Shugah -

Reading your post, part of it made me cry, and part of it made me stand up and cheer for you.

I'm so sorry that your kids had to witness the scene with WH and the police. It must have had a significant impact on them. I'm sure you did your best to explain what happened, but is there a relative or friend they can confide in and talk to? How are they doing today? How are you doing?

While the incident with the police made me cry, your striding into WH's world made me stand up and cheer! Shugah, you have a lot of courage! (I'm a conflict avoider, it would be very difficult for me to do what you did.) You "claimed your space" and showed WH and OW how strong you are. I'm glad your actions brought you a sense of peace, and some understanding of the world WH lives in.

Of course it made him angry that you "saw" him, he doesn't like who he is and what he's doing, and now YOU know, too. Yes, it IS about him, not you, not the M, just him and his problems. I'm not a veteran MB'er, so I don't know what the next step in the WS script will be. I would advise you to slow down for awhile, though, if you can. The past few days have been filled with intense emotions for you, and you will be able to make better decisions coming from a place of logic.

Wishing you a peaceful, calm day.

Lablady

<small>[ September 01, 2003, 11:46 AM: Message edited by: lablady ]</small>

I certainly feel for you.

I don't know what to advice for you to do either just like Lab Lady.

I will say from my own experience to slow down and to not make any major decisions.

I had a physical fight with my WS when I entered his world, when he was deep in the fog in March/April.

Now, I don't even think that he remembers it happening.

It's your choice of course about what you do but ,as always,

HANG IN THERE!!!!

I'm with you, Shugah, I wouldn't move. At least not now. Don't make any major decisions while you're still in crisis. A friend told me that, and it's among the best pieces of advice I received.

Maybe I'm overly big on animals, but I think pets have a steadying effect on kids. Losing pets would be a big deal for me, and for kids as well.

The reason your decision felt so good is that it's hard to play defense all the time, and that seems to be the role of the BS. Just to "take charge" feels good -- but that doesn't mean it's wise. That's why everyone keeps urging patience. After all, WH "felt good" in the affair, and look at the results of that.

Preemptive strikes -- going to WH's bar, moving house, etc. -- tend to irritate the situation, although they relieve some of the pressure of our enforced passivity.

Shugah,

Wow, your story is definitely one for the books. The way you were able to move forward despite what was thrown in front of your family is well.....amazing.

As a child that 'moved' around a lot (my parents were constantly moving to help others....at least 16 times during my childhood), I can say that children are resillient. I hated moving but adapted every time. Never finished through 1 school (4 elementary schools, 3 Jr High/intermediate schools and 2 high schools). So while they will make the most noise, they can also adjust quicker. Just a thought.

You are 1 brave lady. My H read your recent post also. So know that your experience is helping others.

Also, I want to let you know that moving forward takes effort......much of what you have posted shows that. Keep up the good work. Be safe and happy.

take care,
L.

THanks for understanding you guys!
I expect more 2x4's before this is over! I'm anticipating a response from Chris, it's ok Chris!
I know my part in triggering this drama. Although I still feel better having gone down there and standing my ground.
I understand that WH & OW want to live their lives trying to forget the damaged lives left behind, and by my invading their "territory" makes it real for them. According to WH, OW"s lawyer has sent me a letter, "warning me not send letters or call OW" or a restraining order will be filed. Haven't recieved that letter?
Poor OW, she helps to destroy my family's lives yet she doesn't want to be the "victim" of anything uncomfortable or painful. What a double standard, huh? I think she is forgetting who the victims are here. The same double standard applied when I encrouched on her territory, she can sleep with MY H, but I can't even visit her Bar!
Me & the kids are doing OK today, just OK. S was pretty uptight all morning, we talked, I tried to explain what happened and why, and that even if he was feeling angry with me, that it was ok, but that I had do what I had to to protect myself.
He said he "needed" a chocolate cake, his favorite is my homemade, so we just did that. I'm in a baking mood, nervous energy! I anticipate some card games & scrabble in my immediate future!!
Thanks again guys, if it wasn't for the support here, even when I do stupid and crazy things, I'd have lost what's left of my mind long ago!!

No 2x4 from me.....just a {{{{{cyber hug}}}}}

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Enjoy the cake and time with your children. There is where the real happiness lies.

By the way, does the OW own the bar? I would be very tempted to share that piece with the bar staff/owner. I mean really scaring away nice customers like yourself?!?!?!? LOL!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

L.

Hey, who scared who away!! She doesn't scare me!
Thanks Orchid.
I'll let things settle for now, but they may not have seen the last of me! I have thought about doing this for so long, fantasized, that I had to get it done! I should have found out where the next league game is, my appearance certainly wouldn't be good for their concentration. Seriously though, I probably won't be making any more visits. Apart from the reasons for my being there, it was actually a fun time.
I still can't believe it, ME, I too was always a conflict avoider. Oh, I always talked big, "I'm gonna tell so & so just what I think, and I'm gonna do this or that & show them", but when it came down to it, I never did. Even with WH.
My friend has left WH a message to do the right thing, and despite his being angry with me, he needs to send me that $$. I have nothing for 2 more weeks. S needs cleats for soccer and D wants to play soccer, she was excited about her first organized activity, but I have no regis. fee now. Will let you all know how it plays out.

