

nearest place is 100 miles away in the Lake District where I went sailing in the summer- I think that made him think but I'm scared of speed so water ski'ing isn't my idea of fun.
2. take up motor cycle racing

Ditto about speed- though I wouldn't mind a ride on a motor bike and A would love the idea!!
3. bungee jumping

UGHHHHH!!
4. skydiving

Not so sure about this either but would like the idea of a ballon ride - have even got an advert for that

5. get your pilots license.

That would take rather more money than I am willing to pay out

6. Dye your hair bright orange.
Already done this one!!And cut it very short having had it very long.

7. Wear the spotted socks.
MMMMM Thats a possibility.
8. Announce you are running for Prime Minister.

Not while I'm raising three boys on my own do you know what hours are involved in UK Polotocs!???

SS I know these were only to et me thinking and you didn't expect serious replies but thought I'd comment anyway.

I was thinking more in the way of suggesting a long walk in a beautiful valley near us before winter rain sets in.

Or as A missed out on pottery making perhaps a repeat of that for all of us. It was great fun.

Will let you know my choices in the end. Am also giving reflection to your comments on ways of approaching T over his return. Am anticipating being able to say something while up at Levan in a fortnight.

Thanks again for your time.

Jante

You made me laugh too !

Still laughing !!!!

I sought some adventure in my youth, but am pretty mild now.

I wish you a very good weekend. I am still praying for your family, and I hope the good Lord takes care of all of you.

I spent the morning at a funeral - for the father of what was the best friend of my youth. It makes one think. Perhaps it would do T well to attend a funeral, but I hope not his fathers yet.

Don't be afraid to make him think, it couldn't make things any worse. ( not in any way I can see.)

SS

Glad I made you laugh SS.
Well H was an hour and a half late arriving due to problems on the trains- and yes I did go and collect him. Didn't do anything that I had considered as the weather was miserable. Instead talked with H for an hour about the furnishings at the castle and how we were going to divide them etc and then after lunch went to look at kitchens together!!!
When we returned he was telling me of his plans and OW's possible plans to sell her house. I asked if they were planning to buy together but he said it wasn't something they had discussed. He went on to moan about working in London. I made a passing comment about being surprised he'd stayed that long as he always refused to let me move to London in the past when he commuted for 3 years. I said that obviously B meant more to him than I ever had!! Naughty I know but it slipped out. H reared up and said situations change but he wasn't going to discuss it. I just said I had no intention of discussing it but was only passing a comment on his mention about London. He then changed the subject.
Well time was up then and he left or london cheerfully. Two more w/e and we will all be staying in the Castle for a last time. Hes agreed to a bonfire party to burn old furniture that isn't worth doing anything else with, and to inviting old friends and neighbours round.
Jante

Hi J, hope today went well for you.

He went on to moan about working in London. I made a passing comment about being surprised he'd stayed that long as he always refused to let me move to London in the past when he commuted for 3 years. I said that obviously B meant more to him than I ever had!! Naughty I know but it slipped out. H reared up and said situations change but he wasn't going to discuss it.
If he moans about London again, that is where you say " Well, we can arrange for you to live here and you could find another job, the boys would like to have their dad back". Then laugh and say, "Honestly T, some things have simple solutions" and change the subject.

Actually, it could mean the opposite, it could mean that you meant more to him, and he wanted you to have a better life than living in London would be. Living apart long term is not good for the health of the marriage or the family. He could have realized that this led to his downfall, but I don't know. I often speculate about him but I don't really know about some things.

W and I had picnic last night ( we went to a park in town close by) and discussed your family. She said she doesn't know how you have had the patience to do what you have done. She also said that you must be a very strong person. I had to agree with her. I hope you can continue to stay strong in a very difficult part of your life. One of the things W asked me was " what do they talk about when he visits." I suppose this ( above) is one of the things.

I recall the story of King Saul and the prophet Samuel at Gilgal( 1 Sam 13.) Saul was told to go to Gilgal and wait for Samuel to come to him. Samuel would offer sacrifice to God for the success of the armies of Israel in an upcoming battle. Saul waited 7 days and Samuel did not come. Many of the people began to leave - they were impatient. Saul thought that something had happened to Samuel and he took it upon himself to offer the sacrifice, something that only the ordained priest should do. Samuel came as Saul was finishing and asked what was going on. Saul replied that since things were falling apart, and the people were leaving, he was just trying to get on with what was supposed to happen. For this, Samuel told Saul that God would remove him and get a King that could be obedient to God.

I don't know exactly what is going to happen in your life. I don't think you do either - yet. I do believe you know God is in charge and is helping you. I just wanted to help you to have a little strength. If you feel strongly to do something, then do it. If you feel to wait, then wait until God teaches you what to do. Never try to second guess God. Always have faith in him for he never makes a mistake.

Two more w/e and we will all be staying in the Castle for a last time. He's agreed to a bonfire party to burn old furniture that isn't worth doing anything else with, and to inviting old friends and neighbours round.

