never saw a US caller ID showing up
might be coincidence, but think not.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Brit's Brat:
<strong>Hey Lisa, Nick or any others in the UK ~ how prevalent is caller ID for home phones on your side of the pond? If someone from the US in an area of the US that has caller ID calls over to your side of the pond (just outside London) will it show the caller's number or Out of Area or Unavailable or something similar?

Regards,

Brit's Brat/BS-41
WH-43
DS-1 year old
Status: One Day At A Time</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">

Hello Everyone

BB - I don't know as I don't have caller ID, but think that probably wouldn't show up. Why out of interest?

SS and JL - as ever thank you for your wise words and responses. JL how could I ever get fed up of you posting - think it's more likely that people would get fed up with me!!!

SS - these are the things I try to do, and as JL said, make them realistic and meaningful given where I am at with our M. Pretty much I call H every day at work - just for a quick chat, or to give him some information that I think might be useful. Today I just called to say that with the bad weather on Sunday, the trains may be unreliable and he might need to check on them (he is travelling to the North East tomorrow). Or I e-mail him. He never calls me but does occassionally mail me. I would very much like to make a trip to Germany - we had some happy times there, and before Christmas it is really festive and traditional. I will ask H.

Although he is talking in terms of himself a lot, I still do ask to do things with him. For example, he was talking about spending Christmas apart, and I said to him that couldn't we spend Christmas together. I made a joke about spending it with my family, but told him that I really couldn't see that I would rather be with anyone else. He said he'd think about it, but because we had so many good times he wasn't sure if he wanted to go through a "pretend" situation of being happy and having a great time. But I hope that these are the sort of things I can continue to do and as you say SS, mean them.

JL, you are right about timing - it will be 4 months on 6 November since D-day - where does the time go to?!?! Physical relations are non existant. H is still sleeping in the spare room, but has also said that he currently does not want to become close. We do hug and kiss which is better than nothing. In all honesty, this is my biggest problem. How do you physically find someone attractive again? This is nothing to do with the A, but was a major issue before. No amount of Planing A-ing, filling Love Banks etc. can make you find someone physically attractive. My H is a very good looking man, but for some reason I just don't fancy him. I hate to say this and it pains me to say it, but of course, this is my greatest worry about whether our M can be saved. This is my greatest fear, and the one that holds me back from whether we can rebuild or not. The other things about friends, activities etc. are secondary.

JL said: "One thing is for sure is that he is thinking deeply about things as per his statements about his failing so badly in the marriage. Lisa, what I don't think you realize is that he is stating more about himself than about you. He is fearing his ability to make you happy more than he is fearing that you may do it again."

He doesn't think that he failed so badly in the M. He realises that I was unhappy, but he thinks this may be also to do with me being unhappy generally, rather than what he was or was not doing. Which in some ways I agree with him. But I do think you are right about his fear that he can make me happy. After one of his IC sessions, he actually said to me that I didn't need him for any reason. When I told him reasons that I did, he shot me done, saying that they weren't real reasons or needs.

As ever, plenty to think about, and things to work on, which I feel I am getting better at. Interestingly, even though H said he sees no future, when I said what did he want to do then, would he want to move out etc. he was not very forthcoming about that at all! There is still the say one thing but not backing it up which makes me realise the need for that T&P thingy!

Thank you both. I so appreciate everyone's comments and support, it has truly helped me beyond all belief.

Lisa

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> BB - I don't know as I don't have caller ID, but think that probably wouldn't show up. Why out of interest? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">As you know my WH's OW lives in Farnborough (Hampton). I will be posting a post re: OW and WH shortly (if I can get it all typed before my meeting in 45 minutes!) ....I would appreciate your input when it is posted ~ I greatly value your insights.

Brit's Brat/BS-41
WH-43
DS-1 year old
Status: One Day At A Time, but today believe WH and OW have NOT cut off contact despite emphatic statements that they have.

All H's arrangements have now been made for his trips to Germany.

H came home last night just before I went to meet my girl friend (this is the first time I have been out in about 3 weeks). He was very down and sad, I tried to talk to him a little (given that I was going out), but he was not very receptive. When I got home he was going to bed and clearly didn't want to stop and talk to me. I just chatted briefly about the restaurant we had been to.

I sense that his revelations of the weekend have set him back. He has been so strong and positive the last few weeks, that to me it must have set him thinking about those things - does he love me or not, does he want us to have a future etc. I couldn't really get through to him which is sad, but was also to do with not having much time.

I know it's early days, but it's all so painful, I sometimes feel swept away by the sadness of it all. I wish so much I could take back what I did. If I had thought about the pain and hurt surely I would never have gone there. My self esteem is still so low. I dislike myself so much for what I've done, and feel no closer to trying to work out how it happened or why. If I could, perhaps I could begin to forgive myself.

Sorry to moan, just having a sad day - it's raining too!

