</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Kimmy1:
<strong>I wish I had a place by a lake to go to!
</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Aren't you in London right outside of Toronto? I thought you were there. If so, doesn't the lake have places you can go? If you are not from there, then my apologies I must have you confused with someone else.

Actually, I do remember discos. I was a young teenager back then. This reminds me that the first date I had with my W was at a dance club. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

No..I'm not in London. However, since I've joined, there's been a Kimmy2 and a Kim3 that have signed on, so maybe it's one of them.

But..I am north of Toronto, so you were close! There is a lake about 30 minutes north of here and it's really nice in the summer. I'm not a winter person, so you can imagine how that limits me considering I live in Canada. I always say that I was meant to be born in Florida. I adore hot weather and would like it every day of the year. We're a strange country weatherwise. In the summer we're in the high 90's almost every day, and then...boom....we're well below freezing for months on end. Yuck.

Anyway, off to bed now. Up at 5:00 and it's already 9:35 here. My kids are still wound up from trick or treating, so it might be a late night.

Take care!

you know, you probably will laugh at me but I keep forgetting it's getting cold. I am in the midwest and it's beginning to get cold now (highs in the 40's) which is probably warm to you. Even if there was a place to go at the lake, I guess you wouldn't go anyway because of the weather. I guess I have been under so much stress I forget little details like that. And you were the Kimmy I was thinking about; I knew you were outside of Toronto, but for some reason London stuck in my mind.

Have a good one.

Your situation sounds so similar to mine. We've been back and forth, he's giving up so much, the hurt babies... It just doesn't make any sense to me. The pain that you are feeling is right here in my stomach. How can people be so selfish? My husband is home right now, but I've laid down the law. Either stop vacilating and get on with recovery or leave. He's looking at houses to buy....

Hi Kimmy...sorry i dont have any advice, just that my prayers are with you, hang in there, hugs to you...A/C0810

Well..just an update. I left the letter for my H this morning that I've mentioned before..that he needs to follow through and provide me with the separation agreement HE wants, and also to arrange with me when he can pack up/get the rest of his stuff. I also did the 'in order to me to heal emotionally, I realize that I need to have as little contact with you as necessary...etc..etc.' I did put at the end of the letter though that I love him and do not want this but that I realize it is his choice.

I haven't heard anything and won't 'see' him until Tuesday night when we are both at hockey together. Up until then I'm going to make sure the kids are just ready for him to pick up at the front door.

I don't feel too bad. If fact, I almost feel empowered having done this. I've been afraid of it for so long, and 'waiting' in case he changes his mind, that now I've realized he DOESN'T want me and I MUST move on to heal, the letter and no contact plan feels good. Of course, I could be a sobbing wreck tonight...but for now I'm okay!

You probably will be a sobbing wreck tonight and tomorrow night but when you are in the middle of it just remember it goes away, it is temporary. Our bodies could not handle it for long, so allow yourself to be a sobbing wreck, get all the tears out, it is healthy for you. Come to the boards and cry as well, vent away. A lot of people on this board are here for you.

Remain strong and confident and appear that way when/if you see him. Your kids need that confidence and strength as well and let me tell you something I've found out these last months: You have more strength than you thought you had.

Be well. I will pray for you and your family tonight.

Kimmy,

I just read through all of your posts and it seems that we are pretty similar. You are doing the right thing going to Plan B, but let me give you a few hints that have helped me.

1. See if there might be an intermediary that can be a go between for handing off kids, at least for awhile. You're right...seeing your husband or talking to him will hurt and will challenge you greatly. Although my wife has gotten VERY mad this week (check my thread) because I will not interact with her on ANYTHING, it has helped me greatly. By not having reminders around for me and the kids, we are a lot happier day-to-day. So, see if you can make it NO CONTACT.

2. Trust God. I do not know your relationship with Christ or your husband's, but if you are both saved, I do know this...He has you right now! And believe it or not, He has your husband. You said you read my posts so I wont go into all of that. but I did have to ask myself the question in all of this "How big is my God?" If I conclude that He cannot fix my marriage, then I am no different than my wife. If I conclude that He cant get to my wife, remove the fog and bring her home, then my situation is hopeless. If I believe that even if my wife chooses to disobey Him, that my Lord is not going to take care of me or help me find a life that I deserve, then where is my relationship with Him? I am no different than my wife.'

