Pep...the first affair was over 8 years ago and was exposed. My wife took it hard but we eventually worked through it.

Thanks for the support!!

lonleyfather03,

Your screen id creeps me out <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> ... sorry. I like better committedfatherof3.

You have been broken her trust at least more than once ...

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><strong>Becoming 100000% accountable is something I am trying to do ( passwords, schedules, email and voice mail access) but is there more???? </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Yes there are a lot more .... a lot more time !. Also you have to give her 4 gifts of love ... Care (ENs) Protection (LBs) Time (Undivided attn.) Radical Honesty. Ask her to fill in (ALL QNs) one for you and you fill one for her. If she refuse ... you fillin one as if she did it and guess it.

You make her feel secure about you. Honest like a book for her to read. You let her know where you are AT ALL TIME. If you are late comming back home ... notify her. Send all email automaticly copy forwarding to email address that she has access only. This is a few idea.

PTC, Patience, Time and Consistent, ... you M might survive might be not ... I don't follow your posts but this one.

-rh-

Originally posted by lonleyfather03:
Pep...the first affair was over 8 years ago and was exposed. My wife took it hard but we eventually worked through it.

What lessons did you learn from affair #1 eight years ago?

What lessons did your wife learn from affair #1?

"Working through" implies that something was learned, and changes were made.

After going through seeing your wife's heart broken the first time .... what were you thinking?

Is there an alcohol or drug issue here perhaps? Is there a maturity issue? Is there a mental illness working underneath the surface? In other words, are there midigating circumstances within you that you have not thought about?

I am finding it difficult to understand your rationale for affair #2 after the devistation of affair #1.

Lessons learned vs lessons ignored...????

I am certain your wife is thinking much like this.... I bring this up for discussion because it is germaine as to why your W should consider a life with you .... should she consider you a *high risk* partner?

You better have some very clear self-understanding and a very very solid response when your W asks you .... Why? with tears in her eyes.

Pep
<img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />

Thanks Pep.....we sought some brief counseling after the first affair and that was it. The A was never discussed again although there were times during the next 8 years in which I was reminded of it occuring during an argument or something like it with my W. As for underlying circumstances other than complete stupidity and selfeshness....no drugs or alcohol but my psychiatrist has diagnosed me with a form of depression. Not that this is an excuse mind you but you asked and I answered.

In my wife's eyes I am probably high risk but seeking professional help was my first step in finding out why I did such a thing. My second step involves being completely open and honest with my W (she has access to everything and has a schedule as to where I am and with whom each week)

We have not yet talked about what we are going to do about our marriage. I know that I want to be the husband she deserves. We are both very close to our two children and my W has made it very clear that she in no way wants to hamper my interaction with them. We have a schedule we follow each week, although I would like more time. Other than our children my focus, as I stated in previous posts is my wife and her wellbeing.

Although my actions may not show it I do care deeply for my W and love her very much! I have taken all of the advice so far and am taking action daily to show her I am committed to this relationship. Mostly small things but she has begun to accept my offers for help more frequently!

Thanks again Pep and to everyone else who has replied to my posts. I wish you all a Happy New Year.

I had a very tough day today talking with my W...while picking up the kids she handed me back the book His Need Her Needs and said the damage had already been done and did not feel the need to read it.

I guess I had this coming and should start preparing for a D. I don't know what else I can do to show my commitment; I know that what I have done would say otherwise. How can I suggest that we go to counseling together? My psychiatrist has recommended some really good marriage (couples) counselors but I am not sure if she would go. Any suggestions or do I just give up?

LONELYFATHER...

you are going to have to rise above your instinct to run away any time to you get any negative feedback...

while picking up the kids she handed me back the book His Need Her Needs and said the damage had already been done and did not feel the need to read it.

I guess I had this coming and should start preparing for a D.

so lets put this perspective...she hands you back a book...you think it's time to prepare for a divorce.... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

Isn't her posturing and taking control over what she feels understandable...??
In her position...

