DWHD

I may not be able to fully understand your feelings of despair with regards to your marriage but I certainly acknowledge them. If you had the financial resources to go at it alone, would you do it?

DWHD -

A few thoughts that I would like to share with you...

"4 Therapists haven't helped. My faith has been shaken. I have noting left. Nothing. No self esteem. No value. Nothing. "

You need to see a different therapist - before you say... I have already seen 4 and they haven't helped, let me tell you something.

I always knew that I had personal issues that I needed to deal with, but the therapist that I was seeing, I didn't trust to tell that information to. I finally found myself a good therapist with the same religious beliefs as me. She is doing something called Theophostic Ministry with me. In doing this process with her, I have come a LONG way with my own personal recovery. My suggestion to you is see if you can find someone in your area who is trained in this process, it has worked for me <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

In my work with my therapist, I have come to realize that the issues that I thought were 'no big deal,' really are a big deal. Those issues I have carried with me for 20 years and I carried them into my M. Now that I have started to deal with some of those issues, I can see changes not only in my M, but most of all in MYSELF! That is where the change needs to be!!!

Hold on to your faith. I had little faith before my A, then my faith became so strong - I started believing in God. I believed that even though I have sinned against God and my H, that God would still want me. It sounds like you once believed this... you need to believe that again.

"I have considered suicide, and actually did consider it last night. He DID push me over the edge. I am unstable."

I think that almost all BS and WS feel that suicide is a way out of all the hurt. I know that I felt that way. I also know that if I committed suicide, that I wouldn't have dealt with any of my problems here, I would have left them for someone else to deal with. And I didn't want to leave someone else to deal with MY problem.

"It felt good to be wanted. I don't feel that at home. "

All WS's feel that way. But, it is possible to feel that way at home. You and your H just need to be able to talk about what it will take for you to feel that way at home.

Originally posted by MGM:
"Only you can make yourself happy...don't rely on someone else to do it for you."

My H and I are working on this issue currently. I have always done things to make everyone else happy. Didn't matter if I wanted to do it or not, but if it made the other person happy, then I would do it. Just recently I have started doing things to make myself happy. I will use the example of cutting the grass... Sure, I can cut the grass because I know it will make my H happy, but if he doesn't say anything about how nice the yard looks, then I will be upset. (that is doing something to make someone else happy) However, if I cut the grass because I want to do it to make the yard look nicer, then I did something to make MYSELF happy! Then, if my H doesn't say anything about how nice the yard looks, I am not disappointed! But if he does say something about it, then it is just icing on the cake!!

I hope some of this helps you. There are a lot of people here on MB who know what they are talking about! Kily has become a good friend of mine!! I will offer the same thing that Kily did, you can email me at sttsi2003@yahoo.com if you want to.

Good luck DWHD!

I don't trust anyone. I can't remember a time when I did trust anyone. I thought about this a while before I sat down here to type. I cannot think of anyone I have ever REALLY trusted.
I was raised in a christian home, church twice on Sundays and once on Wednesday. I still go to church most every Sunday.As I said before, I've been searching for more than just the knowledge, yearning for the relationship with God that brings peace and joy. I can't find Him. That is a lonely feeling.
I saw an Endocrinologist a few months ago. He said the best thing to do for postpartum thyroid disorders is to wait out the storm. Drug intervention can damage the thyroid or make recovery take longer. He suggested PTU, But I won't take that while nursing, and I don't want to quit nursing yet. Baby's biting now, and has 2 teeth. My opinion may soon change on quitting! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" />
I do have the financial ability to make it on my own. I have lots of support from my family. Would I try it on my own? I don't know. I haven't given it much thought. I know my H would go for full custody of my boys. I couldn't live with that.
The therapists I have seen all seem to just sit there and feel sorry for me. That's not what I need. They've all been Christian, 2 guys, 2 gals. Another problem is that I have been pretneding my whole life. I can seem just fine to most people I interact with. Including therapists. I can put on a pretty good act. I have the habit of being whatever the other person wants to be, in order to gain approval and acceptance. I did this with my H. Bent over backwards being what he wanted when we started out. Bad habit. But I don't know who I am. I don't believe I ever have. I don't even know who I want to be. I have some idea, but I really don't know. I have no real identity.
I love to be alone, because then I don't have to be anything for anyone else.
No one knows the real me, because that person does not exsist. Probably never has. Because of this, my life has been a series of bad choices. But I don't kow how to change this.
My dad had an A early on in my parents marriage. My mom has had many EA's throughout the years, one being with my H. I suspected it, confronted her, she denied it. I found a sealed letter that she wrote him after I had confronted her, confessing many things to him, including that she could see her greatest fantasies come true with him. He never read the letter. He knew nothing of her feelings for him. I have never confronted her on this. Not sure how. She tells me I need help. She 'has it all together'.
What do you do with that????
How do you reconcile that?
How do you take 31 years of crap and make something beautiful and worth while out of it?