I have been amazed with what has heppened in my life when I let go and trusted Him. It surprises me that I am such an idiot and forget that, until the next crisis comes along. If I would just trust and listen to Him from the beginning, everyday, in every decision, it is amazing the things He accomplishes, with and without me. Impossible things.

Look, I cannot guarantee that He brings your husband back, or my wife back for that matter. I know His will is for you two, and Mrs. Mortarman and I to be married and to have a happy life together. But He also gave us all free will. Even in the face of God, in conviction, pain, hurt, etc, my wife may still deny Him, deny His will. And He will allow that decision to happen (and the consequences to come from it. Look, if you choose to murder someone, and then, in jail, ask God for forgiveness, will He? Of course. Will He take you out of jail? Probably not...those are the consequences. So please understand, I know that my wife is under His care, and that He is hunting her down. I pray that she will listen.

But Plan B is about you. You and God. Leave your marriage in His hands. Leave your fate in His hands. Look at Peter in the lake, when Jesus had him step out and take His hand and stand on the water. As long as Peter looked at Jesus in the eyes, he stayed on top of the water. but, it was when he got scared, stopped trusting Him, stopped believing that Jesus would keep doing WHAT HE WAS ALREADY DOING, when he looked down, that Peter sank.

Keep your eyes every minute, of every day, on Him. dont make a decision without Him. remember, He is in your marriage also. If your husband wants to reject both of you...fine. Let Jesus deal with that. you keep your end of the bargain. If you can keep a good Plan B, keep your eyes totally on Him, and pray unceasingly, you will find your miracle.

Can He still bring your husband back? Sure...that's what He wants. Same with my wife. Will He? That depends. Do you trust Him? do you believe in the promises that He has made to you? do you believe He will work all of this for your good, and your children's good?

Believe me, I am trying. It isnt easy. I have my moments. But when I do, I just stop, close my eyes, pray for His will and for comfort, and then step forward. within minutes, I am back up and running. It has not always been this way, as you can see on my threads. But, each day, as I go back to Him, ask Him for help and guidance, ask Him for comfort, this thing gets easier and easier. Trusting Him is now becoming a habit. So, like last night when I had a brief contact with the wife because of the kids, I just took a deep breath, prayed and then stayed the course. The look on my wife's face when I didnt LB, didnt pursue her, didnt ask about her or what was going on, etc was all the help I needed. I saw a woman that knew for the first time that Mortarman is serious, that He is in a relationship also...but not with another person, with Christ. I walked out of there pretty strong. Was I happy? No. it still is sad and hurts where we are. I still wanted to hold her, for us to be there like we were just over a year ago. But, I wasnt destroyed. I didnt lose sleep. I didnt lose my joy.

Hang tough...concentrate on Him and what He wants you to do in this marriage between you, Him and your husband. and what He wants you to do in the rest of your life. you can do this...but only WITH Him!!

God Bless.

In His Arms

Utterly Confused: Thanks for the response. I still feel pretty good and I even brought home some empty boxes from work for packing up stuff. I figure I can easily pack up my H's videos and stuff like that and it's a start. I haven't heard from my H re the letter..but he's taken it so he obviously saw it. He's gone to a co-worker's cottage overnight with a group from work to discuss work stuff. He told me about it last month when we were doing the calendar for our kids for October. However, tonight my D said that Daddy told her he was going out with a friend and that's why he couldn't see them tonight. So...the old gut feeling that he may be having a PA with someone is back when I hear contradictory stuff like this. But I must keep strong.

Tonight I'm just going to watch a video with my kids and then I'm taking them to a movie tomorrow.

Mortarman: I read all your thread and it was a very inspiring story. I have been posting here for a couple of months now and have threads in Plan A&B as well. But..I will tell you that I have prayed to God every day, as well as having a wonderful group of people who also pray. They don't just pray for me..we all pray for my H as well. I have put this in God's hands, and yes..it is difficult to have faith, especially when you see your children hurting so badly. It's one thing for us to hurt and suffer, but to see our children is very hard.

