Hi all!

I've been in PB for oh...four days now.

I seem to be on some kind of fast track MB plan. My story in a nutshell: 7/27 (two weeks, two days ago) my H told me unexpectedly that he was no longer in love with me and wanted a D. I've been posting here for years...came here for some advice. Everyone said they smelled an A. Snooped around, found out about A/OW on 7/29. Revealed that I knew about A that night before my appt. with potential MC. Next day, I exposed A to everyone - friends, family, acquaintances. On 8/2, we visited the MC together. The following day, I discovered WS was going to visit OW in Hawaii. On 8/4, I called the OW's H. They are newlyweds - basically married 2 months. Sounds like they married, went away for a honeymoon, had two more weeks of wedded bliss - then gets involved with my H of eight years. On 8/6, I sent email to OW telling her that I was going to do whatever it took to save my M and to please leave my H alone. OW's H called my WS to confront him. My WS proceeded to spend 2.5 hours verbally abusing me while he packed his remaining belongings and leaving that night. On 8/8, WS called - wanting to discuss "the terms of our D." and offering to take me and my dog to the vet's office on Sunday. I tentatively agreed, but then decided it was time for Plan B. Sent him a PBL in form of email. I knew he received it - because he replied to it! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />
On 8/10, WS called my cell phone, but I didn't answer (God bless Caller ID). I was in the middle of saying goodbye to my best friend of 13+ years. I had to have my dog put to sleep - she was very ill. He called again that night - I wasn't expecting it at all. He called to find out about my dog - I simply told him that I had her put to sleep and that I had to go...click.

So, I'm in pitch darkness right now.

I've got lots of important things to focus on right now - getting a job and getting my career back on track first and foremost.

I have ups and downs throughout the day. Sometimes I have these - Oh my god! This is real and I can't believe this is happening to me! moments. Other times I feel manic and anxious - like I need to move furniture or run around in circles or something. Other times, I feel exhausted. I look forward to the infrequent times where I'm calm, relaxed and not worrying about anything. There is a constant knot in my stomach. I've lost some 15 lbs. on the infidelity diet...

{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{*LULU*}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}
Welcome to the B club. We all understand your pain here. I am so sorry that on top of this A you lost your pet. I have to say that the fact your husband contacted you twice is encouraging. Be strong, take care of yourself and vent here with us! Rhonda

Thanks for the hugs and welcome texmexgirl.

The nightmare only gets worse. Two weeks ago, WS's friend was murdered. On top of this, my cousin - 17 years old went into cardiac arrest and passed away two days later. Meningitis. Sunday night after I sent my beloved pet to the rainbow bridge. Is there a bottom to this pit of despair???

WS told me that exposing the A made me look bad - that all these friends of his have rallied around him to support him and told him that they never liked me in the first place. That there is something wrong with me....that I'm somehow "off" or crazy. He's doing a pretty good job of convincing people that I'm psycho. I'm wary of running into people he knows...I'm also very grateful I haven't had to deal with that yet. I guess it is a blessing in disguise because I know, see and hear nothing about WS and the OW.

I guess most of the time, I don't think PB is so bad. I get lots of time to myself to read and work on making positive changes in my life. I only get down when I start thinking about the 'Hope for the best, Prepare for the worst.'

*LULU*, What a horrible time for you and your family. The murder of WS's friend and the lost of your young relative, and the loss of your beloved pet on top of dealing with this affair mess. Are you taking any anti-depressives? I didn't believe in taking a happy pill but I crashed and burn 4 months after d-day prior to the holidays. It made a world of difference for me. I was able to make it through most days without crying. I am no longer taking them since I have become so much emotionally stronger the longer this goes on.

LULU, don't believe anything that your spouse is saying. He is trying to hurt you. Our spouses know us and they know what buttons to push to hurt us. My WS told me the same thing about people thinking I was the crazy one. I felt like I was the crazy one, he made me crazy with this affair. I have learned from contacts that WS and OW (who are coworkers) have few friends now and that the only few friends endorcing the affair were cheaters once themselves.

I see my WS as not being the same person I married because he is not. He is an alien. He looks the same, act normal around everyone else but he takes his guilt out on me by his directing his anger at me. I have taken myself out of the loop by being in plan b. The only person he can LB will be OW and not me anymore.

