Recently my wife and I are starting to work out an affair she had with her store manager last month. This guy is a real jerk. After my wife realized that she made a mistake and wanted to come clean and tell me about having sex with him, this guy convinced her to keep quiet and that if him and I would become friends, then everything would be okay. Hun? I really can't understand the logic with him or my wife about that one. BUt for 6-8 weeks during the affair, he was over my house twice and him and his girlfriend and my wife and I would all go out for drinks. However, all the time, I was uneasy about being a friend to him, because the moremy wife told me about him the less likeley I wanted to hang out with him. Once everything was exposed and I found out I was really upset with my wife, but I really wanted to kill the OM for manipulating me and my wife and 1/2 causeing all the hurt. I know I sound like a child, but considering his young age, I am thinking of phoning or writing to his parents and informing them. He lost his job, because of all this and he is renting his parents house while they live in another state. I would by no means do anything illegal, but I have sucha strong felling to retaliate against him. I all so know it would be counter productive in recovering my marriage. Help me please!!! I is hard to bury the hatried I have for someone I hadley know.

Your wife could have said no. She is the one who put him into your house.

I really don't see how you can do anything to the OM that will be of gain to your marriage...and that is your goal, right? Healing your marriage?

Often post-affair, the OP becomes the focus of the rage the BS feels. You want your WS and have many reasons for wanting to restore your marriage, so the rage can't be directed there.

And, it doesn't seem satisfying or quick enough to leave the OP's downfall to Karma/reaping what they've sown. But...that is the answer. Taking the high road, and concentrating on loving your wife and the MB 4 rules of successful marriage. The OM is really not your concern, let him live his miserable life the way he's chosen, there's no happiness to be found in being scum. He's already lost his job, probably not quite enough for you, but that's a lot more than happens to most OP.

However, your anger is real and must be managed appropriately. I've found regular hard work-outs help me physically manage the stress and fight/flight adrenaline surges. Pound the heck out of something inanimate.

A good counselor would also likely help you manage your anger.

Lor
I understand your points. I am considering having my wife and I write the OM a letter stating the hurt he caused us and how worng it was for everyone to do this. My wife is reluctant, but for me it is closure, knowing that it is really over. Does this seem approprate or not to do?

frank,
I think the letter is a good idea. I would suggest asking her to write a no contact letter, which is the LEAST she can do to rectify the situation. But Lor is right, it was your W who committed the greatest crime here. She was committed to love and honor you so what she did was WAY BEYOND your standard betrayal, it was downright evil. On the other hand, the OP had no such committment to you and was only doing what your W allowed.

I asked my wife to write a no contact letter but she is reluctant to, because she told him off the day I asked her to leave. Since then I don't see her attempting to contact him at all. I am monitoring the phone and emails, as I told her.
Basically my wife said that she was looking for a friendship in the OM and that things got way out of hand and when she tried to end it he threaten her by saying he would expose everything to me. So I guess my wife played along the whole time, because she knew I hate cheaters and knew what would happen if I found out. That is why my wife told me she was having an affair, because she knew I knew somthing was happening

Frank,
Not sure what your timeline looks like, but give it some time. Your rage will subside to a point where you will be able to deal with it.

In the mean time find an outlet. I started a workout program that KILLS me every day. As I'm working out OM is my motivation. When that stopped being enough I went out and bought a heavy bag. You would be amazed at what even 3 minutes on a bag will do to release tension, stress and anger. Solid investment (only $65) for the outlet, and not blowing up at your wife or driving yourself crazy.