Lisa

<small>[ October 30, 2002, 09:09 AM: Message edited by: Lisa in London ]</small>

Lisa this must be awful for you. I know some of your story as I've read a few of your posts. As far as H going away - not the best thing, but perhaps it will give him time to reflect and think about what he wants. Probably better than him moving out. When he goes do your best to stay in touch with him - phone calls, faxes, letters, anything... just so that he knows you care.

I'm sorry for your setback. H sounds like his friends' opinions are very important to him. That's awful as they don't support you.

Pray for guidance from God for you and your H. He will find a way for you.

Hey Lisa, chin up. Remember the Rollercoaster. You're on a downward dip. It'll turn upwards soon. Don't look to the details per day.

Remember that you can't measure this by daily items. It takes months. His "not sure can rebuild with you" is a cry of uncertainty. It's not a definate. It's an outworking of part dispair and part frustration.

Let him vent like this, give him time alone in his cave like he needed when he was going to bed. Pushing it at those times is really not the best.

Remember sometimes all we can do is breathe and keep going. You are doing well despite what you say.

Best wishes, Neil.
p.s. and it's still raining <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

Hydra/Neil - thanks for your words of support.

Hydra, I think my typing was a little bad earlier!! It was me that went out last night, not H, and so it wasn't something specific that friends had said to him, more my gut feeling about the situation after Sunday and how it had affected him. Having said that, I know that some of the people H have seen have been none too kind about me and supportive of him (which is fair enough). However, H is not the sort to let people run me down. I think it is more, "What a terrible thing she did, how awful, can't believe it of her". Thank you for your thoughts though, and I will do what I can to stay in touch. As Still Seeking said, I will also try and make one visit to him while he is away. But yes, you are right, better than him moving out.

Neil, you are right I know. I posted earlier on this thread how may be the ride had got less scary, rather than being off the rollercoaster, but the reality is, I'm still clinging on for dear life and frightened whitless!! For sure, things have improved immensely, and I must remember that, rather than the daily living situation. When he is down though, I just don't know what to do, because he's doing so well. You are right, these aren't definitive statements.

Thank you both for your support and encouragement. Anyway, something to cheer me up, going out to collect my new car soon Neil, the VW Polo, not the Porsche, but still very nice!!.

Lisa

Lisa,

A couple of suggestions. If he is down, give him a hug or a peck on the cheek. Perhaps rub his neck. In other words make physical contact with him. I am big on this because it really does affect us guys.

Now, so as not to encourage him being down, when he is up you should do the same. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> It will also do something for you. It is a way to express how you feel without words.

One last thought about the sex thing. I am, for sure (a CA term <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> ), not a sex therapist, but I would like to suggest you read the article on sex aversion on this site. It is something you might want to consider. It is not as uncommon as you think and it can be addressed. If you feel your H is physically attractive, but he doesn't do a thing for your libido, then perhaps there is something shutting you down. I wouldn't be surprised that the OM did turn you on, give the highly charged nature of such a situation.

But, this is something you can do for yourself, and it may help your marriage as well. I know it sounds as if I am big on counselors, I am really not, but the good ones can be affective. If nothing else do some reading on the subject and see if it fits. It may not, but it is just a thought that crossed my mind.

Now, I must tell you something. I just cannot believe it is raining there. I know, I have seen the movies and it is always raining or foggy in London, but I have been to the UK, OH, 10-15 times for as much as 10 days at a time, and in all of that time I have never seen a single rainy day. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />
Seriously, I have friends there that used to live near us here, and every time I come through, even if just changing planes at Heathrow, I call them and tell them I am enjoying the banana belt climate they have. I think I am about off of their Christmas list. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

So whether you know it or not IT IS SUNNY where you live. AT least in my mind, and maybe it needs to be in yours as well.

You two are doing better than you think.

God Bless,

JL

I vote with JL,

Was going to come on and say some similar things but he says it better anyway, so I'll just add my agreement.

Only other thing I would have covered is admiration. It is often a need in men, and if you could find a way to express admiration for him it would probably help both of you. It helps him feel appreciated, and it reinforces in your mind that there are good things about him.

BTW, do you know his needs, and do you have a plan to meet them? From your posts It sounds like you do, just checking.

SS

JL/Still Seeking

Thanks for your thoughts and comments. Funnily enough, that's just what I did do, give him a hug. I also agree with Neil, if he doens't want to say anything particular so be it. It is only my own insecurity that makes me worry so.

JL, I have read a lot of stuff, and this is really as I say my greatest worry. This is not an aversion per se, but just (and I say this shamefully and with sadness), about my H. I don't know if and how that can come back, and H knows this too.

Other than that, H has asked to do some things together at the weekend with youngest S-D. I got my car yesterday which cheered me no end, and a new contact for work which should come together. It stopped raining today too. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> For the first time in a long time, I almost feel positive. Isn't this crazy after feeling so low yesterday?

