I asked for some input on the topic of jealousy...on February 28th. No one has responded. I guess this issue is just not "juicy" enough. The going topics seen to be affairs and breakups. I want to talk about building a healthier relationship...anybody out there?

I for one am a red blooded male and I have a beautiful wife. Yes I get jealous. But it comes down to trusting each other. Because you will never be able to stop other people from coming on to or interacting with your spouse.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">The going topics seen to be affairs and breakups. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Forsey,
That might be due to the fact that this area is titled "Infidelity". It might serve you better if you posted on the Emotional Needs forum. People there might be dealing with those issues.

committed

FORSEY:

I went back and read your Feb. 28th post. Jealousy is a worthy topic. When I was younger (teens and 20's) I was a very jealous man, but I am no longer. I look back at myself and I see an insecure and scared person who considered everyone a threat regardless of the relationship (friend, acquaintance, stranger). A little jealously is healthy, I mean we do care for the people we love and we don't want to lose them, but controlling, accusatory, and overly possessive or protective behaviors are not healthy at all, and from what I read in your original post, you have got a serious problem on your hands.

I recognize the person you speak of. I used to be with someone just like that and it drove me insane! You end up walking on eggshells. You never know what you may say or do that will trigger a jealous reaction, or worse yet, a jealous rage. You cannot live like that. If he has past issues that make him "punchy" and sensitive to issues of jealousy, then he needs counseling to get through them. I can tell you from personal experience, you will never have his trust fully. He will always be guarded and "on watch" and you will always be defending yourself and explaining your actions or words to him. You will be consoling and comforting him to make him feel "safe" all the time and it will wear you down. You will begin to feel the walls closing in. That feeling is the "box" that you are being pushed into. It is the box that he will need you to be in so that he never feels threatened and always feels safe. Your whole life will be to make him feel secure. Maybe I am over stating this, maybe not. I have lived through this too many times. It becomes a living nightmare sometimes. My current W is the jealous type and I am a very gregarious and social person, which doesn't help, so what does she do with her feelings of insecurity? She has 2 affairs to make herself feel better. I'm not saying your H will do that, or that you will do that either (I had an affair during a committed relationship because as I rationalized it, I was already being treated as though I was cheating all the time, so I might as well really do it and make it worth my suffering her jealousies.)

To me, jealously, strong jealously, has no place in long lasting healthy relationship. See if your spouse is open to counseling. You shouldn't be suffering because of his past. Good luck.

Forsey,

I agree with the tip that you might get more response on the Emotional Needs board.

Also, weekends are slow so, if you posted on the 28th (fri), you might not get any response until Monday - then your serious question might be overshadowed by everybody working through there weekend experiences in their varius personal crises.

But I've had a lot of experience with a jealous wife. The amazing thing is that it has gotten much better - almost a non-issue now.

-AD

<small>[ March 07, 2003, 09:53 AM: Message edited by: AD ]</small>

Living with jealousy, thanks to Ad, Haze and Blindsided for sharing your experiences. I agree that councelling is the way to go...we were out for a beer with another couple...a very safe scenario you would think, but again I receive the evil eye look and silent treatment...why I have no idea. I never even left our table...

Jealousy is a very destruction character trait, and should I even mention the issue my husband becomes very defensive. I have suggested coucelling and he seems all for it...saying and doing can be two different things. Does anyone know of any good books or articles on the subject of jealousy?

I've copied Forsey's original post on the topic here so we can understand more fully what her issues are:

Quote:

I am in my second marriage and am determined to make a good life for both of us. My husband has a very jealous side to him and this is an emotion that I have never had to deal with before. His x-wife cheated on him, several times before their marriage ended and I believe this has scarred him badly. I have not given him any reason to be jealous and yet he continues to look for reasons to be jealous...
I tried not ever discussing people (men in particular) that I have known over the years prior to meeting my husband. That has not worked, he feels that I am 'keeping things from him'. When he comes home from work and asks what I have been doing all day it is with a suspious tone...where is this coming from? How do I put an end to it? It is really beginning to bother me, a lot.

I searched for your original post to see what your situation is.

It seems that there is a lack of trust between you and your husband. You may not have done anything to earn his distrust... but you married a man with a history of being hurt very badly. Yes, may be transferring too much onto you from his previous relationship. But you have to deal with whom you married and where he is in his life. Remember that the behavior that you do not like is his… jealousy. But you can only change yourself. So that is where you need to concentrate your efforts.

There are things you can do to strengthen your bond and the feeling of trust. One thing I have learned from my life, these boards and Marriage Builders (MB) is that it is foolish to blindly trust a spouse. In every marriage both spouses have unmet needs. Sure to different degrees at different times, but there are always some needs that are not being met 100%. It is simply impossible for any one person to meet all of another’s needs all of the time. Affairs are not cause by unmet needs. They are caused by people not protecting the vulnerability cause by the unmet needs.