I have had a few thoughts after reading this. ( did you mention it before, I can't remember?) There may be opportunities to be alone with T, I am sure that brings ideas to your mind. I recommend that you pour out your heart to God in prayer and then follow the promptings that come to you. I know that sometimes it is hard to understand just what he (God) wants. We have so many doubts and fears that it is hard to hear what he is telling us. I will pray that you will know what to do and have the strength and courage to do it. Perhaps you will feel that you must still wait, if so, have faith enough to do that. Perhaps something else will come to mind. I believe that if you exercise your faith, you will know what to do when the time comes. I will fast again for you both on Sunday the 13th. I hope and pray that the Lord with bless you with what you need to know, and that he will soften T's heart.

SS

<small>[ October 05, 2002, 06:09 PM: Message edited by: still seeking ]</small>

Hi SS, wish I was able to come up with tthe correct quick response when H is here but they never seem to slip off the tongue as they should

"W and I had picnic last night ( we went to a park in town close by) and discussed your family. She said she doesn't know how you have had the patience to do what you have done. She also said that you must be a very strong person. I had to agree with her. I hope you can continue to stay strong in a very difficult part of your life. One of the things W asked me was " what do they talk about when he visits." I suppose this ( above) is one of the things. "

I find it strange to think of people I have never met discussing my m. I don' t think of myself as particularly strong , just some one who gets on with dealing with the life I've been dealt. And I have always considered myself inpatient!!
As to what we talk about, many of the things we have always talked about - without the rel anf feelings part. We discuss our children, our plans, TV we have seen, T tells me about shows he has seen in London, and even as you see occasionally about OW. He also talks a lot about his job situation. What is happening now with the end of the contract is something that happened frequently through our marriage and so he is used to sharing his hopes anf fears about it. I realise that at present time I am meeting some of his EN's while OW is meeting others. still find it hard not to do so.
Hope you and family have had a truly blessed w/e
Jante

Hello, Jante,
See you have been thinking again. Hope you are happy today.

wish I was able to come up with tthe correct quick response when H is here but they never seem to slip off the tongue as they should
It's easy for me to sit in my office and think of things all day long and then type them up like I am witty and smart. I too spend half my life saying "why couldn't I think of what to say when they were here."

I only give suggestions to try and help, don't feel bad about it. You have years of conversation patterns with him, it's hard to change that even with what has happened.

I find it strange to think of people I have never met discussing my m. I hope I have not offended you, just think of it this way. SS and his W care about me enough to try and help. And -you don't really think I am smart enough to come up with all of this by myself do you?

I don' t think of myself as particularly strong , just some one who gets on with dealing with the life I've been dealt. And I have always considered myself inpatient!! I can see that you were once impatient, but I can't agree that you are still. And I would comment further but it would cause you to blush, and being shy myself, I don't want to do that to you. ( not today, at any rate.)

As to what we talk about, many of the things we have always talked about - without the rel anf feelings part. We discuss our children, our plans, TV we have seen, T tells me about shows he has seen in London, and even as you see occasionally about OW. He also talks a lot about his job situation. What is happening now with the end of the contract is something that happened frequently through our marriage and so he is used to sharing his hopes anf fears about it. I realise that at present time I am meeting some of his EN's while OW is meeting others. still find it hard not to do so. You are meeting some very important needs, and I believe that she is not meeting these, or he would not need to have you do it also. This is basic stuff, this is one major reason why we marry, and it is important to him. Perhaps it would be insightful to him if right in the middle of a conversation you would just say " T, I have always enjoyed talking to you like this, I will miss it after you Dv me." and go on, but it is not a natural thing and would be hard to do - as you have already said.
( later) I had much more come to mind to say about this, but find I still have a strong feeling just to wait, and not say any of it. I thought I should tell you that.( later insert finished)

We had a nice weekend, not to much outside work this week, ( although garden will continue another month at least, as it is warm here,) so I got to relax somewhat.

I have one other request for you to consider. Do you think you could put a wardrobe in that shed?

SS

<small>[ October 07, 2002, 10:12 AM: Message edited by: still seeking ]</small>

Hi SS

"I have one other request for you to consider. Do you think you could put a wardrobe in that shed? "

???????????????????????

Jante

This would be the shed in heaven with the trap door, I like to think ahead.

See, I realized I probably would not be able to speak to you once you were all setteled in to your new home up in heaven, and by then it would be too late to ask, so I thought I would ask now. I hope it's not too much to ask, us being friends and all.

It has come to me that now you will probably want to reach through my monitor and wack me on the head, so I resolve to be away from my desk until you settle down a little bit.