LULU, Let Plan B protect you and your heart from more hurt, its does help when you don't have to be subjected to your WS anger to save love for him.

I will pray for you..Rhonda

Hi All!

I have a Plan B question.

Should I be Plan B'ing my MIL as well?

When H first left me, MIL and I got very close. She called me EVERY day and I would call her as well. We prayed together, we cried together we just pretty much talked all day and gave each other hope that this would all pass. I've been in Plan B now for 12 days and have not really spoken to my MIL in about 2 or 3 weeks. Just suddently, she stopped calling and I didn't call her either. Then again, she did get married some weeks ago so is now busy with her husband.

Yesterday, I called her to say hello and she started telling me something about my H wanting me to give him something. It hurt that she was on his side now. It was like she was defending him. Today, I went to her house to pick up some products I had ordered from her (avon). She's a picture fanatic and has her living room covered in them. She has about 10 pictures of H and I there. Some months back I asked her if H had asked to have those taken down but she said no. She said she wouldn't take them down anyways. (he sleeps in the living room and sees them daily) Well, Today that I went I noticed that she took most of them down already. It really hurt to see that. I felt like she was starting to accept the life my H is now living and erasing me from her life. I don't know if I'm just being paranoid or not but maybe he took them down himself. Who knows. I didn't have the nerve to ask her. It just got me very depressed.

That's why I ask the question, should I be Plan B'ing my MIL as well? I know that not knowing about my H has been much better for my heart lately, but now that I've seen this, I hurt all over again. What do you guys think?

Suggestions and comments greatly appreciated.

Thanks.

H98

I am here because my Plan B only ended a short time ago. It was not the sweeping changes all at once, but happened over a month and a half span. I asked H to leave about 2 months after d-day because he was getting more and more withdrawn and sullen...yelling at the kids and me. After leaving he contacted the OW again but claimed he wanted to come back. He treated her like a friend, and she even gave him marital advice..."go back to her, but I'll be your friend". (And this after the first no contact email in March).

We kept in contact with each other almost daily. He stays home with the kids and would come over every morning and leave every evening. Sometimes I would ask him to stay for dinner, if he made it. I realized we could go on like this forever if I wasn't specific about what I wanted him to do in order to return. I gave him a letter that told him the terms of returning. They were...#1 N/C with OW #2 and #3 See a counselor and look into taking medication #4 HONESTY and accountability #5 Spend more time with me and family. He argued about the letter when I gave it to him..."You're trying to control me" I explained it was his choice whether he followed these or not. "I should take these to a counselor and say 'fix me'" at which I replied, I would like for you to see a counselor, what you talk about is up to you. Then I left for work. A switch must have gone off because he followed me out to my car and said he was sorry, he would think about this and we would talk about it later.

We did more talking about the specifics. What honesty would look like, etc. There were still many more nights of bad times when I was sure he was out with her.

We had planned a family vacation I told him he was no longer welcome to, I needed a vacation from the drama. I think that opened his eyes too, and mine. I was able to go on a week long camping trip, on my own, take care of myself and didn't need him. It seemed the stronger I got, the more scared he got. The more independent I became and seemed like I had a life, the more he thought I wouldn't want him back.

After vacation he told me he sent her a N/C message via IM (their mode of communication). He made an appointment for a counselor, and started working on spending more time with us. Things looked up. It was nother month before he had REALLY worked hard at all 5 terms (it ended with a dr. appt to check on medicine of which he is prescribed effexor). So, I asked him back in the home.

I wish I could say everything is dreamy. I worry that the changes we've made (yes, me too) are just temporary and we'll get back to our rut... Some bad habits have crept back, our independent behavior. And everytime he comes back from the counselor he seems to spiral in anger and unhappiness (not necessarily a bad thing), he blames me for awhile...then things are better. So we are back, but it is tenuous.

Had a thought about the MIL situation. How about a modified Plan B with her. One where you can leave the door open but set boundaries...

"I have enjoyed our relationship, and you have helped me during some very tough times. However, it has been healthy for my stress level not to know too much about my H's relationship with the other woman. I would love to continue talking with you, I do so enjoy it, but if we would stay off the topic of H and our marriage that would help me more than you realize."

