MBer's,

I thought I would be prepared for the day that Lucidity arrived and posted here. Now is the time that you all get to hear the otherside of the story. Which that doesn't scare me. What scares me is the amount of love I have left in my love bank, and how that is going to affect my postings. I truly love/loved this woman. Am I still in love? I'm not sure anymore just how much.

I remember an example in SAF about a couple that were so torn and distant, that Steve had to help them from such a 'hard' return to the marriage. The W in the story was on rock bottom and the H in the story was so ready to move on. Happily, in the story the two reconciled.

I feel like this is where the two of us probably are. I was getting ready to move on and I feel that Lucidity is about to be at the lowest point in her life emotionally, only because, now that her sister just moved back to Tennesse, she for the first time since the affair began, is alone, at home. She and our other 2 boys are there, so its now just the three of them in Dallas and the three of us in Houston. As for contact with the OM/OC, there is still contact there, but I'm being told its a matter of convience for the OM to see the baby. I'm not there and I don't know what kind of contact there is. And then there is the amount of trust I put in to what I'm being told. I WANT to believe what she is telling me at this point is true. I'm also afraid that now that her sister has left town and she has 'an empty house', that eventually the OM will find a way to win his position back into her life and within 2-3 months, they'll be living together again out of convience.

So, my question to all of you is, what, where and how do we go on from here. I don't know what to do and I'm the fence sitter here at this point.

I feel like I need to be very careful what I post here, so that I don't push Lucidity away. She definetly needs the amount of help that I have received over the years. I am fearful of what I am going to say and the misinterpitations that come out through the type. I don't want her and I to be another SnL and Thinker. SO I'm choosing not to post on her threads right now. I want her to have the chance independently to ask for help and receive it.

I've included 'our' recent posts for you to review. I have been a member here a long time and I don't think I would know how to respond to anyone of you at this point if the roles were reversed and I was the advice giver.

I will read your responses, but I always need some time to asorb and respond. Thank you in advance for your patience and assistance.

(OT, Just started a new job, with lots of possibilities, so I'm doing good.)

Hers (Lucidity):
Rebuilding
Sorry
Total Confusion

Mine (Husband2you):
She said she'll see me in court and hung up on me
Empty Loney Nights Alone
Recovery vs. Divorce, its my decision

I understand. I am trying to develop a response to her that is kind, and truthful, and full of love and hope. But, this is a bad week for me , and I am a little stuck mentally .... for outside reasons. I'd like to help her, encourage her .... and I think the most I can do right now is offer my prayers.

Pep

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">So, my question to all of you is, what, where and how do we go on from here. I don't know what to do and I'm the fence sitter here at this point.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I've got to admit that her words in her threads is the stuff that BS's dreams are made of, BUT (there always seems to be one, isn't it?) her actions, in particular following The Four Rules For A Succesful Marriage that will tell you if there is any substance to those words. But if her actions don't follow her words and you take her back, you will have no one but yourself to blame.

Given that you do have some desire to give recovery a shot, obviously you need some show of how serious your wife is about trying again before you are willing to put your heart out on a platter again. So some concrete actions on the part of your wife would seem be a logical thing to work out. Like you said, a LOT of damage was done and it seems that pretty much anything would be allowable under the "fairness" justification. Though you should be guided more by the "loving" and "recovery" ideals.

Figuring that out on a public forum that is shared by your W may be a bit problematic since the development process will likely consider many possibilities that may trigger disproportionate responses.

The really tough part will probably be figuring out how to deal with the OC since that wreaks havoc with NC-related stuff. Personally, that would have been a "too late" point for me.

My suggestion is to work this part out first and include other basics of a recovery plan. Optionally, let W know that you are thinking this out.

Decide what are requirements and which are just desireables. And work on comitting to them. i.e. don't be wishy washy. Assuming you've come up with reasonable committments, you should feel some comfort no matter which way things go. And it sort of leaves the next step up to your W, which is sort of good for a fence sitter.

How you are going to share this with her, I have no idea. Good luck. I hope others have suggestions also.

HI H2You....