And isn't it true that if you still want a marriage with her...than you better be ready to weather many storms and bumps...not leaps from giving you back a book to getting a divorce...
did she say she is getting a divorce...
did you say I don't want a divorce...and nor do I ever want to go back to the marriage we once had...but what I want is a marriage filled with respect and love worthy of you and me...
huh?? did you tell her that part..or did you tuck tail and scurry away...

two affairs....
two different women you aggressively pursued at great risk and cost...
she hands you back a book and you're ready for the lawyer...
put your head next to the monitor so I can thunk you on it....

peps post is good...
perhpas you need to open up here with what the motivation for your affairs are/where...

what are the unmet needs on both parts...

I gotta run..be back later to wail on ya... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />
ARK

ARK...I knew I could count on you to put everything in perspective....I am not ready to tuck and run I was just voicing a minor emotional outburt. A little clarification here, the first affair or relationship did not actually involve sex but rather companionship; the second affair went further and did involve sex. As for my motivation, other than low self esteem and mild depression; I would have to say that some of my needs were not being met...sex and admiration being the top of the list with recreational companionship being third. That being said, I am certain I have not met her needs for affection and conversation.

I am not ready to give up, on the contrary I guess I need to be prepared for the ups and downs. When confronted by my W for an explanation or discussion of this, I guess I am a little fearful of not knowing what to say. However, taking a tip from you, worrying is wasted energy and I am assuming that when we do have a constructive conversation that what I say needs to come from my heart with no BS involved.

Thanks again for keeping me on track.

From everything that I have read to this date, I am under the impression that the cold reception I have been receiving from my W is normal. Further, it is my understanding that I should continue to take action each and every day to assure her of my committment....not matter what the reaction. How do I attempt to get my W to open up to me and really tell me how she feels....as of this posting she has not even really vented her anger at me. Do I continue doing what I am doing and hope that over time I get her to open up?

devotedfather03,


Thanks for changing your screen name <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> . Just think if she was the WW ... what it takes for you to trust her again ?.

Guess her ENs ... guess her LB points ... do plan A ... !.

What are her complaints about you before D-day ?. Do them all (plan A) !. Make it as a habit !. This is the least you could do when you are still M to her.

About ENs ... do the top 5. Most people won't reject ENs being fillin unless they are guarding it.

Keep going ... -rh-

redhat...I liked your suggestion regarding the screen name and so took your advice there. As for EN's I am almost certain that Affection and conversation were missing. LB's angry outburts would be one that is common. Regarding Plan A...I know that ceasing all contact with the L is a big part, and that has been done; no contact since October 27th. As for the other parts, I find it difficult to do some of them if she is not willing to engage in a conversation.

Your right regarding how I would feel if she were the WW, but my tendancy would be that I must have done something wrong to have made her look elsewhere! I am not sure if my W will look at herself for any portion of the blame nor am I going to suggest to her that she is....doen't she have to come to that realization herself?

Thanks again

devotedfather03,

Yes, she has to come to a realization that she has 50% fault in here for M be prone to A on her own. You can help it by doing the right thing.

It will take time. Again if conversation is her top EN ... she is still living with you <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> . Make sure when she talk to you, you have 1000% of your attention to her !. Make it enjoyable for her.

Again ... your NC just barely pass 3 months ... you have to be patience, consistent, and giving it time.

-rh-

redhat....thanks again for the information; I realize this is going to take a long time but my gut just tells me that she is not going to want to reconcile....

There have been signs that she is looking to move back to our hometown but nothing has been said to me directly. Anyway, there is no sense worrying in what I can't control; All I can do is work hard at meeting her EN's and making sure I do not participate in LB's. I am hopeful that we will start talking in detail about what happens next or where her head is at this time.

Thanks again and if you have anything more to add just let me know.

Thanks

My wife has agreed to sit down with me this week and discuss among other things our current situation, specifically her thoughts regarding the possibility for reconsiliation or divorce. Again, I have stated before I have no idea as to what her inclination is and hopefully will gain some more insite as to what she intends on doing.

My question here is what is off limits and what is not? This is really the first time we will be having an in depth conversation about us since the separation (October 27th) Do I ask her point blank " Are you going to seek or file for a divorce?" If the answer is yes, then what do I do?

Any suggestions?