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H came today. He has spoken to SH. He said it was good. rah rah rah. THere was nothing else. Its over, my marriage that is. ITs time to move on now I guess. There nothing left. Not even an inkling he may still love me.

I'm really sad. I'm in tears and I'm hurting really bad. I suspected this would happen. I guess at least I know what I have to do now.

I know everyone will tell me I'll be fine, life will be better and I'll find someone and live a fabulous life, but frankly I just don't want to hear it ok.

I'm too sad right now to even think past the next ten minutes. No matter how much you love someone, no matter how much you show them or do you best to improve, sometimes it will not matter. Even though you know you are further ahead even though you know you now have the answer, God just won't allow it.

It you want to give me advice now, just tell me how I survive the next few days, how do I survive the next month, the next year? There was hope before, now its gone completely. I wish there was something else I could have done, I would do it.

<small>[ November 17, 2002, 06:03 PM: Message edited by: Seahorse ]</small>

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((((((((Seahorse))))))))

Love and hugs to you. It may not seem like it now, but there is a great life out there waiting for you. With everything in it you deserve. Take care of yourself and know you can always get support here. I'd love to hear from you again.

There is no easy way through the pain other than to just take it one day at a time and dont be afraid to lean on family and friends when you need support. There will be tough times but they too will get further apart as time goes on. Just remember how special and loving you are, and there will be someone very special who appreciates you and deserves to have the love of a great person like you.

You are in my thoughts

Robyn

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Seahorse -

I think you are being just a tad premature. Just because your husband didn't say WOW, Steve was incredible, I'm going to committ to you and work on our marriage doesn't mean that its over.

Geez, my husband was lying to Steve, running internet personal ads, dating, all kinds of stuff when we had our sessions. Steve told me to divorce him.

It was roughly 6 months later that I saw the impact of Steve's talks to my husband - when my husband made a decision to work on the marriage.

Seahorse, Steve simply tells each partner what they need to do to be married. Each person still has to make a decision to do it. Without that decision, nothing is going to change. Just keep your chin up and wait for Steve's talk to percolate in his brain.

And then call Steve and get feedback - Steve will honestly tell you if its over or not. I don't think you should be making that judgement right now!

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Hi BR, I neglected this from the post earlier. I rang H later on this evening. He said he did not want to work on the M and that there was nothing else I could do or say to change that. He told me that obviously I was taking this much harder than him and that was that.

He also said he is very happy with OW and that he can't just walk away from it (I did point out that was what he did to me, but apparently that is different).

I guess its fog induced, but its very hard not to take it personally when you're told that he's over your 11 year marriage in less than 10 months. I find that insulting.

I can't really see any hope from this now, and I really don't think it would be 'heathy' to keep on the way I am. If he is happy with OW so be it. If he was so unhappy with me for all those years and she makes him happy, good!

If I thought there was any hope left, believe me I would cling to it, just ask SS and WAT.

<small>[ November 16, 2002, 07:41 AM: Message edited by: Seahorse ]</small>

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Thanks for the hugs robyn.

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If someone tells you its over and they're not going to work on the marriage, I can't see what else you can do. I've been plan aing for 10months and I'm going nuts. Its healthier for me to just get on with my own life now.

I don't know if I sound angry. Well I am! I angry at the world right now and I think I have every right to be at least for the next few hours.

I put in 100% It should have been enough but it wasn't. He knows how much I love him but its not enough. Everyone keeps telling me how wonderful I am, well why can't he see it?

I don't think I'm being premature, I think I'm trying to deal with the current reality.

I understand what you are saying, thank you for posting to me. I'm not angry with anyone here, I'm angry with myself more than anything.

<small>[ November 16, 2002, 07:13 AM: Message edited by: Seahorse ]</small>

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Seahorse,

HUGS!!! I have been where you are right now and not very long ago. It is an awful feeling to know that for whatever reason our H's are just "over" us. Its a real kick in the stomach and nothing anyone can say or do is going to change the fact that it hurts like he!!. You will in time see that your plan A was beneficial if not for your M for you personally. I feel so much for you. I wish I could be there and give you a big hug, take you out to dinner and let you cry on my shoulder. My H said much the same to me, also telling me how wonderful I was. WHAT?????

