I have to say that counseling has been great. I have been focusing on me, on the things that I need to improve upon as a person, a mother, a wife. I can see that there is a difference in my home; even a difference in the man that less than two weeks ago thought it would be better if we divorced. He asked me what I thought he'd have to do, what we'd need to do in order to make our marriage work, and I told him I thought that we'd need a clean slate. I was honest with him; I told him I didn't know. I said I was his wife, and that as long as he wanted to work on our marriage, then so would I. He finally has the FOM behind him, and believes whole-heartedly that I have as well. I've been honest with him; I told him what my feelings are for the FOM and then explained to him that I do not dwell on him and he has no place in our lives. That's all I know to do. He seems to be content with that. For me, I am trying to let go of the things I cannot control...the things I do not know. I am learning on how to deal with his depression; I am taking psychology courses that focus on abnormal psychology and immersing myself in scripture. Like I said, he seems happier and things appear to be going well.

I expressed a desire to move... to start over. He agreed and we're getting the house ready to sell. We're looking at other houses in the area as well as other states. I felt stupid for a little bit, like I was letting the FOM run me off (he has called as recently as the week of Thanksgiving, when I finally confronted him on it). He's been much more emotionally stable the last few days... we've been trying to spend time together, learn to be friends. This all points towards being very positive, but... I'm scared to believe too much in it. What if it's like all the other false starts that we've had in the past? What if we turn our entire life upside down and in a few days, a few months, once the newness wears off, it's too much for him?

Can I do this? The last year has been so hard emotionally, that I'm not sure if I can handle any more disappointment.

Just DO IT, dernnit!!!

You guys have the chance I didn't have!!!

There is no TRY, only DO!! (Yoda)

Thank you...very apt quoting Yoda, my husband's world has revolved around him for a long, long time... one could say from "Long ago, in a galaxy far, far away" my husband's love for Star Wars was borne. In fact, he even has 6 foot character cut-outs gracing his computer room.

You're right of course, I have to do it. I will do it... but how do you get past the fear? Every time I feel myself let loose, I think, "Don't get too comfortable; don't get emotionally entangled any further than you are... the rug will just be pulled out from underneath you again." And then I wonder, am I setting us all up for failing by thinking that way? And if so, then how do I get myself to stop thinking this way?

<small>[ December 17, 2002, 05:25 PM: Message edited by: TheStorm ]</small>

As long as we are in a science fiction theme I would like to offer you the Bene Gesserit sisterhood's litany against fear from Frank Herbert's 'Dune' series. I hope it helps you.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">
Litany Against Fear.

I must not fear
Fear is the mind-killer.
Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration.
I will face my fear.
I will permit it to pass
Over me and through me.
And when it has gone past
I will turn the inner eye
To see its path.
Where the fear has gone
There will be nothing.
Only I will remain....</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">

Hi Storm,

You raised a question about fear of trusting, and how to overcome it. I wanted to offer you my point of view.

Fear is a warning sign that we develop early on in a defense against things that can potentially hurt us. I find a lot of times that it helps to understand the trigger behind the fear. What is it about the situation or action that is causing you to feel afraid?

Then you need to evaluate the details. Ask yourself specifically what the worst case would be? Then look inward towards your instincts to tell you what the answers are.

It's a hard thing to do, and it takes a real leap of faith sometimes. I always find that GOD helps me through and that once I've gotten to the other side, I've learned something important about me and my character.

Imagine the other scenario that if you chose to trust and you were not let down. What would be the worst scenario there?

I hope this helped.