Thank you for your long response. I appreciate your concern and I hope you're doing okay.

Do you think I should send my H an e-mail telling him I know he's still having an EA?

Sorry to be blunt... NO.

Plan B is about no contact, about not filling his ENs so he can see what he's missing from you.

It is hard, but you must control yourself. Write the e-mail and post it here instead. Writing it will make you feel better, just DO NOT send it.

This is just MHO. Anyone else?

Be well.

Thanks for your input. That's what I need ..input to make the right decision. However, hows does telling him that meet his EN's? Isn't it telling him I'm not the fool he thinks I am?

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Kimmy1:
<strong>However, hows does telling him that meet his EN's? Isn't it telling him I'm not the fool he thinks I am?</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Another one of my humble opinions:

He needs to miss you. He needs to feel you are not there, not contacting him. Besides, to me, sending that e-mail is like doing an LB. Don't tell him you are not a fool (which you are not btw), rather show him you can live your life without him and be happy without him (even if you are breaking apart inside).

This is a wonderful site where we can receive encouragement as we face these attacks in our ministries of marriage. These are probably the most difficult times we will experience in our lives but as Mortarman has stated and shared, it is important that we remain true to a loving God our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ who knows the plans He has for our lives. All we are required to do is to believe God. It's very simple but yet because of our human frailty the pain that we are experiencing at times seems unbearable, but if you recall other times you've suffered greatly and yet God in His infinite mercy saw you through it or provided a way of escape for you. Never doubt that as God is working on you He is also working on your spouse. Don't be deceived by your fleshly feelings as you hear and see your spouse doing things that are out of character for them and are causing themselves, you, your children, family and friends who love you great pain. Think of this as a temporary situation that could change in a moment and probably quicker as you submit this entire situation to God. Ask God to will his good pleasure in your life, for He wants what is best for you, your husband and your children. I take great comfort in knowing that God says in Malachi 2:16 that He hates divorce. You have the greatest advocate anyone can have and someday soon your spouses will be greatful for the sacrifices that you all have made. Don't see your spouses as an enemy but as one deceived by the real enemy of God and God's people and specifically the covenant of marriage which God says is honourable and that enemey is Satan (the devil, Lucifer...).

Let's put on the full armour of God as Ephesians 6:13-20 tells us and lets walk in the authority and power that God has given to all those who have accepted His Son (Romans 10:9). Lets continue to believe God despite our circumstances.

Let the power of God strenghten and refresh you so that you can continue the good fight of faith for your self, your WS, your marriage and family.

Mortarman and others thank you for reminding us to follow the way of God in the area of our marriages and family.

May God bless each of you and may the enemy of God let your spouses go and may your spouses experience the true deliverance that only comes from knowing, loving and having a relationship with God. In Jesus Name Amen.

Hey, I believe we will have some good reports from you all soon.

WR

Kimmy,

Telling him means you have to contact him. If you contact him, then you meet an emotinal need by him being in your presence, interacting with him, emotional support or whatever. My wife is the same way. I went back to a FULL Plan B over a week ago. Since then, my wife has contacted me three times (I have contacted her none). In all three cases, I shouldnt have talked to her. And I realized on the latest one yesterday that she was using this to get her "Mortarman" fill.

Plan B is about two things. First of all you. Getting your act together and saving your love for your spouse. The second is for your spouse. Up to now, my wife has had most ENs met by me, and some by OM. Since she wont make a decision (and in your case, he is moving away from your marriage), then it is time that they realize what it would actually be like without any contact with you. No ENs being met.

The problem with it is that the WS might just keep going. But, they were going to go anyway. For the one that has a chance of coming back, they are forced out of their comfort zone when some of their ENs arent being met (this is why my wife cant make the decision to cut all ties with OM...even though PA hasnt been going on in awhile). They want to maintain the status quo so that they continue to feel good.