I also got to the point where I kind of knew it was OVER. I still have hopes but it is too painful and counter-productive to continue to pin my life's hopes on something so fragile.

I do have to agree it may be premature, but I was told that too. It has just gotten to the point that my focus has changed. First it was 100% saving my M, plan A. Now it is ME, MY KIDS, Making a life for us and me. If H comes around???? I don't know anymore. I love this man with all my heart have put all my energy into this for almost a year with NO hope from him. I just couldn't and wouldn't do it anymore. I WILL NOT LB him, I WILL NOT turn my back on him but as I said my focus has changed. I am taking my life, my changes good and bad, working them out and moving forward.

Time will only tell if your H will be happy. But I feel like my H won't because he is looking for something that isn't a reality. It is a dream. But if it takes him 1 or 2 yrs to wake up I probably won't be here.

I hope this post doesn't make you feel defeated or sad. I guess I am still working through the anger and sadness. But, I must tell you I DO feel better. I am a little messed up right now but I am coming along. I didn't think I EVER would be okay with all this but I am getting there. I can feel it. I believe I will be okay. I believe you will too. I know you don't want to hear that now I didn't either. My advice for the next few days, weeks is take ONE day at a time ONE hour if necessary. Try to focus on the here and now. Don't waste your time and energy on wishing, worrying, trying to read that magic crystal ball. I think you will find this is a phase just like all the other phases of this horrible mess. I was AMAZED at how quickly it faded. You are still on the stupid roller coaster. I think you will find yourself leveling a little. But, watch out those lows can really still hit and hit hard.

If you feel like crying, yelling, screaming, being a B****, go for it, if you want to be selfish for a while. You can. It's okay. Take care of yourself. Validate your feelings. You've been through He!! and Back. YOU WILL BE OKAY!!!

Seahorse, take care. I will be thinking of you.

Love

Sharon

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</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">If you want to give me advice now, just tell me how I survive the next few days, how do I survive the next month, the next year? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">

How do you survive? Step by Step, moment by moment, nanosecond by nanosecond.

That's how I did it the first time and this second time around when infidelity hit my doorstep.

Hugs and prayers to you,
Twiisty

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Hi Sharon and Twisty. Thank you for your replies ans support. I'm as mad as hell right now. If this is what he wants then, this is what he'll get.

Your email didn't make me sad Sharon, this situation makes me sad. My revenge will be having the best life ever. I'm angry with him, with myself and with God.

Don't be surprised if you see a few angry vents.

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Seahorse,
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><strong>I'm angry with him, with myself and with God.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">You should get angry with WH but you get even w/ your WH, find your own happiness and take care of yourself ... show him what he is missing, ready to move on w/ or w/o him. You should not get angry with yourself. You should be proud of yourself ... who you have become from the D-day 'till now ... growing, glowing, and shinning. About The All Mighty, we are all His children. This mess happens for a purpose and like a children learning how to walk ... we have to trust HIM that HE will never let us fall down and HE will catch us but HE teach us how to walk in HIS Grace. No body say our first few steps are easy and painless. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> . I rather take the red pill (the Matrix) and learn that there is a fullfiling M that I could have rather than half baked M that I used to have. It is painfull.

-RH-

<small>[ November 16, 2002, 03:10 PM: Message edited by: redhat ]</small>

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I'm so sorry. It's obvious to all of us you are in tremendous pain. I don't know about everyone else but, it's times like this I wish I had the right answer, that one word that would make it better. You don't have to do anything now but breathe...take one second at a time, for now.

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((((((((((((((((((Seahorse))))))))))))))))))

Call me if you need someone to talk to.

Love and healing light,

Jacky

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Seahorse,

It's okay to be angry. Just remember God had nothing to do with this. He will help you. I felt the anger to. It is part of your recovery. It was part of mine. Take care. Vent all you want we are here for you.

Luv,

Sharon

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</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">It you want to give me advice now, just tell me how I survive the next few days, how do I survive the next month, the next year? There was hope before, now its gone completely. I wish there was something else I could have done, I would do it. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Seahorse,

I had originally planned on not posting to MB much, but a couple of weeks ago I decided that maybe I could help others.