<small>[ December 18, 2002, 08:26 AM: Message edited by: kily ]</small>

Kily-

Thank you very much for your insight. You brought up a very good point about God giving us the strength to do what we feel we can't alone. I know that I should "turn this over to God" once I understand it, that's just extremely hard to do... but at least now I do know how to do it!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

My fear is for myself; my fear is for my children. My husband and I are very, very different people. Our outlooks are like day and night... literally. I look at the good in the world (mostly) and he looks at all that's wrong with it (mostly). My biggest fear is that if he lets us down or feels that he can't do this, that my children and myself... we'll start seeing the world as he does. I worry about the kids because if we're not 110 percent committed to this, and we end up getting divorced~ OR worse, staying in a loveless marriage for "their sake" that we're going to permanently scar our children's lives and they'll end up in loveless marriages too, because that's what they saw modeled. We are at the point we realize we don't love each other, but know that at one point (apparently it wasn't at the same time?????) we did and are trying to rebuild on that. But is it enough? I know I'm letting these fears own me... indeed, I've had whole days where I sit on the couch in front of the computer (or not) and cry for all that we've done because I can't see the way out. Really, the only way I see out now is God. I'm trying to let Him lead me blindly by faith... but I haven't exactly built up my relationship with Him in the last couple of years, so it's really hard doing, ya know?

You're right: if we don't let each other down, then the worst thing that could happen is that we have a normal, quasi-happy, complete family... whereas right now we have a family that has been falling into the abyss of destruction and pain. I guess when you put it that way, what exactly do I have to lose??

The support here is amazing. I was really afraid to post this, but it has been burning in my heart for a long time... really since the day I stood up to the FOM and I realized I wasn't going to stumble in that way again (you can say you aren't, but until you've been tested, you never really know for certain). I am perfectly honest, I don't know whether or not my marriage is going to succeed, but knowing there is a place where I can come and voice my questions and concerns without bogging my husband down with all of this (he knows broadstrokes, because I don't want to keep anything from him... but let's face it, he's already dealing with debilitating depression, I don't want to make it worse!) is absolutely fantastic and more than I deserve. Thank you.

Storm,

I don't know how much of my posts you have read, but one thing that I clearly have learned and shared in this forum is my struggles through all of this.

I never knew if I really believed in GOD. I never HAD a real relationship with HIM. I used to go into church and feel ashamed and out of place because I didn't think I belonged there. Then one day, I was SO low, I couldn't go on. I knew I wouldn't end my life - I had worked too hard to give up, but I didn't know how I was going to move forward.

That's when I LET GO. I REALIZED that I HAD no control over the outcome of anything. I could make choices, but if GOD wants something to happen, it will! You have to remove all of your expectations - (both negative and positive) and simply believe in what it is HE wants.

I understand what you're saying about you and H not BEING in love. You know what, that is exactly what is supposed to happen! You're conception of LOVE was based on the romantic, fairy tale feelings that everyone is brought up to believe in. THe fact is, YOU BOTH CHOSE to stay and fight to be together - That is what commitment is all about.

WHY fight for it? What was your reasons? You can say the kids, you can say the house, you can say that the finances are easier to deal with...the fact is, if you weren't linked to this person then YOU WOULD LEAVE! None of the other things would be a factor. Look deep inside, beyond the obligatory reasons, and see what really lies in your heart!

There is LOVE there, it is just buried beneath all of the surface emotions - ANGER, PAIN, DISTRUST, FEAR. What you will notice is that if you are BOTH TRULY commited to working on it, and the communication really starts, then the OBSTACLES will start to look less threatening.

It sounds like the previous post has helped you start to think in a different direction. I hope this one does as well.

I have more to say, but I've taken up too much of your time already.

Best Wishes.

I have more to say, but I've taken up too much of your time already.

NO YOU HAVEN'T!!!! Seriously, if you have more to say, then by all means, say it. I check in and out throughout the day, when I need a "straightener." A few months ago, I'd come on here and look at a BS's post about an OW or the pain her WH caused her with her affair when I was feeling like it would be easier to take my FOM's phone calls and just give up. I don't like the way they mostly generalize that all other women are evil, but at least it reminded me I didn't want to be THAT again. Now, I come here when I want to feel stronger in my marriage or need a boost, ya know what I mean?