I was granted a protection against abuse order this morning.
In the meantime, "friend" had recieved a call from WH this morning. He was calm at first, as usual, and then within seconds, was screaming and swearing. He said, that he will not give me the F##king money or anything else, that he is all done, that he will take the f##king kids with him for a visit, and he will file a harrassment order against me. "Friend" said, let me get this right you are referring to your children as the f##king kids and he screamed yeah, the f##king kids! "Friend" tried to reason with him but he just kept yelling "shut the f##k up". So she ended the call.
What has happened to this man? He is out of control with anger, He was never like this before the A!!
I am afraid now that his is so out of control, he will not help support us, he is unpredictable.
I am filing the paperwork this afternoon to get the D rolling. I need things in place to protect me and the kids financially before we lose everything.
It is a sad day. It has gone too far.

Your right, it is out of control, or should I say your H is out of control! He is angry and wants to hurt you. It's a mechanism that WS do to reflect any guilt from themselves. The anger comes out at the BS! Just don't contact him for anything. Don't play his game. Just do what you have to do to protect you and your kids. And file for child support ASAP! Keep records of everything, including the incident that happened with the police (though it is already on file). Stay strong and be the SANE ONE IN ALL OF THIS. No more going to where you know he hangs out at. Discourage your friends from calling him on your behalf, it is useless at this point and will only upset you more to hear his responses to them. If he calls let the kids answer or let it go into vm. NO CONTACT while he is out of control!

Vehicle that 16 yr.old S has been driving was repossessed during the night.
Not unexpected of course, however, if WH had signed the Bankruptcy petition by now, repossession would have been delayed for the approx. 3 mos bankruptcy process. WH can't even get a Bankruptcy right!!
S knew that and was trying to save enough $$ to buy his own car. Thought he had 3 more months.Also, won't be able to go to a concert next week that he's had tix for for months.
S is angry with WH for leaving us all in this horrible financial predicament! Now I'm back to adding one more rider to my Taxi service!
S's golf clubs and new jeans were in the vehicle (despite my warnings) but he located the car in the back lot at a Dealer's and retrieved his stuff!!
Oh well, when does it all end?!!

Oh man. So sorry Shugah. Ugggh.

-TMD

Ok I do not want you to get any ideas about what BALLS to USE while GOING GOLFING WITH YOUR SONS CLUBS !!!!!!!!!
SORRY had a need to try and make you smile .

THIS sucks , sorry you dealing with all this . GOT to say I agree , I would shut him down , I mean cut him off completely .

I would just file for child support court ordered . You can do that even before any D papers are done .

Praying for ya !!!!!!!!!

Just pasting from another thread to catch up my own, so this may sound familiar to you ISGirl!:

It's been an interesting week here, with the Protection order, repossesion of the car, etc.
Last night I had the whole Football team here after practice for a potluck!! Yeah I'm crazy, but it went well, they stayed outside, the coaches were here too and it only lasted about 2 hrs. THen S had a few friends over and they had a campfire.
WH called during the football thing, talked to S, asked where I was (he wanted to make sure I was not on my way down there!! LOL), S said I was talking to his coach.
I"m glad that he knows that I had the team here, it shows him that life hasn't stopped for us, we are not sitting around crying in our beer!!! And that I continue to be the "involved" parent!
He's coming up tomorrow, sunday, to meet the Bankruptcy Lawyer and sign papers, I have no idea if he plans on coming here to see the kids, I need to make some calls today and find out if he was served the Protection order yet. He may not even know about it yet!
So I'm a bit nervous about tomorrow, don't know if he'll show up here or what.
4 yr. old D starts soccer tomorrow, she is sooo excited, asked me to bring my camera and will she get a trophy!! She sees her 3 big brothers tropy collections and she can't wait to get one of her own!
It's times like these that I think, "WH, you don't know what you're missing!"
Oh yeah, 3isaCrowd, I can still laugh through all of this, does that mean I'm crazy or too sane for my own good?