You see, I am not one of the ones here that had a marriage to survive. Most that I read here are either in recovery, or still married and in conflict with their spouse.

My XW walked out about 7 months ago, and 3 days later I found out about her 2-year long A. We never reconciled, although I wanted to. My DV was final on 10/17, and the EX has re-married. Wierd thing is, she is NOT married to OM. She married someone that she has just known for a few weeks, and married just 3 weeks after the DV was final.

Anyhow, I realized that are several on here whose marriage does not survive, and I thought that my experience through my ordeal may be of some benefit. I realized that MB is not just for BS's and Ws's working on their M. It is also for those of us to help ourselves should we be DV'ed.

With that, here is the attitude that I take. Spacecase sort of liked the way that I put my thoughts over on a post of his. My thinking is that I have wished that I could go back 10 or 15 years and know what I know now.

I now have the chance. You do too.

So, you are early 30's. What is the difference between you then, and now? The big difference is that you are MUCH wiser! You have the same capabilities that you did then. The thing is, you don't have nearly the weaknesses. Think about it....from your knowledge that you have gained through all you have gone through, you are MUCH more powerful than you could ever imagine.

There is a future! There is a BETTER future than the one that you had at 20-25 years old. Your sense of direction is now sharper. You now know how to achieve goals and maintain them better than most. We think that we forget the how-tos and the such after we have been married for a while. Well...we don't. People who have affairs prove that we do not lose that capability just by getting married.

The only thing is that we think we no longer have them, because we no longer use them. We become "comfortable" in our marriage, and usually is one of the characteristics that cause our M to fail. To revive a marriage that is salvageable, we have to become "uncomfortable", and get down in the trenches and work on it.

Seahorse, you shared YOUR life with your H. YOUR life still remains. You chose to commit YOUR life to him. Although it is hard to see sometimes, YOUR happiness relies on YOU! Another person, whether it be your H, or your next R, does not control what you get out of life.

That is entirely up to you.

You have the knowledge. You have exactly what it takes to survive this.

Can you think of anyone whose marriage has ended, that has had to live the rest of their life alone? That is HIGHLY unlikely. There are those who choose to live in the past, and they waste what remains of them. They waste what they can contribute to the world. They waste the knowledge that they have gained. They refuse to share their happiness with others.

Your happiness that you share with Mr. "X" at a later stage in your life may very well be heaven-sent to that person. You could be part of God's plan for SOMEONE else!

Don't concentrate on what you gain from all of this. Concentrate on what you can GIVE, out of what you have learned.

Too many times we focus on the imaginary thought that we, somehow, could not hold our marriage together. I think that for a lot of us that is where our pain is actually derived. Not that we are "losing" something. Our pain and despair comes from the sensation of being a "failure".

Does a doctor become a failure because the person won't let him do surgery? Does the auto mechanic become a failure because someone won't let him work on the car?

You can't lose a game that you are not allowed to play in. And sometimes our spouse chooses to not allow us to "play" anymore. That does not make us losers or quitters. We go out to find another "game" where we CAN play. In marriage, the "routine" is the same after the M ends. Just the main players are different. Sometime the next team that we go to will even suit "our style" better than the one we came from. Sometimes it's the "change" that we fear. Not that we feel that we are uncapable of doing well. We know we can. But...we get too hooked on the "comfort factor".

Even though I have just been "single" for a month or so now, I have actually been that way for 7 months. A few months ago I could not even begin to imagine life without the EX. Lately, I have had the feelings of "attraction" to be nourished in ways. I know I can love again. I know I can love someone other than my wife. Remember, love is a choice.

If you can be "attracted", the rest is easy. You go for a while without that need being met, and trust me...you will feel it. That doesn't mean to immediately act on it. Savor that feeling when it happens. In all actuality, that is probably something that you, and I, haven't felt in a long time.

When that hits you, and it will, the rest is downhill. You will know that you will get through all of this OK. There are thousands out there that would cherish the thought of someone like you. There are thousands out there that you would, too.

You have to choose to do it. It's really that simple.

