Lex, Good to hear that you're around. Well, I "made" it through Sunday somehow...one of our "couple" friends invited me over to brunch followed by apple picking with the kids followed by dinner and home-made apple pies...didn't get home until 9:20...it really did help me to get through the day knowing H was coming home at some point. Did come home to a message from him that he was looking for us...he called my MIL to find out where we were, etc. etc. Anyway, I waited before calling him. Had D call. Then she gave me the phone. I took it. Big breath...

And I DIDN'T REACT. DIDN'T ASK HIM how his trip was...he sounded pretty sick on the phone. Didn't ask him anything. He asked if he should come over. I said nicely that D was in her pyjamas and that I would prefer not. I ended the conversation quickly and hung up.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">What are you worried about? That he might come home and say he doesn't want you? Well sheeeeesh -- is that something you haven't heard a million times this past year????
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Lex, I'm not as worried about this as I am that he was with HER. That's the truth I can't face or perhaps don't want to believe...he left so secretly, didn't want to leave a contact number, told a few people he needed time away to think yet his time away has changed so many things. I am much less hopeful and in ways, much harder inside myself. The reality that he left us behind so that HE could enjoy himself angers me and in a way, I wish he had been gone permanently.

My D was much more peaceful and happy. Of course, in many ways, I don't believe he deserves us anymore.

I really don't want to see him. I don't want to see his tan. I don't want to hear his voice. I don't want to look in his eyes.

Over the phone, I was controlled. In person, I don't know if I can maintain my resolve.

Hope you're doing okay.

Terri,

No it isn't just you that gets the 'get over it already' attitude.

In my case people think I am way over it, because I am moving on in my life. But nothing will make me get over the emotion one second quicker than I NEED to take.

I was talking to my MIL recently, and she said "Oh, well, as long as you are doing okay." I looked her in the eye and said "I am NOT doing okay, but I have to LOOK that way for the kids. I am still hurting over this and I will probably do so for a while yet." She had such a SHOCKED look on her face....like "What???? She HAS to be over it by NOW!" - Well NO I don't, and neither do YOU!

This is a journey that we all take at our own pace. Trying to ignore it only delays the process of grieving. In my opinion, if people give you that attitude, just don't bother trying to talk to them about it at all. If they ask how you are doing, just say "Fine". That is all those sort of people want to hear anyway.

And then, come here and let us be your balcony. Those who have not been through this just don't get it.

Love and light,

Jacky

Hi Nina, Thanks.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> If they ask how you are doing, just say "Fine". That is all those sort of people want to hear anyway.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">You're so right about this one.

Take care.

Update...he sounds cold in his email. His trip hasn't changed anything. In fact, he's probably more determined.

Boy, the pain just gets worse.

Terri,
I really thought I responded on this thread Sat. but it doesn't look like I did.

Your H keeps talking like he is determined, but he doesn't DO anything legal. I can't even guess what his trip was about.

At some point it is likely that guilt will kick in as well for him. And he may think he may as well go ahead with continuing separation and/or divorce because "you'll never get over it." Which, is among those most frustrating WS utterances because it makes the lack of reconciliation the BS's fault without giving them the chance to get over it.

Does your H's trip change things for you? Do you still want to keep yourself at the point where reconciliation is possible for you if it became what he wanted? If so, keep at that Plan A. Kill him with kindness--he can't target you as the bad guy, except for past actions, nothing current.

No lovebusters for you. If he saw her, you don't know what her attitude was, but you can hope it was less than wonderful all the time <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> .

Hi Lor, You sound so good...too bad you have to come back to my sorry soul...but you do keep us going.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Does your H's trip change things for you?</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">No, I still pray for my marriage. There's a small part of my heart that still harbours hope for my marriage. However, his trip has just changed ME. Kind of like a milestone for me. That acceptance phase that starts to become reality without you realizing it.

I still love him Lor BUT...reality kicks me in the face.

My love isn't enough for him anymore which he's pointed out many times.