Your husband will want to keep parts of you, parts that the OW cant meet. Dont let him have them. My wife is going to learn over the next month or so that the OM cant/wont meet these needs (she even admitted it recently). And that I can meet all of them like I used to. If she can come to that realization, she can then head toward recovery. If she cant, then the realization will come once she has done something permanent and realizes she has made this unhappiness permanent in her life.

So, I am going to make sure no more contact happens, even accidentally. Even concerning the kids. She will have to learn what life is like without the Mortarman. Only then, if she has any chance of coming home, will she understand what she is giving up and what she is gaining.

I continue to pray for you and your husband. God is good. He can fix your marriage. He can wake your husband up. He might not. just like my wife might not listen in the end. But, even if the marriage fails, He will work blessings in my life for my obedience.

And for you also. God Bless.

In His Arms.

Thanks to all of you for your encouragement. I just got back from taking my kids to see the new 'Santa Clause 2' movie. Very good and it was a nice distraction for the 3 of us. However, as you can all relate, as soon as you leave the theatre and walk to the car, you remember what it was like to have your spouse with you at times like that. And now we're just making dinner for the 3 of us, whereas before Saturday nights my H and I made a nice dinner together and chatted the whole time. I sure do miss him and thinking that he probably doesn't miss me hurts alot.

But..I haven't cried today, so that's good (mind you ..I felt like it when I looked out the window this morning and it had snowed overnight! Yuck!).

I will try to have no contact as much as possible, but I know I'll need to talk to him on the phone early in the week to do the kids' schedule. But..he hasn't seen my face since Wednesday night, and I'm trying to make it as many days in a row as I can. Normally we would see each other Tuesday night at our son's hockey practice but this Tuesday night I have an appointment so won't see him then. And, I change shifts Monday (they switch every two weeks) and I get the 9-5 shift so he won't need to be here with the kids before school like he has to when I'm on the 6:30 a.m. shift and leave here at 5:55. So..that's good timing also.

I won't send him the e-mail..thanks for making it clear. But..I did send some yesterday re kid stuff but it's hard not to do that as I'd rather do that than talk on the phone and hear his voice more than I need to.

This site helps so much. Thank you!

Hi Kimmy....have been reading through your posts. I think a good no contact plan b, is your best plan. You have done a good plan a, and now he will need to see what life is really like without you completely.

I know you mentioned in one of your earlier posts that you were north of Toronto. You said you were half another from a lake. I am also north of Toronto, and if you are talking about the same lake i am thinking about, i am also half an hour from this same lake. Which may make it that we might even live in the same town, or very close to each other. Anyway, here is my email addy, write me and tell me where you are and i will do the same. It is elvira43@rogers.com

take care and god bless....A/C0810

Good for you Kimmy. Yeah, things will continue to pop up and remind you of the life you had. And it is no fun doing things as a family sometimes when there is someone in it that is missing. But you did well.

I would try to not talk to him at all Monday. Make Plan B a true Plan B, otherwise he will suck you up into a conversation and get some "Kimmy" fix. Is there anyone that can be a go between to hand kids off, to give messages back and forth? If not, then set the deal as (hopefully you have caller ID) if he calls, you wont answer and he should leave a message. You can then check it, call him back, and he is to not answer, where you can leave a message.

This is what I am doing. It sounds silly huh? And we are still hearing each others voices. But, what I am not doing is being drawn into a conversation with her, I am not relating with her. Before I leave my message, it is thought out, it is short and to the point. It only has to do with functional areas surrounding the kids. No "Heh, our oldest hit a homerun today...wish you were there to see it." No "by the way we went to the movies today...the kids really missed you." Nothing. Nada. Zilch. Instead, she gets: "I got your message that you want to pick up the kids at 6:30pm. That will be fine. Just beep the horn and I will send them out. I understand that you will have them back at 10am tomorrow. I will be here, so just let them get out and come up." End of message.

You are like me, we both have the kids. As Steve Harley states, that is a HUGE advantage. If he isnt getting his Kimmy fix, and he has to wait to see the kids in order to find out what is going on (except legal, medical, serious stuff, which I do discuss in the messages), then when he does see the kids, and hear about what is going on and what he is missing, ENs will not be met. He will then look at the OW and see someone who CANNOT meet those needs. That he is missing out on something. Now that is just one time, one example. But do that with everything, where he gets nothing from you and gets everything from the OW, and you will find out one of two things: 1. OW is enough and he doesnt care about those things...marriage is over anyway OR 2. he begins to realize the price he is going to pay and what he is going to give up.