I suppose this is all part and parcel of the wider situation.

Thank you both.

Lisa

Lisa,

I am not sure if we connected properly yesterday. Sexual aversion can be to ONE person, not everyone. That was my point. It can be from, what I understand and there some people on this site who have dealt with it, your relationship with your H.

I don't know the book title but apparently there are some very good books on this subject. Perhaps a post to everyone asking for guidance to information on the topic might help.

I wish I could be of assistance but I cannot.

See I told you it was always sunny in the UK. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

God Bless,

JL

Thanks JL - it's not really something I'm terribly comfortable talking about, but I'll think about it.

Anyway, am feeling much stronger and positive today - first time in months. Surely a good sign.

Lisa

Lisa,

You don't need to talk about it here. Just see if you can get some good references and see what you think.

JL

Lisa,
I feel a bit 'out of the loop' this week as far as reading posts and seeing how people are doing. From my reading, I gather that you were feeling down but now are improved. Please, as someone said it's like a roller coaster. Things will improve even more, in time.

It's funny, the other day I felt better in the morning than I had in months. I really don't know why, but I think when we're in a crisis period we don't realize just how draining that condition can be.

My thoughts are with you, in any event. From my point of view I see it as so positive that you are still WITH your H.

I'll remember what JL said, too, about males liking admiration and touch so much. It always helps to be reminded.

Take care,
H_P

JL and H_P - thank you both for your thoughts and comments.

I just don't think I'm doing terribly well at any of this. I don't think I'm trying hard enough, I need to do more, but given my uncertainty and H's, it's hard. H_P you are very right about forgetting the emotional strain of all of this. This is something people here remind me of from time to time, and I still forget, plus it is early days.

Last night, H snooped at my mobile phone. It made him angry, and there were some fairly angry outbursts. He asked me if I am still in touch with the people who knew about the A. I told him the truth, one I haven't spoken to for a while, the other I do speak to from time to time (although I don't see her). I have nothing to hide, but reminded him that if he choose to snoop, he must be prepared for how that might make him feel.

He said we have no future if I am in contact with them - he referred to them both as scum. I said it is not them that had the A but me, and I am scum, not them. I reminded him that on Sunday he had told me that we have no future anyway - I feel that he can be very contradictory, but I have always remained fairly constant about my feelings. I love and care for him, but am not sure if our M can survive.

He told me that I have done nothing to show him that I am willing to make any changes, and he is worried about how my "secret life" may be continuing. This had started because earlier in the evening the phone had run, he had answered it and the person hung up, and they witheld their number. I have no clue who that was or why. I said to him that I felt although not making huge strides, I had done and do things to show him that I care and am thinking about him, such as calling him everday at work, making his favourtie dinner for when he came home from a long day - he agreed but said it wasn't really enough. For me, I believe because I am still uncertain about our future, I do things which I am comfortable with. I don't want to "pretend" and do things that are unreal or pushed for me - does that make sense, or is it just selfish?

SS asked in an earlier post about meeting H's needs - he won't do the ENQ, so I pretty much have guessed what is important to him. No, I'm not doing the best job of meeting his needs, but I am doing the best job at trying to be warm, caring, honest and open. It actually doesn't bother me about my phone, because I have NOTHING to hide!!!

So, yet again that rollercoaster dip. I have tried to be positive about me, and want to continue to do that. I am no help to anyone when I am depressed and crying every day. Yesterday was a good day until the evening episodes. My self esteem has been so low, and the fact that I dislike myself immensely for what I have done and created.

No-one made me have the A, it was something I actively choose. The people who I confided in, were only going on what I told them and supporting me as my friend not H's. Yes, his feelings were not considered, but that was about me not them and what I told them. I am not trying to minimise how H feels about those people. If the boot were on the other foot, I would feel the same, and that is why contact has been reduced incredibly and virtually cut with one of the people. The point I am making is, that H cannot blame other people for the A. It was of my making, and yes that still troubles me.

So folks, as I say, I must stop saying that things look brighter, because they inevitably take a downturn.

I do so value everyone's insight and support. I may however take a few days away from the board. If I'm not around, I may be reading, just not posting.

Thank you again.

Lisa

Lisa,

My guess is that he senses your reluctance and he surely knows that you feel no need to be intimate with him. Now if he doesn't accept that some of this existed before the A, then his natural conclusion is that perhaps the A is still somehow affecting you, or that you are in contact with OM via your friends.

I think you need to see that he sees them as you embassaries in this, although that may not be the case. He is also probably thinking that you and your friends feel his is a fool for being in this situation.

Again, the point I am trying to make is this is more about him than you at this point. You continue to do your best, but you also need to address your issues as he has to address his.

Lisa, you are only at 4 months. You are working at this by just being there and hanging in with him. I think that at the 6 month mark you will see some changes and perhaps more good days than bad.

It is that old T&P thing you know.

God Bless,

JL