My timeline is as follows:
Suspected wife AE in sept, 2002
Wife confesses to SA in Oct, 2002
Met the OM in Oct of 2002
Strongly suspected AE and SA in Nov, 2002
D-Day Dec 19,2002
Still in contact with OM from 12/19-12/22
WW moved back Dec 22
Therapy on 1/14/02

frankdd! Even though our spouses are the ones who hurt us, broke their vows, I fully understand your anger. I am a BS and it takes two to commit adultery!
While others may not agree with me, I consider them both guilty and equally liable.
The NC letter is good for closure, but if she's already told him off, perhaps you should leave it lie unless he makes contact of some sort. Then it's time for her to write the letter, allowing you to see it and then send it!
To me, when the OP knows one is married, it's like walking up an putting a gun to the BS head! Play russian roulette without giving a damn about you! To me, this is no different than if one actually walked up and deliberately did me harm!
The self defense mechanisms kick in for me. Territorial rights also! I needed to let the OW know that one more false step and she'd be mine!
The anger has a bad effect in healthwise as well. Its' like acid in a cup. It will eat the cup before dripping on anything else. So you need to counsel about the anger if you can.
For yourself! There comes a point after the A where you really have to take care of you! Rebuilding is a piece of work to say the least. But repressing all the hurt, anger is not the way to go for most. Counselors will tell you not to repress it!
But you need a safe place to allow it out! I repressed things for 18 yrs after WH first A. All it did was erupt like a volcano 18 yrs later and make me very ill.
Nip it in the bud now. Do not wait to deal with all the emotions further down the line.
I believe the only people who can change our WS's is them! They have to want to and be willing to go the extra mile.
It's necessary to find out what they felt was missing in the marriage to work to prevent future problems. But let no one put the blame on you or transfer guilt. The WS will try anything to justify what they did. And if you are not aware, you'll wind up feeling guilt, low self esteem and many other emotional illnesses.
There is no justification for adultery! NONE
Only choices people make when they think something is missing and they're too selfish to communicate the problems with Spouse.
I don't believe there is one WS that doesn't know it's not going to solve any problem at home.It's just a good excuse to be unfaithful. And I believe this goes deeper in their internal makeup. There is a lot more going on inside these people than we can ever understand.
We're all capable of many things according to therapist and stastical studies. But a character flaw exist in those who do actually carry through with the any type of harmful behavior.
Lack of moral values, lack of religious beliefs, lack of the ability to care about another person in their lives. Selfish instincts!
For some, it's the me,me syndrome, and if it feels good, do it!
There isn't one who doesn't know the risk of losing all they have in their marriages either. So we deal with the fact that at the time, they were willing to give us up!
I truly believe those who betray their spouses need some deep psychological analysis! Because there is a lot more going on inside them.
Just take a look at your anger. I did! I found I actually could have murderous thoughts without the blink of an eye.
This is not my normal personality! I really do care about others, and try to help many if they cross my path. But in an instant I could feel a rage I never knew I was capable of.
I never buy the excuse I didnt' think. I don't know, it just happened. NO it doesn't just happen. It starts with the fantasy, then becomes reality because they allow it to!
For those who haven't become WS, it's because they have an internal code of conduct they live by! They have a conscience they listen to. They have some moral background and religious knowledge that keeps them in line.
I believe my WH's true self showed up. One I didn't know or like. Someone I truly feel I did not know. But it was the real him, I'm sure.
When one says it was a mistake, I won't buy that either. A mistake is something we accidently have happen or due to unwillingly doing it. I drop a hammer on my toe because I mistakenly took hold of it the wrong way! I get lost driving if I mistakenly read the map wrong, It wasn't a conscious decision to read the map wrong or take a wrong turn!That's a mistake!
Adultery is a choice pure and simple based on knowledge and a conscience decision to enter into the sin.And this goes deep into the character and persona buried deep inside.
For me, two sick people(The parties to the A) got together and created an illness for themselves and others!
God bless, LouLou

One of the underlining problems in my marriage is the age difference. I am 36 and my wife is going to be 25 soon. We have this father/daughter relationship though. She is not on any of the same level that I am regards of education, finaces and sometimes maturatiy. She has conflict avoidance, can't talk about problems. Her ecuse for the affair was, he made me feel good about myself when I talked to him, he gave me alot of attantion. ya right, okay. he played you because he wanted to sleep with you, he told you what you wanted to hear are you that naive to believe him.
The OM has a criminal record, restraining order against him and is 26yrsold with a 10 year old kid. Ohh I am sure he is a nice person.

