Well, it's been over a month since I suspected my W's EA/PA, and we're closing in on the month anniversary of D-Day. It feels like it's been a lot longer, this whole thing has changed my life so much. I guess a lot of you feel/felt the same way, especially when you didn't see it coming. Your life goes from having this tangible future with another person, and suddenly, everything is just a big question mark.

I wish things didn't happen so fast for me, since it seems like so many of you here were able to Plan A and had WS's that were at least willing to see you and talk to you following the A. My WW, ever since EA/PA started, has been distant with me, quiet, not open to me meeting any of her EN's at all. 3 weeks after D-Day, she was already out of the house and in her own place. I'm alarmed at how fast things seem to be going on the downward spiral towards D. Though I did LB a lot after discovering the A, I'm at least over that now, but I worry if the combination of that is what amplified the A even more, and drove my WW to an even closer PA with OM. Though that's still on my mind quite a bit, I'm trying my best to work on myself during Plan A, instead of focusing on her relationship with OM.

This weekend, I went to help my Dad paint at his new house and saw some family. Seeing family for the first time after you start having problems with a WS is the worst. With Thanksgiving and Christmas coming up, I figured it was best to tell my family members SOMETHING about our problems, just so they wouldn't be surprised if/when my WW wasn't there for the holidays (plus, I'd hate for them to buy her Christmas presents, considering at this point she still seems to have no interest in getting back together). Anyway, I decided to tell my family members just that we were having some problems and that she moved out to her own place. I left it at that. No talk about the A, I feel that's something left between my WW and I and just a few close family members and friends. They were very understanding, and told me that they were very sorry to hear that, and hoped things worked out for the best. They said if we were to reconcile, she would of course still be welcome for the holidays and otherwise. I have a really great family.

It's now been almost a week since my WW and I saw each other or spoke. Considering I am still in Plan A, I decided to send her a very short e-mail this morning, just to let her know I was thinking of her and hoped she was happy in her new apartment. No mention of OM, A, or anything like that. I assume that was acceptable? I do wonder if she misses me at all, or if she's just happy and content at the new place. Since we don't have children though, and no real reason to talk, especially once she gets the rest of her things from the house, I think sending her an occasional e-mail is a good idea, right? I think, otherwise, we may be in a deadlock, both too stubborn to be the first to contact the other.

I do let her know that, when we DO see other, that I am here for her anytime she wants to talk or see me. So at some point, I do think I will need to be the person that backs off and waits for her to contact me. E-mail is best for us right now, since phone calls seem to be out of the question -- If I call her at her new place, OM will probably be there and I'll be able to tell by the way she talks to me on the phone. I can't really call her at work, that's not something that's allowed, plus OM works with her, too. I do wonder if her and OM have a big future, working at the same place all day and then spending nights with each other as well.

I realize I'm still in Plan A but I don't want it to be a pushy Plan A, where I do all the reaching out. I do still feel like I made mistakes in forcing her out of the house so quickly, but I just wasn't strong enough to see her leave the house and come back, or stay out all night with OM while still living with me. I wish I'd had the strength to work a better Plan A while we were still living together, but even after a few good days, I'd always end up LBing. Since she's left, it's been a lot easier not to LB, in fact I believe I have pretty much eliminated them at this point.

I'm hoping that my WW may come out of the fog and come back to me to work on our M. I can't put any conditions on a recovery, and at this point just hope that if she did come back, she would be willing to leave her job and possibly look into some anti-depressant medication, maybe even for both of us. But I can't think about that unless she's even willing to give us a chance. If she wanted to come back, but NOT quit her job and still see OM every day, that would be a very tough call for me. As much as I want her back, a recovery for us would involve complete dedication from each side. I just hope I'm doing a good job showing her that she has a safe place to come back to, and that I have no intention of holding the A over her head or never forgiving her. I think she knows she would need to leave her job AND the OM to come back, and that makes it twice as hard for her. If only OM wasn't a co-worker. She may think of coming back sometimes, but then I think she realizes that not only would she lose OM, but her job too, and that makes it even tougher to want to reconcile. In her mind, the OM and her job, maybe not on their own, but together are definitely a better choice than me right now. And that does hurt, but if that's how she truly feels, I can't change that.

Anyway, if anyone has any other suggestions for following my Plan A path, things I can do while my WW continues to see OM actively and lives apart from me as well, let me know. I realize I can't force my WW to come back or change her mind, but I just want to be sure that I'm doing all I can to show her that I still love her, and I would still love for her to be my wife again. If she's convinced that a life with me is hopeless, there's nothing else I can do, but if she even has a glimmer of hope, I want her to know that I am here for her.

Still hopeful,

ALS

<small>[ November 18, 2002, 11:30 AM: Message edited by: ALostSoul ]</small>

ALS - I'm with you on the e-mails, but not too frequent, and supportive and upbeat, not needy. Nix on the phone calls unless you have a legitimate reason, e.g., money matters. Consider sending her a card or some special greeting for Thanksgiving - if this was an important occasion to you two in the past.

