Hey all,

Just wanted to update you on today. If you've been following my threads (as many of you have been reading and responding, and I'm most thankful), you'll know my situation.

Anyway, WW moved out tonight. I spoke with her a bit about things but mostly it was just packing and moving. After a long day of almost LBing when I read some email between her and OM, I resisted and helped her pack, move (including a queen mattress and boxspring) and drove it all to her new apartment, moved everything up 3 flights of stairs for her. She thanked me, but showed little appreciation otherwise.

The only real moment of anything clear regarding us was when I asked her how she was feeling when she first came in. She was obviously very depressed, and seemed very short and cold to me. She said she didn't have a good day, and she was feeling confused. Not sure what the truth is though, since I read emails she sent to OM all day and they sounded just fine and dandy to me. Not sure which is the real her.

I told her that I wanted her to know that I had hoped she'd stay. She told me that she felt forced out, and had no choice. Unfortunately I'd LBed enough to really get her out. I told her I wish she'd have stayed and given us a chance (though she may have, she was not willing to give up OM and my Plan A wasn't strong at the time). She then said, "I'm not ready to be your wife right now, and I'm not sure that I'll ever be." That was more than I'd gotten out of her in weeks, though.

The first thing she said when I opened the door was that she wanted the cat (recall my earlier post). I told her to take the cat, no problem at all. I guess she expected a fight. Funny though, the cat is still here - She said she'd get her tomorrow instead. I'm wondering what lies she'll weave to the OM tomorrow regarding how I didn't give up the cat and she has to come back another day to fight me for it or something.

After I helped her move a TON of heavy stuff up to her new place, she came back for a few more things and just before she left, I sat her down to tell her a few things: That I never wanted her to leave, and that anything I did or said over the past few weeks, it was never in the hopes she'd move out. Unfortunately, I found MB too late, and had already urged her several times to get her own place when she continued to see OM after D-Day. So, I guess sometimes we get what we ask for.

Tonight, there wasn't a lot of hope in the air, at least from what I feel right now. I gave her a little goodbye note and wished her well, told her that I still loved her and that I am here if she needs me (staying away from Plan B for right now since it's only been a month). She said she'd give me her new phone number when she got it (though I can't see why I'd use it).

However, she didn't seem awfully moved or sad by anything I said or by the note, as she had been previously when I'd done similar things. I'm not sure how to read that, except maybe that she is losing her feelings for me completely. At least in the past, when we talked about things, she would cry and seem upset.

When she left, I got a very cold, one arm around me hug, brief. She told me she'd be back tomorrow to get more things. That was about it.

Not a very promising night, from what I can see. Any thoughts, folks?

ALS:

Yeah, I got a thought (and on only 3 active brain cells, 2! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> ):

This point of yours struck me:

"The only real moment of anything clear regarding us was when I asked her how she was feeling when she first came in. She was obviously very depressed, and seemed very short and cold to me. She said she didn't have a good day, and she was feeling confused. Not sure what the truth is though, since I read emails she sent to OM all day and they sounded just fine and dandy to me. Not sure which is the real her."

I think the depressed WW is the "real her." This caught my attention because my WW was always complaining and unhappy about her daily activities, things that went wrong at work (and it's a goofy outfit, so things go wrong a lot! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> ). Now that we're doing better (true recovery starting, I believe) she's cheerful with me EVEN WHEN THINGS GO WRONG. She's cheerful because I'm not LBing and am truly loving and understanding like I've never been before (and never thought I could be, I guess). Anyway, your WW is depressed because she's not inwardly being very successful in following this path she's chosen. She's blaming you for "pushing her out" because she can't face the plain fact that it was her choice, pure and simple. She probably even left the cat because she wants an excuse 2 see you 2morrow!!! It sounds different from when you read her emails, because she can't hide her emotions very effectively in person.

I wouldn't be at all suprised if she calls you a lot, maybe even many times a day. But I'd stay in your plan A mode for a while now. Sure, don't call her and bug her, but it sounds like you don't plan 2 do that. But do answer the phone and talk 2 her when she calls.

Take care, ALS. You're doing well.

Well, 2long, it's great to hear that from you. I wish I had your optimistic attitude all day long, but you really do give me a good boost! I hope that if something was WRONG you'd tell me that, too, though, I mean I'd rather know than be under any false impressions.