There IS life after. There really is. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

God Bless,

Boo

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Hcii,

I second all you are saying. Great advice!!. I am sort of where you are. I am also feeling the attraction thing. It is so weird after 24 yrs. Thanks for your post it helped me too. I have been alone for almost a year. D is not final. But I am actually almost looking forward to it. I feel trapped now. I haven't seen my H for more than 10 days total in a year. I want to get on with my life.

Thanks again for your insight.

Take care,

Sharon

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Remember, the best revenge it to live well.

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Dear Seahorse,

You have shown us how much you do love life and those who love it. Keep in your heart the love of right and the right to be loved.

We are all painfully aware that some we love make stupid mistakes and though we know it, we have to let them have 'their way' for the moment. In some cases, it means to let go.

The anger piece is a part of your healing. No need to browbeat you on it....... it is necessary to heal. I went to the ocean to yell. I also knew that the ocean is where he took her. I was offended because the ocean was MY sanctuary and the mountains were his. So he took her to Yosemite also. Another trigger anger point for me. Well I took my anger to the ocean. I yelled at the waves and I so much wanted them to remove me from my pain. But you know I needed that pain to heal. Was my heart scarred? Yes. But it did not need to stay as an open wound as it is for you right now. Time does heal but how we use that time will depend on how to heal. It will be minute by minute at first...... you have already been through that and once this initial shock wears out, you may find that the pain will not last as long as the rest did. It may make you even mad that you are not in 'enough pain'. Sometimes the BS wants in a way to continue to hurt thinking that not hurting means not caring. That is not true but we think it anyways.

The bottom line is that you do have to watch and see how you do. That is why it is important to concentrate on you. He says you are taking it worse than him.....don't worry.....his worse time is still to come. Yours is in the past. See the difference? You aren't living in fear it will get worse......you have seen it already......in some crazy sense that may be comforting.

Please take care.

Hugz,
L.

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"Tell me how I survive the next few days"

KICK SOME BUTT !!!! Thats how.

Take some classes in martial arts .... and work the anger out in a constructive way.

I MEAN it!

Empower yourself to physically demonstrate the rage and anguish you're feeling.

Not only will you "release" all those feelings ... you'll get stronger as you do this.

Physical work outs release a powerful natural morphine ... that will wash your brain with helpful neurotransmitters .... and it is a win-win situation.

You cannot feel sorry for yourself while you are screaming and yelling and punching and kicking.

GO KICK BUTT!!!!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

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Seahorse -- I only came to the boards today to check in on your situation knowing WH was coming over on Saturday. I can't add much to the great advice you've already gotten, particularly from hcii, but I can send my thoughts, prayers, and belief that you will survive. It's true that right now you will only be surviving, but I do believe from all that you've written here over the last ten months that you will thrive once you get through the anger and pain.

Believe me you are entitled to your anger and pain, but you have too much life in you to make them a way of life.

The advice you got to go kick some butt is a good one. When I'm really angry at my WH and know he's with OW and lying to his family about me I work out hard and I mean hard. This morning I went cross country skiing and you'd better believe I kicked some butt or at least left some people in the dust.

There are no magic words or magic bullets which you know already, but there is still magic in this life. I will be thinking of you and imagining you out there kicking some butt.

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Hello all, I appreciate your support. Its monday morning here, I am at work, its very difficult. I am taking it easy on myself, but still trying to be a productive employee (as best I can-I'm taking morning tea to write this) and 'get on with life' - if I keep going through the motions it will get easier right?

I rang H this morning as the last conversation we had was not great. I clarified that if that's what he wants then fine, that up until recently I thought there was still a chance.

He said that obviously he WAS still unsure but NOW he's not and that now he's spoken to steve he understands why he has moved on and that now someone else is meeting those needs he dosen't want to go back to 'that' (meaning our marriage).

It was very hard to not hit out, to control myself. I didn't say much, I couldn't I didn't know what to say, what could I say? I wanted to say no! 'You're a fool'. I wanted to scream at him. His clinical 'that's the way it is' tone offended me. This is how my H acts when he has a job to do. And I'm the job. Time to get rid of her, no emotion, don't show any emotion.

Can someone really get over you that quick? I feel insulted and hurt. I don't believe I was that bad a wife. Whatever!

