Of all the advice I've gotten from Steve Harley the part I'm having the most trouble with is telling the kids about what's going on. I hate lying to them and feel it's very important that they know I don't approve of the way there Mom is handling this. I had an idea last night to incorporate telling the kids about what's going on along with the separation agreement I'm going to work out with my wife. Part of the agreement on my end is the desire for the kids not to have any contact with OM while we are in the separation stage. I could use that as a starting point to begin a discussion with her about telling the kids. I thought I could very respectfully state that it's important for me that the kids know my values and ideas on marriage and family commitment. I could say that I can see her ideas are very different from mine and that since she thinks it's okay to go live with someone else when things get hard and I don't that we should be able to explain why we think the way we do to our kids so they can easier make decisions on these things when they grow up. You can see where I'm going with this. There is a whole host of things she is doing that I could do this with in a nice respectful way that would put her in the position of having to defend her actions to her children. Part of me loves this idea because it would really force her to look at what she's doing but I honestly think a bigger part of me believes it's very, very important that my kids see that I believe strongly in these ideas and don't want them to make mistakes like this in there lives when they grow up. I haven't read much about people telling there kids one way or the other except that it's a very personal decision. Can anyone share any experiences or opinions?

SM,
I had to tell my 2 daughters (ages 12 and 13) because my H blew up at our 14 yo son on DDay. My son found out by asking why is Mom crying? Is she ok? and my H literally blew up. Told him in the most ugly and foul way exactly what was happening. Well, after that I knew I had to set all 3 kids down and talk openly and honestly...with as few details as possible. I explained to them that Daddy and I weren't getting along so great and Daddy met someone else and was seeing her. They cried, I cried. I told them that I love their Dad and that he made a mistake. I also made sure they knew that they could be angry at Dad (and me) that that was ok and even normal. But that no matter WHAT...he was ALWAYS going to be their Dad and he would ALWAYS love them.
The very HARDEST thing was when my 12yo asked me,"But Mommy, who could daddy ever love more than you?" Ripped my heart out. How do you answer that? I told her, I don't know.
We are back together in recovery and doing GREAT! I had maintained the entire time to the kids (and H) that I love him and he made a mistake, and even if he wanted a D, I would forgive him and still love him...BUT I made it clear that I was NOT going to allow him to disrespect me or treat me as a doormat. My daughters were watching closely all of my actions and I wanted THEM to see that no matter what life throws at you, you handle it with grace and dignity.
My kids are still traumatized by this. My 14yo S will hear a song (follow me by uncle kracker) and say," that song is promoting cheating Mom, turn it off" Before he said that I never paid much attention to it before.He has triggers just as much as I do.

This is a nightmare for ANYONE who has to tell the kids. But I honestly believe it's better to be truthful and open (as much as you can taking their ages into consideration) than to beat about the bush and let the WS continue living a lie. The kids will NOT respect you for "protecting" them by not telling. They will see that at least ONE parent cared enough to "protect" them with the truth. I also think that forcing my H to face his kids pulled him out of the fog faster. He had to see the contempt in the eyes of our two oldest. And he had to live with our 13yo daughter telling school she wanted to kill herself over the OW and her aunt(who aided my H with the deception).
No matter how you slice it...it will hurt. You and them. But this way they get to see you as a positive role model and not someone that says"lying is ok as long as you do it to keep someone from getting hurt" (geez isn't that A LOT like fog talk?)

Sorry so long, I tend to ramble this early in the day lol.
Best of luck to you and God Bless you and your family.

thank you for your story. I agree that telling the truth is the best option. I know it's a huge LB but if I give her the chance to do it with me that's the best I can do. My oldest is twelve and when my W calls the OM name comes up on the caller i.d. We have to tell him that a friend is letting mom use there phone. It's killing me doing this to them. She tries to justify it by saying it's not important that they know these things, but what will they think of me if they find out what was going on when they get older. Am I not condoning her behavior in a way by keeping it a secret?