<small>[ September 06, 2003, 07:04 PM: Message edited by: Shugah ]</small>

Shugah, do not take son's threat lightly. Kids hurt badly commit suicide or try all the time.
Now, others may not agree with me, but if Wh can put ow and her kids first,he'd never step foot back into my life again!
Sorry, anybody can hurt me and I can fight for myself, but my kids? That's another story and this is above forgiveness in my book.
Get son into counseling quick. Call crisis centers if you need to. And do not let son be alone. He is your very first priority right now for his life depends on you!
Plan B, or A. I'd move straight to divorce plan!
This man cannot be trusted to care as he's shown, so he's not worth fighting for at all!
Your children are worth fighting for!
So sorry for all that you're having to endure. Just dealing with H's betrayal is bad enough, but to see children depressed and wanting to die, that becomes the greater pain.
You're in prayers, LouLou

Shugah,just reread some post here. Do not worry about the financial support not coming. Get the judge to order it taken straight from his paychecks before he is even given his pay! It can be done. As long as he works and earns a paycheck, you'll get your money!
If anytime he has control and refuses to pay you otherwise, let them pick his A$$ up and take it to jail!
LouLou

WH showed up here at the house while I was at soccer with D, and guess who was with him, yup, OW!!!
He called first, talked to 16 yr old S and asked if I was here, then came by to pick up the concert tix that he's buying off S.
I was so ticked off when I found out he was here and brought OW, I felt he was really pushing the situation considering the Protection Order.
I missed them by about 10 minutes.
I called the Sherriffs Dept. just to have the incident on record as I was not really sure if it was in violation of the order.
A patrol officer arrived and took my statement. He thought it was violation and was going to issure an arrest warrant. But after reviewing the Protection order a 2nd time, he wasn't sure either, he complained that these things are sometimes too vague, so He said he would let the D.A. decide.
So WH could be in further hot water!
I'm filing for D tomorrow as things have gone too far, and WH is not providing support.
My lawyer wants me to fax the Protection order to him for his review and may attend the hearing with me. To be decided.
I was looking at photos today, it was like looking at a complete stranger. It seems so long ago that we had loving feelings for each other. I hate to even go there, it is too painful.

Do you know what I hate!
When someone says to me, "DO NOT take that man back"

I'm not an idiot, I would not take back this shell of a WH, that I do not recognize as a human being, for God's sake!

But I would consider taking back my H, who I was happily married to for 19 yrs., if he were ever to show his self again and make the necessary steps and changes...
I just feel insulted, as if I have stayed married to someone who has acted this way all those years, which couldn't be further from the truth!

Ok, that was all, needed to vent, someone just said that to me... and for some reason it just fries me!

Now that I am proceeding with D, out of financial necessity mostly, what should I do from here?
Attempt Plan B again (I was horrible at it!)
Try new phase Plan A, just to make everyones lives, kids (and of course WH & OW)easier, more pleasant? You know, "honey, let me kiss your **** while you screw your family over?"
At this point I'm sure WH & OW have me portrayed as #1 B##tch. WH thinks I should be calling HIM with children's sports schedule, etc. Yet he doesn't call us for 2 weeks at a time.
Do I just surrender and do the nicey nice XW now.
I still want to protect my children, don't feel that exposure to OW is in their best interest at this point.
I'm feeling pretty down and confused right now.
This new step is tough.
I'll start checking out Divorcing Threads now too. I had hoped I would never have to go there!

Shugah,

I really feel my H has been just as awful as yours is. He treated me and the children horribly about 6 months ago. He was nothing like he is now. He is more like his old self but even in someways better because I believe that he is being more authentic with me. That's the word he is using. In MB terms, he is being honest about how he really feels.

The point is, you can get your old H back. However, I would strongly, strongly recommend PLAN B. PLAN B, the Dobson approach and my modified MM stuff worked for me. I keep learning alot about this from my FWH.

WH called me this evening. I "allowed" him to get me all worked up and upset.
First he starts out by saying "how are the Kids" but barely listens for an answer, before he starts in about the Protection Order, and it of course being my fault for not making it easy for him to see the kids in the house, etc. He made it sound like he hadn't been served the Prot. Order yet and was trying to get the info out of me, what does it mean, what do you mean there is a hearing?, and then finally, you are a lunatic *****, why aren't you over it by now, why are you calling "my" friends.
Also, "don't you know kids whose fathers aren't around on a daily basis?", trying to minimize the affect this is having on them, and then "what is 16 yr. old S wetting the bed?" His attempt again at minimizing 4 yr.olds bedwetting episodes since this all happened!
He told me that the friend of ours who went to the concert with him last night doesn't understand why I call him, and made it sound like friend and his wife don't want to hear from me.
I left them a message about what he said, and within a 1/2 hr. friends wife called, to say, "that is so not true, we love you, we don't understand what WH is doing at all and I had to call you right away because I didn't want you to be thinking that for a minute".
At that point Friend arrived home and got on the phone and filled me in on the concert evening. WH admits that he is doing something unforgivable, he's the one who abandoned his family, but that he's not coming back and that we need to find a way to move forward....etc. etc.
ANyways, WH taunted me, saying, "what is it going to take, 2 yrs. for you to get over it?" I said yeah, that's the standard rule of thumb, if you know of a magic pill that me and the kids can take to wake up over it and make your life easier and guilt free, let me know?
I finally did hang up on him, I was crying, he used that as an excuse for why the kids may not be dealing with it, because they live with a lunatic mother...
He really thinks we live every moment of every day like that....just because he can push the right buttons...
I'm ok now, I was wound up for a bit, but after talking to friend I feel better.
Plan B probably is the way to go from here.