Regarding "conditions" for her return: IMHO, you should welcome her back unconditionally. It's better to get her back in close proximity to continue Plan A than to not have her back at all. Stipulating that she quit her job and cut off contact PRIOR to returning denies you that opportunity. The conditions are more akin to Plan B. Clear?

WAT

WAT -

Clear as a bell. I think the conditions for her return were sort of assumed before she even left. She even told me, the day she moved out, that for her to come back to me, she felt she'd need to quit her job, because OM would be in her life every day otherwise. Now, if he starts to LB and the A falls apart, I'm not sure what that changes.

I agree with you though, and I would take her back unconditionally, well, except for that in doing so I'd have to assume she was coming back to work on our M. I did give her some stupid ultimatums early on before I found MB, and said things like "Don't have sex with him, or I'll never take you back" or "If you move out, that's it for us, don't come crawling back to me" and the like. I do think I have let her know in the past weeks that she would still be welcomed back, but I'm not sure.

Any suggestions on how I could do this now that she is out? I've already given her a letter but even that may have been a bit vague -- Is there any way I can let her know that it's still not too late for us, and I would still take her back unconditionally if she wanted to come back, without seeming pushy or desperate or controlling?

ALS

I think you're doing all you can do for now - assuming you're hard at work on your self improvements.

Did you post the letter you sent?

You could consider sending another letter later to update her on your improvements, if appropriate.

Keep in mind that she may decide to move back without the intention of working on the marriage. Can/will you allow this? I say yes, but others may argue not to.

Important point to remember: the affair is likely to end DESPITE what you do or don't do.

WAT

WAT,

I have been reading my butt off and learned so much. It's funny, before D-Day, I always thought, yeah, I'm like a PERFECT husband. I provided for her, paid all the bills, put food on the table, bought her lots of cards and flowers, showed her a lot of affection, but there were still IMPORTANT ENs that I just wasn't fulfilling. And that was going on for MONTHS without me even realizing it.

The biggest problem was that she regressed into herself and became depressed when things didn't get better, instead of talking it through with me. Harley's books and this site have taught me so much about how much better our M could be. I think, if only she would open her mind to the possibility, there's so much we could learn together. But I also realize that she might never get there, OR that by the time she did, it might be too late as I'll just be ready to move on myself.

I think it's a lot easier for folks whose WS's at least END the A when it's in the open. My WW got even MORE intense with the A (also because it was so new and I discovered it so quickly) and each day she's out of the house is another day she's getting closer to OM, at least that's what drives me batty sometimes. I have no doubt (nor does she, I believe) that their relationship will be long term, but it's fulfilling her needs now, future be damned (her perspective).

She went this far, signed a 1 year lease, and is setting into her place quite nicely. I think if I were able to have convinced her to stay at the house, she may have continued the A and not wanted to work on the M, but now that she's out, I don't see her coming back unless she has hope for the M. She is too proud to come back solely for financial reasons. If she came back to live here, I would have to think it was because she at least missed me.

So, the beat goes on. I posted a thread up in the EN forum if you want to check that out, WAT. A few folks are helping out there. It's got the latest details. She's coming over tomorrow to pick up more of her things, first we'll have seen each other or talked in a week (longest since we've known each other). She also mentioned she was doing okay but is lonely and not sleeping well at night.

So, anyway, that's the latest, in short.

Thanks for your continued insight, WAT.

ALS

bump (for WAT and others)...

ALS - I don't have any more specific recommendations at the moment. One general thing for certain - you need to hunker down for the long haul. An acronym you may see around here some is PTC. Patience, time, consistency. Your vision should be long term, like following the stock market. You can't react to every current in the river. Don't count your chickens in one basket. (oops, ignore that last one.)

I highly recommend you pick up a copy of Private Lies, by Frank Pittman.

WAT

Thanks, WAT. I'll pick up that book after I finish reading through all my Harley books.

In case you're interested at all, I am getting a lot of excellent help from some other MB'ers over at the EN forum, in this thread. Updates there as well.

ALS's Plan A Thread From EN Forum...

ALS ... how are YOU doing?

Whippit -

Not too terribly bad. I have a lot of friends and family that are keeping me company and have been very understanding. Everyone is there for me regardless of the outcome, and no one is holding anything against my WW should we reconcile, so that is a good position to be in.

Generally I have been very busy. Going to the gym a lot, working, etc. Sleeping pretty well. The A and my WW are still on my mind for a good part of the day, but I don't get overly sad about it as long as I keep busy. Weekends will be the hardest, when we used to spend the most time together. I have been busy on the weekends, but being in the house alone at those times isn't easy. I imagine it's not for my WW either when OM isn't around.

But, I am doing my best to move on with life, taking care of house chores, cleaning up, and prepared for either outcome. Thanks for asking!

ALS

ALS:

You're still doing very well under the circumstances, and WAT's advice in his posts 2 you have been EXCELLENT.

No conditions, no LBs, no talk of your R or the A initiated by YOU (and none encouraged if initiated by HER if YOU aren't ready 2 discuss them without LBing).

Take your time. WAT's right. The odds are high that this A won't last. But it could take several months longer 2 crater on its own. But that's what it has 2 do. Don't interfere.