I'm wondering if I'm alone here.... Anyone else done what I did ??? Read "now I am the Betrayer.... "<P>Who is both ( Betrayed and Betrayer ) and was it during your separation or Divorce ???? I am looking for advice on how to proceed... Did you get back with your spouse and were you able to move foreward together ?????<P>------------------<BR>Rutger......One day at a time.<P><BR>

I must be all alone on this one.....

I've been both but we never separated or divorced.<P>H betrayed (very short term fling) I found out, flipped out, threatened to leave him, he pleaded with me to stay, promised me the worlds, and I stayed with him. We "worked it out." Really, we just stayed together, made some temporary changes, and then regressed into the SOS. 2 years later I betrayed him. It was a 2 year love affair which produced a child. I was ready to leave H for OM (long story - I think you are familiar with it, but my profile tells all the details). Then H begged me to stay (at the 11th hour - so to speak). And I am still here, still in love with OM, but trying to find happiness with H. Neither his affair, nor mine happened during separation or divorce. If we ever actually separated or divorced, there would be no going back. I think that is the one thing we both agree on.<P>Sorry I can't speak directly to your question, but maybe "New woman" can - she too has been on both sides.

Hi Rutger<P>I am not on both sides but I can give ya my 2 cents worth...<P>For starters did you cheat? Is it cheating? I thought your W put your marriage vows on "hold" or threw them out altogether. So who did you cheat on?<P>Figure out "why" you feel bad. Do you really think you had a chance for reconcilation before this issue? I think you are just getting control back of you life and you are exercising your right to live.<P>If your W is filing the big D because of this issue then she would have filed anyways. What are you susposed to do for the rest of your life ? wait?<P>If anything I would indicate to your W that this is how life is going to be. This is reality, she will be with OM and you will give all your love and attention to someone else and she will miss out. Filing the big D is only hurting herself and her chances of being with you.<P>Good Luck<BR>_____________________________________________<BR>"Better to die on your feet than live on your knees"

If you want to count 12 yrs. in between my H affairs and my affair, then I'm there too. Yours differs because you had an immediate affair (for revenge or because you were hurt and out of your mind, or both) and I waited 12 yrs. without ever thinking I would do it.<P>You'd think it would be easier knowing both sides, but it isn't. Yeah, I understand my H's pain, but that doesn't lesson my, nor the other way around. It just makes things messier.<P>I'm sorry you have to be going through this right now, and understand your confusion and frustration. My H is going through similiar feelings, wanting to "get me back" or just "get some love" he can't seem to get from me.<BR>I feel for you.

Rutger,<P>No, you're not alone. There are several of us who wear both hats, so to speak. But, my situation is different than yours in that our affairs were simultaneous and unbeknownst to either of us. I found out about H's already ended affair while I was deeply involved in mine. I ended mine and confessed mine to my H almost immediately.<P>Truthfully, I don't think either of us could have cheated after finding out about the other. In fact, I can definitely say neither of us could have. Finding out about his knocked out all the excitement of mine, and also exposed my affair for what it really was ----- B.S.<P>But there are others who have discovered a spouse's affair, and then years later had their own affair, or vice versa. I think that scenario is more likely to happen when there hasn't been intensive rebuilding to the marriage and major changes in both spouses.<P>Hope this helps.<P>------------------<BR>Love is meant to heal. Love is meant to renew. Love is meant to oust all fear. Love is meant to harmonize differences. Love is meant to bring us closer to God.

yes i've been both....read my profile...mine first...later his...thought we were going to make it...but didn't...in the process of separating and i intend to file for divorce....scared, alone, hurt, confused....<BR>i would strongly recommend to all people that they never wear EITHER hat..they each have their own pains....<P>------------------<BR>Kellie<BR>Sometimes Love Just Ain't Enough<P>

Amen KelStill!! Both sides of this awful situation DO have their own pits of hades!<P>Yeah Rutger, I've been both the betrayed and the betrayer. (Last 5 months as the betrayed -W had an affair on me for a few weeks - 7 weeks after our wedding). Things are doing very good these days though with us!<P>And this same woman who did this to me, is the one that I had an affair with on my first W 8 years ago. That marriage I walked away from after only two years.<P>It's a big, messy, weird story. I don't know if you read any of my old, old posts from a few months ago about all of that.<P>I must say though, being the betrayed hurts more in a "emotional pain" way. But betraying/hurting someone else (especially leaving them, ending the marriage) is a long-term "remorseful" torment that I have lived with (and still live with) all these years. <P>In fact, that was one of the things that for me hurt so bad about my current W's affair. Even though we broke up a few times over the last 8 years and only got married the first of this year, she still saw how messed up I was about cheating on my first wife (WITH HER!) and how it still haunts me to this day. But as her & I have covered in counseling...she's not me and she did it for her own selfish and messed up reasons.<P>Ask any questions you like Rutger (or anyone else for that matter) if you want any perspectives from both ends of the brimstone pit. But just to re-emphasize KelStill's comments..... BOTH SIDES SUCK! If you can keep yourself or your marriage out of either, do everthing in your power to do so!! Because it's something you have to live with for the rest of your life otherwise. (Not to say that problems in a relationship can't be overcome/improved or that one can't learn from their failures....but this is just NOT THE WAY TO DO IT!)<P>-knifed<p>[This message has been edited by knifed (edited September 13, 1999).]