Long time my friend! I still believe that YOU must do what is right for YOU. If she is right for you, she must choose the right path. You cannot continue to put your life on hold waiting for what may, might, sorta kinda, maybe, possibly could work out. If she is still chancing things out of convenience and if OM can still weasel his way back into things, then it obviously is NOT the right thing for you. What do YOU want and need? Are those things going to include her in the picture the way she is now? SHE is the one that needs to make the commitment...if she can say, without a shadow of a doubt that YOU are the one she wants to move forward with, then you have half a chance. If not, keep moving in the direction you have found. From the sounds of it, your path has begun to look like the path YOU have chosen. I am no expert, and I am sure there will be dissenting opinions about waiting this out, but it sounds as though your life is much more positive and productive NOT waiting. If she chooses to follow your path, then perhaps you are already on the right track to something better. Perhaps she will like the path you have chosen. If not, you still have a path!!

Food for thought! Hang in there!!

H2Y,

Only you know what you need and can accept in order to have reconciliation.

I haven't followed your story - though I have seen your name on here for a long time.

I think you need to be communicating with your W directly - not only through this board. It's easy for us to get caught up in MB. Do you really need us to get between you right now?

It sounds to me that your W is lost and hurting right now. She wants you to ease her pain. That means a lot.

As for the "4 rules"... if you expect her to follow them, certainly don't leave her guessing as to what they are. You may think "I've told her many times what I want." OK, tell her again. She's listening now.

-AD

<small>[ June 04, 2003, 08:06 AM: Message edited by: AD ]</small>

H2Y-

I don't know your story. I have posted to your W.

I want to tell you that I've been where your wife has been. No, perhaps I didn't live with OM. No, I didn't completely leave my children...but I've been at that dark emptiness where your wife now resides. I've walked through the FOG and come through it - alone. She is now standing at the edge of the darkness, the FOG has drifted away and she stands alone.

I read what she wrote, and I recognize something there. It's the same something that I saw in Mrs. Mortarman when most everyone was telling him to move on.

See, when I read her post, I can envision her pain. I can feel her cry for help. I can "see" her sincerity. I have NO doubt in my mind that this woman has learned a very hard lesson. I guarantee you that it is a mistake that she will never make again.

If there is one thing I would like to convey to you sir, it's that this woman will do everything in her power to make your marriage work 1000%. You may not believe it, I wouldn't blame you a bit. As a former WS, I see it. Maybe it's a sixth sense that one develops, but it's there.

She has lost everything that she ever valued and faced her emptiness. She is ready to come home and be a wife. It is because she now knows what this loss is that she will do everything to ensure that she protects her family. She doesn't ever want to be that empty again.

Truthfully, it takes a WS to get to that emptiness in order to stop running and start looking at their fears. You have a great opportunity and I pray from the bottom of my heart that you at least try...

Hello Husband2you,

I think it's normal to feel unsure right now. If I were in your shoes, I would expect panic to set in soon. Those are feelings so they will pass, they will probably come again, they will pass, and so on. They don't call this a rollercoaster for nothing <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

My marriage is not being rebuilt so I won't be able to offer lucidity much support in this area, I just don't have the experience.

I do know this, Husband2you, I wouldn't try this on my own--I would invest in counseling with the Harleys. Are you two considering this?

Best wishes to you and your wife.

Take care

Thanks all, bumping for now, will reply later today.

Kily,

I think that you have a better chance at reaching Lucidity than most people here do. If any other WS who've recovered, reconciled or returned home are here, I would very much appreciate it if you came out and tried to help my marriage one last time, by talking to Lucidity.

Thank you all so much in advance.

H2Y-

I will do my best to help her through...if she wants me to. She has reached out to me, for that I am grateful.

You, she, and your children are in my heart and prayers.

God Bless you all....

and it's a difficult choice that you have to make today, but I sincerely believe that the kids (and a potential recovery) are more valuable than any job on earth...

Kily she edited her post 'Sorry' and removed those wonderful words to me. Is she pulling back, hiding now, lawyering up? Why did she do that? Did she want me to respond to her thread? I wanted to give her some room on here, to not make contact on here unless she wanted me to. I'd love to post to her here and discuss things, without us becoming the next SnL and Thinker.

You said in another post that she was contacting you. Is she contacting you via MB or via Email?

H2Y,

I'm sorry she edited her wonderful words away.

But...

Have you seen that commercial - can't remember what they're selling, but it's about timing. The woman is sitting with her man in the resteraunt. She says "I love you". He sits in silence for a long time - with no change of expression. She (embarrassed) gets up and leaves. He says (as she walks away - and too late) "I love you too."

Maybe she just felt like she laid her cards on the table - laid everything out for the whole world (wide web) to see - and after you didn't pick it up and run with it, she was embarrassed.