I look at her having the affair and I say to my self" stupid kid, what the hell where you thinking!"

It sounds to me like your wife is trying to put a nice spin on this. The fact that she would go along with the idea of having this guy coming over to your house for dinner and going out together is over the top. Your wife has to have a screw loose to think it was all right to have sex with this other man at work and believe it was all right for him to hang out with you and have dinners in your home. What kind of a spouse would have such a lack of respect for her husband to do such a thing? I cannot imagine how you could have any respect for her. How could she not think that she was making a total fool of you allowing him to come over to your home
and making you go out with him and his girlfriend? I think you need to do anything that makes you happy and if the no contact letter makes you feel better so be it but I do not think it is needed. I just hope she is not with you because she has no place to go and is truly remorseful for her behavior and her total lack of respect and humiliating behavior toward you and your marriage. You must have a great deal of love for your wife although it sounds like she does not deserve it. I wish you luck.

Well I think both my wife and the OM have a screw lose. While he had his girlfriend liveing with him. He confessed he loves her, and that the day I told her to leave, he said that my wife can live with him and that his girlfriend would not mind. Thats really screwed up. I know my wife made me look like a fool, by inviting him ove rmy house. As I told my wife its not so much the EA she had or the sex, but its what she did afterwards that kills me. I hope she is with me because she loves me and not because she has not where else to go. Though mine gut instincts say she has no where else to go.

Hi Frankdd,

Your last post has so much of "me" in it that it's scary!!!

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> One of the underlining problems in my marriage is the age difference. I am 36 and my wife is going to be 25 soon. We have this father/daughter relationship though. She is not on any of the same level that I am regards of education, finaces and sometimes maturatiy. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Read my sigline and you'll see a 6 year difference in our ages... Like you, we had a "father/daughter" type relationship. For me, one of the BIGGEST hurdles in our recovery was for ME to start treating my W as an EQUAL partner in the M. This was one of MANY of the "messages" of my W's A's.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Her excuse for the affair was, he made me feel good about myself when I talked to him, he gave me alot of attantion. ya right, okay. he played you because he wanted to sleep with you, he told you what you wanted to hear are you that naive to believe him.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Listen to her!!! I know that you are hurt and angry right now... but try to let your anger out in a safe, godly way. Recognize your hurt then deal with it. It sounds like your W is trying to tell you that she doesn't like being your DAUGHTER and that she wants to be your WIFE.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I look at her having the affair and I say to my self" stupid kid, what the hell where you thinking!"</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">...I do hope that you haven't SAID this to your W... even though I suspect that she probably FEELS that way... Get over the "age" difference and recognize that your W is an equal partner in your M and start treating her as such.

Semper Fi,
RIF90

Any idea on how to get over these father/daughter relationships.

Here are some things that I started to do that really helped:

* Listen to your W without interrupting her.
* Use "I" statements instead of "You" statements.
* Take her words at "face value"... don't read into what she says.
* Don't try to "fix" HER problems... she is an adult. Treat her like one.
* Don't try to "educate" her just because you are more "mature" (OLDER) than she is.
* Work TOGETHER in finding solutions for small household "problems".
* Look for ways that YOU can SHOW her that you respect her as an adult.

Hope these help...

Semper Fi,
RIF90

Faith-

Did these work for you? are you still with your wife.

There seems to be an endless amount of books audio tapes and advice on affairs and everything afterwards. How do you deal with the bombardment of all this information?

What is wrong is this? I'll tell you what...

Let your S hit you once, you'll be a pretty sore for a while. It you don't get respect now, waht makes you think you'll get later.
Marriage is about trust, honesty, kindness... then comes love.

How long do you plan to put yourself in this situation???

Think about it... then do what's right...

