Bramblerose,

I need your help to sort thru something. From what I have read, there are some similarities in our situations.

Steve Harley, suggested to me as well, to separate myself from WH. WH has been involved with cocaine as well as alcohol and his A continues. Our conversation was in July. (WH is currently denying everthing. He lives 1200 miles away but I know that he is still invlolved and using)

I started going to alanon in July mainly because I respected what you had to say not only to me, but in all your posts.

For me, I am having a hard time telling WH that we must separate until he is clean and sober and has stopped seeing OW2. I have detatched and let go in many ways so that WH has the opportunity to experience the consequences of his actions.

Finances have been horrendous, but I have been doing whatever I can to prepare the kids and I financially. I have seen an attorney and my plans were to file a legal separation, but there isn't any in Florida. There is something called spousal support without dissolution of the M.

I need help in figuing out how to get over this barrier. Did you have trouble? Or are you a different type of person than me? What did you say to yourself? What did you have to overcome?

Now, my head knows what I need to do, it's getting my heart to co-operate. I have been asking God if I am delaying because of fear or am I supposed to not say anything yet. I don't have a clear answer. Then the uncertainty drives me crazy & I berate myself for not saying anything. this becomes a viscious circle.

I am doing well emotionally and it's a relief not dealing with WH. In I can see how our whole time together has been ruled by alcohol and not based on anything wholesome. It had been two sick people, now one is getting weller. BTW, I am a sober alcoholic myself of 10 years, so I know the deal. It just doesn't make it any easier.

Any words of wisdom? Any questions that I need to be asking myself?

God Bless,

D.

I am not BR, and I did not have to deal with alchol or drug addiction, just an OW addiction!!!

I let go of the whole mess and gave it to God. I asked for His will to be done in my life, STBXH never wanted to come back to our family so there was no need for me to go to plan B. I did what I had to do legally to protect myself and the interest of my children to the utmost, I believe that that was the Lords will for me.

I decided that I no longer needed contact with STBXH, as all he was giving me was garbage, I distanced myself big time!!!! I feel very sorry for my STBXH as I see him as a very sick man, that is so far buried in the fog, I continue to pray for him and the OW that the Lord will work in their hearts.

I have kept the letters and cards that we first shared in our marrriage and thru the years, just a reminder that it WAS GOOD and that he did love me, he has tried to re-write our history and I wont allow it.

As far as the barrier, you allow it to be that or you chose to go over it!!!

As I said BR I am not!!! She is such an awesome lady with so much insight and way of putting it into words. But I did want to share with you after reading your post as I too respect the lady a great deal.

I hope that you can sort thru my thoughts, they get jumbled some!!!

Dawn <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Thanks daybreak for your response. it's the barrier, I've let it have me cuz I haven't figured out how to go over it yet.

I continue to pray for him and the OW that the Lord will work in their hearts. That is hard to do, but I am praying for the same thing.

God bless,

D.

Hi D,

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Steve Harley, suggested to me as well, to separate myself from WH. WH has been involved with cocaine as well as alcohol and his A continues. Our conversation was in July. (WH is currently denying everthing. He lives 1200 miles away but I know that he is still invlolved and using).</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">So your H hasn't even come close to a bottom.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I started going to alanon in July mainly because I respected what you had to say not only to me, but in all your posts.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Yay! Good for you!

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">For me, I am having a hard time telling WH that we must separate until he is clean and sober and has stopped seeing OW2. I have detatched and let go in many ways so that WH has the opportunity to experience the consequences of his actions.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Ok, well....couple of things leapt out at me here. First, you already ARE separated. So why are you having to tell him anything? Is he asking to come home? If you are drawing a boundary, then telling him really shouldn't be an issue. If you are trying to get a reaction...or trying to force a solution...well that might explain the difficulty. Secondly, as I said to Topie in her thread...what are your motives? Are your motives to fix him, or to respect you? Sounds like you are struggling with the first, and trying to do the second....but you are missing an all important ingredient to the mix: acceptance.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Finances have been horrendous, but I have been doing whatever I can to prepare the kids and I financially. I have seen an attorney and my plans were to file a legal separation, but there isn't any in Florida. There is something called spousal support without dissolution of the M.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Well now you know you have options. 1. do nothing, figure out how to take care of yourself and your kids without any help. 2. File for divorce to get the support that you need, and that your husband owes you and your children. 3. File for spousal support and then remain in the status quo for as long as you choose to.