My WW was a generally depressed person, has been that way a lot of her life. She had her good days and bad days. OM will find this out soon enough, once their "honeymoon" is over. Right now they have just started PA, but the thrill of that I expect will die down eventually, especially now that she is on her own. At least I assume it will. You never can be sure.

Once the OM sees the real her, once she starts letting some of that show though, that I think will be the true test of the A. He might be able to deal with it a while, heck, maybe even longer (I still love my W despite this quality of her, though I tried too hard to "help" her with it), but when we long distance dated, she required attention 7 days a week, and lots of 4+ hour phone conversations. If OM is ready for that, I guess they'll continue on a while. If not, it may go sour soon.

I don't plan to call her at all, really. I will miss her sometimes, that I am sure of, but I also know I can keep myself fairly busy, especially with the house to keep clean and orderly on my own know. As for her, with a new place and not a lot to do in it, without companionship, she's going to get bored -- FAST. And at first she may turn to OM, maybe if that starts to fail is when she'd turn to me.

I'm just hopeful she doesn't call only when she needs something or to talk about the impdening no-fault Dv that she wants to get started.

Regardless, I'll take her calls, and I'm sure it'll be nice to hear her voice if she decides she wants to talk to me. I wouldn't expect that for at least a couple of weeks though, from the last day I see her.

The cat -- Well it's a nice thought, but she also did have a lot of stuff to pick up anyway tomorrow, so whether she took the cat or not was no real bearing. I more think she was in a hurry to get back to her place and call/see OM so she didn't have time to pack up all the cat's stuff. I am tempted to check her email again tomorrow though, just to see if she tells the OM more lies about me, such as that I tried to hide the cat or fight her for it. That was the most shocking of all to read today, when I noticed she was lying to OM to make me look bad, when I was in a Plan A! Unreal.

I bet she doesn't even tell OM all the help I gave her, carrying heavy stuff up 3 flights including her mattress. She'll probably say someone at the complex helped her. After all, OM must think I am this HORRIBLE person that she MUST get away from.

Oh, one final thought, when she drove away -- After the short, cold hug, I told her to take care of herself. She said, "We're gonna be ok." Not quite sure how to read that one either.

Ah, well. This can only get easier once all her stuff is out and I don't need to see her so often. I still plan to continue reading HNHN, LB, and SAA, I'm learning so much. If my WW doesn't want me back, someone else will be lucky to have me! Then I'll ask HER to read the books as well. That way, this will never have to happen to me again. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

ALS:

"Well, 2long, it's great to hear that from you. I wish I had your optimistic attitude all day long, but you really do give me a good boost!"

Believe me, if YOU had said the same thing 2 ME back in February, I wouldn't have been able 2 understand the optimism either!! (sometime, for entertainment, check out some of my threads from months ago... ...you're doing FAR BETTER than I EVER DID!)

"I hope that if something was WRONG you'd tell me that, too, though, I mean I'd rather know than be under any false impressions."

I don't believe in false impressions, so I would tell you if something was wrong (assuming I could discern it, that is!).

"Once the OM sees the real her, once she starts letting some of that show though, that I think will be the true test of the A."

You could almost bet money on this, but don't (because it's not good 2 "expect", just "hope").

"The cat -- Well it's a nice thought, but she also did have a lot of stuff to pick up anyway tomorrow, so whether she took the cat or not was no real bearing."

I'm not so sure. Wait and see what happens 2morrow... maybe she won't pick up the cat then, either... or maybe she'll need the box of $h!tty litter next... or something else. ;o)

"I more think she was in a hurry to get back to her place and call/see OM so she didn't have time to pack up all the cat's stuff. I am tempted to check her email again tomorrow though, just to see if she tells the OM more lies about me, such as that I tried to hide the cat or fight her for it. That was the most shocking of all to read today, when I noticed she was lying to OM to make me look bad, when I was in a Plan A! Unreal."

Don't try 2 make sense of this stuff. Just hang back and work on yourself.

"I bet she doesn't even tell OM all the help I gave her, carrying heavy stuff up 3 flights including her mattress. She'll probably say someone at the complex helped her. After all, OM must think I am this HORRIBLE person that she MUST get away from."

Hey, my W claims she NEVER said bad things about me, and yet I found an email that "omitted something important that I had done but would have probably put RM (initials for Rat Meat) off. the weekend before she sent him an email telling him SHE had found a hard spot in her breast, *I* found it and urged her 2 get an appointment with the doctor. Why didn't she tell him? Because she didn't want him 2 know that I loved her. (It wasn't cancer, thankfully).