This is the hope for my wife. She has said as much. That OM cant give her family, the things she counts on. That I am the only family she has ever known. That I have been her best friend. That sex with anyone else has never been like it has been with me. And so on. Now, will she choose the right road? Will her missing out on Halloween this past week with her kids help push her home? It might, with the help of God. But it might not. Remember, she chose the wrong road in the first place. She is human and might stay there, EVEN though she knows she doesnt really want to. The point is, that the heat gets turned up on her enough that she is forced in the end to make a decision, that she has to decide what is best for her self.

As with your husband. Kimmy, find a way to cut ALL direct contact (messages, intermediary, etc). Then trust it (check out my thread...I have a daily battle with that). After a time (a couple of weeks, a month or so...I think you will see something happening, especially if there is hope for your husband. Then, prepare as the Harleys outline, for the recovery and the conditions for Plan B to be dropped.

You are doing well. Now just close the loop hole he has, protect yourself, and trust God. In the end, you will be rewarded.

In His Arms.

Mortarman: I have been reading your posts and you are very strong.

My H NEVER calls me..hasn't since day one, so I don't need to cut down on that. I do have call display and know when it's him calling to say goodnight to the kids and I haven't answered those calls for a long time.

But..when my H has the kids..he NEVER asks about me, so if he started to during Plan B..maybe there'd be a chance. I just have a gut feeling that he's emotionally finished with me and that's why I haven't had any interest in almost the whole 4 months he's been gone. I feel unless he made a conscious decision to allow himself to feel for me, he never will.

I believe he likes the fact that the kids are with me. He has given up all responsibility, really. He has his free, independent life with no responsibility, and then he has the kids for fun times and sleepovers, but no real work involved. I think he decided in his mind one day he didn't want the hassle of the boring, day to day household and life responsibilities that we all have to do. I think now he's decided that he's had his kids, done some work, and now it's time for him and that means giving up the mundane stuff.

I did bring home some empty boxes this week and will start doing whatever easy packing I can do of his stuff. I want him to know that if he wants the separation, then I'm helping him with it..I have to accept it even though he knows I don't want it.

Oh, you're right Kimmy. He probably is loving the bachelors life again. My wife is too. No responsibility. No one to answer to. No kids sick in the middle of the night. Come and go as she pleases. Make all decisions by herself. Great. But it will not last. Mine has been gone three months. The holidays will be coming up. This will be the first Christmas that all of us have not spent together (I came home from Bosnia for a week over last Christmas...didnt know wife was in the middle of the affair...we spent it together as a family). How is she going to like being in her apartment alone, or with OM as the kids open presents in the morning? She gonna have them over later? HHMmmmm. I always was SAnta. Now, she wont be there for Santa. No presents from me. I dont even plan taking the kids out shopping for her, unless things change drastically. Maybe I am wrong on that one...I will have to pray about it. But, I just feel that I am not going to do ANYTHING for her, including helping her with the kids or fostering their relationship with her, as long as she is not being my wife, and still living immorally. I just dont see how I can do that.

Anyway, our spouses will go thru the holidays without family. It wont be fun. Now, I might be wrong about your husband, but I know my wife is going to have major problems over the holidays because of all of this. Inside her, she still wants her family (to include me). To keep missing out on family events is killing her. But it is her choice.

The point is...how big is your God? Is this problem too big for Him, to hopeless? Sometimes He has to bring us to the impossible to show us how awesome He is. I am not sating the answer will be your husband or my wife whole again and home. I am saying if this even has a chance, He will do it.

Let it run its course. In the end, if our spouses come back, they will know who stuck by them at their worst. And their love will return for us like it never was before. If they dont come back, then w can at least look our kids in the eyes, God in the eyes, and say we were obedient and did our best. And we will be rewarded.

In His Arms.