Let me point out that #1. may appeal to your pride (I don't need his help, I'll do it myself), or your exhaustion (easier to do it for yourself than fight him), and/or your fear (I am afraid to do anything to provoke him). It is also what I would consider the most enabling. Your husband is allowed to continue his behavior without any financial or legal consequences.

#2., requires acceptance.

#3., requires acceptance too, but might be a better interim answer while you work on earning #2.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I need help in figuing out how to get over this barrier. Did you have trouble? Or are you a different type of person than me? What did you say to yourself? What did you have to overcome?</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I had to overcome my fear, my self-loathing and disrespect, and most importantly, my pride and self-will.

Did I have trouble?!?!?!?!? <heehee>

Glad you asked.

I've tried alot on this board to post about my successful story and recovery. I had really wanted to give encouragement to help those at their lowest to try just a little while longer, not to give up in anger or despair.

Unfortunately, the result I fear, is that when I do respond to people, I get the impression that they think I can't possibly understand THEIR situation because its so much worse than mine!

I guess I really do a bad job at communicating that the success that I enjoy now is because of the blood, sweat and tears, the agony and the despair and the hard work that I put into fixing ME. And that if I had not been willing to do that, I would not be enjoying the marriage I have now.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Now, my head knows what I need to do, it's getting my heart to co-operate. I have been asking God if I am delaying because of fear or am I supposed to not say anything yet. I don't have a clear answer. Then the uncertainty drives me crazy & I berate myself for not saying anything. this becomes a viscious circle.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">ok, I haven't expanded on the "acceptance" thing here because I wanted to give you this thread to read. I think it will help.

http://www.marriagebuilders.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=31;t=006216

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I am a sober alcoholic myself of 10 years, so I know the deal. It just doesn't make it any easier. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Aaah, but I will disagree with you more than a tad. Recovery issues as an addict is much different than recovery as a co-dependent. You are lucky to get the honor of being both. With 10 years of addiction recovery under your belt, its definitely time to start working on the co-dependent you <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> don't worry, you get to rub shoulders with celebrities like Melody Beattie! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

hope this helps <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

BrambleRose: Is your story posted somewhere? I've noticed in a couple of your posts that you were pregnant when the A was going on.
I'm in that same situation and now my WH has said he wants out of our marriage and has started talking to his lawyer.
I started a thread today called "how many WS actually go through with D?" and more of my story is there...

Just wondered if you had any thoughts you could share?

BR,

Thank you for your response. I have printed out this post and the one on acceptance so I can really think thru what has been said.

God Bless,

D.

BR,

Here are my initial responses. I have printed out all of the posts that you have bumped so that I can really think through this (my part).

This is off subject -
Do you have an alanon step study? or know where to get a good one?

Now, back to the subject at hand .....

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> So your H hasn't even come close to a bottom. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I totally agree. We had a conversation a few weeks ago, and what it told me was that he is in strong denial of his alcohol and drug problem, but about the problems of living.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Ok, well....couple of things leapt out at me here. First, you already ARE separated. So why are you having to tell him anything? Is he asking to come home? If you are drawing a boundary, then telling him really shouldn't be an issue. If you are trying to get a reaction...or trying to force a solution...well that might explain the difficulty. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">We have lived apart but not officially separated. We also talked about that recently. WH origiginally left to take care of his father who was critically ill. My comment to WH was that when he left it was like we were separated but he just didn't tell me. His response that was partly true, part not. I didn't get a straight answer on the explaination of that.a

After his Dad passed away, my Dad became critically ill & passed away the following year. I was distracted from relationship & actually after WH's Dad passed away, WH became withdrawn, angry and critcal. When he was home, we couldn't stand to be around him and couldn't wait for him to leave.

WH started a branch of our business in the Northeast. In our small area, there are many who work outside of here, so that didn't seem so unusual at first. When his mom died and dday surfaced, the S&*% hit the fan.

So to this day, we have not talked about a separation. But it's like the big pink elephant in the living room. My delsions have been strong. Looking back it was not a healthy M. As I learn more about R's do I really see our R as very sick.