"Oh, one final thought, when she drove away -- After the short, cold hug, I told her to take care of herself. She said, "We're gonna be ok." Not quite sure how to read that one either."

Don't assume. She probably meant you 2, 2gether or apart. But don't worry about it. Fog's set in.

"Ah, well. This can only get easier once all her stuff is out and I don't need to see her so often. I still plan to continue reading HNHN, LB, and SAA, I'm learning so much."

Do me a big favor and read Greg Baer's book "The Truth About Relationships" while you're at it. It's my favorite of all that I've read so far.

"If my WW doesn't want me back, someone else will be lucky to have me! Then I'll ask HER to read the books as well. That way, this will never have to happen to me again."

Good for you!!!

ALS,

You have done this whole thing very very well. I have a recommendation for you. Stop reading her emails, just assume that what comes out of her mouth from now on is a lie and you will be right most of the time. Why stop? Because it is hurting YOU.

You have done a good plan A and hopefully you will continue it for awhile yet. You will never know how affective your plan A has been until her A is over. Most find that it was more affective than they thought. It is too soon to go to plan B as 2L said. But, reading her email is taking you love away, so stop it.

She acted as many here have done in the past. She is cold because she is protecting herself and the betrayal she has committed. She will probably have a great time in her new apartment for about a month perhaps a bit more, but eventually living alone will get to her. She could move in with OM, but then that will shorten the time for the A to live.

She is lying to him as you know, so rest assured he is going to be getting his punishment fairly soon. So will she, you won't have to do a thing in that regard.

Now, I have a few other thoughts for you. As someone even older that 2L, if that is possible <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> I must say you are too young to be in this mess. I realize you love her, but she has been depressed most of her life as you said and she is hunting for the fix. In my opinion you are/were a "nice guy" so she hoped you would "fix" her problems you didn't so in less than one year the marriage is over according to her.

You my friend probably like helping damsels in distress. You like being the nice guy and women that need help probably attract you. Let me offer you some advice from someone who dated ALOT. There are wonderful women out there that don't need your help nor need you to fix them. They will STILL appreciate that you are a "nice guy". They can love you just as much, BUT your life will be much better with a well adjusted woman that one that has been "depressed most of her life".

I am not advocating that you just dump her, and run off to get divorced. What I AM advocating is that before you take her back (yes I think you will get another shot at this) make darn sure she has had counseling and is on anti-D's. If she won't do this, then don't take her back.

Young man, life is too short to be married to a woman that needs 24/7 care and has run off to have an affair within 1 year of marriage. You are married and I think you should try and see if this can be repaired, but if she wants to go, let her. If she wants to come back, make darn sure a professional has "fixed" her. You cannot "fix" what ails this woman.

You have done this very well, you are learning some very hard but valuable lessons. Get on with your life and enjoy it as much as possible until this thing is resolved one way or another.

I hope something I have said helps you.

God Bless,

JL

<small>[ November 11, 2002, 08:26 PM: Message edited by: Just Learning ]</small>

JL and 2l,

Wow, you two are absolute SAINTS. Thank you for your continued insights into this. What would I do without you?

To address JL's post first, in general:

Thank you for saying I should stop reading her emails. Secretly I kept hoping her password wouldn't work. Take the temptation right away. You're right, they are hurting me to read them. I never see anything good. But at least I was able to see what she was saying. God, I love her parents, I hope she doesn't tell them that I cheated on her or something as her excuse for leaving me. I can't trust her to tell anyone the right thing anymore. I almost want to email her folks and tell them what's been going on, but that's not appropriate for me to do, is it?

I realize I am losing love for her because of these emails, but I think I was also reading them because, as you said, this was such a short marriage and I want to make sure that, on the rare chance she wanted to try us again, that I could trust her. So far, her emails indicate I can't. But if it's just fog that's going to burn off, sure, there may be a chance.

The depression thing is a tough issue. In fact, she blamed the way I handled it as the reason the A started. I tried to cheer her up always, or (mistake) solve her problems by talking through them, instead of just listening. On a few occasions, I suggested she see a doctor about it and get medication. Well, that was a MAJOR LB for her, she told me that she doesn't want to take a medication to alter her, that she is the way that she is. I wonder if a lot of people with undiagnosed/unmedicated depression say that? Anyway, I guess at this point, were she ever to want to come back, how would I approach telling her that she needs to see a doctor about depression first? I think she is still convinced that the depression was being caused by me, when it clearly is just inside her, just waiting to come out again. Might make it hard to convince her. But yeah, if she was medicated, I bet a recovery would be SO much easier.