And another one of my fears...she's better...a wonderful person, caring, loving, all in the ways he's missed it from me. I've never seen the OW or met her. Just talked to her cold voice on the phone.

Pain keeps getting worse...

A friend of ours that works with my H emailed me today. He told me H got to work at 5:00 a.m. this morning. He said he couldn't talk to H at work about his trip because H didn't want anyone knowing about his trip and because very few people know about our separation at work.

He did mention that H became sick after eating fish. Wonder if he was at work early because of the time difference between here and Yugoslavia?

God, I feel like calling her right now. Stop me.

Terri,
Don't call her. It wasn't very satisfying for you the last time was it? In a way it gives her power over you, moreso if he was with her, because she becomes aware that she is getting something you want--his attention.

You know I've seen my H's FOW recently again. And, there are people who've told me she's a "real sweetheart". So, I know she can be nice. She certainly had enough of something to keep my H going back to her for 18 months. Even I can see she's attractive, eye-catching, even if she is a bad dresser <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> . She's a nurse, so apparently she's got a few brains and some compassionate skills.

But so what?

She made really bad, immoral choices, had sex with a married man, is of low character, wanted him to leave his wife, his kids. She's NOT NICE. She's NOT A GOOD CHOICE.

Don't put the OW up on a pedestal, even if your H would do that, YOU DONT.

You have a marriage, a child with this man, if he would get his crap together, YOU are the BEST CHOICE for him. Raising your daugher together is the OPTIMAL OUTCOME for her, for you, for him to be a good father, a honorable man.

For the next day, couple days, just continue to wait it out. Try not to torture yourself with images or what-ifs. If he's truly determined to change things between you further...then he will do so, but he's bluffed so many times, I doubt the time has come.

But if is, deal with it as it comes. What's that Bible verse? Worry doesn't add a minute to your life or change a hair on your head? (I dunno that doesn't sound quite right.)

The ball is in his court right now, see what he does with it. But again, no lovebusters on your part. You can ask all the respectfully worded questions you want...but no LBs.

Lor,

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">She made really bad, immoral choices, had sex with a married man, is of low character, wanted him to leave his wife, his kids. She's NOT NICE. She's NOT A GOOD CHOICE. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">H says that the OW had told him to come back to his wife and try to work it out so she does look like such a wonderful person. I guess I have to start pushing him back at her. Tell him that the OW is too good to pass up...kidding.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">You can ask all the respectfully worded questions you want...but no LBs. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">What, in your mind, is a respectfully worded question? I'm getting a little cynical...so don't ask me what I'd like to say "respectfully".

Lots of hugs...

Terri,
My H's FOW started out "helping" & "advising" him with his marriage...so that makes her (and your H's OW) wonderful? Nope. The road to hell is paved with "good" intentions. It is not wonderful to say, "you should go back to your wife" and then hinder it by emotional & physical expressions of love/lust.

Discussing the FOW still irks me <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> .

Respectful questions...I don't know what you want to ask. But I think of it as straightforward, non coniving, not trying to trap or trick answers. Or cuss like a sailor, no insults, no slurs(or slurring for that matter).

"What was your time away like?"
"What did you do?"
"Did you accomplish what you wanted?" (he said he was clearing his thoughts or something, right?)
"What are your plans now?"
"Would you want to go back to our visitation schedule, any changes?"

And of course, your statements are "I" statements. I feel, I want, I think. No blaming or damning or accusing.

It isn't like I think this stuff is easy, Terri. In the past he's pushed your buttons, turned you emotional. Do your best to be cordial, polite, amicable no matter what he throws at you, keep your dignity. If you need time to think, you can say so, "I need time to think about this, can I call you back (or if in person, take a walk/few minutes, or days, in the other room)."

Like in softball, a change-up pitch, not quite what he's expecting or used to pushing you into.

He's not the only one who is determined, so are you.

If you think you can be humorous without being mean or nasty, you can go that way too. Orchid is a good example of that. (I'm not, I have more than enough natural babbling to try and do it deliberately, clarity was more what I needed <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> .)

Is that any clearer?