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by starman:
<strong>She tries to justify it by saying it's not important that they know these things, but what will they think of me if they find out what was going on when they get older. Am I not condoning her behavior in a way by keeping it a secret?</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">IMVHO yes you are condoning it. And your 12yo is probably old enough to figure it out all on his own. Better to hear it from parents than to piece it together himself with friends help.(my 12yo daughter had some well-meaning friends that told her things like "well now you'll get twice the Christmas gifts and Birthday gifts) She didn't find that a "good trade" for not having her Dad home anymore.
Like you, I feel honesty is the best policy. At least you're giving your WW a chance to participate in the discussion with the kids. She has to face them sooner or later...better sooner IMHO.

God Bless...You have a hard road ahead of you.

thanks again. If anyone knows where there's more info both pro and con to this question let me know.

While I wouldn't tell them details...you're oldest isn't stupid...she already knows or suspects. She's questioning this man's name coming up on caller ID and you're lying to her! This only creates an environment where she feels that no one is being truthful with her. Bad move! jmho

If you stated the other child/ren ages...I missed it...but the younger they are, the less you tell them...but you do NOT lie! If they ask a question...tell them the truth taking into account their need to know and their ages.

Yes, you and your W should discuss this together before discussing how each of you want to handle this. Hopefully, neither of you will burden your children by speaking hurtful or harmful words about the other. I would NOT get into a big debate at this stage about "my values" and "her values". That comes later as the questions began. And as they see how you live your life, the choices you make and why.

Telling them mom and dad are separating and that their mom has a new man in her life will be more then enough information at this stage. Let them come to a place of acceptance and understanding of this much before you must burden them with more. jmho

At least when I was divorced...years and years ago, I was able to put into the separation agreement that until the divorce was final, STBXH was not allowed to bring our children around a third party. Don't know if you can do this or not...but would try.

Know that as your children mature, new questions will be forthcoming. Answer honestly taking into account their level of maturity....and always...I repeat...always...tell them this is from your POV as to what happened...that their mom's POV may well be different.

You are NEVER required to say more then you are comfortable in sharing with your children. This is about adult situations and much of it is PRIVATE. You have a right to have boundaries on what you will and will not share...be honest about this. If they ask for a detail you do NOT wish to share...tell them they are going into areas that are private and you will not answer. Just don't lie!

Some thoughts and experiences...

Obviously, the older the kids, the more details becomes appropriate.

But when to tell? Sometime before signing of divorce papers is usually good. One spouse moving out is usually a good time.

I thought SH gave me good advice on this including some actual scripts. My kids were young, so I didn't plan on telling them about OM. Just that marriage was hurting and that I wanted to work on marriage (ergo, FWS was the one who did not want to work on it - I would hope would be the reasonable conclusion even for a 6 year old).

Your twelve year old should be wondering why mom isn't home, right? She deserves some story.

But before you talk, you need to have a talk with WS and try to get an agreement. If she tries to push some fake story, just calmly state that the kids don't need to know a lot of the details and that you are willing to defer questions to mom, but they don't deserve a lie and that you will not lie to them. Hopefully, your WS isn't so far gone that she will try to fight that. It's a potential LB, but that's a good boundary. If she's ok with the whole truth then that's probably bad for your relationship, but at least you can be freer with the kids.

Make sure you control your desire to get the kids on your side. It will be seen in a bad light and make recovery harder. Kids should be smart enough to figure things out themselves. Especially if you are still at home.

If kids ask questions, refer to the mom in as nice a manner as possible. Let her be the one to lie to them if she wants. If she does lie to them, try to dispell the falsehood through your actions and let kids figure things out (again).

FWIW, I had a verbal agreement that kids would not interact with OM. Apparently that didn't mean that OM couldn't sleep over (a few times only) after kids were asleep.

If you can leave out the judgements and (again) let the kids figure things out. They should have enough of a moral compass to figure out that mom and dad breaking up is bad and that mom staying with a guy is bad. (This presumes that the old situation was not terribly abusive or otherwise than the current situation).

Anyway, the general thing to keep in mind is that you can always say more later. It's harder to take back stuff that's been said.

Prove your family committment stuff to your kids through actions. Words are nice, but without actions, it will come off as false. I hope your kids are "good". If they aren't, I hope you have the strength to deal with that also as they also go through a terrible time.

Oh yeah, and try not to be passive-aggressive about this thing.