I am trying hard to be happy for him-he has found his happiness, its really hard when you feel so ****.

I'm trying really hard to remain positive, I feel like if I start internalising negative stuff right now it will turn on me and become a part of me. I want to live the best life I can now, but I'm so worn out and emotionally exhausted I don't know where to get the energy from. I wasn't always a negative person.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> This mess happens for a purpose and like a children learning how to walk ... we have to trust HIM that HE will never let us fall down and HE will catch us but HE teach us how to walk in HIS Grace. No body say our first few steps are easy and painless. . </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Redhat, I'm trying to trust, but sometimes I wonder if I make the right choices.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">it's times like this I wish I had the right answer, that one word that would make it better. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Thanks mgm, I know everyone here would like to do the same thing. I know.

Thanks Jacky, I know you have your own set of problems right now. Ditto for you. If it gets to much call me and I'll listen.

Hi sharon, thanks for that. The anger always takes me by surprise and scares me, although less now as I learn to control it better.

hcii - thank you for your post. I guess I wanted to be one of those whose marriages survived. It dosen't look that way right now. I think you are great to post, it would be easier and probably less painful to not post after the marriage is ended. I cannot post to others right now other than be support for them. My advice right now would not be sound.

Starting over with someone new, if thats where all this goes now, is going to be really scarey. At this moment even though I have learned so much the fear is there that I will fail again, that the mistakes will happen again. Yes, H does have me thinking that I failed, and badly, so badly that he could never return to 'that' as he puts it. I keep telling myself it takes two, but sometimes the doubt creeps in. What if I stuff up again? I don't want to go through the pain again.

I know I've grown a lot, but right now I don't feel very powerful. I feel tired and worn out. I feel scared and alone. I know that even if I had 10 people here I would feel the same. He has someone to get him through this.

I do think about the future, parts of it excites me, but then I get scared, so I stop. For now I can't deal with it, knowing he probably won't be in it.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Your happiness that you share with Mr. "X" at a later stage in your life may very well be heaven-sent to that person. You could be part of God's plan for SOMEONE else!
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I hadn't thought of it that way, but its way to early to anyway. The thought of someone else...I just can't, I don't want to.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Don't concentrate on what you gain from all of this. Concentrate on what you can GIVE, out of what you have learned.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I have to think about this for a while. I tend to give too much and I have given a lot this year to one person (him). I'm not really sure what I have to offer right now or if I can give to anyone right at this time. I help people where I can a little bit at a time.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Our pain and despair comes from the sensation of being a "failure".
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Yes, I thought I had got over that, but the feeling is back.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Does a doctor become a failure because the person won't let him do surgery? Does the auto mechanic become a failure because someone won't let him work on the car?
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">No, this is true. I understand.

Alazarin - thanks, I know, I'm looking for the energy to do this.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Time does heal but how we use that time will depend on how to heal. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Orchid, this is what scares me. I know this is an important time, meaning that there are a few roads I could chose. I want to chose the road that leads to healing and happiness and I was on that road, but I am constantly fighting negative thoughts and it pisses me off. I'm pissed off that I've been put in this position.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> you have already been through that and once this initial shock wears out, you may find that the pain will not last as long as the rest did </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Yes, I believe that will be true, this was a particularly hard blow this time.

I have contacted MB for another appoitnment with Steve, to debrief more than anything. I'm going to make it clear to Steve that I don't want anymore false hopes. H is armed with MB principles now, he can make his life with her wonderful.

I have joined a Divorce/Separation group with the local church, I will go tomorrow night and (try) to discuss this and see if they can help me work through this bit.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> GO KICK BUTT!!!!!! </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Pepperband - I've thought about martial arts for a while, but chose dancing instead. I went off to a Jazz class yesterday, even though it was the last thing I felt doing. I enjoyed it while i was there, but the feeling come back when it was over. I think its just the way it is right now, just have to ride out the waves when they come and not sink.

Hi USH, I'm not quite at Kicking Butt stage. Maybe later. I'm exhausted right now.

I'm not a very good skier, I've only been twice, I enjoyed it though. We don't get heaps of snow down here in Oz.

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