The short story. My wife is spending almost all of her time with a girlfiend she met over a year ago. She's not a lesbian, but I guess sex is not really required for an A. So it's an EA.
I've read a lot of post here and I'm wondering wether or not I should confront her with the fact that she's having an EA.
As I've read an A needs exposure to end. Guess I'm the only one who can expose the A.
So should I confront her, tell her I think she's having an EA? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />
Please help me out here.

Are you sure that she doesn't have OM ?. Usually woman doesn't quit M unless you are LB'ed and unbearable or there is OM. IMVHO, rather looking into her "EA", you should try to plan A'ng your wife. Show her that you could change !!. Learn not to LB and try to fillin her ENs.

-RH-

soltair,
If she's not a lesbian, then how could you come to the conclusion it is an EA? I don't get it.

EA stands for an emotional affair ... she is very much emotional involved with the girlfriend, spending almost every single minute of the day with her. It's affecting our marriage so it's an affair. Read the description of an affair on this site. The girlfriend has had the same problems as WW did in her childhood. That's why they connect. When you're most of the time talking and spending time with someone else it does affect the M.
I'm plan A'ing her, doing rather well ... if I say so myself. Doing the best I can fillin her EN's and I'm far from LB'ing her.
I'm sure there is no OM involved.
Told her today that it hurts my feelings when she say's she wants to be alone and spends all of her time with her girlfriend. Asked her what she would feel if it was me.
I should let her know how I feel, that's one of her issues about our marriage ... so I need to let her know I can talk about my feelings.

Ow, the ovens ringin ... pizza's ready <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

An EA usually involves a sexual attraction, even if there has been no physical contact. With an EA there is still 'chemistry'. Your W isn't hiding her relationship with this person from you. I'll assume she's not bisexual or homosexual. IMHO your W is not having an A but, she is spending too much time with her friend. She has found a good friend with whom she can share things. I'm speculating that she doesn't feel she can talk to you about some of these things. Part of being married is turning to your spouse when you have EN etc.. She must feel she can turn to you and you must be available for her to turn to!

Maybe, this is just an issue of inconsistency in your M...maybe, it's an issue of setting boundaries. All of us make mistakes in our M...I sometimes still call my mother about issues I should talk to my H first. What I saying is that being married is a journey, at every part of the journey we learn new skills and grow up a little more. On this journey we make mistakes; what's important is that we learn from these mistakes.

If the two of you are having problems communicating your needs to one another (which, by the sounds of it, you are) you need to get some MC to learn some effective communication skills.

I know communicating is a problem ... she thinks she can only talk about her problems to someone who's had the same experience. However we are communicating better now.
If I don't talk about my own feelings with her, then I'm hiding my feelings for her.
Asked her if she sees any improvement in my efforts to no LB'ing and fillin her EN's. She says she sees improvement.
My problem with communicating is not the wanting but the how. She's a feeling person while I'm a thinking person.
I've suggested we go to MC, she doesn't want to go.
She's made it clear she wants to live on her own for a while to deal with herself. It's hard for me to understand, but I'm trying and I'm not putting pressure on her.
But if being alone is what she wants, how come she's never really alone? She either with me or her relatives and most of the time she with the girlfriend.
That's what's hurting me, can't understand it.

Sounds like an affair to me.

She may not be a lesbian. But obviously the GF is filling ENs, especially if sex is low on the EN list.

Or perhaps some experimentation is going on?

Sex is low on her EN list. Communicating however is her bigest EN. That's why I think it's an affair. Carefully, without LB'ing, told her today the relationship with her girlriend, at least the way it is now, is in the way of solving our M problems. It's draining my LB ... she has to know it hurts me ... why else would she even consider changing?
She has it both ways now ... gets to be with the girlfriend and with me whenever she feels like it.
If she thinks our marriage is lost anyway why not divorce?
She had a date with an other girlfriend this tuesday, but she says she wants to cancel and wants us to be together ... told her she always welcome but she should think about it first. Because if she planning every day to be somewhere when is she going to find time to be with herself?

sol1tair..

I do not know how it could be an affair if she is not homosexual nor bisexual. It would be the same as if you had a "best bud" that you watched football with, went fishing with, drinking beer with...etc. Would you consider yourself having an affair with your best bud? This is just a mixup in priorities..in my opinion.

Women have things in common just as men have things in common. Men would rather watch football with a man (after all, who knows the game better than another man?), they would rather go fishing and hunting with another man. Those are just common bonds. Evidently your wife has a common bond with this girlfriend, and that would be the problems that they both suffered in their childhoods. When you go on to mention that she states that she wants to live on her own for awhile she might be influenced by her girlfriend (especially if she is single and living on her own). It would not be an affair. It would be the girlfriend being a bad influence.