Something like that, so you open the door to talking, but let her know you are not going to pump her for information, and neither complain about her baby. It may be your H's wishes that she not talk with you...and out of respect for her son she does not call...

Everyone,

I think for a while I will leave my very recent, very active participation in MB. I made some recent posts on Cerri's thread, where, in a fit of anger and frustration, agreed to do things that went against my very nature: writing letters to the OW's employer, contacting her family, my WH's employer, etc. They were read by my WH, who immediately threatened D because of those planned actions.

Today he and I talked. In person. Even tho' we are in Plan B. When the conversation started, he was ready to make an appointment with an attorney this afternoon. He said "we" were ready to D. I told him no, I was not...perhaps he was, but I loved him. I have stood by him through this affair, through cancer, and through 19 years of being married. I had no intention of leaving thru divorce now.

As we talked, he also brought up the potential problems with some of the advice being given out here about sending letters to people disclosing affair partners. There are all kinds of legal action (I have done a bit of research on this now) that can be taken by the person about whom the information is written.

My WH is starting IC/MC next week. While he is not ready yet to give up the OW, I am holding on to the fact that he is going for counseling. And he is taking Cerri's list of questions to ask. That is a positive for me to hold onto as well. If he had no interest in saving our M, he would not take that approach. And at least he has been honest with me about his present inability to give her up.

We both agreed that we have had many, many happy years and he loves me still. He said all this would be much easier if he didn't. I told him I wanted him well, wanted him home, wanted our marriage and wanted the opportunity to make him happy as we used to be.

I know all of this flies in the face of the MB philosophies. But there are times that we have to trust our gut (just as when we suspect the A in the first place). My gut this time told me it was not my style to write the letters to strangers that were recommended here. Instead of defending my position and stating how I felt, I reacted with anger, frustration, and actually all I was doing was "venting." I never intended to write those letters. There are also times that we have to put our faith in God. And that is what I did this afternoon. I prayed for the calm heart that all on this board talk about. I prayed for the words I needed, I prayed for guidance in terms of whether a D was the right move or not. The answers were given to me and I have dealt with this situation my way. It may not be the MB way, and who knows what the path ahead may bring to my life.

I will continue to read and post here, but I must remember that above all else, I must be true to myself. I must be honest with myself and with others here and, if it doesn't fit, don't wear it.

I don't mean to discredit Plan B. We may remain in it. I just do not know yet.

ISG

Bump for 23down!
Here it is, let's get it going again!
Plan B is tough, I'm sure we can all help each other here!

I'm back, despite what my previous post said.

I know, deep in my heart, that this is the way to go. I still don't know the answer, the outcome of my situation (and who among us does?), but OK, Plan B'ers...let's get back on it.

Shugah! Thanks for resurrecting this thread. We all need each other's support.

Hi All!

I'm actually doing very good in Plan B. I don't have many down days since I don't hear about my H and what he's up to. BUT.....

I'm scared that I'm going to get used to this and not want him back. Sometimes I feel that perhaps letting go of him forever will be easier than actually going into recovery with him. That's NOT what I want but I just KNOW we're going to have such a hard time if we go thru recovery. I know that life is not easy but seeing him again every day and remembering all he did to me is just going to hurt me so much, all over again. I want to recover and would do anything to be there but why do I feel this way sometimes? Does anybody else feel the same? or have felt the same?

H98

Hello fellow Plan B'ers-

I've been away for a few days of sun and surf, with limited computer access. Lots has happened here!

ISGirl - have you heard anything from your WH about his IC session? Or are you back in Plan B before talking to him?

Shugah - how are you? What's going on with the kids? How's the mowing? I just lowered the deck on my mower, maybe I won't have to cut the grass so often if I cut it short, LOL.

Hopeful98 - I also wonder if I will get used to living without WH, but that's part of Plan B if I understand it correctly. If the WS never returns, then we BS's will find it easier to Dv because we have detached from the WS. It's a risk, but I can't think of a better way to handle this situation.

I had a great heart-to-heart with 2 of my sisters-in-law while on vacation. They reminded me that they have always seen me as independent and competent, 2 things that I'm desperately trying to be right now. It felt good to hear them say that. My entire family has been careful not to say much about what they think I should do about my M. Hearing about Shugah's problems with her family, I am grateful for this.