I know what you mean about your testimony. I am much the same. There is a lot of doubt, a lot of insecurity.. because I don't feel that I have a strong relationship with God. How could I after all that I have done??? But I know I am HIS, I see that now... I've just gone so far off the path it's hard to see where it is now! But, slowly and surely, I'm finding it again. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

Anyway, that was a lot of rambling to say I'd love to read anything more you have to offer, no matter how much it may be.

kily....I read your post and it helped me so much......I needed it so much much today....I just found out my husband has had an affair two weeks ago..and The pain has been so bad,,,and I forgot to look to God for my help....
I don't know how I am going to make it,but I do know I will make it...Thanks again,,,
Cindy31

STOP saying" WHAT IF."

What if monkeys fly outta my butt? (paraphrasing a line from Wayne's World <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> LOL)

You have to let go of your neurotic need/desire to control the outcome! People who ask "What if ... blah blah blah..." are NOT surrendering themselves to God. Think about that !!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Blessings to the stormy one .... you are doing GREAT by the way!

Pepper <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />

<small>[ December 18, 2002, 01:12 PM: Message edited by: Pepperband ]</small>

Pepperband-

First off, thanks! Sometimes I wonder if I'm ever going to "get there," but then I stop and remember there is no "there" ~ it's all about the journey.

You're right. I am a total control freak. Always have been. That's one of the reasons I'm still somewhat suprised I chose to involve myself in an A, because there is very little control there. Which is probably why it drove me nuts! Anywhoo.... not the point. The point is you're right, it is NOT what God intended... it is something good to think about.

Thanks for the thoughts. I love the analogy.... lol

Ok, is this all related??

Our eldest daughter has a virus... and a VERY high fever. I've been up with her for the last two nights checking on her fever, sponging her off, watching her breathing (she has asthema)... all of this while I'm turning the house upside down trying to get it decluttered so we can sell it (I'm world's original packrat... my house is clean, but I'm not sure there are any blank horizontal spaces in our home! lol) Last night, I asked H to pick up littlest daughter (who spent the day with Grandma), on the way home because OD was still sleeping. Well, he was worn out (night before was date night and we were out until 4 am) and forgot. No problem, I'll pick her up so you can go sleep with OD. I go and pick up YD, who wants to go Christmas shopping for her Dad and sister. Sounds good to me, the next week is pretty hectic and I haven't spent any quality time with her today. Call H and tell him the plan, let him know that OD needs all her medicine @ 9. No problem he says. I get home at 11 (really late to have the YD out, I know... but we had a lot of fun and my mom met us so we ALL got to go shopping together, the three of us!) and OD has had no medication. She has a rip-roaring fever of 104.5 ~ ok, my first thought here is to rip-roar my H's head off, but I let him sleep and take care of it. I'm mad at him for not giving her meds, which made her feel worse and mad at myself for going out because "I should have KNOWN he couldn't handle this." This morning, I asked him to take a carton of sierra mist downstairs and into the fridge... wasn't really sure why I had brought it up in the first place, but I had only caught a couple of hours of sleep all night and was hoping to just rest a few more minutes.... well, apparently, the container busted on the way down and all of the cans went cascading down the stairs. I jump out of bed to "find out what he's done now." I see all the cans, and it amazed me that my first instinct was to LB big time with "Ok Einstien, why did you carry the box by the broken handle and are ya gonna clean this mess up?" but, realizing that was NOT going to help our cause, I just asked if he needed help. He didn't, so I went back upstairs. He asked if he could go get the dog food... "No," I said, "Some of your Christmas presents are in there..." This cheered him up (I guess he thought I wasn't going to get him anything???) and the rest of the morning went smoothly... but I still haven't gotten OD's temp under control and that bothers me... she was hallucenating this morning (Had 105.; had to start Emergency treatments)... did get the temp down from that, but now WITH tylenol and motrin, it's back up to 103. I realize that he didn't mean to cause an adverse reaction by not giving her the meds, but he did, and I'm irritated.

Ok, here's the question(s):
1. I'd like to be able to talk to my H about the whole medication thing, but we have never seen eye-to-eye on that and I don't want to LB... I am not sure how to point out my concerns without sounding accusatory, which I don't want to sound, but kind of feel.
2. I am overall doing really well at not LBing, but how long does it take before it's not a second nature response that you have to keep in cheque?
3. Does all of this relate to the control issues like I think it might, or am I just being crazy?