As Always, JMHO

committed

It's not really important how you call it ... but how to deal with it. Fact is she has a bad influence from my point of view. My question is wether it's okay to talk to her about it, to show her how I feel about it when doing plan A?

sol1tair,

I thought you were insisting that it was an affair and I was only stating that that I did not think that it could be called an affair. Your comments about it being an affair and insisting that it was, lead me to believe that you cared what it was called. I was stating that I think that her g/f might be a bad influence on her. It seemed to matter to you what it was called to the point that you kept bringing the word "affair" out there. I only meant to shed a different light on it... my apologies if I was off base.

I would think that the veterans here would tell you that you could bring up the subject with her if you did not LB.

committed

Committed,

I'm not angry with you. I read the articles about what's an affair and I concluded it is an affair. An affair doesn't have to be sexual, it's about fillin EN's. At least I think it is. Right now the girlfriend is fillin WW most important EN's, so it's difficult for me to do the fillin.
So how it's called isn't all that important, it's just a conclusion I've drawn.
Sorry if you got the wrong impression.

You can call it an A if you want, you can call it misplaced priorities, call it whatever...poor communication is the problem. If your W won't go to counselling then, you can go! You can't change others but you can change yourself. There is nothing stopping you from learning new communication skills, is there? Maybe, she'll see you making the effort and that will be all it takes to get her into counselling. It's important for you to remember that you can't change or control others; you can only change and control yourself.

The definition of an A is really what the BS thinks is an A. I've seen tons of defintions, some I agree with, some I don't. There are some common criteria in most though...
1)secrecy
2)'chemistry'
...these don't apply to your W. IMHO, you don't like your wife's friend because she takes time away from the marital relationship and your W turns to her friend for emotional support. Is it possible you are jealous of this friendship...feeling threatened. This is a given, IMHO. BUT, just because you feel threatened doesn't make this an A!! She may or may not be a bad influence on your wife but, as I said before, you can't control your W and this situation. Start working on yourself, making yourself a better person.

Sol,

Find the book his needs/her needs and take the emotional needs questionnaire located in the concepts section. Read the adjoining info in that section.

Sit your W down and share what you have learned. Let her know that your M is a special relationship between the 2 of you. If anyone needs help from either of you, you 2 should do it as a team. It can include giving her some time to spend with this 'friend' and group time with this friend. You will find that at this time the friend and your W will show whether this is an EA with potential PA or just a very needy girl (friend) and a very overly helpful friend (W).

From a woman's POV, it is very easy to lean towards those needy women. Even here on MB some of us (me???!?!) spend a lot of time. My H had to remind me and he was the WS, that I spend a lot of time here and my family needs me. He is right so I curtail my time down (a lot). Also in H's family, the children and his parents are ALL very very needy people. One of his younger sisters came to live with us for a while and wanted me to care and love her more than our own son! Go figure. Of course this girl also has mental issues (bi-polar) and other bad experiences, so I understand her need to want attention. I gave some but had to watch out that I also did not neglect my family. It was hard, very hard.

So I understand, use some of the tools here to verify your opinion. Don't jump to conclusions.
You may be right that there is an EA or you may find that your W gravitates to very needy women and then find out the reason. I would prefer that my H work with me (especially on his family's problems), than let me deal with them by myself.

L.

sol1tair

Simply having ones emotional needs met by another person other than yourself doesn't constitute an affair. Ones EN's can be met in all sorts of ways. Reason being that we have all different types of emotions and have different needs from different people. Heck, a pet can meet our emotional needs.

An affair revolves around a Loving relationship...not simply a frienship or bond between two people. I feel that some form of Intimacy needs to be involved...if not physical intimacy then at least the desire for it.

You said she is not a lesbian nor do you think she is inimate with this person, therefore I don't believe it to be an affair. This is simply someone she can talk to and relate to at this time in her life.

Anyway, I think if you feel the need to talk to her about this then do so. Screw the LB theory.

tagging off <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by sol1tair:
<strong>It's not really important how you call it ... but how to deal with it. Fact is she has a bad influence from my point of view. My question is wether it's okay to talk to her about it, to show her how I feel about it when doing plan A?</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Sol,
Don't judge ... learn how to speak to her w/o judgemental ... read the language of love book if you have problem communicating. There is no EA ... your W might be a giver that doesn't know how to stop .... Orchid is one of them, sorry Orchid ... Actually I am also one of them too. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Embarrassed]" src="images/icons/blush.gif" />
-rh-

Normally, I'd agree with you folks that this is simply an overly helpful woman.