I know that WS's can go up and down, but I believe those words were sincere and if I were you I would do something to let her know that it matters - that you are receptive to moving toward reconciliation. If it were me, I would have gotten in the car and driven to where she was - hugged her, told her I loved her - that the road back would be difficult but that I was willing to work with her. Then I would take care of her for a couple of hours - do some things for her - maybe simple "manly" household chores, tell her again that I love her - and that we should start talking regularly on the phone - and then I would drive home.

The message would be that I care, and I am willing to get back together - while at the same time I need to see some changes before I recommit.

-AD

<small>[ June 05, 2003, 10:25 AM: Message edited by: AD ]</small>

H2Y,
Lucidity's post reminded me so much of my H's first post on MB, over 3 years ago, and I didn't receive his very well. In fact, I emailed all my MB buddies to alert them that the remorseful WS was my H. So, though he got some "oh I wish you were my WS" (a <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> on my part, nobody ever wanted to change places with me during the separations!) he also received some hard edged "action not words" replies.

I know your timeline has gone on a long time. I posted on Lucidity's thread, but I also wanted to say one of the same things to you.

I don't regret giving my marriage the 7th try (7 separations, 6 failed over about a 2 year period). I was asked at that time what I possibly thought could make the outcome different.

And, I didn't know that it would be different, except my H had made changes during the reconciliation, as I served him divorce papers. The changes were real. The promises made 3 years ago have been kept.

I remember just pulling every hope that still lingered within me and pouring them toward trying to make the decision to try that 7th time. I was so shaky, but I believed the effort was the right thing, so stopped the divorce, re-started counseling and, we've made it.

No regrets.

Best wishes to you.

Lor,

You know how envious I am of you and H. We arrived at the same time Apr99, have nearly the same timeline and same number of failed attempts. What was it that you did diffently than I that your husband came home to you and my wife didn't?

Was it me, was it her? Are you all better people than us? Jeez, for the first time in a long time.. Tears..because I've failed at what I tried so hard to keep.

Dear H2Y, I have read your posts many times over the years. You could have given up before but you remained steadfast in your love of and belief in your wife for a very long time.

Failed??? NO WAY!!! Quite the opposite...

I call it great success. An example of outstanding strength.

I admire you. I pray for you, your family and your recovery.

H2Y-

I really don't want to scare her off so I will not go any further than to say that she's really struggling.

I feel that any more divulgence might scare her away from me too...She needs a safe place right now. If you are to get to recovery, then I want to BE that safe place for her...at least until she can stand up on her own. I hope you understand and are okay with that.

I want to be there for her if she decides that she wants to trust me.

H2Y- Facing your demons is a SCARY thing to do. She is asking the questions that she needs to ask. I am answering as honestly as I can. I can only hope that she will continue to reach out...

{{{{{{{{{{{{{{H2Y}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}
I didn't intend to make you feel worse!

No, we're not better people. I believe it is a miracle that though we both gave up, we didn't both give up at the same time. If my H's change of heart had come a few months later, we'd have been divorced for 3 years.

He hit bottom and hit hard.

I thank God that somehow he had the inner resources to go to our counselor at that point and the C knew what to do...for both of us.

I'm sorry that my post saddened you.

I was also in your wife's shoes with an om. I had a few downfalls where I called him, he lived away. Well it is too late my husband is living with the ow since December, he started seeing her last year in June. He blames me for him and her being together. I love my husband and I am truely sorry for all the pain I caused for him and my children and there is nothing I want more than to have my family all together again with the ow out of the picture.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Husband2you:
<strong>Lor,

You know how envious I am of you and H. We arrived at the same time Apr99, have nearly the same timeline and same number of failed attempts. What was it that you did diffently than I that your husband came home to you and my wife didn't?

Was it me, was it her? Are you all better people than us? Jeez, for the first time in a long time.. Tears..because I've failed at what I tried so hard to keep.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">H2Y,

IMHO, the tears show you are healing. I truly hope that both you and your W shed some tears and work on the healing. Separately at first then together.

Family's are often the hardest on the ones they love. I used to hear that when I was little and it used to make me angry. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> Why? Because I didn't think that was fair. But life is like that and some are prone to doing such in the name of many things good and bad. The outcome through doesn't have to stay bad.

What do you think you and your W can do to make the bad experiences in your lives a thing of the past and move forward. Learn it is ok to be happy. Smiling is not hazardous for your health.

JMHO, please take care (both of you). <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

L.