I don't feel like I am trying to force an issue. It's true that many find sobriety when forced to face the consequences of thier actions, but many do not even then. Only God knows for sure. I feel my reluctance has more to do with my fears and self image. If I had a strong self image and had confidence, it would be easier to make a decision. Also, I am a strong Christian and believe most get DV too fast. However there comes a point where enough is enough. I must accept that WH is an addict & he may never find sobriety.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Secondly, as I said to Topie in her thread...what are your motives? Are your motives to fix him, or to respect you? Sounds like you are struggling with the first, and trying to do the second....but you are missing an all important ingredient to the mix: acceptance.

</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I feel I have given up trying to fix him. Only
God can do that. The illusion of WH getting sober & staying that way dies harder. I am working ont he self respect thing in me. A question I ask myself - can I respect me & stay? Not that I am saying I will, just a theoretical question.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Well now you know you have options. 1. do nothing, figure out how to take care of yourself and your kids without any help. 2. File for divorce to get the support that you need, and that your husband owes you and your children. 3. File for spousal support and then remain in the status quo for as long as you choose to.

Let me point out that #1. may appeal to your pride (I don't need his help, I'll do it myself), or your exhaustion (easier to do it for yourself than fight him), and/or your fear (I am afraid to do anything to provoke him). It is also what I would consider the most enabling. Your husband is allowed to continue his behavior without any financial or legal consequences.

#2., requires acceptance.

#3., requires acceptance too, but might be a better interim answer while you work on earning #2.

</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I am inclined to start with 3 and then could move to 2.


I'm really getting tired so I will call it a night but will be back with some more thoughts that don't seem to be forthcomming at the moment.

Thanks again BR,

D.

BR,

I've just come home from an alanon meeting & shared a revelation of sorts. I had been praying for wisdom and guidance & heard Let go there's more. To me that meant dv or legal separation.
I was focusing on that and then would berate myself for not doing it. Then the cycle would start over.

What I realized is that my circular thinking was getting me nowhere. I had to turn it over to God, ask for help, pray & listen. I began to realize that Letting Go is a lot of little (baby) steps and at times giant leaps. I have taken a lot of those steps and have more to go. When I am OK, then I will say the words. It might be tonight, next week, I don't know. That DV or M, that I take me with me.

I'm going away till Fri night on business but taking the print out of the posts that you bumped. I have 6 hours each way in the car & have great alanon & positive thinking tapes for the ride.

God Bless,

D.

WGGT, If you read the link BR posted, then you know how crazy I was not very long ago. Steve H. also told me to divorce my H. I fought against that option, dragging my H along to several other MCs. He'd go for a session or two until he'd decided that, like Steve, they were all on my side. But even they couldn't make him see that I was "right."

Finally, late last Spring in desperation, I gave my H the final ultimatum, get sober & end the A, or it's over. That was the last time I talked to him. In the interim, I've gotten an alarm system, after he broke into my house, threatened to kill me, and ended up with a number of charges against him, and I've changed my phone #, cell phone #, and e-mail address in order to end the hostile threatening communication I was getting, despite the fact that I never answered.

Unlike BR, my H didn't come back, but neverthless, I'm finally being restored to sanity, as it promises in the 12 steps. It's been a slow process of letting go. I was addicted to the drama, afraid I couldn't live without him in my life. But I had to just keep putting one foot in front of the other by making the healthiest choices, for me, that I was able to make: maintaining no contact, lots of Al-Anon meetings and reading and rereading Al-Anon literature, calling people when I felt like isolating, exercising regularly, forgiving myself, etc.

My H has chosen to stay in a lifestyle that I no longer want to be part of. He's an alcoholic and a drug addict and a spousal abuser. He hasn't worked in 2 years, neither has OW, but he's taught her how to use needles like he does. He doesn't have contact with his family. He's been evicted from all 5 places (and been 86'd from several motels) he & OW have lived for the past 2 years. I clearly was wrong in thinking that I knew what he wanted better than he did!

Meanwhile, I no longer feel responsible for him or humiliated by his behavior. I don't blame myself for his mistreatment of me. I'm running our business alone and actually doing a fairly good job. I have lots of friends and a reasonably active social life.

I filed for divorce and got a restraining order in July 2001. I didn't pursue it until a year later, after I ended contact. Because of our business, it's a slow process of digging up financial records, etc. I still feel sad, scared and wistful about the loss of my dreams, but time is slowly healing the wounds.

LetsTry,

Thanks for the post, I have read some of yours & you have gone thru a lot. It's good you are taking care of yourself.

I'm headed out of town so have to sign off now

D.