She is stubborn, so I think you're right, she will have a good time at her place, but even if things start to go bad, I doubt she'd ever "crawl back" to me. I can't even be sure at this stage what would happen. Due to the fact that the OM is her co-worker, and she loves her job more than anything else here (her words), there would almost need to be an immediate chain reaction were we to get back together: She leaves the OM, leaves her job, thus needs to leave her apartment (no money), and move back here. I don't think I could work with her in good faith if I knew she was still around OM at work every day.

Thanks for saying I have "done this well", as I really wasn't sure -- I did LB a lot and push for her to leave. I was very hurt by her, as she was once so dedicated to me. But I think she just might be a commitment-phobe, or there could be even more wrong inside her head that I can't even comprehend right now. Maybe she'll just spend the rest of her life in a string of relationships, hoping to find happiness but never looking for it inside herself first.

And if not, I will hopefully find a new girl that can be my everything.

2l,

Funny, my WW said the same thing. She said she didn't have a bad thing to say about me. And I thought, good, because there's not really much bad to say? Did I miss out on her EN a little bit by not being as good a listener or conversationalist? Yes. But that's it. I have a feeling that the OM (and maybe her friends) are starting to hear horrible, made up things about me. I truly hope not though, especially her folks. I'm one of those nice people that hates it when ANYONE thinks ill of him. I always want to be everyone's friend. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Thanks for the tip on that book! I'll look it up once I finish my current stack.

I'll see my WW again tomorrow, and I'll tell ya what, I looked a little sad and depressed tonight, but tomorrow, I think I'm going to feel and look a whole lot better to her. Now that she's got a lot of her things out, and I've seen her new place (reluctantly, I'm sure) I feel a little more liberated, and ready to be on my own again. Sure I still have moments of reflection and sadness, but I feel that with her out of the house, it'll be easier to focus on ME.

Thank you! As always, love your feedback.

Don't have a lot of time right now, but wanted to pop in and say...You did good!

A couple of things popped out at me..."she was cold, depressed...etc"...was this before she knew she could have the cat without a fight or after? If before, it's a general statement on her state of mind. If it happened after, you took "the wind out of her sails". She's likely been going over and over in her mind all the arguements she could bring forth over the cat...and no arguement happened. So it left her unsure and confused. /Which could be why she seemed so detached. When you've spent all day building up your defenses and then nothing happens, you hit bottom. Anyway just a thought for you to think about.

Remember...do your best to make yourself better and don't call her...she'll call you.

Hi there,

First a side point:

<strong>
I tried to cheer her up always, or (mistake) solve her problems by talking through them, instead of just listening
</strong>

That's a classic! That's the male 'mr fix-it' approach to things whereas women rather tend to talk - and expect us to listen. I think the bottom line here is that both need to be aware how each other ticks - simply drawing away, interpreting every move as an LB and generally feeling pissed off is certainly wrong. Some elementary concepts need to be understood - both should do some background reading. Note - I am a latecomer to all of this as well, and lots of it was a great revelation! Actually, I think that some of these books (like, about emotional needs, like about the basic differences between men/women) should be compulsory reading before any marriage :-)

To your plan A: Obviously, you are trying hard, and many on this board - including myself - have great admiration for your strength and work. Keep it up! A few hints from someone who has been through the same dark valley:
- don&#8217;t expect instant results. Think in terms of a 6 month time frame thereabout
- your WW will have extreme ups & downs as well and generally not being rational and straight. she'll look you in the eyes and lie, she'll hug & kiss you only to turn around and do the same and more with OM, and so on. Been there, done that. Protect yourself from being drawn into this maelstrom by simply discounting everything she does and says. Count only positive actions on the ground - and safely ignore the rest.
- plan A is about YOU. So do some retail therapy, sign up for this gym or whatever, do those things you always wanted to do.
- don&#8217;t LB! Relax!

Good luck,
N

ALS - a big ditto to JL's reply.

When you coming back east, JL?

ALS, your wife could be my XW's younger sis. A family history of depression and the definition of stubborn.