Yes... Our MC zero'd in on the "father/daughter" bit early on in our counseling. He gave me these suggestions and it took a while for me to get out of my "father" roll, but once I did, I found that my W was much more responsive and our rebuilding process really started taking off.

I didn't find MB until we were well on the way to rebuilding our M... for me, Torn Asunder by Dave Carder was the only book that I "used".

We celebrated our 16th wedding anniversary this past Dec and we plan on celebrating many, many more....

Semper Fi,
RIF90

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> * Listen to your W without interrupting her.
* Use "I" statements instead of "You" statements.
* Take her words at "face value"... don't read into what she says.
* Don't try to "fix" HER problems... she is an adult. Treat her like one.
* Don't try to "educate" her just because you are more "mature" (OLDER) than she is.
* Work TOGETHER in finding solutions for small household "problems".
* Look for ways that YOU can SHOW her that you respect her as an adult.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Speaking as a W who is 9 year's younger than her H and who's friends are mostly 5 to 30 years older than her ... I have to say that Rebuilding's advice is wonderful. This is the way my H and friends treat me. I love it. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Back when H and I were dating there was a woman (40) we both knew who used to treat me like a child and would use my (young) age as weapon whenever we disagreed. My abilities were belittled and ignored because I was 'only young', she 'had so much more experience', and I was 'too young to ever understand'. I resented this bitterly. We don't have contact with her anymore.

Ironically she and her XH are (were??) both having affairs. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> So much for age bringing wisdom. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

frankdd, getting over the father/daughter relationship might be solved in how you interact with her. Of course, she's not as mature. But she's old enough to act responsible.
Do you take a domineering stand with her? do you treat her like a daughter? Do you value her for her intelligence and thoughts? Her dreams, ideas?
Or do you put them down as immature?
There are ways to evolve at any age! She could take some classes, or take up hobbies, join reading groups, poetry groups, etc. Help her to find things that make her feel she's accomplishing something worthwhile and that you're proud of her.
I say this as a woman who was once married to a man 17 yrs older than I.
I am very intelligent, worked hard, and excellent wife and mother. But he treated me like a child. I was not allowed to help make financial decisions, or any control of monies. But guess what? I was allowed to open a business which he controlled but I managed very successfully! It was my talent and my schooling or else there would have been no business. But he took all the income and gambled it away! While I worked many long hours building that business.
If she is not mature enough, then help her along the way. How's her education? Short? Then get her to enrol in college classes. How's her social graces? Rough? Then send her to modeling school, finishing school, or look up what is available in your area to help her refine her talents.
I'm not condoning her behavior and betrayal. But I am answering your ? about the age difference. That isn't a big deal unless you've taken the roll of being the dominate one. Treating her as though her thoughts, ideas or input has no value!
She's to be an equal as your wife. Not under you, or over you, but beside you.
I sympathize with your pain as a BS. I know it's hell to deal with. Unless you believe she's a total loss, then you can do things to rebuild and help her be more of a partner than an underling. There must be something there that made you love and marry her to begin with.
LouLou

lady Lou-

Thank you for the suggestions and your own story. Up until very recently, I tried some of thee things you mentioned. I probably pushed my wife too hard. I want her to be the best she can. When we first where going out, I helped pay for her college classes and then when we got married I paid for her to college again she was almost done last semester, one class left, but she failed it because of the affair she had. Now I told her that she is resonsbile for it now not me. As far as finacies, she has no idea what it means to save a dime. I tried a lot of things. I made her be in charge of paying the bills, but she would forget and then it would go to collection agaencies or she would bounce checks. She would rack up $200 in charges every month, with charges for lunch, gas, clothes ect treat the OM while I paid the bills. Or the cell phone bill was huge, why, because of all the calls to the OM, though she would hide all the phone bills from me and tell me that she does not know where they are. I mean come on. Now she has everything stripped away from her. no credit card, cell phone I have keep an eye on everything.
Now she is complaining that she wants to be on my credit card.