I guess you could say I have been on both sides but one side more lopsided than the other.<P>The funny thing about human beings is that when we are the one hurt its the end of the world... but when we are the one hurting someone else it isn't so bad. I guess its natural to be that way but regardless who we are there is some part of us that justifies what we did and makes what happened to us horrible.<P>I betrayed my wife for 5 days with someone I had been talking to on the internet... at the end of those 5 days I returned to me wife and told her it was over and we got a divorce from there... I didn't allow myself ANY kind of rebuilding, would talk about it but not seek to fix it in any way... I didn't want to, the affair made me realise I was losing out too much on life and that my marriage was killing me.<P>Though I regret the pain I put her through to this very day I think it was the right thing to not get back together... she is now married (not happily from what I gather) but has a daughter and that has made the world for her.<P>The OW and I spent another 3 days together before that ended sourly (she was seeing her ex boyfriend at the time and went back to him even after I left my wife).<P>On the other hand I found my current partner had not exactly cheated but had spent a half an hour being extremely affectionate with someone else... I dont even know if you could really call it cheating as such but it hurts all the same.<P>Reading all of these things tells me one thing... that it is the dishonesty, lies, deceit and breaking of trust that hurts FAR, FAR more than the fact someone I loved had sex with someone else... and bottom line isn't that really what its about?<P>I mean we can get ANY emotional need we like from any source be it friend, family or anything else... but these affairs ALWAYS include sex and usually to a level far above that of the original relationship.<P>Does it actually bother you she slept with someone else? Or was it the betrayal that hurt more? Is your W actually upset you slep with someone? or is she hurt because you told her how important trust and honesty was and then did the exact opposite?<P>I see an answer forming from reading all this but it seems everyone else is purposely blinding themselves to it.<P>Word of Wisdom :<P>"People are stupid... they believe something is true because they FEAR it is true or because they WANT it to be true"<P>Remember that before you EVER believe in something.

Kelstill, Good to hear from you. How's your backhand?<P>Rutger, Been there. Read my profile. I responded to her affair. Doesn't make it any less wrong. It makes things even more of a mess. (Is that possible?)

Thank you all for responding, I'm glad that I am not alone..Misery loves company.<P>I have so many questions but I just don't know how to ask them... My W told me that she is in shock and can't understand how I could do this with the knowledge of how painful it is. I agree, I still don't know what my motivation was. Those of you who don't know my story it goes like this.<P>W cheated on me 2 months ago with a guy she knew from a dance club, We seperated and have been in limbo since. I got drunk after my best friends wedding and slept with a gal from the reception. I still am having trouble recalling the event because I was so drunk. I do know that it was the worst experience of my life. I told my W the next day and she immediatly called for a divorce.<P>My problem now is the guilt and the pain... I do feel guilty and now I know what my W was going through. I feel like I blew any chance that I had of trying to show my W how loyal I was to her and that I would stand by her no matter what ( I still will ). So I guess I feel like I cheated not only on her but more so on my own personal values and morals. I was in the mind set that I could win her back by showing her how much I loved her and accepted what she had done and now I betrayed that. For me this was a drunken act that meant nothing emotionally. My feeling for my W have not changed in the slightest. <P>Now at the same time I find it easier to accept her infidelity. Almost like eye for an eye. The playing field is level now. We both made a huge mistake and both have learned so much from it and I can honestly say that I don't ever want to do this again, So I will never get myself in this situation again.... I don't want to wear either HAT.<P>How does one work through the guilt... No wonder my W wouldn't deal with me since her one nighter, She couldn't even deal with herself. However for me I wish she was here, I want to deal with her.... to show her how remorseful I am. <P>I want to help her through this pain she is having.... I know I would have had an easier time if she was there with me during my time of need and now I have an opportunity to help her and she wants nothing to do with me.... I can understand that. <P>So not to make this any longer but thanks for listening and responding... You all are a godsend and I thank you.... <P>------------------<BR>Rutger......One day at a time.<P><BR>

Rutger... I have one question for you...<P>Did you CATCH your wife cheating or did she come clean with you on her own accord?<P>If your wife wonders why you did it even after knowing the pain it caused... maybe she should ALSO understand why YOU did it after being there herself... if she felt it was a mistake, a once off and "one of those things" then why can she not understand that of you?<P>If you caught her and you came forward voluntarily... what does that say? She wasn't honest and you WERE honest...<P>You see your betrayal wasn't dishonest, you didn't lie, you didn't deceive her and it happened while you were separated...<P>I dont see how ANYONE can consider that the same in any book. While infidelity has occured its a bit different to doing it behind your partners back, covering it up, maybe even denying it and getting caught out.<P>I think you need to sit down with her and ask her that you are willing to understand HER side if she is willing to understand YOURS... from everything I have ready about your situation she is giving me the impression it was ok for her to do it but fire and brimstone for you to do the same thing<P>The only GOOD thing I see with an even playing field is that NEITHER of you can now get high-and-mighty or start preaching to the other person on what is right or wrong because both of you have done it and I am sure neither of you want to throw stones in a glasshouse.<P>Rutger, perhaps your W's shock in handling this comes from how you handled her one-nighter... did you preach to her about how wrong it was? If you did and made her feel really guilty then doing it yourself (regardless of how/why) makes you appear very hypocritical and maybe that is what is hurting her

Oh Rutger,<P>The playing field is NOT even now, don't you see that? It's piled up higher and higher, a lumpy bumpy mess!<P>You both need time... that guilt won't go away over night, and from what I've read from others, sometimes it never goes away. Gee, I sound uplifting, huh?? Sorry.<BR>I'm just now realizing what infidelity does to a family. Let me tell you, having to bear your soul in front of family, friends, and most of all your kids is pretty humbling. <P>I can understand why you did what you did, no matter WHAT the reason. It is awful, no matter which side you're on (or HAT you're wearing!). It hurts, it hurts, it hurts.<P>Take care, and give your W the time you know she needs to at least begin to deal with what you did. <P>