BUT, she's moving out - or did I misunderstand that?

She's saying she wants to be on her own, but then spends all of her time in company of the friend.

That's affair behaviour in my book. She's got a high EN (possibly one of the top 2?) for conversation, and is seeking out someone else to get that met.

The time spent away from the husband is harming the marriage, the ENs being met elsewhere is harming the marriage, the emotional energy going elsewhere is harming the marriage, the relationship is more important than fixing the marriage, and now she wants a separation.

If this "friend" was male, everyone here would say "Affair".

JMHO...

I feel that since she is heterosexual; an affair (be it Emotional or Physical), would have to be with a male. I guess you can just call me closeminded. If she were bisexual or had homosexual tendencies, then I would call it an affair. Otherwise, I call it "wanting to be like the single girl down the street".

As Always, JMHO

committed

P.S. Maybe there is a chance that she is discovering some bisexual or homosexual desires. I am sure that stranger things have happened and a BS is none the wiser.

<small>[ September 29, 2002, 06:49 PM: Message edited by: committedandlovingit ]</small>

Thanks for point it out BR. Being a giver is one thing but to move out to go find yourself is definitely fogese talking and not giver gab.

BR you know I always appreciate your directing us back in the right direction. I went back and totally missed that point until you brought it out. Thanks!

Sol,
IMHO, I read your posts again and in light of the above info, I feel that your W is having her needs met by others. Women need conversation. They long for it...... that's why our mouths get us in sooo much trouble!!! LOL! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Therefore, your W sounds like she is having an EA. Regardless of who it is with, she is wilings to jepordize the M do to so then her priorities are now screwed up.

I am a giver but not willing to move out and leave my family to do so. Redhat and many others here are givers by nature also but not to the extent to leave their families. That is where the line is crossed.

So you have a lot of reading to do, your W may not be able to be rationalized with at this moment. You need to read and decide how much of her actions you are willing to enable and what you are not. Then proceed to follow through.

You have a lot of good people here supporting you and at times we even help each other out. This is a great group to be with.

I hope this helps.

take care,
L.

Hi,

Thanks for all the posts, it's nice to read them.
I'm working out the issue's in our M from my point of view. I know the last few months were rough, we've got into a lot of arguments over her being away all the time. But afcorse I did it the wrong way ... almost everytime we would fall into yelling or just not speaking.
She always says you're not a talker, it's true, I'm not realy the talkin kind.
When we do talk I've a habbit of trying to make her see it my way, working on it ... at least I know I need to change this.
She thinks she is a talker herself, but she can't talk about problems with me or her relatives. Guess there's a lack of trust.
When she has something on her mind she just says 'things aren't ok lately'. When you ask her if she can explain what she means she says 'It's just a feeling'.
How can you solve a problem if you don't know what you need to solve?
This is where our communication fails.
So by telling her how I feel and not telling her she has to act on my feelings I think I'm controlling my habbit of trying to control her.
So now when we talk and she says 'so you want me to ...', I say, it's just how I feel, you don't have to do anything with it and if you choose to do something with it should be your decision.
There are some other issues I'm working on, putting the problems and possible solutions on paper. So when she decides she wants to talk about solving the issues I'll be ready and I can show her I'm serious about saving the M.
Readhat mentioned she might be a giver who doesn't know how to stop.
I think you could be right there, she has had problems with overcaring before. She is a professional caretaker and she does get carried away sometimes.
But the caring doesn't give her the satisfaction in the end, when she starts to realize it isn't working depression is on the way.
Might be WW is afraid of not giving enough attention to the girlfriend because she is affraid the friendship will end. The girlfriend is a needy person and my wife loves to take care. She says you have to do things on your own, so why isn't the girlfriend fixin her own life?
She needs to know her actions do affect our M and my feelings for her. So I gently told her I love her but she is hurting me and this means our M is in jeopardy.
Yesterday we went to a football game and had a great time together. This morning for the first time she sends me a message on my cell, asking how things are? She hasn't done this in months.
Now she want's to come for diner tomorrow ... she will break an appointment with an other girlfriend she made.
Told her she's welcome but think about it first because you need time to be alone.
I'm a little suspicious, mayby she thinks if I spend more time with him he won't mind me spending my time with the girlfriend.
So mayby she trying to please everybody, forgetting her own needs, this will get to her at the end.
But ok, I've got to work on my plan A. She needs to decide for herself and so should I.