SS

<small>[ October 07, 2002, 11:22 AM: Message edited by: still seeking ]</small>

Hi SS must be the american sense of humour- still don't have a clue what you talking about. I certainly hope that I'll speak to many of my new christian friends in heaven who I never got to speak to in person on earth.
Jante

When you go to heaven, you will have a HUGE (and very nice) home, with a very large yard. You will need quite a big shed to keep all the yard things in. I was wondering if you could put in a trap door in the floor of the shed so I could come visit, and also, if it's not to much to ask for, a wardrobe would be nice. Perhaps A or one of the other boys could bring me a bit of someting to eat from time to time. I would be willing to help mow the lawns, but as there will be no weeds in heaven, I would not have to weed. ( this is sounding better all the time.) I am sure it would be nice for me to get away from the heat from time to time - hence the trap door in the floor.

No, it's not you, it's me. Some days I get into these moods and I just won't leave it alone.

Now you can wack me, I'll even sit still and take it like a man. Please get it over with, the waiting is killing me.

On a more serious note, yes, I am sure we will be ablel to visit there and I believe we will have more time to do it, Heaven being what is is. I hope to see both you and T ( and of course the boys) there someday. ( I hope I don't need to come through a trap door to get there, somehow I think it would be hard to do anyway.)

Well, hope I cleared up the confusion that I caused. Please forgive me, and don't tell all your friends how bad I really am.

SS

Thanks SS you made me laugh which as I've been having a bad day with D again was much needed. Trouble at school yet again, I have told him and his teachers that if he doesn't improve and behave in all lessons between now and half term then after half term I will go and sit with him in any lesson in which he misbehaves! That may stop his antics!!!
Jante

I am sorry you are having problems with D. If it is any help, I was that way quite often in school, and my W says if she gets another 20 or 30 years with me, she expects to have me quite well behaved by then.

( told you I was in a mood today)

Not all boys do this, and it makes it worse that he does not have his dad at home. Some boys are worse, I won't say what I did that caused an explosion at school. In this day and age, it would probably have me spending time in jail. Then, it was a prank. I am not sure why I did those things but I have a soft spot for boys with this kind of trouble. I don't know if your D is as bad as I was, but I agree that something should be done. I think your solution is a good one, and you should do it if it comes to that. He should know that he can chose his actions, but not his consequences to them. I had almost this same discussion with our son S, age 16 last week. He is not doing well in school right now, and he was yelling at my W when she spoke with him about it. I wouldn't stand for it, and he got angry with me also. I suspect this is one of the problems you are having with D, he is not respectful of you.

Well, perhaps it is his name, and really not his fault. ( see, I haven't quit yet, now you won't take seriously any thing I say.)

I believe you have a good solution to this problem, I probably ought to leave you alone today, I have caused enough trouble already.

Any wardrobe would do, I am not to particular.

SS

Thanks SS and yes I think my offer to sit in class with him will do the trick at least at school but yes he is disrespectful of me at home a lot as well.

Re the wardrobe, it just so happens that with the move from Levan I will have a spare rosewood edwardian wardrobe too large for my purposes, I'll have a word with tthe Boss about having it installed for your use!!!!
Jante

I trhink you got the better of me in that exchange after all. A real wardrobe, fancy that, now I don't know what to say.

I don't mean to make light of what you are going through with D. It can take a lot of energy out of us to cope with these things. I hope that he can apoligize and help you more. Right now, you need help, not someone to fight with. He should be an example for the other boys, but he knows his dad should be his example too, and Dad is not doing as well as he should right now.

I usually include all of you in my prayers but will include D in my fast this weekend also. I know he (D) has agency, but God still has power to help. I was a little off center today, but I still care.

SS

Hi SS thanks- your fast and prayers are much appreciated. Well a peaceful day with D today he did school detentiona nd has been pleasant with me since coming home.
Found a job that would suit T on the internet last night- within commuting distance of here, and emailed it to him. He rang and thanked me this morning and said he would look into it. It will be a pay cut to what he is on at the moment but hes at top of scale and the salary fpor this new job is still a good figure. Will pray he gets it and moves at least nearer to here. He has mentioned he looked into buying land in Derbyshire to self build so I'll see where this goes.
Jante

Hi J,
Neither you nor I know where this will go, but I think you should explore every thing you can think of. I know that God expects us to do all we can. ( then he does the rest)

I encourage you to continue with things that come to your mind to do for him.

I am glad D is better today. Nothing like detention to get his attention. BTW, you will have these bouts with the boys on and off until they have their own children Then they will call you to say "thank you for not killing me when I did that." Actually, since you are the Mum, they will just thank you for loving them.

This is so odd for me, no questions come to mind, no real advice. Wait.

Wouldn't it be something if T took that closer job. I know by now you won't get your hopes up, but I wish some success to help your faith.

I hope you are doing well, not just getting by. You seem to be in good spirits.

(later) When I keep saying wait, I don't really mean YOU should wait and not do anything, I mean that I don't have any strong feeling of what to say, thought I would add that for clarity.

SS

<small>[ October 08, 2002, 01:36 PM: Message edited by: still seeking ]</small>