The trick is to build protections into your martial relationship. These help to make a spouse feel safe and protect the marriage. Have you read the MB books? “His Need, Her Needs”, “Love Busters” and “Surviving an Affair”? You will find a lot of info in those books about how to affair proof your marriage. What this does is build trust between spouses.

On the topic of discussing people from your past, men in particular. One of the cornerstones of the MB concept is radical honesty. There are not secrets or privacy in a marriage living by the MB concepts. Take a look at the personal history questionnaire. The idea is for each spouse to fill it out.. to share EVERYTHING. A person has the right to know who they married, what their spouses strengths and vulnerabilities are. Perhaps sharing more about your past is better than sharing less. And if he cannot handle it, then he needs to work on himself. Yes he feels you are hiding things from him. You are. They maybe of no consequence but you are being silent about them. If you cannot share all of you with him, if you have to hide who you are and you have been from him, and if he cannot handle the truth of you, if you have to hide both male and female friends from him … then you married the wrong guy. You should be able to tell him ANYTHING.

Some suggestions on things you can do:

---Be open about all things in your past.

---Don’t wait for him to come home and ask you what you have been doing. Call or email him through the day and tell him what you are doing. My husband and I now call each other at least 3 times each work day and discuss our day. It’s a wonderful way to stay connected all day and it will help him feel better. If you tell him upfront, he’ll loose the need to ask.

---If going out drinking with friends is causing problems then don’t do it. Find some other activity that is healthier for your relationship. Take a look at the topic of recreational activities in the marriage builder books.

Hints for getting more responses:
Stay with one thread on your topic, to many threads are confusing and people loose track of your story/point. I had to search for your original post to know why you think your H is jealous. Many people will not take the time to do this.

If you are not getting the responses you want, bump your topic to the top of the page. Many people don’t have a lot of time so they only look at the top few threads and than ones from people who have helped them.

Respond to every post you get individually. It takes a lot of time and energy to reach out to people here. If we see no responses from the original poster, then we figure they are not returning. Or maybe they are not interested in what we had to say.

People often respond to those they know.. those who have reached out to them too. Respond to others. I find that’s where I have learned the most… from the situations others are in.

<small>[ March 07, 2003, 09:34 AM: Message edited by: zorweb ]</small>

Ok Zorweb, I completely understand you response. I know that the jealousy is 'his' problem and that the sensible thing for me to do is to modify my own actions and feelings to create stronger trust in the relationship. Right now though, my first reaction is to say screw it! I am so tired of trying to change myself and be a better person so that 'other people' can be happy and content. I know that sounds really selfish...and maybe I am just really tired...I just think that it is really crazy the way that he reacts...I have tried to discuss my past, not to dwell on it, just sometimes something reminds of something or someone from the past. Often it is just a short amusing tale...when I see his mouth get tight and the silence follows...then I am left to feel like I shouldn't ever open my mouth. I'm so tired of this. Maybe tomorrow will be better.

Was he jealous before you got married?

If so... you need to recognize your mistake and work through it.

If not... remind him that one of the things you found so attractive about him was his self-confidence and that he knew you were his woman and that he was your man.

Here's some other hints to try out. Hold him when in public. Hold his hand at dinner when you are talking to someone else, put your arm around him, put your hand on his knee under the table... just stay physically connected and showing him that you are thinking of him. If you are talking to someone else and he walks up, immediatly put your arm around him, maybe hug and kiss him on the cheek and introduce him right away as "your husband" and then keep holding his hand, etc. And another one, when in a group, etc. and your H is talking... look at him in the eyes the whole time and just a couple seconds after he stops so that he notices that you were looking at him (throw in a little sly smile and a wink also). These are some very simple things that reassure guys greatly and we love it (even if they never say it or act like they don't). I am not the jealous type, but I still love when a woman treats me this way... it makes you feel like a king... really. I got a million things that I could tell you that men love and will make your guy very happy with you in public. I know they all seems so stupid... but us guys are stupid... just play along and enjoy the results. Here is a killer one... At diinner with friends or at a party, etc., lean over real close to him and whisper in his ear (while holding hand tight or pullng him in to you) ans say something like, "I'm having fun here but I can't stop thinking about going home and tearing your clothes off... I'm just so horny for you." OK, you can leave the last part off, but it is so great to hear and you will notice this is constantly said among these idiots that have affairs. I wish my wife said it to me occassionally instead of me reading her saying it to OM!!!

Try and soon and see the results.

<small>[ March 07, 2003, 05:37 PM: Message edited by: Conan ]</small>

I just think that it is really crazy the way that he reacts...I have tried to discuss my past, not to dwell on it, just sometimes something reminds of something or someone from the past. Often it is just a short amusing tale...when I see his mouth get tight and the silence follows...then I am left to feel like I shouldn't ever open my mouth. I'm so tired of this.