The good news for you is that you're learning this young and very early in the marriage. It took me about 20 years. Like JL, I'm not necessarily advocating you bolt while the gettin's good, but do widen your scope of potential outcomes and know that you will emerge MUCH wiser and worldly.

Wifey,

Thank you! Again I'm kind of amazed to hear that I'm actually doing this Plan A thing so well, though I do wish I'd found this place sooner. If I was Plan A-ing from day one of D-day, things may have been better. Then again, I may just be a MAJOR doormat by now. And like I said, I actually am feeling better having most of her stuff out. Tonight, she'll be back for the cat and more things, it may very well be the last time she needs to come over for anything.

She was cold and depressed and sort of just zombie-like for the entire time. Her demeanor didn't change much after I told her she could keep the cat. I immediately told her okay and didn't argue at all, she started to MAKE her argument anyway, and I just kept saying fine, fine, take the cat, it's fine. But she was very quiet and distant for the entire night. It definitely felt like it hurt her to have to say "Thank you" for helping move all her stuff, and she seemed to not be thrilled for me to even see the inside of her new place. So yeah, that could be true about the cat -- I really gave her no arguments or resistance at all last night.

No plans at all to call her, what happens next, happens. I'll handle email the same way. If she writes me something, I'll write something small back. I assume OM will still pressure her to file the Dv, but I am leaving her to do all the work on that one, even though it is no-fault as we discussed, if she decides to go through with it.

Nick,

Thank you! I'm glad you understand what I was saying with the "fix it" approach. Instead of her trying to understand me, like I am now reading and learning why she needs me to just "listen", she just shut me out and gave up. Not a good approach. I hope one day she may be as open as I am to understanding why things happen, instead of just reacting. The OM is supposedly this "GREAT listener", something she claims I never was, hence why EA and PA started. We'll see how long he can last. Then again, she stuck with me for 3 years, maybe she can put up with OM the same amount of time before getting tired. Who knows.

I'm back in the gym, and feeling good. Can't really afford therapy at the moment, but will go there if needed. Thought about trying Anti-D's just to stay focused but today I feel I'll be okay without them. I won't be taking anything WW says with any credence for a while for sure, and I'm going to focus on me. I have a lot to do around the house anyway. And I won't expect to see any results for quite some time. A is still going strong, maybe even stronger than ever, so I know she'll be in la-la land for a while now that she has the freedom of her own place.

By the way, anyone heard this one before? She claims that OM has nothing to do with her leaving, and she was going to go anyway -- Do they say that a lot? I'm not sure if she was trying to protect me, her, or both of us, by claiming she's NOT leaving me for OM, she's leaving me for herself. If that was true, and A failed, wouldn't she STILL not want to come back?

Tonight, I don't think I'll feel as melancholy as I did last night. It will be hard to see the cat go, I love the little thing, but I will try and hold it together as I am sure me being upset is big LB for her (will cause guilt I assume).

WAT,

Thank you. I am at least thankful for that as well. This could have been much worse if it happened further down the road, if we had kids, whatever. I am not one to just give up on anything, especially my marriage, which is why I continue to try. Were my WW to ever want to come back, there would definitely need to be a plan, not just a half-assed attempt. If I couldn't see her really TRYING to work on us, I would be too afraid that I'd waste more time of my life with a person who just can't possibly be happy (something she said a lot to me over the past years, she's just NOT a happy person and I should stop TRYING to make her happy all the time).

Anyway, I will drop back in later today or tonight, going to do my best not to read her email today as it will just upset me, and I am feeling pretty good today (so far!).

Will keep you all posted. More responses always appreciated and welcome!

ALS

<small>[ November 12, 2002, 06:38 AM: Message edited by: ALostSoul ]</small>

ALS,

Have you ever read the story about the Trojan Cat? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />
You don't realize it but giving her the cat, something that you were very attached to as was she guarentees that she will be reminded of you. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

I would speak to her parents with regard to the divorce. I would express to them this isn't something you want and have and are willing to work very hard to rebuild the marriage. However, if she wants the divorce you won't fight her. They may know of OM, or they may not. I am not sure I would bring it up. If they ask, perhaps you could simply say she has met someone else. And leave it at that.

She WILL lie about you, just as she WILL lie to you. There is nothing you can do about it. Those that know you will know the lies from the truth, those that don't know you really don't care and will believe what they want.