Nothing new concerning WH. When he called 10 days ago I told him to end his A and call me when he was ready, then we could talk. I really wish I had added that I wouldn't wait forever.

Just checking in, this is a good thread. Thanks for keeping it up!

Lablady

<small>[ August 19, 2003, 10:24 PM: Message edited by: lablady ]</small>

Thanks, Shugah, for getting it going again. Not much to say on my first night except sorry I have to be here. Looks like I am in very good company, though. Hope I can contribute.

Thought I'd drop in for a few minutes before I get ready for a beach day. It's about an hour or more away. I'm on vacation this week and though I can't afford to do much I thought it would be good for 12 yr.old S to spend some time together. But he is being so difficult trying to agree or get him to suggest activities. Like today, D & I want to get in at least one beach day and he refuses to go, wouldn't even ask a friend to go. I'm torn between making him go and leaving him here. But he sat home alone for a good part of the summer. I've even suggested an additional activity on the way home from the beach. He likes mini-golf and we've done that this week. Also just playing games like Scrabble and cards, we've done a LOT of that lately. He's attached to my hip. Anyways, I'm sure it'll work out, I just fear a little manipulation may set in on his part when he sees I'm bending over backwards for him. I did have a long talk with him last week about WH's addictive like behavior. Basically said his Dad loves him very much but because he is caught up in somehting right now that prevents him from seeing what he is doing to the people he loves and from using good judgement and that hopefully he will come to realize that what he is doing is causing pain to others but that there is nothing S or I can do do change it. It has nothing to do with anything he or I did. We can still love WH but that it's ok to be angry or sad too. I hope the talk helped.

Hopeful: I feel EXACTLY the same way! IT's uncanny how similar us BS's feel about things. It's a scary process and there is risk but like lablady says it's the best way to handle it.

Lablady: Lawn is looking great! All that rain has kept it looking good for this time of year but hasn't seemed to slow the growth! Don't cut it too short, not as healthy for the lawn, 2" is good.(I like the short look though!)
I know how hard it is to hear from BH about reconc. and then not hear again. 2 mos. ago, mine said "lets get together and put all our cards on the table and see what we have left, I'm not saying it'll change anything but I'm not saying it won't" Well I took that as a let's talk about us, and it was the closest thing to suggesting a "maybe" that I'd seen. The talk never happened! I had gotten so excited about it only to be disappointed big time. I won't let that happen again.

ISGirl, let us know if you hear from WH about counseling.

Gotto Go, this was longer than I'd planned and the sunshine won't wait!

IS Girl, The Harleys have obviously seen thousands of these cases, and they can tell us what will and won't work in most cases. That doesn't mean every word they say will work in every individual case. I haven't had personal counseling with them, but I understand that they adjust the recipe as needed for individuals. I really truly value someone who can tell me the percentages on some of the judgment calls I make -- it helps guide my actions. But it doesn't determine my actions.

I am in a "modified B" myself. I know my H would love total NC at this point, because it would help him to forget me and move on with OW. He's not getting ENs met from me, and I know there are LBs on their side, but I, too, have adjusted the recipe for a particular individual. Just keep their warnings in mind as you proceed forward.

I guess I'm a MODIFIED B like some of you others. I TRY to maintain minimal contact and not meet ENs. WS claims that he is "ending it and it's over" with her but still has not met all of my conditions.

Does that make me a PLAN B Failure???

I'm not sure but I still want to remain part of the club.

Ok, now I'm worried. I have a question about the comments above on letting OW and WH's employers know about affair.

My sister has a letter ready to go to WH an OW's employer and is angry that I haven't done this myself.

I don't live close to them anymore and I think they have pretended that WH and I are divorced. They recently had OC, but I have been Plan A'ing long distance and it has shown some positive response.

If my sister sends this letter, I believe that my WH will automatically assume that it was sent by me and it may get both he and OW fired. I don't want to destroy the progress I have made so far, but don't think it is right for them to live and act as if they haven't done anything wrong.

There are some other things coming into play here, but for now, I would appreciate any one who has informed the employer and how did this go?

