Long story short after 5 months, last night, after a long discussion about trust, WW said that she commits to me and to working on the marriage.

Although she agrees to block OMs e.mail accounts she still expects privacy and will not give me free access to her machine.

Is this a possitive step to start from or am I just setting myself up to be decieved again?

Confused,

JGNC

I believe you, unfortunately, know the answer to this question already, since you are here asking it. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

NC, 100% access, 100% accountability.

If she is doing nothing wrong, what does she have to hide?

Amy

Others may not agree but here is what I suggest.
Take her at her word, (then go buy a key logging program that you can install on her machine: about $30 records both sides of the conversation, many references to this on the site). Then if she is truthful it will give you peace of mind when you check. If she's not truthfull, then at least you will know and can use the information as you wish. Trust is a 2 way street, I know, but you already know she can't be trusted, and what this is is protection for you and your M, not a violation of trust.

Well,the first thought that popped into my head is your WW is hiding something.Sorry,but if she is willing to block OM e-mails,how the heck are you going to know if she doesn't give you complete access to the computer? When a WS commits of their own free will *truthfully to working on the marriage,they should be saying something like:"I will do whatever it takes to make you feel comfortable".Complete access to all e-mails,passwords,accounts,etc,etc.

I hate to rain on your parade but that's what I woud be thinking if I were in your shoes.Maybe talk to her and see if she would be willing to go that extra mile to make you feel more secure.If not then NO deal.

O

<small>[ February 25, 2004, 04:24 PM: Message edited by: Octobergirl ]</small>

Been through the keylogger thing already.

so much for hope.

I'm a bit torn. The fact that she wants her "privacy" means one of two things: she's up to something, or she genuinely feels violated by having to be an open book.

So, you could get keylogging software. That will require you to be highly paranoid for the next few months and for you to force yourself to not trust her, until enough time has gone by with no evidence of further cheating. But, I don't think you want to live like that.

So, tell her that it's non-negotiable. Remind her that she betrayed your trust. You're not just going to hand it back to her, she has to earn it. And as long as she's still keeping secrets from you, she can NEVER earn it, and you will NEVER trust her.

A marriage without trust isn't worth having. And if she's as committed to working on the marriage as she claims, then she'll have to prove it to you. And as long as she insists on privacy, then tell her that there's no point in discussing it
with her.

Oh, and one more thing: considering the fuss she's putting up over something so basic, I'd get keylogging software on the computer even if she gives you unrestricted access. That way you can find out if she has a Hotmail account you don't know about. If she's planning on continuing to cheat, she will find a way, and it's better that you know about it immediately.

"Trust but verify."

I used to be a firm believer in "All Access", but my Christian Counselor put it this way.

When you're speeding and you see a cop, what do you do? Slow down in hopes you don't get caught.

It's the same principle.
When someone is looking over your shoulder, you are on your best behavior.
They can play you for the fool by "slowing down" when you're looking. It's when you're not looking when it counts.

No matter how strictly you police the person, there are ALWAYS other means by which they can communicate if they want.

I did the keylogger program just to be disappointed. It is just a symptom of the trust that is not there.

Shouldn't your WS take the necessary steps to enstill the confidence that it takes for you to fully trust him/her? If I were in their shoes (thank God I'm not) I would go beyond the "bare minimum" of just getting by in giving you a little tidbit.

<small>[ February 25, 2004, 04:24 PM: Message edited by: Eduard ]</small>

Oh, a her good point Reservoirdog1 brought up.

If she makes a big fuss, that should tell you something.

The other thing is you are Married. Nothing should be off limits to either person. When you took your vows, there wasn't a clause that said "you have no business being in my personal things".

she genuinely feels violated by having to be an open book.

I once it was apparent to her that there was a keylogger she demanded I remove it and I did. I thought that if she did not want to give me that then I would not force her. In the times that it was there while she did it, it was just like you said. It kept her in line but not because she chose to so I removed it.

If I place it there again without her knowledge, there could be no contact for a year and still I could not fully trust her because if she did not offer it to me then in my mind she is still hanging on to something

I cannot express how angry I feel right now, that I could let someone treat me like that and take it.

I understand how you feel. Many of us here do.

Keep posting your feelings. It is important to get them out of yourself.

Thinking of you . . . Amy

Right before/at the beginning of me and my wife's first seperation I got into her email(Snooped) and found a plane ticket confermation from a guy in Alaska. She told me she had been talking to a guy in Alaska but not that he was coming here. But you will also have to 'pay' for that when she finds out. I don't know, my situation is a lot different. I knew something wasn't right, and had an idea she was talking to someone 'special' over the internet. But was told they were just friends. I'm a natural paranoid/jealous person, not good I know. Then I found that and asked her about it. She told me that she didn't really want to meet him but he insisted on coming anyway. She later said she wouldn't have met him.

Hmmmmmmmmm....

Anyway, about the paying part. She will feel you have violated her trust. Even if she was trying to cover up something. I don't personally have a recommendation on what to do. But expect to see that thrown in there somewhere. But if you do decide to do that be ready for the consquenses.

Spelling > ME

Sorry, I'm a slow poster <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

Wish I would have known sooner.

Being an open book is hard also. It takes trust on both sides. And a willingness to work on things regardless. But then again my views change from day to day.. Hour to hour is a little more accurate. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

I'm being unusually confrontational today so pardon the tone.

To bloody hell w/ the consequences. Yeah she feels I violated her trust. What has she done for the past 9 months? At least I can say that I have a right to know if I am being betrayed and decieved.

This is what has me so damn angry... Here at the end of all of this she comes to a moment of clarity and she wants to commit but not without setting conditions. Under what mindset does one dare to set conditions after all that has happened?

ARGH

I guess I did already know the answer to my question when I started this thread.

Take you time. My H is just like your wife. He wanted to move back in and then have NC with OW. And this is after promising to have NC and breaking his promise over and over.

I have more trust in Saddam Hussein. H is still out of the house and will be until he can meet some conditions.

As Believer says, take your time.

Enforce the boundaries that are critical to restoring trust.

Vent your anger here, so you can talk to her without making the situation more volatile.

"You attract more bees with honey than vinegar."

We are listening. Let us hear it! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Amy

Yesterday I did something I probably shouldn't. I contacted OM told him to not IM/e.mail my W ever again and threatened him w/ the copies of e.mails and chats btwn them. She seems to think that there cannot be C anymore. Part of me is glad I did it and wonders why I never did before. I suppose because I wanted her to chose to end contact rather than force contact to end. What i don't like is that I did it out of anger rather than as a thought out choice.

Anger seems to come in flashes now. I know that I want this marriage but I'm questioning everythingnow

Can you tell us how she discovered the keylogger software?

Yes she would be entitled to be trusted IF she hadn't given you any reason not to trust her.....

Problem is she gave you the biggest reason to not trust her.

She has to earn back your trust not expect it back.

I confronted her about C several weeks ago. Because she had been careful to delete logs and e.mails, well she put 2 & 2 together. Software stayed on for a couple of weeks until I couldn't deal w/ the AOs and removed it. I didn't want to force it on her anyway if she couldn't/wouldn't offer me the peace of mind.