So, you're choosing to behave in ways much like your Mother's ways?

You apparently do NOTadmire your Mother ... yet you choose to walk her path.

Why is that?

Pep

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Doing what he did:
<strong>I don't trust anyone. I can't remember a time when I did trust anyone... I cannot think of anyone I have ever REALLY trusted...

The therapists I have seen all seem to just sit there and feel sorry for me. That's not what I need. They've all been Christian, 2 guys, 2 gals. Another problem is that I have been pretneding my whole life. I can seem just fine to most people I interact with. Including therapists. I can put on a pretty good act. I have the habit of being whatever the other person wants to be, in order to gain approval and acceptance. I did this with my H. Bent over backwards being what he wanted when we started out. Bad habit. But I don't know who I am. I don't believe I ever have. I don't even know who I want to be. I have some idea, but I really don't know. I have no real identity.
I love to be alone, because then I don't have to be anything for anyone else.
</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Have you talked to your pastor about help finding a new counselor? They can probably be a LOT of help for finding a GOOD therapist!!! Did I see somewhere that you lived in MN? I know a few good therapists who may be able to give some referrals.

I have a LOT of information that I would like to share with you... Too much here for MB. email me and I can give you some more information. You and I are more similar than you can imagine.

I don't know, Pepperband. Maybe because that's what she modeled for us. ??? My sister doesn't have this same behavior pattern. But my older brother does. And my younger brother shows the same tendancies. Why DO we repeat the same destructive patterns our parents follow??? There are things I admire about my mother. We did nothing but fight until I left for college. We have benn more like friends in the last 3 years. But the knowledge I have of that letter colors every interaction we have. I don't think it's a concious decision to act in the same ways that she has acted. Now that you say that, you can bet I'm going to be workin' hard on not being my mom. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> I don't want my kids to grow up the way I did.
We have a new pastor at our church. Nothing against California here, but that's where he came from, to rural Wisconsin, and it's just not a real good fit. I'm not comfortable talking to him. I need to find a new church home.
How do I re-light the fire for my H? How do I re-engage in this marriage? It seems a monumental task that lies before me. I am overwhelmed.
But I feel there is a great deal of support here. Thanks, everybody, for your words of encouragement, your 2x4s, and your honesty. I need this.

Find a Calvary Chapel, there are hundreds in Cali.

DWHD-

Trust starts inside. I'm hoping to guide you in a journey towards trusting yourself. Once that little thing happens, trust becomes more natural.

Truthfully, therapists are just a tool. Until you are fed up with your life - (rock bottom) - and are wanting the change, no therapist or psychiatrist can help.

Imrdy and I can answer your questions, along with the many other wonderful people that have responded here. We won't let you fall and you've already shown US trust just by posting here.

I answered your email. I look forward to your response.

You can change your thinking.

You can change your life.

You have the willingness once you decide you have the will.

Pep

YOu asked a question about WHY we re-create our parents life in our own. I have a theory on that if you give me the patience, I'll try to offer it to you.

I've come to believe that as children you're exposed to things that your parents do and you watch them deal with it a certain way. Based on their coping skills, you form a frame of reference. It's because of this frame of reference that your own skills develop and are utilized.

Some of the interpretations are different based on the age of the child as they go through the experience. YOu might be older than youe brother so you might have had a maturity to understand a dynamic where your brother didn't. Therefore, you might sail through something that scarred him, or vice versa.

I think that what happens is if you didn't get to some resolution about THEIR issues, you tend to recreate the painful situation in an attempt to understand it and heal from the damaging event.

In my case, my mom left us when I was young because my father forced her out of the house. At that time, I was really young and only saw that my mom left me and I didn't know why.

Later in my life, I left my own children for two weeks to go to Maui as a "declaration of my independance" to my X. This of course was his introduction into D-day and a wake up call to my A. Now, looking back, I see that I had created that abandonment cycle with MY kids.

Although they had no part in the situation that led to my leaving, I in effect, repeated that cycle. What I learned was that it wasn't MY fault that she left. I realized that SHE had issues and left because it was her way of dealing with her pain.

I hope this made some sense...