I have my Plan B letter ready to go and am finishing up this month. Do I inform employer and risk getting them both fired????
Thanks,
cajeanie

Hello PB'ers,

I am not convinced that my WH actually saw a counselor, truth be known! But he emailed me today, saying he didn't know if he would ever find one he'd be happy with (!) but that a friend had talked to him about Promise Keepers and how it had helped him. WH also talked about possibly seeing a counselor he had seen about 10 years ago that had helped him a lot. He asked if I wanted to be kept in the loop about his counseling progress.

Ready?

I re-wrote a very kind, very loving PBL, and included the following:

"H, I care very deeply about your efforts at counseling. I care that you are seeking help that we both feel you need. But because you are continuing this affair, I will have to trust you, trust God and trust the counselor(s) to bring about improved health for you. I just can't be an ongoing part of the process until you are ready to tell me the affair is over. At that time I will look forward to hearing from you. We'll have a lot to talk about."

I feel good. Unfortunately, the reason I feel good is that I "reached out" to my H and feel I made a connection. Instead I should be feeling good about my reinforcing boundaries. Maybe in some small way I do.

This board and many members have been so helpful. We frequently forget to thank each other, and I am here to say, I could not - repeat - COULD NOT - do it without all you guys!

Thank you! Hugs to each and every one of you!

ISG

cajeanie,

Allow me to take some license and copy and paste what Star*Fish has recently posted to me. She is a very wise fish, by the way:

"I just wanted to say some things to you about exposure that should help you feel a little better about where I stand on this issue, and how I believe you are not operating outside of where you should be for Plan B.

Ideally, exposure should be done during Plan A. There are alot of reasons for this. First of all....when it can be done quickly and early, it can definitely shorten the affair. It works better when you are living together because the anger that the WS feels can be assauged a bit by meeting needs. It seems more understandable and even forgivable by the WS because at that point, you are still in Plan A (treating them very well in every other respect)....filling needs, not lBing and it seems reasonable that you will do all that is necessary to end the affair. The anger actually subsides fairly quickly and you still have time to build up the Love Bank before implementing Plan B. The problem is that very few people have the courage it takes to make full exposure during Plan A....it's just too scary and it goes against instinct.

Then Plan B comes along.....and that's when spouses seem more willing to expose...but for the wrong reason. That reason is vindictiveness...and that's how the BS sees it too. From their perspective, it's like saying "oh yeah....well if I can't have you...no one can...watch this." NOT the message you want to send at all. If it isn't seen as a marriage saving technique, then the riskiness of Plan B is just worsened sometimes. So I am not worried about your lack of exposure at this point. It is NOT however because I believe that your husband would never forgive you....I still think that's a threat...but the real value is right in the beginning of Plan A....and you get diminishing returns after that. So with Plan B....rather than sending out letters and such....I just prefer that the BS doesn't keep things secret if asked. You shouldn't have to be dishonest if you are asked directly by people close to you...but the whole exposure "campaign" is not optimum while separated. JMHO Does that make sense?

I also am not completely on board with just blanket exposure....I much prefer to see exposure used to enlist the help of people who can fortify your marriage. IMO, work is one of the gray areas, and is most helpful when the A is with a coworker. In that instance, the hypocrisy of the WS saying that "it will ruin a career" is unbelievable since it's THEY who chose to go against company policy to begin with. But again, this is most appropriate during Plan A."

You can easily introduce a thread to Star*Fish, just call out her name in the topic title and she will get back to you. She is a great calming influence here.

Hey Star, my invoice is in the mail!

ISGIRL,
Thanks for the hug! I really needed it. Kids are driving me nuts, just haven't had any time to myself lately, it's really exhausting trying to keep on top of kids needs, especially 12 yr.old S's increased need for attention, affection, etc. I think when they get back to school I'm going to take an extra day off just for ME!
IT's when I feel stressed and exhausted that I start to feel the anger well up. I think -this isn't fair to me or the kids.
WH gets the "prize" and we get stuck with picking up the pieces of our lives.
ISGirl, good for you in re-establishing PlanB boundaries. It was done in a very caring and loving way for both of you!

Shugah,

Where do you live, if you don't mind saying (no prob if you dont't want to).

If I were in your geographic area, I would physically be there for you...helping with kids, etc.

Have you thought about posting and maybe seeing if there is local support?

We need to be there for each other.

Count me in!