You are right she may last 3 years with OM, but I doubt it. You see this affair is going to drive her deeper into depression once the high wears off. She won't be much fun to be around.

The point is now that she is gone, you need to be pleasant to her when and if you see her. But, focus on yourself and your life when not around her. She is likely to run to the divorce court and get this done, but I think you will get another shot at this whether you want it or not. My bet is you won't when the time comes, but one never knows.

So do your best to be kind to her. Protect yourself, and LEARN. If you don't learn a lot from this whole mess, you will have failed to turn this thing into something positive and it is within your power to make this a painful but positive experience. If I could recommend anything it would be to set that as your goal: to make this an overall positive experience by growing from it.

Must go.

God Bless,

JL

Thank you JL, you are obviously an incredibly wise and insightful person.

Her parents and I were never very close (she was never very close to them as well, rarely speaks to them) so I won't contact them. If they contact me, I'll try and fill them in as best I can. I hope she doesn't try to tell them I kicked her out or cheated on HER. I know in the big picture that doesn't matter, but I seriously hope she doesn't have to sink that low to cover up her own mistakes.

Thank you for the advice about focusing on myself. I am doing just that. It's amazing, but I can't believe how much I have already learned from this event already. I have learned so much about myself, and relationships in general. I've read tons of material at this site, lots of posts, and the books. Everything has taught me so much. There is no doubt in my mind that I am already a better, wiser person as far as relationships go, even after just a month of this.

I will still have a lot of questions (getting another post ready now) while everything is still so fresh in my mind, but with each passing day, everything that's happening seems to come into perspective and make so much more sense.

If she races to file Dv papers, I won't stop her, I'll sign away and keep the lawyers out of it. As I've said in the past, we have no disagreements about any property or finance, since we haven't been married long.

And if she wants to come back, before OR after she files those papers (still a 90 day effective rule), I'll have a tough decision to make regarding her sincerity and my confidence. Of course, I'll keep everyone here at MB in the loop.

Thank you again for your wisdom.

ALS

Hi Als,

Wanted to see how you are doing and must say you are doing fine. It hurts I know and but despite how it looks you are handling yourself quite well. You have great supporters posting to you here. They help me too! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

I also want to apologize for my bad direction about you 'keeping the cat', I read the other's line of reasoning and glad you did the right thing. I concur with the other's post that the cat will constantly remind her of you and your life together (especially if the cat is cuddly and sneaks up in bed with her.....imagine if the cat doesn't like the OM!!! ). Wow an LBIng cat! Hm.....see your support can come from the strangest places! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Back to the serious note, I agree that not reading the e-mails may be healing on the other hand reading them may help you see where they LB. But if they are together more, there could be less e-mail contact. You never know so the judgement call is yours. Use this as a learning experience. For me I thought I needed to know 'everything'. I did at the beginning but eventually I learned to narrow down my real important items in life and it made it much easier to survive.

You have come a long ways in a short period of time. My WS moved out about 1 month after d/d also...... it was painful and my son cried but he left anyway. He lived out there for 5 months until his money ran out and even his A foggy calculator couldn't make his bank account appear positive. So reality has a way of shaking up the fog with or without our help.

Use this time to figure out what will be acceptable for you. You can spend this time learning like JL pointed out.

Keep respect for yourself. It is important. Don't be willing to take her back on her terms as is.

take care,
L.

Thank you, Orchid, you have been most helpful as well.

Well, the cat is something I can't really let bother me. I did originally get the cat for her, as I am slightly allergic anyway, but fell in love with the cat all the same. I'm sure the cat will remind her of me. I wish the cat wasn't so friendly, or it probably wouldn't like the OM, can always hope I guess! hehe

As for the emails, I am going to stop for now, they just hurt me and they do nothing at all to HELP. Sure, I may be able to see where there relationship is and what she is saying about ME as well, but none of that helps me focus on myself, it's more making me focus on her still, and I don't want to do that anymore if I can help it. I want her to do whatever she wants. The hardest thing about this is taking her back. To take her back, I'd feel I would want to know a lot about the A and what went on, why it ended, etc. Reading email would help that. But if her emails are clouded in fog they don't really indicate the truth anyway. So I think, if the time comes, I'd need to give her a chance to answer my questions, and if I believed her, perhaps that would be a start. I at least have enough information to know what some of her answers regarding the A should be. They email each other back and forth all day from in the workplace to pass the time, since they can't talk in there.