Kily-

I think you answered the question beautifully! I think sub-consicously we all choose one parent to be like. It is not that we 100% agree with that parent in their actions and thoughts, it is that we really only know how our parents react to things in life. One parents reaction we agree with more than another. It isn't until we see how similar we are to our parents and then find the tools to help us that we begin to make the changes necessary to begin our own life, filled with our own thoughts and actions based on what we want.

STTSI- (OR Mrs.)

Thanks for adding. I think EVRERy piece of input will help this lady 100%.

DWHD-

Here's the link if that's what you want to do.

Kily's Links

Now, in your case...I would walk you firther into this becasue I feel that you need to see what my journey was like and what I felt. I think my experiences will touch something inside you that will tell you whether or not you CAN trust the things that I am suggesting. YOu will feel a warm peace inside you as you read IF you feel that it's real. Otherwise, that cold emptiness which has settled in your chest as a tightness will remain....

I'm here if you need me.

I seem to have perpetuated the negative characteristic of both of my parents. How bad is that???
Why is that? Why can't I emulate some positive traits? Why am I unable to rise above my circumstances and find the good in everything that happens in life?
Am I just really immature?
Honesty, please. You can't hurt me anymore than I already have.

"Why can't I emulate some positive traits?"

Pick one or two simple positive traits .... and start emulating your heart out hon!

We love you and your struggle.

Every day a baby step.

Pep <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />

Doing-

Why do you always look at the bad things you have done? Have you no good in your life? Remember Monty Python "Always look on the bright side of life!"

You can't and don't rise above the negative things because you seem to prefer the victim mentality. When life gives you lemons, make lemonade. Ha! I seem to be full of them tonight.

OK, so your M isn't everything that you wanted it to be. What do you want from your M? Set some goals, make a plan and then follow through with it.

The other day I was talking to my sister, she is getting married next month and she told me that her and fiance are using W and I as an example of what not to do in a M. We also spoke about how similar we are to our parents and their M. She said she didn't want to end up like our parents or W and I. I told my sister that W and I also spoke about my parents, her parents and their M's, we also said we didn't want to end up like them. I told my sister that the one thing we were missing was the image of what we wanted. I told her that W and I knew what we didn't want, we somewhat knew what we wanted but most importantly, we had no plan of how to get to where we wanted to go. So instead me floundered around and ended up just like our parents. You see Doing, with no plan of action we fall back into what we learned as children. I became un-loving, W had an A and Kily ran from her children. Just like our parents. So often we know what we don't want but we spend so little time focusing on what we do want and how to get there.

Look to the future and what do you see? Ha, another line from a song!

Doing, I digress with my long story, sorry. But the point is, you can rise above the problems only when you are tired of the victim mentality and you are ready to, we will try to get you to that point!

I know no other mentality. I have no frame of reference. I don't know how to think positive because I can't remember a time when I ever did. I'm sitting here thinking, and I can't think of anything. I just asked my H, he can't think of any times either.
But I will try. Something positive...............
what? where do I start? Give me something to focus on.

How about when you held your newborn children in your arms for the first time? Don't you consider that a happy and positive time?

You know how to find something to be positive about, you are just afraid to. By being positive you would shed your victim skin and become a new person.

You have children right? Do they give you pleasure?

Do you work or are you a stay at home mom? Do you find any pleasure in that?

Today was a nice day, was it not? Not too hot and humid, right? That made me happy, how did it make you feel?

When someone goes thru the express lane at the checkout with more items than allowed you would get upset, right? You would think "That darned person doesn't belong in this line and they are holding up the rest of us."

It is your CHOICE to be mad at that person. They did nothing directly to you to hurt you or anything like that. Sure, their action was inconsiderate, but that is it.

You could A: Choose to get upset and stressed out because of it, or B: Take the extra time you have while waiting to make sure you have all your items or to read one of those silly magazines that are sitting there.

Doing, do you see what I am getting at? Just like it is your choice to be mad at that person, it is your choice to be upset about things and it is your choice to play the victim role.

Like Stephen Covey said "Between stimulus and response lies choice."

DWHD-

How about the fact that you woke up this morning and felt the sun in your face?

The first thing that I suggest that you do is to sit down and write out your life history. All of it. Every bad memory, every hurtful rejection...all of it.

By the time I finished, I had 45 typed pages. When I met my therapist, I handed it to him and said - "This should help you understand where I'm at now."

I'm not saying that you should share this with anyone, though it is a good way to start healing.

The idea is to purge all of your anger into that document. It will help you understand exactly where your pain began.

Take that time and do it for you. Once you start, you will find that you HAVE to finish it. It will become like an obsession. I promise you, that once you do it, you'll feel less angry.

I just wanted to add that plenty of Anti-d's are safe while BFing, I've had to take them with both of my children.