My C., My friends, His C. all say he will probably not change. He will not go to NC, I don't think his C. is even trying to work with that concept anyway. He is depressed and lost his job so they are just keeping him going til meds kick in and trying to focus him on getting a job. While I understand that having a job is important is it more important than us? I guess I just feel it is more of me being pushed to the backburner and him being the focus of attention-like always. Them saying no, you can't make a decision you're too depressed, just wait til you feel better. Am I wrong for feeling this way? I am not going to contact him and if he does call me I don't think I will answer. I am not sending a plan B letter yet, maybe never, depending on what I feel will happen. He has many issues, and is passive agressive, will not take blame for anything, tries to justify things and always has the classic ending to something that could be a good statement by adding "but" I just hate that. His C. isn't working on our marriage and I don't even really think he fully understands what my H. is like. He is so good at talking around issues and ignoring things and lying. I just can't take the abuse these affairs have done to me. And to my self respect, but I know I am getting stronger, I just don't want to become bitter, and right now I am very angry at him for being so cruel and selfish. Maybe I can't ever get over what he has done to me, I don't know, every time I turn around I find out something new. Last weekend he told me after the first OW and him had broken it off she had a miscarriage. so that was part of why he had continued contact with her. Sometimes I think there is just too much to get over and I have no strength left.

Dear DbD,

Hugz dear..... Cyber hug (you know how to do it?) <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

This may be a turning point for you. A piece where you learn to move forward. You still don't know where he will land. Seems like he is going every which way but right.

DbD, you are probably very tired of that, I certainly understand. So how can we help you?

Remember recovery is always possible. Personal recovery is within our individual grasp.

take care,
L.

Thanks Orchid, I just need to be away from him, and to be with my friends and family. I have been reading a lot about emotional abuse and feel he has always been that way in certain ways. And while I know he isn't the only reason our marriage had problems he didn't give us a chance and that really bothers me. I may not be giving up for good, but just stopping the pain he is causing me by being a part of it. It took a long time but I guess seeing how far he went and how much he was and is willing to hurt me helped me make that decision. I've got a website I'll send you later, it has a ton of jokes and crazy info on it. I called my GF and we had a good laugh! And I sent her the hallmark ones you sent to me. So, mainly I need to laugh and have fun and not worry about him or us and start healing, and then decide if I ever can go back to him, if that is what he wants later, because I don't think certain things will change for him ever.

Well DbD, you have the desire to be happy. He needs to make those choices for himself also.

Do you remember when I told my H to smile?!?!? I stamped my foot on the ground and said "SMILE!" LOL!! The special effect was so conflicting it was hilarious. That helped me relieve some stress and show that crazy WS that he appeared just as confused (imagine demanding someone to smile). <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

I will be sending you more <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> stuff tomorrow.

take care,
L.

DAYBY,

I would say not to focus and worry to much about what others say...that just like Honey's topic reaching out to others for some support can backfire if when you ever attempt to go for some sort of reconcilliation...

Those that care for us don't want to see you hurt...but your attempts to reconcile are not necessarily a reflection on you and how "dumb" you are to take someone like "that" back...but the drive to reconcile can be a result of a good Plan A within ourselves that shows us what we now want in a marriage and what we believe is worthy of us...quite a noble quest...

BUT (oh crap do I sound like "hubby" using the BUT word ... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> ) having said that...plan A is ALL about you...and what you can and can not accept or tolerate in your world...

I beleive and know people CAN change and DO change all the time...If I didn't I would go live in a cave...because their are parts inside of me that I used to be in the "past" that I never ever want to be again...so I have changed...

I think you need to change what you want from him...drop all expectations...
Try not to focus on him...in fact I am becoming a little more leary of seeking out too much literature and information on spousal behavior...as I sometimes am begining to fear labelling and pigeon holing people...It is becoming my opinion that some individuals themselves seek out such labels, and therapists use them to be able to bill for services...and in the end...it can sometimes just be one big excuse for poor behavior...OR can sometimes consume on in seeking out all about it...
and at the same time I realize that educating oneself can give one strength to face some behaviors...so I guess what I am saying...is don't focus on him...focus on you only...

Dayby...plan B is all about protecting what ever love you have left...and if your's is draining then perhaps you should consider....do not confuse plan b letters with having anything at ALL to do with your spouse...it is not a letter written with expectations for him "take blame" or to even be able to "argue or rebut.."..It is a letter ALLLL about you....what you have learned...what you believe in now for you and him...what you can and can not have in your world...nothing nothing nothing about him....

He is a cake eater
He does play his "poor me" card rather well
Even in his post he is good at not addressing directly issues at hand...
He is very very lost.
He makes me sad
You on the other hand have grown and strengthened
I would protect myself from him if I were you..
I would think about Plan B..
I would stop discussing him with C and discuss only YOU...

I would smile sweetly at those who give you "too much advice on what you should do" and babble back something like..."did you ever hear that saying..wet birds don't fly at night? " "Do you think it is true"...or some other moronic conversation stopper..

luck to you
ARK

ark, thank you for that response. I know I shouldn't listen and believe everything others say to me. But I get scared thinking I'm the only one that believes he COULD change, if he would try. And maybe it is a protection of sorts too so I won't let myself get so hurt again. and yes plan b is about me, I know, and what I need to do to protect myself. I am not going to see him now and don't even want to . I have things planned this weekend and do have good friends to help me out. I think most people that say he won't or can't change say it because they don't want to see me hurt any more, because they've seen the devastation he has caused in my life and family, and it just doesn't quit. And they think that I should protect myself from him too, it has just taken a long time for me to be able to do that.