Anyway, staying strong, learning a TON about bettering myself, and prepared for whatever might come!

ALS

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by ALostSoul:
<strong>I hope she doesn't try to tell them I kicked her out or cheated on HER. I know in the big picture that doesn't matter, but I seriously hope she doesn't have to sink that low to cover up her own mistakes.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">ALS - do not underestimate the willingness and ease with which she will lie about you. Just keep this in mind whenever you interact with her family/acquaintences. Don't seek out what she may have lied. Just be your rational self and answer questions honestly. The lies have a way of self-revealing to people who matter. Some lies may be so ridiculous that they are not believed by others on their face or will be quickly revealed.

For example, I have no idea what my WS told her family about me, but before long one of her sisters came to me in disbelief at what she heard, and she was right on. I do know she (WS) told her work acquaintences that I moved out of the house instead of her. Duh! How long do you think that took to be revealed?

Keep up the good work.

WAT

ALS ... I'm no expert ... but from a guy in almost the EXACT same spot as you, I think you're doing really well. I just moved my wife this past weekend and am at D-Day plus 30 today. We're a little further along and our friendship is re-developing. Keep up the plan. It can be pretty amazing when you do it right ... and it sounds like you are.

Whippit,

Wow, I didn't know our D-Days were so close.

You are definitely further along than I am, as I really don't feel a friendship with my WW wife at all right now -- Not that I'm not trying, but she's not offering me anything at all back right now, she is being extremely distant whenever she is around me. With her being out of the house now, and my not planning to contact her (modified Plan A), I'm not sure I'll be making a lot of big steps anytime soon. I'm impressed that just 30 days in, with your wife out of the house, you're actually redeveloping your friendship already. Good for you!

Is your story/posts anywhere around here? I'd be interested to read up about what you've done since D-Day and see what's gotten you this far.

Thanks,

ALS

ALS ... My story is available from the link in my signature below. You can also see my recent post history (and anyone else's for that matter) by clicking the screen name to the left.

In a nutshell, my WW and I have a long way to go still. On my D-Day I learned that my W is not only having an affair, but is in love. Yours is telling you something different ... but I wouldn't count on it being the truth. I had suspected for some time (six weeks or so) and actually began Plan A almost immediately. So when D-Day hit I was well into it. I also got some great counsel from my parents who have had their own troubles (although I don't think there's been any infidelity there).

Another similarity: I'm about five years older than my wife (who just turned 30 a week before D-Day ... I wasn't invited to the party). We've been together since she was 19, so she feels she's "missed out" on stuff. Sounds familiar, I bet.

Here's my recent posts: here and here

Just keep the faith and always try. If you want, I'd be willing to trade email addys.

Good move on getting back to the gym. It helps elevate seratonin ... which will help any depression you might be experiencing. I've dropped about 30 lbs since mid-september. Getting back to work now my wife is moved.

whippit

Yep, I think that may be some of it as well. My WW never did have an independent lifestyle, either. She lived with her parents, even after graduating high school. After a couple years, she tried college and moved away from home, but after about a year of that, she couldn't take it and begged to move in with me and leave school. Against my judgement, I let her.

She's lived with me ever since (even before getting married). And she's never made friends down here (aside from me and my group of friends) until recently. So the fact that the first thing she did was have an A once she had new friends really hurts a lot. It makes me wonder if she was ever a trustworthy, faithful person EVER. The first opportunity she had to cheat and she did.

So, starting this week, it's the first time she's truly been on her own, supporting herself. She has a pretty good job here and now she has her own place. Rent, bills, and the like are expensive though, so she'll have to struggle financially, but she'll make enough to tread water.

I don't want to believe it, but I'm afraid my W might just not be a very faithful person. She revealed to me after D-day that the last couple of her realtionships lasted 3 years as well (same length of time she's known me). She said she didn't feel she wanted to ever be married or commit again, just be free to do as she pleases.

Does she LOVE the OM? I'm not sure. I'm sure she could convince herself she was in love very easily. I wouldn't be surprised if she told him she loved him already, or very soon, but that's not something I care to hear or know. Even if she did, I would take it with a grain of salt. She said she loved me so many times, but to be able to do what she's done to me, I really wonder if that was EVER true (even though she claims she STILL loves me). When they say that, you just really wonder where it's coming from. How could you EVER hurt someone you love THIS MUCH?

ALS