It’s hard to tell what is going on here with out witnessing it firsthand or without more info so forgive me if I assume wrong.

It does seem strange that you cannot speak about your past without him getting upset. His reaction to you after you both go out with another couple seems odd too.

Was he jealous before you married? Does he try to cut most people out of your life?

I assume you have asked him about his reaction to this. What words do you use to bring it to his attention? What is his response?

Why does he say he gets upset at you after you have been out with friends?

The trick here for you is going to be to evaluate how much change is appropriate for you to make. It should not mean you giving up all friends, family and activities. I believe that the MB material will help you find that balance.

As for you being tired of having to be the one who changes. I understand that. But if you are changing so that others can be happy, you are changing for the wrong reason. You will only become bitter if that is the reason you are changing. Do it so that YOU create the marriage you want.

Life and marriage is about change. The first few years of marriage are hard because of this. We have to change to build a good marriage.

Another set of books I’d suggest for the “divorce busting” books. I’ve read “Getting Through to the Man You Love” and “Divorce Busting”. I find that they work very well with the MB material. The basic premise of the DB material is that if what you are doing is not working, stop doing it!!! Do something different. Your spouse will have no choice but to change. It’s like a dance, if you are waltzing, and one of you suddenly starts to do a tango, the other cannot continue waltzing.

I’ve a question. What was your reaction to the idea of you calling him a few times during the day and letting him know how you are doing and what you are doing so that he does not feel that he has to ask you?

Conan.. I love your ideas. I do the ones you mentioned. But what are the other million ideas? Could use all the tips you can think of.

Yes, he was jealous before we got married. At the time I called it 'possessive' and was flattered by it all. Now I recognize that it was jealousy.

He couldn't wait for me to move into his home from the city I was in (5 hours away). The moving date was even moved up two weeks due to his impatience...this put alot of stress on me but again I was flattered. To move to a new city I sold my business to my General Manager and left a lifestyle of twenty years behind.

I wanted to. I chose to and I am still glad that I did. Silly me, I thought that might be enough to show him how much I love him.

I guess that I thought I would (could) still communicate with friends and business associates, perhaps even go back for visits, but that isn't going to happen. I would never even mention it. And you know it doesn't really matter. I don't miss them, except for sometimes when I think of things.

I have enjoyed being here, but as you know new friends cannot take the place of people you have know for twenty years. Time will mend this and I can be patient.

I am totally shocked that I have to continually reinforse my love for my husband but as your responses indicate this is a fact I have to make the effort.

My parents are in their 80's, married since 1949...I watch and admire how comfortable they are with each other, they always have been. I guess that is what I want. To be able to relax, enjoy, not always trying to do the right thing at the right time...to make him get the message that I want to be right beside him...So sad.

When it comes to jealousy there is a fine line to walk.

It does seem that your husband is more jealous than is ‘normal’. You should not have to give up all the things that make you who you are. You should not have to give up friends. If there is a particular person who a threat to your marriage, then it makes sense to choose your marriage over a friend. But to isolate yourself is not healthy.

After d-day, I have become what one might call jealous. For example we were bowling and there was a very nice looking younger woman on the other team. Every time she did anything that resembled throwing her bowling ball, my husband would get up and give her a high 5. Later I pointed out to him what he was doing. When he said he just was encouraging her ‘cause she was struggling, I pointed out that she was doing better than the two men on her team yet he did not give them as much attention. Told him that if it happened again that was the end of our bowling.

Under some circumstances my reaction could be considered jealous. But my husband had affairs with 10 women in the first 2.5 years of our engagement/marriage. I discovered them 9 months into our marriage. I have a reason to be concerned.

Of interest is that two weeks before d-day and old boyfriend of mine called. He was coming to town and wanted to spend the day with me, skiing and dinner. My husband’s reaction was not no, but hell no. Yet he was involved with a whole slew of women behind my back at the time.

There are things that the two of you are going to have to do to make your marriage a safe place for BOTH of you. You will both have to make changes it seems. But, it does seem that he has a problem. Establishing a good marriage does not mean that you have to do unreasonable things to make him feel safe.

Even if he does not want to go to counseling, perhaps you should. It may help you get a handle on what is appropriate. Reading the books would help. And maybe the people here could help you come up with an appropriate list of things you can both do.

I do suggest that you post in the Emotional Needs forum instead of here. It’s more geared this type of thing. I tend to hang out there a lot now as that’s more where my relationship is now. We are so far into our recovery that we are dealing more with normal, every day stuff.

I have a jealousy issue. I am jealous when I see two people holding hands, and laughing. That hurts, cause my husband and I used to do that when we were dating, and first married. Of course I got pregnant right away, and 9 months later our first beautiful daughter was born.

I am so jealous to see people holding hands. I want to hold my husbands hands everyday. But not the man who he is now, the man that I married.